MAC
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I have no idea why but Kerry Collins reminds me a lot of Jim Harbaugh and to this day Jim Harbaugh is still my favorite Colt (sorry Peyton). Frankly that's what this team reminds me of, Harbaugh's team they have enough talent they can beat any team in the NFL but they can just as easily lose to any team in the NFL.
I've always liked Collins, even had a Carolina Panthers jersey of his when I was younger. I look forward to what he can do here.
I loved Jim Harbaugh (hoping the 49ers do well for him). Now that you have me thinking about this, I just realized that Harbaugh reminds me an awful lot of Bert Jones. Similar attitude, leadership, confidence, mobility, and desire to win. Just a pleasure to watch in every respect. Of course Jones had a lot more physical skills, but I'd take either on my team in a heartbeat. Jones was my favorite Colt for a very long time (perhaps still is, hard to say). Probably something to do with my being in my teens when he was in his prime. Hero's from that time of your life carry a lot of weight.
I can't say that I share your enthusiasm for Collins though. I want to like him - no choice at this point - but I live in the NY market and I spent years when he was with the Giants trying to make the argument to fans here that their QB wasn't the franchise player they imagined him to be. I have no problems showing respect to the Giants - their LT years were tremendous - but people here considered Collins a star, and I got sick of hearing it.
I'd love to be proven wrong, believe me.
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Speak for yourself, it was very painful because at the time you weren't sure if the Colts would ever be in that spot again. That was the first time other than 87 that the Colts tasted anything close to success in Indianapolis and for a lot of fans it was the first time they saw it. It hurt a lot. I mean just the way they lost and the split second people thought Baily cought the ball was herat breaking. It's the only time in my life I sheed a tear over a sporting event.
I can easily imagine that. I should have said "That game wasn't THAT painful" for me. I wouldn't presume to speak for anyone but myself.
Of course then they were stomped by the Steelers in the playoffs the next year again, and imagine how you would have felt if you could tack on the recollection of two more humbling loses to Steelers from the 70s. So I was pretty much at my wits end by the time we got to the late turnover against the Steelers in 05 - probably the best Colts team of this era. There have been many losses which have brought tears to near boil - and I resent the Steelers as much as I admire them.
The one that really got me though was a positive. By the time the Colts completed that final TD drive to take the lead against the Patriots in the AFC championship game, I was on my knees in front of the TV crying like a baby. SO much frustration washed away. The SB didn't come close to affecting me the same way.
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Yes even more important than the d-line even without Manning we are still built to be an offensive team. That didn't just change when Manning went out. The defense isn't going to change without Manning in it's make up. They didn't lose anyone. They are still going to be at best a middle of the pack defense. So I think it's silly to count of them to start winning games for us. They aren't built for that and just because Manning isn't here doesn't mean they magically became built to do that. I agree with what Freeney said when he was asked if it was time for them to step up, he said something to the effect of no because that would mean they weren't trying as hard as they could in the past.
Clearly I don'think Collins is going to pull off the magical comebacks Manning did. That's going to be one of the effects of not having Manning. We need to do the best we can to not get in that spot in the first place. If we do we are probably done.
Makes sense. I guess that I'm referring to myself holding out hope that the change of philosophy (and the three newcomers) on the dline will result in significant improvement. If the dline is as bad as it was at times last year, it may not matter much what the Oline does. Collins is never going to score on the same % of possessions as Peyton (which now that I think about it is a statistic that would probably be very interesting to consider when comparing QBs).
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That game wasn't THAT painful because we had no right to be there in the first place, and we gave them a run. It was just fun.
Now the other FOUR playoff losses to the Steelers were just tortuous.
And for playoff near misses I was actually far more thrilled (and a lot more pained) by the OT loss to the Raiders in '78 (ish - don't remember the year).
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Well in theory right now the best we can do is 16-0 with Collins we haven't lost a game yet (worth reminding people at times right now).
I think we are going to win and lose based on how the o-line does. The games they play well I think we'll win. The games they struggle I think we are going to struggle. One thing Collins can't do is cover up the lines struggles like Manning did at times. He doesn't have Manning's footwork in the pocket or his lighting quick release.
Even more important than the Dline?
I can't picture Collins pulling off one of those 3 TD comebacks that we've come to enjoy. Time of possession may become much more important to the Colts. If they can't get off the field, nothing else matters. On the other hand if they give Collins enough chances with all those weapons, something good should happen.
