Colts have the worst TE room in the league ((MERGE))

Moosejawcolt · November 27

I think by far the most disappointing feature of this team has been the tight ends. Most coaches say a tight end can be a young qbs best friend. Thia has probably caused a regression in AR's development. For those that have seen them live. Are they really that bad, and what do u see as being their reason for failing? They all apparently have athletic traits. Just wondering.

RollerColt · November 27

30 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I think by far the most disappointing feature of this team has been the tight ends. Most coaches say a tight end can be a young qbs best friend. Thia has probably caused a regression in AR's development. For those that have seen them live. Are they really that bad, and what do u see as being their reason for failing? They all apparently have athletic traits. Just wondering.

It’s pretty bad…

These guys are dropping passes in the open with no one around them. It’s not like they’re attempting tough, contested catches.

I haven’t heard the term “stone hands” thrown around here since the Luck days with Dwayne Allen… and we’ve got 4 stone hands on the team right now.

OLD FAN MAN · November 27

54 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I think by far the most disappointing feature of this team has been the tight ends. Most coaches say a tight end can be a young qbs best friend. Thia has probably caused a regression in AR's development. For those that have seen them live. Are they really that bad, and what do u see as being their reason for failing? They all apparently have athletic traits. Just wondering.

moe seems to catch the ball but is seldom targeted is he being used to just help block because our oline is so bad?

coltsfeva · November 27

I don’t know. I look back over the past year and a half and I’ve seen some great catches by Granson, and Ogletree. MAC and Mallory were pretty steady, not spectacular but steady.

Woods had a couple of great games before he got hurt.

Then Sunday rolls around and you get Granson not ready for the ball and Ogletree trying to score before he catches the ball and all-of-a-sudden-NOBODY IN THE TE ROOM CAN CATCH !! (Supposedly)
I for one don’t believe it. I think a lot of their “ineptitude” is scheme. Seems they’re blocking on a lot of plays.

It kinda blew up Sunday against the Lions; Two guys had two bad plays and everybody blows it out of proportion. I can remember not so long ago, when it was a really hard decision on which TE should be let go. So tough, in fact, that the Colts kept all 5 and it kinda made sense at the time.

When you lose, opinions start flying, like sh#^ hitting the fan

Maybe everybody is right: maybe the sky is falling. As long as they have a chance, I’m just going to hope for the best.

Rolltide_gocolts · November 27

Athletic traits are different from football traits… hell our #1 TE is a bball player… every TE on our roster is more athletic than Jack Doyle but Jack Doyle is 3 times the TE/ football player they are

DavePSL · November 27

What makes it worse is they are not that good at blocking either. An offense is so much easier to defend when you dont have a threat at TE and that's why I have been saying for 2 years we have to get AR a real TE because it will go a long way toward his growth. I never for one second bought the "crowded TE room" talk. It was nonsense to start with. We have had different systems with different QB's and none of them have come close to being a reliable threat and not playing Mallory just makes no sense at all. Why not give him a legit shot ........................................and implying that we need a blocking TE is nonsense with what we pay our OL . The great TE's are not known for blocking and shouldn't be....and good OL's shouldn't need help from TE's near as much as our TE's stay in and block and sometimes with a RB blocking too.

Think about this. When we have 2 TE's blocking ,that means the only players that need to be defended is 2 wr's. Bad strategy, especially for a young QB. Spread the defense out and let AR get use his legs to move and find more targets down field or he will kill them running.

Boondoggle · November 27

Yeah they're bad. It's a big need.

jbaron04 · November 27

5 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I think by far the most disappointing feature of this team has been the tight ends. Most coaches say a tight end can be a young qbs best friend. Thia has probably caused a regression in AR's development. For those that have seen them live. Are they really that bad, and what do u see as being their reason for failing? They all apparently have athletic traits. Just wondering.

Ballard always ignores obvious needs I don’t understand how he can literally know the team is weak at a position and just say oh well. The TEs are very very bad, Mo is slightly average blocker but not good at running routes, slow and can’t catch. Olgetree is average blocker but not good at routes and has slight below average hands. Granson is the worst of the bunch can’t block , can’t catch , and always slipping on routes but can separate when he not slipping but slipping lead to 2-3 of AR int this year. Mallory is fast and can catch but not polished route runner and very bad blocker. Long story short they all suck but I would run with Mallory since he can atleast catch and run and Mo since he is a big body

jbaron04 · November 27

4 hours ago, Boondoggle said:

Yeah they're bad. It's a big need.

