[Jets And Redskins Are Out Of Manning Race]

Never thought he would head to Redskins, there is too much family love & loyalty to compete as division rivals....

Still think he ends up in KC, maybe Miami second, but like KC for some reason. Good receivers, running game, and it is a market somewhat like Indy...

Don't want to see him in Houston, probably great for him, but watching him trounce us and the rest of the division in a Texans jersey would be painful

[Why The Hate On Grigs?]

More of a question than a comment...

Grigson, I'm sure at the behest of Irsay, has completely blown up a nucleus of veteran players that have won, won consistently and won big... there is a lot of fear that we have left a somewhat sure thing for a high stakes gamble.

Can anyone think of an example of this kind of strategy working in the salary cap era (other than us with Manning)?

[Aren't They Concerned]

People get cut all the time :S Wasn't Clark and Addia getting cut expected anyway? They'll probably draft a bunch of offensive talent, because at the moment, we have way more talent on defense. Personally, I can't wait for the Colts in a couple of years with a bunch of young offensive talent and a beastly defense. Just gonna have to watch a few expected losses in the mean time.

that is really scary... because our defense completely stunk last year.... if true basically means we have little to no talent at all.

and after cutting our HOF QB just for fun we also cut our best overall RB, TE, our defensive team captain, and about to do the same with our best DE. At this point it is no longer a rebuild, for a rebuild you need a foundation. Who or what would be our foundation?

[I Don't Get Argument For Rebuild]

With Manning we looked to re-tool every year, filling a hole, drafting a replacement for a player whose contract was going to be up. We always had veterans at certain spots that we could count on.

Last several years, those draft picks haven't exactly been replacing our aging players the way they should, so we end up having to re-sign Mathis because Hughes doesn't pan out. We have to re-sign Addai because Brown wasn't living up to expectations. Gonzo never became the #2, so you have to spend more picks on WR's....

That leads to this- overloaded with veteran contracts that, for whatever stupid reason, expired on the same year. (why would we allow our two starting WR's to have contracts expiring on the same year, seems like a rookie mistake for sure).

Now we are in desperation mode- no more re-tooling around veteran talent- won't have much of that left from what it appears. Just really don't like this scenario-- rookies QB, rookie HC, rookie GM.... too many rookies at too many key positions.

[How Do We Improve Our Offensive Line?]

Any O-Line that does not include Jeff Link-to-a-sack or Mike Pollack as starters will be an improvement.

It is really sad that we seem to have this discussion nearly every year for the last 4 or 5 years. I don't care if the linemen are big, small, just want them to be able to open a hole for a rb and give the QB at least a couple of seconds to throw without being mugged. If we don't do something, I am afraid we are setting Luck up for a difficult year- and God forbid- injury. WR's would be nice to throw to, but if he is always running for his life, that is just wrong.

Seems like a mixture of a serviceable G and C (assuming Saturday leaves) as FA's plus a draft pick or two would seem realistic and doable.

[Rebuilding Mode]

Give Luck all the help he can get, because we're not turning the GOAT's replacement into David Carr.

Now that is a scary thought... hey at least at the combine we saw that he can run, he may need it

[No Sure Thing- #1 Qb's]

Just an objective look for those who are viewing Luck as the "next sure thing"...

#1 Overall Draft Picks- QB's since 1990

1990- Jeff George, Colts... ewwwwww

1993- Drew Bledsoe, Patriots Not a bad career, on the winning way before being replaced by Brady after an injury

1998- Peyton Manning, Colts First ballot HOF

1999- Tim Couch, Browns Uhhh, no

2001- Michael Vick, Falcons Not too bad, except for those two years he played for the Federals

2002- David Carr, Texans Has been holding a clipboard for a few years now, before that just trying to hold onto his head with Texans

2003- Carson Palmer, Bengals Don't know if it was him or just the black hole that is the Bengals

2004- Eli Manning, Giants (from Chargers) 2 SB's, one of the best in the league

2005- Alex Smith, 49ers Finally found his groove last year... 7 years into the league