I hope.
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I had this done. I'm sure experiences vary depending on surgeon and technique, but I can tell you that:
It takes more than an hour. I was told mine was going to take three. Not sure what it actually came out to.
Most people go home from the hospital the same day (I stayed overnight because of minor issues with the anesthesia).
Most bone comes from a sterile bone bank (cadavers). I can't imagine why anyone would want a second surgery on their hip unless they absolutely had to.
I never had a neck brace of any kind. I think the variable is whether or not a plate is inserted. With a plate it's stable enough that there isn't much risk of damage unless you do something stupid.
The pain after surgery was absolutely nothing in comparison to the pain before the surgery - when the nerve has a disk pressing against it. Mobic relieved the pre-surgery pain substantially. I was given a prescription for Oxycodone post-surgery but didn't even bother filling it. I would never take a narcotic unless in desperate pain, and it really wasn't a big deal. However:
You aren't supposed to move much the first week or so, and you aren't going to want to. Twisting and bending will amp up the discomfort. Things like getting in and out of bed require a little planning and good technique.
You DON'T want to be in a car - PERIOD. Normal braking makes it feel like your head is about to fly off. You aren't supposed to drive for a couple of weeks because you won't be able to turn your head normally from side to side.
In short, I wouldn't worry about Peyton being at risk of further damage just by taking a bad step or something, but it seems to me that standing on the sidelines short-term would be a moronic thing to do. And he sure as heck isn't taking an airplane to Houston. I would expect he will be home Sunday, and perhaps in the Irsay's suite for the next two home games. Who knows after that.
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Yeah, you are. On a boat lost in the middle of the Atlantic.
Colts 24
texies 20
Collins has to start, and I think the Colts still can win their division, but I somewhat agree with bdog. It depends on the effectiveness of your crystal ball.
I'm optimistic that our o-line and running game can come together enough to let Collins put up some good numbers. I like him as a backup and short term replacement. However I'm a bit concerned about him starting all season. If it turns out that Collins is ineffective and the Colts lose a lot of games early on, I'd much rather give Painter a chance to develop than watch a 38 year old flounder. At least it would provide a long-term benefit for the team, and you never know what might happen. Painter has a lot of talent (and is far more mobile), he just needs to get his mental hitches under control. We know what Collins can do, and it's not going to improve at this point.
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Colts 27
Houston 24
I really do think that Collins can put up some numbers. Of course, since he hasn't been with us long it's also possible our offense could really struggle. If the O does struggle, obviously we are in huge trouble.
Makes sense - and you write like a normal person. What's up with the signature? Makes (what's left of) my hair stand up.;)
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I've never played fantasy football, but here's a related issue. I've entered many a football pool - even ran an office pool 7-8 times. In all that time I have always picked the Colts - every week, regardless of spread or situation. I'm talking picking the recent Colts with a huge spread that I think it unlikely they will meet, I'm talking picking the lousy Colts who had little chance of anything but humiliation. I worked with many other passionate football fans who had no problems picking against their teams if it might gain them a little money. They were "just being realistic".
I simply have no interest in watching the Colts and finding that my financial interests conflict with the Colts interests. It would make me feel like a traitor, and detract from my enjoyment of the game.
I'm not sure that I see fantasy football any differently. If I was playing I would do everything possible to avoid a conflict. IE: Drafting Rodgers would be great, but can't you sit him against the Colts? I sure as heck don't want to be watching and thinking "I want Rodgers to throw for 8 TDs, but I want the Colts to win too.". Makes little sense. I don't WANT Rodgers to have a good day against my team.
And I would never draft a player that I detest (IE: Randy Moss, Terrel Owens, Michael Vick, Tom Brady), nor perhaps anyone on a division rival either, nor anyone on the Patriots, Chargers, Steelers, etc. I simply wouldn't pick them regardless of the consequences because I refuse to have to root for them. Sorry, but I don't see much fun in that.
Perhaps that's why I've never played fantasy football. I'd be left rooting for the Lions (and Bengals) and Bears of the world, which would be unlikely to meet with much success.
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Surgery #2 was, as far as I can gather from the press, for nerve compression at a different position. High-end athletes will sometimes have the disc removed from posterior, which is harder technically and may allow for residual or recurrent compression, but it doesn't require fusion, which makes it more desirable for the athlete. Why didn't it work? Well, the decompression was probably excellent, but the nerve apparently didn't recover.
