ben ijalana was waived

[CR91]

Because they didn't personally draft him that suggests that they don't have any attachment to him? He's a 2nd round pick (Colts) that was under contract (Colts). That's an attachment.

people in the FO often stick to a player they drafted because they dont want to admit they made a mistake taking him, but since the new regime werent the ones responsible for drafting him they see him as just another player in camp instead of a second round pick.

[buccolts]

Thats stupid to waive him!!

Time will tell.

[ruksak]

I'm not sure if this is exactly what the other poster meant, but my take is that it is way too early to determine whether there has been an organizational shift regarding injuries. We are still in the phase where the players on the roster from the previous regime are being excised without mercy and with little provocation. Grigson is marking his territory - that's what new GMs do. I'm not sure how many GMs would waive their own second round pick during his second training camp. If a guy had to retire due to injury that's one thing, but waiving him?

The point is, lets see what happens when a player that Grigson drafted shows signs of recurring injuries. He drafted Fleener and Chapman despite on-going issues. If Fleeners back flares up a few times, lets see how eager Grigson is to give up on him before talking about a philosophical shift. I would be willing to bet that he will suddenly show a lot more patience. Giving up on Ijalana just paints him as a bold, decisive leader. Giving up on Fleener would paint him as a guy who wasted a high draft pick.

I suppose it's easier to ax other people's "mistakes" as opposed to ones own.

Philosophical semantics ........Ijalana was a high draft pick only a year ago and that, IMO, is reason enough to heavily weigh the option to waive, regardless of whom exactly picked the player.

You make a good point though.

[NewColtsFan]

I'm not sure if this is exactly what the other poster meant, but my take is that it is way too early to determine whether there has been an organizational shift regarding injuries. We are still in the phase where the players on the roster from the previous regime are being excised without mercy and with little provocation. Grigson is marking his territory - that's what new GMs do. I'm not sure how many GMs would waive their own second round pick during his second training camp. If a guy had to retire due to injury that's one thing, but waiving him?

The point is, lets see what happens when a player that Grigson drafted shows signs of recurring injuries. He drafted Fleener and Chapman despite on-going issues. If Fleeners back flares up a few times, lets see how eager Grigson is to give up on him before talking about a philosophical shift. I would be willing to bet that he will suddenly show a lot more patience. Giving up on Ijalana just paints him as a bold, decisive leader. Giving up on Fleener would paint him as a guy who wasted a high draft pick.

I don't think Fleener has a history of back issues. He did get dinged here and there. Missed a game or two with a concussion. Missed some time with a high ankle sprain. But I don't think his back has been an issue.

Hope I'm right. Because if I'm wrong, my memory is fading fast!! Yikes!!

[MAC]

I don't think Fleener has a history of back issues. He did get dinged here and there. Missed a game or two with a concussion. Missed some time with a high ankle sprain. But I don't think his back has been an issue.

Hope I'm right. Because if I'm wrong, my memory is fading fast!! Yikes!!

I'm just going by what I read in the draft guide before he was taken. Lets see.............

"Had back surgery following season" (2009)

Negatives:

"Very lean build with little bulk. Average physicality and core strength - underpowered blocker. Back injury has affected lifting and requires close scrutiny - always could be a restricting as a blocker."

[TKnight24]

Ijalana looked so Promising. I just want our Draft Picks to be Healthy. Is this too much to ask For?!

[Freenyfan102]

The Indy colts......THE NEW CLF of the NFL......the new punching bag for up coming stars.

[NewColtsFan]

I'm just going by what I read in the draft guide before he was taken. Lets see.............

"Had back surgery following season" (2009)

Negatives:

"Very lean build with little bulk. Average physicality and core strength - underpowered blocker. Back injury has affected lifting and requires close scrutiny - always could be a restricting as a blocker."

ah-HA!! You had to go all the way back to 2009 after his sophomore year! You sneaky so-and-so!

Well... let me put it this way.... I'm not aware that it affected him after surgery. I don't think he missed any games because of it. And while the write-up says it affected his lifting, all I know is for his pro day, he surprised everyone with 27 lifts of 225 pounds.

But, thanks for the good 411. May I ask whose draft book you got the info from? Just curious.

Thanks again....

[deedub75]

I don't have a problem with Ijalana being released. For a man his size, it's tought to rehab a knee. Just walking on it could injure it. Two major knee surgeries in a year is a bit much to hang your hopes on.

[NewColtsFan]

Dear god we seriously are going to the Arena League now? Hopefully we resign Ijalana at some point but seriously the arena league Grigson? C'MON MAN!