2007- JaMarcus Russell, Raiders Poster child for epic fail

2009- Matthew Stafford, Lions Becoming a good QB, helping Lions finally becoming more than the leader in ineptitude

2010- Sam Bradford, Rams We'll see, but hasn't exactly lit up the league yet

2011- Cam Newton, Panthers Awesome rookie year

So that's 21 years... 13 QB's drafted overall #1

* They have led their teams to 4 Super Bowls (Peyton 2 & Eli 2) and won 3 Super Bowls

* 3 of them could barely hold a starting job

* Couch's career lasted 5 years, Russell lasted 3

All of this for information only, not saying anything about our future #1. Hoping he turns into the next great thing and leads us to many more winning years.... just trying to put some perspective on this decision to place so much trust in a #1 pick that we release Manning.

[Article By Gene Wojciechowski]

"None of it matters now because Irsay thinks his franchise is better off without Manning than with him."

"I know Irsay's decision makes financial sense, but that doesn't mean it makes football sense. If Manning is healthy -- and his arm strength certainly seems to be trending that way -- then Irsay just deprived the Colts of their best chance to win games."

Amazing how a little common sense put down on "paper" summarizes all the crap we have been hearing over the last few months.

The business of football is winning, not managing cap space. Putting a winning product on the field is what matters. But in his first critical decision since wresting his team away from Polian, Irsay dumps the best player this team/city has ever seen by a mile...in hopes that Luck/Griffin can actually be a winning QB. Have this horrible feeling that it is- Welcome to the new Colts, same as the old Colts (pre-1998)

[Dungy On Manning's Release]

Dungy had an interesting response when asked about where he may go.... he said it wouldn't necessarily be somewhere to win a SB. thats a bit of an indictment against manning

I tend to think what he was saying was that Manning is not going to a contending team that already has an established QB- which would fit with his personality- not causing a QB controversy. If that is the case, it probably eliminates some teams that have been talked about like Bal, Dallas, Houston & Jets... and maybe Denver.

I also cannot see him signing up with a team like Cleveland (although that would be interesting).

Some team like the Chiefs or Arizona, where there is no established QB and no real established offensive style, he could come in a really make a difference. Those would be my guesses anyway

[Upset With Irsay [Merge]]

Listening to Irsay at press conference...

I hear Irsay speaking, but this is what I heard...

"Everything I said up until this point has been complete <cowpaties>.... It really was about the money... Yes, Peyton can still play, Yes, he still wanted to be a Colt... but I am full of <cowpaties> and lied through my teeth to everyone, including Peyton.I know he has made me a ton of money, beacuse of him being here I have a brand new stadium... but I really am just a selfish son o a b."

[People Do Realize...]

Looking at this as a business decision is the only way to look at it. For 40 years when it comes to my Colts only one thing matters to me, are they doing everything they can to put the best team on the field. This decision goes against that. Money was not an obstacle.

When Montana left, Young was playing as good or better. When Favre left, Rogers was playing as good or better. When Unitas was traded he'd already been in and out of the lineup with re-occuring injuries.

IF PM is 100% (and that is still the real question) then he makes ANY team a Super Bowl contender, unless an owner just decides he wants to go in a different direction(away from the winning direction), or rebuild(built in excuse for losing). That's the kind of things Bob Irsay use to say.

Agree... everyone seems to think that Luck is plug-n-play and he is going to be just like Manning. You are trading a sure thing (when healthy) for a "who knows". There is no such thing as a sure-fire rookie. If we want to win, then we go with Manning... and who wants to plan to lose??? Rebuilding is for those who plan to lose, hate that term. Sat around here enough years listening to the Colts talk about rebuilding-- and losing. Have gotten rather used to them being competitive and exciting to watch.

