That Guy
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Posts posted by That Guy
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Peyton was the gun, Marvin was 'a' bullet. We'll define the 'weapon' that way.
You COULD say that, but the 3 years after Marvin retired, the Colts att 601,679,534 passes, so that would be wrong.
! Philly police reported that the gun was Marvins...I see it more as Marvin being a javelin, and Peyton throwing him. We shall start a war of analogies!
And you could say the increased passing attempts after Marvin's retirement was due to defenses focusing more against the run game. They were less worried about the pass because the Colts lost a top-five-all-time receiver (my opinion).
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Im not arguing any of that. None what so ever. Marvin was a better WR. But Ward played a more complete game. Something the Hall voters love. And he did it in Pitt. which carries ALOT more weight than it does nearly anywhere else. And Ward played better in big games.
Your original argument was that Ward would be enshrined before Marvin. I disagree simply due to the head start Marvin has by retiring earlier.
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Marvin wasnt ever the main weapon either, Peyton was (is?).
In the NFL records, points scored are attributed to the player who crosses the goal line. Marvin was scoring the points, which makes Marvin the main weapon.
And more chances establishes a relationship, but it does not establish CAUSALITY. You can say the Colts passed more BECAUSE of how good Marvin was. THAT is why your stat is irrelevant.
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Whoa whoa whoa. Tripled? Come on now. Lets not get outta hand here.
I mentioned in another thread, Marvin played 2 less years, and still had over 400+ more balls thrown in his offense. More throws=More Stats. And one guys had Peyton throwing to him.
I'm not saying he was tripled every play, but there were coaches who tried to stop Marvin with everything they had. I remember a few Texans games in particular (before they realised how to play defense), where Marvin would have a linebacker covering him underneath, a corner covering the outside, amd a safety covering any deep routes.
His offense had more passing attempts BECAUSE of his impact. Why run when you can throw a wicked slant to Marvin? He was one of the most dependable receivers in almost every year. His route running was superb, his hands were glue-covered football magnets, and his timing with Peyton was unmatched.
I understand that your argument is that Ward is a better FOOTBALL PLAYER, and I agree he was tougher. Marvin was, however, the better receiver by a wide margin.
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but how can I expect you to know that when you believe Polian and Dungy are players.In his defense, Dungy was a player. Just not for the Colts...
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Pass attempts by year. Based on the years in which those WR played
Colts. 537,523,576,546,571,557,591,569,527,515,557,515,585
Steelers. 489,535,439,454,551,532,358,379,523,442,506,536,479,539
All can be found here.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/
*Note, 407 less pass attempts.
That stat is irrelevant. You could easily say that the Colts passed the ball more due to having a better receiver (Harrison). the Colts passed the ball more because they had the better players in their passing game. Hines Ward wasn't even the main weapon in his own offense. The running back was...
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What do you think the results of this would be in a Steelers forum?
Whos the QB?
What type of offense is the team running?
Your argument of "what offense was the team running" works against Ward too. He was in an obvious rushing offense, so less attention was paid to him when he was on the field. Marvin was doubled or tripled regularly, but Ward did not receive that attention. Everyone was stacking the box against the Steelers, so Ward was left to contend with less attention from the defense, yet he still did not produce as many yards, completions, or touchdowns (the main relevant WR statistics).
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Marvin-1102-14,580-128
Ward 1000-12,083-85
Marvin isn't that far ahead of Ward just on career #s. Lets look at playoff #'s
Marvin 65-883-2
Ward 88-1181-10
Ward was on a run first, run always, team for his entire career....Ward was hands down the more complete player, and I don't think that can even be argued. And he's got a SB MVP under his belt.
You saying "Marvin is top 5 all time" doesn't mean its true. No one outside of Indy believes that.
You may want to read back up on Marvin's accomplishments:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_Harrison
He is a first or second ballot hall of famer. Since he retired in 2008, that would make him hall eligible in 2013. Hines Ward hasn't even announced his retirement yet. That makes him eligible in 2017 AT THE EARLIEST! There is no way Marvin goes four years without joining the hall.
He is STATISTICALLY a top 5 wideout all time. That is RECORDED STATISTICS (third in career yards and fourth in career touchdowns). I don't need to say it for it to be true, and you claiming it's false doesn't make it false.
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I think he's in the HoF before Marvin is.
I doubt it. Marvin is a top five receiver all time. He is in for his first or second year of eligibility. The amount of time between their retirements alone gives Marvin a huge advantage.
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#1 - Hockey Goalie
#2 - Quarterback
#3 - Baseball Pitcher
#4 - Basketball Center
Soccer is the truest team sport in the sense that no one peice is ridiculously more valuable than the others.
