Bad Morty
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Posts posted by Bad Morty
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Yeah, I think the ball changes are good but also seem somewhat contrived. I mean they had to do it as you can't penalize the Pats the way they did and not change ball handling as the Wells report exposed just how poor the league manages that aspect of the game day operations. I am interested to see what happens when a team violates this procedure again. I believe this a BIG can of worms that the NFL really did not want to open and will regret later.
Nobody is better than Goodell at closing the barn door after the horses have run off.
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Yes it is because of the timing. If anything this helps Brady as he can claim in court if he goes to court that the NFL did not have the proper ball procedures in place when they tried to suspend him. This may be Roger's out for reducing the suspension. Who knows.
I agree, although we are not allowed to discuss the Brady appeal process here. But whereas this topic addresses a change in protocol from what was done in the past I thought it would be allowed by the moderators.
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Let them take it to court. But the NFL should then not allow Brady to play while the case is open. As he is being detrimental to the League and therefore shouldn't have a right to play in it until the case if over. I guarantee that would change Brady's tune real quick.
He's a cheat
He's a whiner
He's self absorbed
So hit him where it hurts. Don't let him play at all. And then when he finally either A. loses in court or B. decides his tantrum is finished then give him his 4 game suspension.
The court would issue an injunction preventing the league from enforcing a suspension pending the legal review. In all likelihood, given the court system, he'd probably play the whole season before the case was heard.
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Serious questions here:
Let's say the suspension is upheld and they take this to court.
Suddenly his phone will have to be subpoenaed. What if they find even more evidence as to what was going on. People will be forced to take the stand I would think and be interviewed under oath. That could uncover a lot more stuff.
If that is the case, could the suspension be increased due to the new evidence coming to light?
Why would you believe Brady would be dumb enough to go through this process if he knew he did something wrong and/or had incriminating evidence on his phone? If you are thinking of this ^ stuff, then you can be sure he and his lawyers thought of it too.
He's willing to go to court and see it all the way through for a real simple reason...he didn't do anything wrong.
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oh I'm sure it will get reduced. I'm guessing 2 games.
To directly respond to your post on the subject, it appears as though 2 games won't be enough for Brady and the NFLPA http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/report--tom-brady-will-go-to-court-unless-his-suspension-is-reversed-134008783.html;_ylt=AwrBT0dm7aZVzlEAHnJXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEybnBpMzVoBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMyBHZ0aWQDQjAzNDBfMQRzZWMDc3I-
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This is direct from the Wells report. I'm sure Anderson will testify the same under oath in a court of law, if it comes to that
You are a scientist...this is not good enough for scientific proof.
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I take exception to your fact here-
you'd have to present a link to the logged pressure readings for each ball pre-game in order to dispute the fact I posted.
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What exactly is gained by Vincent making these comments? It just comes off as petty and self serving.
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You are what has made it a trying few months.
Battling cancer can make for "a trying few months"
Losing your job can make for "a trying few months"
Posting on an internet message board....not so much.
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By abusing the authority that was collectively bargained to him, Goodell is all but guaranteeing a holy war over this issue when it comes time to do the next deal. It's one thing to win a concession...it's another thing to throw it in the face of the losers when you know you're going to eventually be back at the bargaining table.
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1) Did a Patriots employee remove the balls from the referees room? Is this illegal? Yes, and Yes it's a violation. Nobody has argued this.
2) Did he take the balls into a bathroom? For what purpose? Yes. As the video turned over by the Pats clearly shows, he did. None of us know for what purpose. You are guessing that it was to deflate balls. Others are saying it was an innocent trip to the bathroom to take a leak. I suspect he was putting a gauge into the balls to make sure they were set properly by the officials. My guess is every bit as plausible as your guess.
3) Explain the discrepancy in PSI observed at half time. Any mention of the Ideal Gas Law requires you show your method and calculations please. We don't know what the discrepancy actually is, since we don't have recorded beginning measurements and we don't know which gauge was used to make the measurements. That's fact.
4) Based on the above answers was the deflation totally natural or linked to 1 & 2? Dependent on your answer did "The Deflator" act independently or under shall we say loose instruction from his QB. Since we don't have any conclusive evidence as to the actual deflation level, we can't answer this question. -
Yet for all you will pick at scientific testimony or opinion that doesn't agree with your own you've yet to disprove what ColtsBlueFL has presented.