By the way, I believe that Irsay, whether intentional or not, has just set up Pagano for an epic fail. How many coaches are going to get 3 years or more to lose games. You have a rookie HC (only a coordinator for 1 year)...and a rookie QB... a paper thin OL, most of our O leaders this year look like they are gone (Manning, Saturday, Garcon, Wayne), no secondary to speak of....this does not sound like a winning formula anytime soon. This is the NFL, you don't get three years to start winning- in fact how many coaches that have more than one or maybe two losing seasons in a row, keep their jobs?(BTW, Caldwell only had 1) I am just praying that Pagano has some magic up his sleeve to keep this team competitive until all the new parts can kick in.

If this is just about money, then Irsay is a lying so-n-so. If this is really about winning- then this is a dumb decision. It's one thing to lose, its another to lose on purpose. Letting go of Manning, to bet on a rookie, not a "winning" choice.

Irsay has caught lightning in a bottle once since he has owned the club- the rest of his record is not so hot (OK, downright awful).

[Upset With Irsay [Merge]]

Disagree. I think Irsay has been as transparent as we could expect in this process and he did NOT make any unqualified promises, particularly since Mannings surgeries.

He is not a liar, he does not think fans are anything less than great.

He's a leader and will take heat for this decision but, this is an unfair characterization

Unqualified promises... you mean like "If Peyton's healthy he will be a Colt next year"?? "If Peyton wants to stay, he can"?

Don't know how much more "unqualified" you want. Either the statement is true or it's not. No political doublespeak crap. Don't defend the undefensible. He lied. He misled. He backed out. He "changed his mind". He told us that he wanted to keep Manning, it wasn't about the money, etc, etc.

Call it whatever you will, but don't try to say that he never made promises- He did, and didn't keep them.

Colts fan absolutely, Irsay fan h ll no!

[The Greatest Colt Of All Time Should Have Retired A Colt.]

Does anyone think it is possible that Peyton will retire from another team? What if he goes on to be more successful, winning more superbowls, breaking more records, more MVP's and plays another 5 years? What if this decision will come back to haunt the Colts? Will the fans be angry at him or remember this decision and support his choice not to retire as a Colt?

As competitive as Manning is I would not discount this as a possibility, but the city of Indy will always be his place. You don't do what he has done with so much charity and then just walk away from the city. The football team is another matter- if he kicks our butt for the next several years and wins a SB, who knows.

[Irsay's Twitter]

I really do think Irsay is honestly trying to do what he thinks is best for the long term future of the franchise.

Too bad he is really an when it comes to making football decisions. No Polian, No Peyton= we pretty much sucked almost every year. All this new found trust in Irsay stems from remembering post 1998. After hiring Polian and the team drafting Peyton, he looks like a genius. Before that, there not a lot of love for Irsay among Colts fans. Colts fan absolutely, Irsay fan- not a chance in .....

Only thing I can say is that I hope we strike it rich twice...

[Just Say No To Peyton!]

I'm to the point now where I don't even want Peyton back on this team next year. The biggest reason I say that is because I want us as a franchise to prove we are more than just one man. I want us to succeed beyond Peyton to SHUT all these ESPN analysts up when they continue to keep bashing the Colts as of late. I want us to start anew with Luck and have the money we save from not signing Peyton to go out and get very good players in FA to help turn this team around soon.

Your thoughts on my take on this?

Thoughts are that you have a short memory, or haven't been a fan of this team pre-Manning. Pre-Manning, well, we sucked a lot of years. Since we moved to Indy, pre-Manning we struggled to have a winning season, much less consective 10+ win seasons, division titles, Super Bowl appearances, etc.

To toss this out the window like a piece of trash is, and I don't use this word lightly, stupid... don't know what will happen from here on out, but to think that somehow Luck is Plug-n-Play and things will be just as successful as Manning, that is a huge, huge assumption.

There are so many variables right now- who knows if the coach can actually lead a team? who knows if the next "can't bust" #1 pick will be more like Peyton Manning or JaMarcus Russel? who knows if we can acquire the right kind of talent to eventually replace the vets who have been with Manning- Saturday, Wayne, etc.?