Wasn't Kurt Warner found in the Arena League?

Haven't their been two or three other players to come out of that league?

Hey, I'm just askin here....

[MAC]

ah-HA!! You had to go all the way back to 2009 after his sophomore year! You sneaky so-and-so!

Well... let me put it this way.... I'm not aware that it affected him after surgery. I don't think he missed any games because of it. And while the write-up says it affected his lifting, all I know is for his pro day, he surprised everyone with 27 lifts of 225 pounds.

But, thanks for the good 411. May I ask whose draft book you got the info from? Just curious.

Thanks again....

Pro Football Weekly.

I used to just buy one of the cheaper magazines, but couldn't find the one I'd enjoyed previously (whose name escapes me). I'd heard good things about PFW, so with time running out, I actually went to Barnes and Noble and spent $19.95 on it.

Not one of those things that I'd be too specific about with my wife. Great mag though.

[NewColtsFan]

Peyton shouldn't have trusted him. He was an unproven rookie, whom Peyton had no practice time with. I wouldn't expect him to sing the guy's praises, but a vague reference to a conversation a year ago that Manning felt something was missing just doesn't hold very much weight.

And, again, what does "can't play dead" mean? And how does anyone know that Howard Mudd said it? And how is Howard Mudd an authority on Ben Ijalana, given that he's never coached him before?

Also, regarding the "Chris Polian busts," it's funny. When everyone loved the 2011 draft, the storyline was that Bill took back control in the draft room and was mostly responsible for that draft. Now that Ijalana is hurt, he's a Chris Polian bust. I should note here that, if Ijalana never plays again, he is NOT a bust.

I've been knocking the quote around in my head for some time now... and I think I've got a handle on it......

You might ask your dog to "play dead".... so, I think "can't play dead" is tantamount to saying.... 'he's so bad, he can't even play dead..." In short, it's a big insult.

As to Howard Mudd, he's already back in the NFL as a line coach with the Eagles. And Lifers like Mudd don't get out of the game, even if they take a year or so off. They stay connected. So, between his connection with the Colts and his connections with others in the NFL, Mudd may have heard less than flattering things about Ijalana from his 'grapevine'....

And, with Peyton.... he may not have played with Ijalana, but he was certainly a member of the team... he was in the locker-room.... he stayed connected to the coaching staff, his teammates, the support staff -- everyone. So, if Peyton is letting out a little "inside the locker-room" info... the kind of thing he normally wouldn't do... then again, I'd think that would not reflect well on Ijalana.

In short... I think it's more likely than not that these comments have merit, than they don't.

Just my hunch.... and I appreciate that it may be unfair to Ben... I'm clearly speculating....

[NewColtsFan]

Pro Football Weekly.

I used to just buy one of the cheaper magazines, but couldn't find the one I'd enjoyed previously (whose name escapes me). I'd heard good things about PFW, so with time running out, I actually went to Barnes and Noble and spent $19.95 on it.

Not one of those things that I'd be too specific about with my wife. Great mag though.

I hear ya.... I'm a big PFW guy myself... and to be honest, I think that magazine used to be even better.... but it's still good... so I appreciate the 411...

Good stuff...

[Gavin]

That's how you grade a draft pick. And unfortunately we don't have enough on Ijalana to say. However, the little time he did get, he was more than decent for a rookie. So it's kind of a stretch to suggest that he wasn't good. That's a definite "IF".

Besides that, the "bust" designation is whatever the user wants it to be. I don't think it's fair to label someone a bust because they have dealt with injuries in their first two seasons. Bust, to me, indicates that the player wasn't worthy of their draft position, and that's impossible to say for someone who has been hurt. If Ijalana had a history of injury in college, maybe we could go there, but he didn't.

You do expect more from a 2nd rounder, obviously, but without the benefit of hindsight, Ijalana was a very justifiable pick. It is a results based league, but it's easy to talk about busts when you have a little history on your side.

This is a very unfortunate situation, both for the player and the team. But he's not a bust. Everything about his play and his rating as a prospect says that he was a good pick for us. The fact that he's been hurt isn't a part of the equation. That's patently unfair.