I'm not a scientist, so I can't speak to the validity or invalidity of his experiments. I am genuinely in admiration of the work he did on it...but it's been a long time since I took a chemistry class. I need to speak about the topic on a far more basic level. So maybe CBF will help me out with this...does he feel, after all of his analysis on it, that it's strong science to form a conclusion on how much a set of footballs deflated from Point A to Point B given that there is no written record of the values at Point A nor is there a record of the gauge that was used to ascertain the Point A values on a recollection after the fact basis? Because I'm pretty sure if I was back in my 10th grade chemistry class and I turned in homework that said "here are readings I took at Point B for each ball. I didn't record the values at Point A, and I don't remember which gauge I used to measure them, but I'm pretty sure each ball was around 12.5 PSI and while I thought I used this gauge, my brother says I'm wrong about that. Therefore, the balls deflated by an average of (X) PSI", I'd be expecting a pretty lousy grade.
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I don't believe that I said BM, you or anyone else had to accept the Wells report as fact. My comments about proof are due to BM having a propensity to make declarative statements without any facts/data to back them up. He just types in statements without any regard to them bring true or not.
declarative statements?!
! You called me out on this: And I wonder why they "chose not to field the questions"? Could it possibly be because an Ivy League university wasn't willing to compromise it's integrity by selling a rigged science report the way Exponent did?That's a question, not a "declarative statement"!
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Zajc-right here:
"Columbia physics professor William Zajc said it was "more likely than not" that the deflation was caused by tampering, not the weather:
William Zajc, another Columbia physicist who was aware of the request by Reisner, said that he was tempted to field the questions because of all the flawed physics discussions he had seen in news media reports.
"I'm amused," Zajc said of the query. But in the end, he said, "I didn't do it."
Zajc said he believed there was little chance that atmospheric effects alone could account for the discrepancies in the football pressure.
"I think it's more likely than not that they were manipulated," Zajc said."
http://www.businessinsider.com/columbia-physicist-on-deflated-balls-2015-1
And my question was "on what basis is he making this claim?". Because I don't believe he had any access to the data that had been collected by the NFL, seeing as how they didn't engage with the NFL. So he is making this claim based on hearsay as to what the actual deflation levels were, which as we know were wildly overstated in the news media. So his opinion is baseless.
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Where is your proof of the above? I'd wait for it, but I know there is little chance of anything resembling proof appearing.
Where is your proof of this statement?
Do you just make declarative statements without any proof to back them up in all areas of your life or is it reserved for the Colts forum?
Where is your proof that the Columbia folks who said they didn't think atmospherics caused the pressure drop had any insight whatsoever into the actual data given that they declined to take the case from the league? Also, no need to keep asking me for "proof" of my opinions. I guess I must be the only person here who is posting opinions instead of clearly linkable and irrefutable facts...eyeroll.
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I give.. McNally lied about going in the bathroom. Lied about using a urinal , called himself the deflator and I'm getting the "really .. that's your position. What in Gods name was he doing in the bathroom ? He said he was peeing in a urinal that didn't exist after he lied about going in there in the first place. Did they find urine on the floor ? Where did he pee ?
He was probably checking the pressure level of the balls...same as the colts sideline guy did after the interception.
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http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/13170427/troy-vincent-talks-deflategate-more-qa-nfl
He dodges and plays politics in this interview, but he did say something that struck with me.
How much time and money and energy and resources did the union spend on defending Ray Rice, Adrian Peterson, Jonathan Vilma, Greg Hardy, Richard Sherman, etc., players who mostly have proof did something wrong (illegal or against NFL rules), or in certain cases are most likely to have done something wrong? And all in an effort to undermine the league's ability to administer discipline, even though the league's authority to administer discipline was collectively bargained.
Meanwhile, most of those guys are coming from situations in their lives and with their families and friends where the odds are against them, the cultural upbringing is contrary to living life among the financially elite, they have no business skills, etc. How much more effective would it be to spend that time and money and energy on helping players make better decisions with their money, with their time, help them hire good consultants, etc.
They are all valid concerns, however why is it just on the union to spend their money on loftier things like this? What is the NFL doing with regards to these issues? This, to me, is a cheap shot at the union veiled by phony "concern" about issues the league itself should be taking a leadership position on. It also sounds like a guy worried about a lawsuit he might shortly be involved in that he doesn't have great odds to win.
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Yet you'll tout AEI, which has an even worse reputation than Exponent, and a potential bias in this regard. And again, the Vermont guy who says the Exponent model holds up. So even if Exponent has credibility issues, that doesn't mean their evaluation is worthless.