Too many variables to just assume we run Manning out of town and we will suddenly be OK, much less enjoy running him out of town

(BTW if you enjoyed having a Super Bowl in Indy, thank #18)

[What Have We Done To Improve Our Running Game]

Only thing that solves our running game problem is talent on the O-line. If you look around the NFL, running backs seem to be interchangeable and lots of them can be successful in a lot of different kinds of offenses. But you need to have blocking, which we have not had for the last few years.

Polian consistently failed to address the OL with any sense of urgency. How in the world we could have turned out the O-lines we have in the last couple of years knowing our weakness there is beyond me. It didn't help our passing game either, too many rushed passes, short routes because of pressure. But we still went with underperforming draft picks (Pollack, Richards) and rookie undrafted free agents (Reitz, Link-to-a-sack). I know he hated free agency, but we needed and still need an immediate talent upgrade. New guards, and likely we will need a new center, would be a start- and picking up a decent veteran free agent would be a good start at one or maybe two of those spots.

[Reggie Wayne Open to Going to the Pats [Merge]]

IMO If Peyton leaves, Reggie is likely close behind him wherever he goes, and they would make a good pair for a team like Miami, KC or Arizona (imagine Wayne and Fitzgerald).

Can really see NE though, while I wouldn't like it, who wouldn't blame a guy for wanting a shot at a ring or two before his career is over. Also, what receiver wouldn't like to be able to say he spent his whole career catching passing from Peyton Manning AND Tom Brady.

[Mike And Mike: Jim Irsay's "hypocrisy"]

The whole time the Colts have been in Indy, Irsay has done two smart things- hire Polian and pay Peyton Manning. For those that don't remember the Colts in Indy pre-Manning we won 1 Div title and 2 playoff games (1984-1997)

Now he has fired Polian, likely will release Manning... don't like and haven't liked where this is going. The last time we were w/o Polian and Manning our winning % was south of .400 and most seasons we were prenenial losers. (see for yourself here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indianapolis_Colts_seasons)

Now I am hoping the new guys knock it out of the park, can't help but root for the Colts to win.

Whatever I think of Irsay's tweeting and endless flip-flopping in the media while decrying Peyton's every word to the media.... I just don't think our owner is a good football guy. He is the wrong guy to be making this kind of decision. If it is just about the $$$ then OK, just say it and be up front about it- that is his call as the guy who writes the checks-and quit acting like this is somehow about other things.

But if this is about Manning's readiness and ability to play football, then please leave it up to someone who knows football and football players, that's why you hire a GM, have player personnel people and, by the way, a new head coach who would like to win as many games as possible.... and quit with all the double-talk. Would feel much better if Grigson and Pagano, the football guys, would be the ones evaluating whether or not they have a football player on their team that they want to keep and feel comfortable with his health.

[The Cap]

Question here. . .

hypothetically the Colts can cut Manning, re-sign Mathis, Wayne, Garcon(even with larger contract) and some other low tier F/A's and drafted players (outside the #1 pick) and still be under the cap? I know not all the F/As are going to be re-signed but some of the more important ones can be right ? Assuming Mannings 6m savings helps here. .

And why would you keep any of these guys if you are going with rookie QB. You won't be playing for the playoffs or the SB next year... maybe evern the next couple of years. Signing all these guys may be the difference between 4/5 wins and 6/7 wins. Big deal. If you are going to go young, go young- there are enough vets under contract already to have a few around.

Besides, why would any of them want to return knowing the team is in rebuilding mode? Vets in their last few years in the league that still have something to offer, seems like they would want to be on a team with playoff and SB chances.

BTW, it is interesting that no one seems to be discussing that, even if Peyton is healthy, played last year, etc.... we still we be in a world of hurt salary cap wise. Thought Polian was supposed to be the master of the salary cap?? Seems odd after years of being able to manage cap with veteran players, that we run into this year with such a problem on our hands.

["noodle Arm"?]

Notice the tweets after that one? Now he doesn't recall the context of his noodle comment, just doesn't remember what he said.... For a guy paid to use words to explain things, don't you think he'd be more careful than to use the phrase noodle arm, or at least understand how negative that is. If he can't understand how derogatory that is..... And now he, at least to me, seems to be back-tracking a bit.