Surgery #3 ensures excellent, comprehensive decompression, It is unclear if manning had residual or recurrent compression, or if the lack of recovery forced some additional action.
Perhaps more concerning, however, is his triceps weakness on the right. I have no idea if he recovered any strength or not after surgery #2... but if not, I'm very worried.
Thank you so much for your willingness to share your knowledge, and for taking the time to post this.
Follow up questions if you can. I understand that you can't diagnose from a distance - it isn't my intention to ask for more than general guidelines and informal conjecture.
1) When you say that you read that the second surgery was for nerve compression at a different position, are you talking about a different disk? I keep hanging my hat on the FO statement that arthritic degeneration wasn't an issue for Peyton, and therefore hoping that he has an isolated problem. But if the first two surgeries were on two different disks, wouldn't that be far more concerning long term.
2) What do these surgeries from the rear of the neck actually entail? Partial disk removal to make room for the nerve or something? I didn't think that you could remove the whole disk without the necessity of filling the space/fusing.
3) I was told when debating whether to have fusion surgery that "if you wait more than 90 days you risk permanent nerve damage". It's seemed logical to assume that with all the resources available to Peyton he wouldn't "wait too long", but I've read some articles suggesting that this has been lingering for years. Can you clarify which symptoms indicate that a nerve is actually in the process of being damaged, and do you recall reading anything as this problem has evolved over the past year or two that would allow some conjecture about when the damaging compression occurred? I realize that this is awfully close to asking "did he wait too long to have surgery"? I know that you can't answer that specifically for a variety of reasons - just looking for general info and public statements that might be relevant. With all this in mind how would the wait between the second and third surgeries - if it were to turn out that the nerve is still impinged - affect his prognoses?
4) I had assumed from the timing of the third surgery that the nerve was still impinged. If in fact the odds are that the "decompression was probably excellent", what other types of issues might have necessitated the third surgery. Or is it more likely to be a matter of "it's not getting better and this is the only thing left that might help"?
I apologize if any of this pushes you outside your comfort zone. Don't know until you ask.
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id like to see the pats raise the trophy in indy
It's nice to know how concerned Pats fans are with the Colts.
The Pats are one of the teams I'd would not want to see win in Indy, but I also have no desire to see the Colts win it in NE. It would add nothing except the risk of embarrassing fan confrontations. If they can't win it at home, one of the traditional warm weather sites would do just fine. There is something to be said for a neutral site. How about LA . Nobody home there for some time now.
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Why does that make you sick? Please don't say because of the dogfighting. If so, that's lame. He's made a great comeback as a player.
Why not exactly? Where are your priorities in life?
If Vick was named the QB of the Colts I would probably stop watching football for the duration - only using my free time to complain to the management. I certainly couldn't root for him. I live in NJ and hear a lot of Philly sports radio. Initially there were a lot of people protesting his signing. After he started playing well the noise stopped. The entire sports community sat on their morals in the hopes of having a slightly better football team than they might have had otherwise. Are you freaking kidding me?
This isn't all that different from when a child-molester is released from prison. I'm theoretically all for their civil rights, but on an individual basis I don't want them living on my street, sitting at the next desk in my office, playing catch with my nephews, etc. I sure as heck wouldn't idolize them, support their efforts to become independently wealthy, or celebrate their accomplishments. Do you want your kid running around with a convicted child molester's Jersey on? This guy is just as bad, arguably a lot worse. Sadist, sociopath - you don't usually grow out of that. I gather that you don't care much for animals. You have my pity. If you are capable of doing what he did, you are capable of anything. I don't want to see his face or hear his name, much less see him win the Super Bowl. Where he does it is much less important. I just want him to fail miserably and fade quietly into the back-round.
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I know it's not lifting, but I know there can be more than 22 pounds of torque when he throws, anyone have any idea if that torque would act on the body like lifting would?
I don't know physics, but I did have a cervical fusion. I was given the OK to "resume normal activities" within a few weeks. If I could lift a bag of dog food, I wouldn't worry too much about an athlete lifting 22 pounds. But I also think that the idea of him playing again this season is a bit crazy. The bag of dog food never tried to lift me up and slam me head-first into the ground.
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You are my favorite new poster. This may be the start of a bromance. ;)
Very well said.