He also doesn't have to be a bust in the NFL to be a bust for us, we used a 2nd round pick on the guy and cut him, it wasn;t like we were paying the guy alot in NFL terms, I believe if I remember right it was 560k something along those lines this year, I went away for a bit I dont have it handy on spotrac at the moment, but if he is picked up by another team and works out then he wont be a bust but he will be for the Colts, Personally I keep the guy, put him on IR, we had 6 other Guards I believe

[Kyle]

The Indy colts......THE NEW CLF of the NFL......the new punching bag for up coming stars.

dont be such a drama queen

[Gavin]

Wasn't Kurt Warner found in the Arena League?

Haven't their been two or three other players to come out of that league?

Hey, I'm just askin here....

Rarely

[coltsfansince65]

As a former O-lineman himself, I'm going to trust that Grigson knows a little more of what to look for when it comes to addressing the line. At 6'8" 325 lbs, the guy sounds like a beast of a man that shouldn't be easily pushed into the backfield. Besides even a guy from the arena league is better than a guy that can't make it on the field.

Just watched some film on him. He's only competed in 12 games total in the span of 3 arena seasons playing for 3 different teams.

The films look pretty good but I've got to wonder why he's only played in 12 games during his tenure.

[StewieG]

That's not the quote, and the quote isn't from Manning. This is being discussed in the link below:

http://forums.colts....ge/page__st__80

The quote is from an unnamed source, stating that Ijalana "can't play dead." Who can, by the way? What does that even mean?

What's being attributed to Manning is that he was skeptical of Ijalana, thought something was missing. Not a quote, just a vague reference to a supposed conversation a year ago.

I think its just a super poor way of saying he can't play for crap. But its weird because I always thought he looked good when he played.

[buccolts]

Rarely

So......there's a chance.

[Gavin]

So......there's a chance.

Hey Im with the Colts no matter what, whoever they pick up from wherever, we will fight, scratch and crawl our way back to the top it might just take a little longer

[cbear]

So if I understand this, they waive him because they hope someone will pick him up (thus freeing them of his salary). If he clears waivers though, why would they pick him back up and put him on IR? Wouldn't he just be an FA (albeit an injured one)?

[MR. Blueblood]

Just watched some film on him. He's only competed in 12 games total in the span of 3 arena seasons playing for 3 different teams.

The films look pretty good but I've got to wonder why he's only played in 12 games during his tenure.

I didn't do too much investigating into him, just saw that he's even caught some passes too. As far as games played to number of seasons, it's hard telling why that is. Could be injury related, could be off field issues, etc....about the only people that know for sure are the teams and him. Some people might just not fit with what you want/need. Just like you can't make a square peg fit into a round hole. Like I said Grigson played O-line so he should have a good idea what fundamentals a prospect needs to have to be successful in this league. Am I expecting him to be Pro Bowl caliber? Prob not. Am I hoping that he can come in and be a solid contributor to this team? Absolutely. Like every thing and every person in this league only time will tell.

[MR. Blueblood]

So if I understand this, they waive him because they hope someone will pick him up (thus freeing them of his salary). If he clears waivers though, why would they pick him back up and put him on IR? Wouldn't he just be an FA (albeit an injured one)?

I'll steal the answer from Superman for you.

I believe they work out an injury settlement if he clears waivers, which adjusts his contract status. And he is eligible for free agency one year after the waiver process.

Thanks for the info Superman!

[mark5362]

Dear god we seriously are going to the Arena League now? Hopefully we resign Ijalana at some point but seriously the arena league Grigson? C'MON MAN!

I believe that's where Kurt Warner came from. Not trying to compare the two,just saying.You never know.

[Jaric]

That's not the quote, and the quote isn't from Manning. This is being discussed in the link below:

http://forums.colts....ge/page__st__80

The quote is from an unnamed source, stating that Ijalana "can't play dead." Who can, by the way? What does that even mean?

What's being attributed to Manning is that he was skeptical of Ijalana, thought something was missing. Not a quote, just a vague reference to a supposed conversation a year ago.

It means he sucks. (according to the person saying it)

[krunk]

Can someone put that quote through a Peyton Manning to English translation dictionary? Cuz, I have NO idea what that quote means....

It means the guy is not good at playing anything! If he tried to play dead he wouldn't even be good at that. Much less playing football

[HtownColt]

Sad to say but realistically..two acl surgeries on the same knee as an o lineman your career is finished..being that he is young he might get another shot in a couple of years but as of right now his career is over with that knee

[unitaswestand]

I expect he will clear waivers and the Colts will put him on IR. It is done quite often in the NFL.

[Gavin]

If someone picks him up off waivers do we get a future draft pick?

[The Fish]

(out of nowhere warning)

I've been thinking about Polians current crop of drafted talent and what those guys are bringing to the table.