That's awesome - you slipped in two fibs in one post: AEI having a potential bias (there is not one shred of evidence of this) and the Vermont guy saying the Exponent model "holds up"...here's what the "Vermont Guy" actually said:
DeSarno pointed out that the data set is incomplete and flawed — what we’ve been saying for four months about referee Walt Anderson not recording the pregame data and all of the different gauge-switching scenarios — and that Wells cherry-picked results to fit the “Patriots are guilty” conclusion.
“I still don’t place any faith in [Wells’s] conclusions,” DeSarno said. “All I can tell you that the analysis method Wells used is absolutely correct, and the analysis method AEI used is incorrect.”
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I have to believe Roger is thinking long and hard about Exponent as he considers his ruling. Remember IF this does go to court, the reasoning he uses for suspending Brady will become front and center.
An independent arbitrator or a judge would look at this case and say "Let me get this straight...you claim that you have scientific evidence that balls were tampered with, but you don't have a written record of the beginning ball pressure or a record of which gauge was used for what you are recalling those beginning measurements to be? And furthermore, you are relying on the referee's recollection that the balls were all 12.5 to start with, but you are dismissing his recollection on the gauge that was used?"
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That's amazing to me. One person said that. Everyone else said the balls were significantly underinflated. We didn't all believe the footballs were 2 pounds light. We just believed they were all light.
Even still, the point is that there's no evidence aside from wild-eyed speculation from one of the foremost wild-eyed speculators that Wells didn't use Columbia because he didn't think they'd find the result he wanted. That's nonsense. Even the Pats fan from the report I linked yesterday said that the scientific findings from the Wells report make more sense than the findings from AEI.
Then on what basis are the people at Columbia saying that they don't believe atmospherics would explain the drop? I'm guessing they are well aware of the fact that atmospherics DO in fact cause pressure to decrease...so their comments can only speak to their understanding of the magnitude of the drop. At any rate, they didn't take the case, so their opinion on it is largely irrelevant and not fully informed.
You have to at least admit that Exponent has a foul smell attached to them. You can't look at their body of work and claim that they aren't a "science for hire" operation and not who anyone who was looking for a truly "independent" analysis would turn to first.
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LOL -- Florio's speculation doesn't equal anything more than speculation.
And from that link: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/28/sports/football/nfl-investigator-seeks-to-consult-columbia-physicist-over-patriots-deflated-footballs.html?_r=1
Columbia researchers were asked to help, and mostly chose not to. Some of them stated on the record that they didn't think atmospherics would account for the drop in PSI, by the way.
of course they didn't think atmospherics would account for the drop...because at the time, we all believed that the balls were 2lbs light.
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If his suspension stands for even a game for his role in the cheating you realize he played a superbowl he shouldn't have, the timing, cover up, and denial and backlash from all the * patriot fans just worked to his benefit.
HAHAHAHA!!!! Suh tried to break someone's ankle and wasn't suspended for a playoff game. That is some grade-A hater kool-aid talking there!
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How much time do you think past between measuring the Patriots footballs vs the Colts football? From what is being reported it could not have been very long, a minute to two minutes at most.
What would be odd about the officials switching gauges as long as they used the same two? I have seen multiple posts decrying the use of two gauges. If the officials only used one gauge they probably would not have been able to measure any of the Colts footballs. I can imagine the outcry from Pats fans if that would have occurred. "Well they never even measured the Colts footballs, so there is nothing to compare the Patriots' footballs to. Throw out the investigation, fire Goodell, this is all the Colts fault."
Measuring the Colts footballs was clearly an afterthought. The point of the exercise was to measure the Pats footballs. Somebody probably hastily thought "Hey we should measure the Colts balls just in case", which is why they ran out of time. The Wells report is pretty clear on this...they measured all of the Pats footballs twice before moving on to the Colts balls. Since you all seem to believe that a guy could deflate 12 footballs in a bathroom in a minute and a half, then it doesn't make sense that they could only measure 4 Colts balls before the half ended unless they started measuring them literally right at the end of halftime.
! You called me out on this: And I wonder why they "chose not to field the questions"? Could it possibly be because an Ivy League university wasn't willing to compromise it's integrity by selling a rigged science report the way Exponent did?
NFL Changes game ball procedure
in NFL General
Posted
You mean if the league just handed the game balls to the teams and said "here...you're playing with these" like every other sports league does? Absolutely. But I think that's why a lot of us think the league is pretty hypocritical in this whole thing. They have done everything in their power short of requiring the defense to play with fewer players than the offense in order to create more offense and more points. Allowing the guys who throw the ball to do whatever they want to the footballs is a part of that larger plan.