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Lets put it this way, if I could 'BUILD' a QB, it'd be pretty darn close to looking like Manning.
Was that a Frankenstein's monster joke? He does kinda look like one...
I think it all comes down to what you're looking for in a quarterback.
If you want arm strength, you can find better.
If you want longevity, he is behind Favre.
If you want preparation and intelligence, he's hand down your man.
If you want rings, go with Bradshaw.
If you want stats, I put Marino first, Manning second, but they will both be passed with the new rules.
If you want leadership and an ability to carry a team, I would go with Manning.
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http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/mock-drafts/chad-reuter/80001?module=HP11_content_stream
This is a mock without Barron going in the first. He would just need to make it past St. Louis with the 33rd pick.
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No need to hide. I totally agree with you. And, I did an extremely poor job in wording my post.
What I meant was that I didn't know if this was cold or funny because I don't know if the sender was a Giant's fan or not. If it was a Giant's fan, then it was just cruel.
If it was a fan of the Broncos (or any other team), it was funny as in "
the joke's on you . . . at least the Patriots made it to the SB. Where was your team?"It was definately made by a sour Broncos fan, but the writer is encouraging revenge:
"What would be Boston's return volley here? Erecting a movie screen in downtown Denver to show a replay of the Patriots' beatdown of the Broncos in the playoffs? Dropping Curt Schilling into town to talk about the 2007 World Series? Perhaps letting Denver know Tim Tebow will be their quarterback next season?"
I thought it was a good joke. Broncos fans got a laugh, and Pats fans got free candy!
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I'm not old enough to hate on Baltimore (I was -3 when the Colts moved in 1984).
I do agree that those were low blows towards the Kraft family, though. I assume what you mean about the "Cundiff ball" is Kraft keeping the ball from the missed feild goal. Is that right? That is kinda a low blow (I doubt Pittsburgh enshrined a Vanderjagt ball), but Kraft has more class than most owners today.
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Lame thread imo. You could be a 6 5" 230 lbs muscled up freak wr for all I care. And our wrs may be slow, but they run good crisp routes. (with the exception of garcon, who has speed instead). Like another poster said, give me Marvin Harrison over randy moss any day. If they are big and slow, i would much rather have wrs who can run crisp routes and catch well.
Agreed. Being tall does not mean the same thing as being open. Speed and route running ability (or zone awareness, depending on the defense) are the most consistent ways to get open. After that, you have to look at catching ability.
If we just want height, lets draft a whole class full of tight ends who are 6'5" behemoths and start them at receiver.
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If the Pats nab Wayne, I say we (the Colts) should go after Welker! He is a free agent as well!
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Ahhh...no
What would likely happen in that scenario is that Washington, Miami, or Seattle would jump in there and get RGIII which would leave us >>>ed when Peyton is ready to call it quits or if he seems ready to go and then ends up getting hurt or regressing and can't go. We're back to Orlovsky.
If anyone jumps in to get RGIII, it leaves us in a position to get Kalil or Blackmon. One of them has to be available at pick four (Luck, Kalil, Blackmon, or RGIII).
If Peyton can't go, we are going to need two years MINIMUM to rebuild (with or without Luck). SuperBowls's draft is just trying to give us possible options.
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I would wish him (Reggie Wayne) well.
If he is not a Colt next year, it won't be because he DID NOT WANT to be a Colt. He loves this frachise. He would do well in New England, though.
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Jake Scott, eh....
I saw the same thing. I would prefer him over Carl Nicks (even though everyone seems ready to sell our souls for him).
He is familiar with our players (if not necesarily our new schemes or coaches), and he would be cheaper and easier to attract back to Indy.
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So the Welker drop was due to a phantom bullet changing the momentum of the ball...
IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW!
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We went 2-14 because we got lucky in two games...
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Football Sundays may be over for a while, but new episodes of "The Walking Dead" start this Sunday...
That's not a bad replacement.
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Let me respond to your cliche with another cliche:
"Defense wins championships,"
but
"the best defense is a good offense."
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I can't wait to hear some of the things you guys come up with for this one
What I hope he is saying:
"Let me win the first Super Bowl, then you can win the next one. We'll alternate after that."
! Philly police reported that the gun was Marvins...
but how can I expect you to know that when you believe Polian and Dungy are players.
Marvin Harrison Or Hines Ward?
in NFL General
Posted
At least Hines DOES smile... I looked Marvin up in yahoo images, and it's hard to find a picture of him with a smile...
http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=A0PDoYCU4DlPnn4A_9mJzbkF?p=marvin%20harrison&fr=yfp-tab-701&ei=utf-8&n=30&x=wrt&fr2=sg-gac&sado=1