It's been as a generality, poor. Given the nature of the Colts cap situation prior to releasing Peyton, is it possible that Polian tried to get (how do I say this? I don't want to say he picked guys who had a higher potential to "bust" to keep the contract situation with Peyton under control ie, not paying much) too much value?

Just a thought on what was possibly the strategy on his last few drafts.

[Fx Stryker]

(out of nowhere warning)

I've been thinking about Polians current crop of drafted talent and what those guys are bringing to the table.

It's as a generality been poor. Given the nature of the Colts cap situation prior to releasing Peyton, is it possible that Polian tried to get (how do I say this? I don't want to say he picked guys who had a higher potential to "bust" to keep the contract situation with Peyton under control ie, not paying much) too much value?

Just a thought on what was possibly the strategy on his last few drafts.

No, I just think Chris was terrible. But last years draft, was the best over the few years, and rumored that was the work of Bill.

[ColtsBlueFL]

You do expect more from a 2nd rounder, obviously,

Yes, I do.

but without the benefit of hindsight, Ijalana was a very justifiable pick. It is a results based league, but it's easy to talk about busts when you have a little history on your side.

Grades and busts are totally different. Grades are evaluations before you draft. Busts are evaluations well after you draft.

This is a very unfortunate situation, both for the player and the team. But he's not a bust. Everything about his play and his rating as a prospect says that he was a good pick for us. The fact that he's been hurt isn't a part of the equation. That's patently unfair.

*. Many things in life aren't fair. . Fact- we have received almost no value from a second round pick in 2 years, and next year will be a huge ? coming of 2 straight ACL. What little we did (aside from his contribution to the salary cap, which is his only reward from my stand point) get was not well received by an All Pro and future first round selection to the HOF, and reports (agreed, not substantiated) that he was on the cut list for poor performance just before the second injury at this camp. What was spent, what was gained. That's the equation, ifs and buts and injuries are not. Here, is where we disagree.

[HtownColt]

If someone picks him up off waivers do we get a future draft pick?

Why would somebody pick up a player who is out for the season off waivers..he is goin clear waivers and the best of luck to him in the next two years because nobody is going to take a chance on him next offseason either being 2acl surgeries on the same knee

[ColtsBlueFL]

So......there's a chance.

What you did there... I see it!

h ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCFB2akLh4s LOL

[Nobody]

So......there's a chance.

http://www.lawlz.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/so-youre-telling-me-theres-a-chance-dumb-and-dumber-lloyd-christmas-meme.jpeg

[Superman]

I've been knocking the quote around in my head for some time now... and I think I've got a handle on it......

You might ask your dog to "play dead".... so, I think "can't play dead" is tantamount to saying.... 'he's so bad, he can't even play dead..." In short, it's a big insult.

Wow. Now I get it. That's actually pretty funny. I think I might use that.

...

That's really funny. LOL

As to Howard Mudd, he's already back in the NFL as a line coach with the Eagles. And Lifers like Mudd don't get out of the game, even if they take a year or so off. They stay connected. So, between his connection with the Colts and his connections with others in the NFL, Mudd may have heard less than flattering things about Ijalana from his 'grapevine'....

I respect Mudd as a long time NFL coach, but his opinion is not above reproach. To think that his designation of Ijalana as a bad player carries any weight whatsoever when he's never been in contact with him is a bit much. And it's just like local Indy media to troll up a quote from a respected former member of the staff that everyone respects.

And, by the way, no one is willing to attribute the quote to Mudd. This is a so-called connection one of the least reliable and reasonable bloggers I've ever read has made of his own accord. At this point, that so-called quote could have as easily come from Howard the Duck as from Howard Mudd.

And, with Peyton.... he may not have played with Ijalana, but he was certainly a member of the team... he was in the locker-room.... he stayed connected to the coaching staff, his teammates, the support staff -- everyone. So, if Peyton is letting out a little "inside the locker-room" info... the kind of thing he normally wouldn't do... then again, I'd think that would not reflect well on Ijalana.

Meh. Reading the transcript, this could easily have been Manning criticizing something Ijalana did on the practice field, off the record, to Chappell, as much as a year ago. It's not even a quote. It's not credible. It's a recollection of something Manning supposedly shared with Chappell, that may or may not have been a true reflection of his feeling about Ijalana as a player. And, as much as I admire and respect Manning and his knowledge of the game, his opinion of a lineman that he has never practiced or played with is largely irrelevant.

And, I repeat, this so-called comment being attributed to Manning isn't even necessarily indicative of his opinion.