Thanks. I feel tingly all over. lol
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yes i remember watching peyton stumble around in the snow for a quarter!! must have forgot about that big picture thing. or maybe to keep a streak alive. i could drone on and on about the way 70,000 people booed and cussed as i try
to explane to a 9 year old what they are thinking,about protecting peyton and then watching him play in a blizzard, but no need for that. good luck #5
Sorry you had a hard time with your kid. Personally I had read numerous comments from Polian in particular indicating exactly what they were going to do, and was vividly aware of their prior history. Were you completely oblivious to this for some reason? I was only surprised that they kept the starters in against the Jets as long as they did. Since I had absolutely zero expectation of them attempting to go undefeated, I had no reason to be shocked. Maybe a little disappointed, but it took me about 10 seconds to get over it. It's hardly worth holding a grudge - particularly since these are the very same people who are responsible for the success which you obviously enjoy.
I agree that they played too long against the Bills. One quarter would be typical, but I thought the snow would have justified pulling them earlier. I recall a lot of passes to Reggie in an attempt to reach a season mark - which is frankly pretty childish. But that only supports the argument that the players shouldn't be the ones making these decisions.
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Does anyone remember Houston rushing for 257 yards in game 1 last year? If our offense can't move the ball it will be the same thing over again. Even without Foster, Houston will still have a formidable rushing attack.
I agree that this is likely to be the linchpin of the game, but I'm hoping we have a demonstrable better rushing defense. Three new players, and others one year better.
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I had a surgical fusion.
If this report is true it suggests that the initial surgery didn't accomplish it's goal, and that his muscle weakness and pain are the result of a ruptured disk continuing to press on a nerve.
The good news is that he might regain the use of the muscle immediately upon completion of the surgery, and rebuilt the strength with exercise. It's possible that nerve regeneration wasn't the problem.
The bad news is that it takes a long time to heal. He has access to the best - so who knows what they actually did - but by my experience the initial healing times you are reading have to do with all the internal wounds healing and the neck stabilizing. Being in a car a week after surgery, normal braking made it feel like my head was about to fly off my body. This resolves pretty quickly. But if he had an actual fusion than it isn't considered 100% healed until the bone has grown over the implant, which takes many months. I wouldn't want to be playing a contact sport before then.
I also lost some range of motion as far as raising and lowering my head. Left/right may not be 100% either, but perhaps physical therapy could resolve that. His might be in a different area so who knows. And the act of fusing the disks puts additional pressure on the disks above and below. I would be willing to bet that some experts would advise him to retire. I can aggravate my neck just by carrying something heavy at arms length away from my body. But then again I'm not an athlete, and I have an arthritic-like degeneration. Polian/Irsay previously stated that Peyton had no such issues.
You have to hope that the problem was confined to one area, that the rest is solid as a rock, and that aside from minor loss of range he will return good as new. I sure hope so. If he does he will be a star in my eyes in a different way than he was before, and I may have to get my lazy butt off the coach and do a better job of building up the supporting muscles in my own neck.
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you are wrong we lost to nem orleans in the sb! I believe that was sarcasm about the pro bowl, and most colt
fans will never get over the fact we did'nt have the guts to go for a perfect season, including peyton manning
"Didn't have the guts?" What, do you think that they were too scared to play?
"Never get over?" What, did they cheat on you with another team or something?
I love how people assign a rudimentary human failing to a rational decision so that they can wrap the whole topic up in a simplistic ball of hate.
Wouldn't it actually make more sense to say how remarkable it is that the FO HAD the guts to make a decision that they knew would engender ridicule, scorn, and hatred - because they thought that that was the best way to win the Super Bowl - the entire point of the exercise. In other words, they were doing their jobs to the best of their abilities, not pandering to people who have more emotion than sense.
And Peyton's opinion is irrelevant - he is a football player. They have to drag him off the field kicking and screaming when they are up by 30 points with two minutes left. He lives to compete - and I'd expect nothing less - but all successful football players are competitive to the point of self-destruction. This was a decision that needed to be made by someone aware of the larger picture.