That is what someone who tries to be a bully does when he gets called out, backtracks, denies, deflects blame... sounds like a politician who just got caught... "Uh, I don't recall"...

The fact that he is so condescending, and amazingly sounds A LOT like Polian in his comments.

[Here's Another Thought On The Media(Just A Heads Up)]

It only matters if somehow you believe the * talking heads are actually reporting news... Crapitz, Wilson, all of ESPN, NFL network... all guessing at this and making it up as they go along. Stop responding as if anything they say has an ounce of real fact in it. We will know when Irsay/Manning tell us what has happened. If someone happens to guess right, I'm sure they will shout from the mountaintop that they got the "scoop" and "I told you so".

What I hate the most is the constant bashing of Irsay/Manning by people that are "tired of this thing being dragged out". The only thing I am tired of is them talking about something that the team already said it would handle in early March. Worst thing that could happen is to rush through this to get the media off their back. The only people that are dragging the story out is the talking heads and writers who aren't creative enough to tell another story (esp Kravitz/Wison who have whined to the point of annoyance about this-- neither can write anything remotely looking like a story about anything, all whining and griping these days. Hey guys, have you noticed we have a new HC.. OC and DC... ??????).

Have lost what tiny respect I had for sports media through this- really sad to see them like vultures, gladly waiting for the animal to die so they can pounce all over it. No respect what so ever.

[Phil B's Blog On Peyton...interesting]

Article is like some sniveling little child who got his feelings hurt... which is not unusual for him or Kravitz, they are wannabe national journalists who are stuck at the local level- you read this junk from them all the time. It is no wonder not many of the Colts mgmt has wanted to give them the time of day. And speaking of Colts management....Hey Phil, if you haven't noticed, the owner is sitting behind every microphone in town talking about Peyton Manning- who he said would not be the center of attention this week. He also said if Peyton is healthy he will be a Colts...his backtracks are now showing. Before you dump on Manning, take a look a little higher up the ladder and at least be honest and fair.

[The New Staff Is Really Coming Together - New Coaching Hires Merge]

It's hard to get too excited about this coaching staff. I like Pagano but he has very little experience as even a coordinator ( one year ) and Arians and Manusky seem pretty average. Now, these guys could end up being great, and I hope they do, but I can't say that they look like a sure thing.

I think I feel better about Arians hiring- he has led SB winning offense- and that O came through in clutch times. Manusky is, how can I say it, uninspiring.

This was my concern with a first time HC. If we bring Peyton back it is to make a push for SB, trying to break in a new HC. If we have rookie QB leading, well rookie QB, rookie HC just does not sound like a great combination.

Either way- whether or not I feel good about the hiring or not.. I hope they blow the doors off of the NFL

[The New Staff Is Really Coming Together - New Coaching Hires Merge]

Yes it can. The only defense that was worse on 3rd down than the Colts.... The 3-4 defense ran by Greg Manusky. They allowed 49% 3rd down conversion. Not only was that the worst 3rd down percentage allowed in 2011.... it's the worst 3rd down percentage this century (and perhaps longer, I only looked back to 2000).

I could see hiring him as a position coach- but the D in SF was always average at best, and last year w/ SD, the defense regressed bad..see the above quote.. so why our DC??? He has not been known for playing an aggressive style. Not sure what they see in him, will be interested to hear what Pagano has to say about the guy and what in the world motivated them to hire him as DC.

[Has Anyone Heard Any New Info On A Dc?]

Yes, from 5 minutes ago on Twitter, per Adam Schefter:

"Colts are interested in hiring former Chargers defensive coordinator Greg Manusky for their defensive coordinator job."

No, no, no... guy led a soft D for the 9ers for several years and the San Diego D was nearly as bad as ours was last year. Don't see how he fits a more aggresive style D like Coach Pagano has been talking about. Maybe as a position coach, but not as DC.