For Chappell to bring this up strains credibility.

In short... I think it's more likely than not that these comments have merit, than they don't.

I disagree.

Just my hunch.... and I appreciate that it may be unfair to Ben... I'm clearly speculating....

I think my opinion is pretty clear.

[braveheartcolt]

I reserve "bust" for a situation where you pick a player and he's just not good enough to justify his draft position. And the higher up he's picked, the better he needs to be to avoid that bust designation. I'm hesitant to put that label on anyone picked outside of the top 25 or so, and all of our guys that people complain about -- Gonzo, Brown, Hughes -- were outside of that range. Some deserve the tag, though, especially Hughes. Not a good pick for our team, hasn't shown first round potential on the field... okay, call him a bust. If he blows the doors off the joint in 2012, we have to revisit that, though. Either way, to me, a bust is someone who isn't good enough to warrant being picked where he was.

Ijalana was picked in the middle of the second round, 49th. You expect a starter, maybe as a rookie, definitely within the first three years, and you expect him to be one of your better players for the next five to seven years at least. It doesn't look like he's going to be that, not at this point, but that's not because he's not good enough. It's because he got hurt. We don't really know whether he was good enough or not, but everything about his rating as a prospect and the few reps he got as a rookie suggest that he was.

Calling Ijalana a bust is revisionist history, if you ask me. It's easy to look back at a draft and say whether the team should have picked the players they did, but that's not the way it works. When you pick a highly rated player in the middle of the second round, someone who has virtually no injury history in college, and he looks decent as a rookie but suffers a season ending injury, he's not a bust. When he gets hurt again in camp, he's still not a bust. He's star-crossed, absolutely, but "bust" is reserved for players that simply aren't good enough to warrant their draft status.

Why did you set the 25th pick as your cut-off point for a BUST? Why not 32 or 10? Is it because the Colts have not picked anyone under 25 for a long time (Luck apart)? To me, a bust is someone who never contributes anything worthwhile to the team, irrespective of where he is drafted. It doesn't mean the 'BUST' is a bad guy, or our drafting startegy or our scouting teams are poor. It just means he (the player) was a wasted pick. It's not being full of hindsight either, just a fact. Every team has busts every single year, it is part of the game. Clearly the higher the pick, the severity of 'bustness' goes up.

Although this does cement Polian's legacy as a 'One Pick Wonder'

[RGIII]

As a former O-lineman himself, I'm going to trust that Grigson knows a little more of what to look for when it comes to addressing the line. At 6'8" 325 lbs, the guy sounds like a beast of a man that shouldn't be easily pushed into the backfield. Besides even a guy from the arena league is better than a guy that can't make it on the field.

Size means nothing without technique and great technique is not what you'd tend to expect from any guy whose pro experience is limited to the Arena league. Stranger things have happened, of course, but people making judgments about how a guy will play based on their size is a pet peeve of mine.

Thats stupid to waive him!!

It's actually very smart. Fans strongly underestimate just how valuable roster spots are in the NFL, even when you're looking at an expended pre-season roster. It's extremely unlikely anyone will claim Ijalana given his injury history so he'll basically wind up on IR and will have another chance to catch on with you guys next year.

Wasn't Kurt Warner found in the Arena League?

Haven't their been two or three other players to come out of that league?

Hey, I'm just askin here....

You're likely thinking of the now defunct NFL Europe. Kurt did play Arena ball as well but he is the only non-kicker to make something of himself in the NFL after a stint there. His success in NFL Europe was more noteworthy and there have been a handful of players whose success in that league was a portent of things to come (Delhomme, Warner, and Kitna all got their respective starts there at approximately the same time). To arrange the quality of the players coming out of secondary leagues visually...

USFL (RIP 1987) > CFL >> NFL Europe (RIP 2007) >>> Arena League = XFL (RIP 2001)

Also bear in mind that Warner was originally signed by the Packers out of college but couldn't work his way on to the roster against stout competition in the form of a young Brett Favre, Mark Brunell, and former Heisman Trophy winner Ty Detmer.

[jimirsaysdog]

Dear god we seriously are going to the Arena League now? Hopefully we resign Ijalana at some point but seriously the arena league Grigson? C'MON MAN!

camp body, no more no less. i believe he doesn't go through waivers until after he's had his surgery. i bet he stays with the colts. they had to make the move now to free up a spot and stay at 90 for camp.

[Nadine]

Come back Ben Ijalana. HEAL! REHAB THAT KNEE! you can do it!