Of course I would have liked to see the team go undefeated, but it wasn't that big a deal. The difference is that for all intents and purposes I feel that they DID go undefeated. In football, you either need to win a game, or you don't. If you don't, then it is impossible to recreate the intensity of a real game, and foolish to waste the effort and risk injury trying. It was NO more important than the pre-season, which is so boring that I barely pay attention. And do you remember the snow in Buffalo? I was just praying that the key players would get off the field in one piece. The only thing that bothers me about that season is Hank Baskett, Dwight Freeney's leg, and the pick six. Change any ONE of those and the Colts would have completed arguably the most impressive season in the history of the sport.
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This is the post of the year!
It is funny how you can counter moronic anti Polian platitiudes with a carefully thought out rational argument and people will still just repeat the same talking points over and over.
PS Why is my reply stuck in the quote box for the original post?
Thanks.
I feel compelled - as apparently do you - to refute some of the comments, but they keep coming like a flood. Very frustrating. Probably a waste of time, but I always think that if you don't tell someone they're spewing toxic garbage they might assume that the silence means that everyone agrees with them.
PS - you must have written your answer above the "/quote" thingy.
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Apparently we have not watched the same Curtis painter. No team in the league would call him there starting QB and would probably have him @ 3rd string on some of the worst teams. The front office signing of Collins proves every bit of it.
You're missing the point. People are screaming 'blah blah blah they should have drafted and developed a QB blah blah blah ego problems blah blah blah".
The fact is that they DID draft and develop a QB. I may have a higher opinion of Painter than many but I'm not saying that he's ready for prime time. What I'm saying is that drafting a young qb and developing him is a difficult process with a high probability of failure. It seems to me that the commentators are REALLY saying that the failure is in not having Aaron Rodgers sitting on the bench - which is just *ic. How often does that happen? The only reasonable complaint about the FO is that they didn't have an experienced backup ready to go. But then again they have an experienced backup here now just as he is finally needed. Aside from his lack of practice with the offense - likely more a result of the off-season being compressed than anything - what exactly has the front office done?
I know, they avoiding wasting countless millions in prior years on a disgruntled vet picking his nose on the bench, so they could use the money to field a better team. It's a little hard to take issue with the results.
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Yea, ironic would have been better, but I cant edit topic titles, unless a mod wants to do it.
If I was you I'd see who was active and PM them before dawn brings another 300 people dumping on you. I knew what you meant, but many will not care. Piling on is too much fun for them.
And now I see that the change has been made. Either my reading comprehension is off or they are incredibly fast.
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Not to be totally dense but... how do you do that? Is it the little green + sign button and the red - button? Or what?
Yuperdo.
You might want to read the help section about reputations. It's actually pretty cool to be able to acknowledge good posts (and bad as well). And it doesn't feel half bad when someone acknowledges yours either.
By the way, is the NM New Mexico? Your signature suggests someone who has spent a little bit too much time (for a Colts fan) in the NY metropolitan area. Pretty funny actually. I'll have to show my Jets fan sister and brother in law.
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I hope Collins doesn't have two picks - too small a margin of error to withstand that.
I'm sure you meant that the Colts will have 30 carries (I hope they do by the way) - not Joseph alone.
I can't imagine Tamme seeing much action unless Clark gets hurt or has to spent a lot of time in the slot (ie: if Collie, Gonzalez and White can't play).
I don't think we can win a shootout, and I'm not sure that Collins will mesh quickly enough to put up 27 - so falling behind would probably not be a great idea.
I'm optimistic about your bottom line though. The Colts can win this.
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The negative 1 on this post was my bad. Accidentally bumped it since I'm on my phone. Can somebody +1 that for me to cancel it off? Sorry presto, totally agree with your post!
Done
Interesting Belichick Show
in NFL General
Posted
I was coming on this thread to mention this. If memory serves he was working for next to nothing, sleeping God knows where, trying to get his foot in the door. It's not as if he was born the Patriots coach and devoted his life to making Colts fans miserable. In a different world (where Marchibroda had never been foolishly forced out) he might STILL be with the Colts. Of course he might not be as good if not for the years with Parcels, but who knows. I couldn't care less about his occasionally unpleasant manner, I've seen tons of examples of humor as well. There is no rational reason to hate the man, He's brilliant.
But then I seek out the little touches of humanity which make it hard to personally dislike someone. I don't WANT to personally dislike anyone. I was pretty sick of seeing Robert Kraft's smiling face up in the press box, but after reading about his wife and watching him hug Jeff Saturday I will never look at him the same again. Keeping an open mind is healthy and relaxing. And watching a documentary about Belichick is bound to be informative and fascinating.