“I like my guys” lol been a need for pass few years

DavePSL · November 27

4 hours ago, jbaron04 said:

Ballard always ignores obvious needs I don’t understand how he can literally know the team is weak at a position and just say oh well. The TEs are very very bad, Mo is slightly average blocker but not good at running routes, slow and can’t catch. Olgetree is average blocker but not good at routes and has slight below average hands. Granson is the worst of the bunch can’t block , can’t catch , and always slipping on routes but can separate when he not slipping but slipping lead to 2-3 of AR int this year. Mallory is fast and can catch but not polished route runner and very bad blocker. Long story short they all suck but I would run with Mallory since he can atleast catch and run and Mo since he is a big body

Bingo.......and this could be the reason why Irsay ends up cleaning house. He has watched how 2 young franchise QB's have been groomed and each had their own success. He is now seeing how AR is being groomed and that could be what breaks the camels back. From not getting AR TE's, to his benching, to sending 3 rookie OLman out there to protect AR, and SS play calling at times...It's not a good look for Ballard or SS. Remember , Luck retired early supposedly because he was tired of fighting injuries and getting beat up. Some of this looks like a repeat.

John Hammonds · November 27

We can't underestimate how much effect there is from Jelani Woods' 2-year injury. He was supposed to be The Guy. The rest of them - Granson, Ogletree, Mallory -- were all supposed to be complementary pieces to Woods. He was supposed to be the guy who replaced the capped out MAC.

Not saying that Woods would have absolutely developed into a pro bowl TE. But this was supposed to be his job. Of course the TE room is awful. None of these guys were supposed to be the starter.

Solid84 · November 27

2 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

We can't underestimate how much effect there is from Jelani Woods' 2-year injury. He was supposed to be The Guy. The rest of them - Granson, Ogletree, Mallory -- were all supposed to be complementary pieces to Woods. He was supposed to be the guy who replaced the capped out MAC.

Not saying that Woods would have absolutely developed into a pro bowl TE. But this was supposed to be his job. Of course the TE room is awful. None of these guys were supposed to be the starter.

I agree, but at some point you have to accept the situation is what it is. We don't know what we have with Woods and going into his 3rd season missing A LOT of games we can't really rely on him to be that guy. We keep him of course, but develop him in a backup role.

Granson has to go. He keeps disappointing and the fact the Colts still roll him out as the primary receiving TE is mind-boggling honestly.

Mo flashes from time to time, but he's soooo slow and lumbering. I hoped Ogletree would be Mo with more speed, but honestly he disappoints more often than he flashes at this point.

I have no idea what we have with Mallory, but since he isn't playing I assume he's disappointing in practice, right?

I just can't see a scenario where TE isn't a need for us this offseason.

John Hammonds · November 27

14 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I agree, but at some point you have to accept the situation is what it is. We don't know what we have with Woods and going into his 3rd season missing A LOT of games we can't really rely on him to be that guy. We keep him of course, but develop him in a backup role.

Granson has to go. He keeps disappointing and the fact the Colts still roll him out as the primary receiving TE is mind-boggling honestly.

Mo flashes from time to time, but he's soooo slow and lumbering. I hoped Ogletree would be Mo with more speed, but honestly he disappoints more often than he flashes at this point.

I have no idea what we have with Mallory, but since he isn't playing I assume he's disappointing in practice, right?

I just can't see a scenario where TE isn't a need for us this offseason.

Unfortunately, our options for addressing the issue are limited. Do we dedicate a high draft pick to it? Does TE outrank our other needs at LB, CB, DL? What about the traits of those TE's that would be available during the high rounds?

Colston Loveland, Michigan - The highest ranked, and most plugged. I've watched a little film on him. I'm not all that impressed. Yes, he can "do stuff". But can he do stuff at such a high level that it warrants a mid-first round pick?

Tyler Warren, Penn State - More productive than Loveland, and also a lot bigger. I haven't watched film yet, but I would lean more towards him than Loveland. He's projected at pick 30 by Tankathon. Again, do we really want to pick this high with other pressing needs on the table?

Harold Fanning, Bowling Green - Insanely productive. However, he's smaller than Granson. And his productivity is against lesser competition. Not sure we'd want to go this route.

Mason Taylor, LSU - Projected in the 3rd round. Roughly the same kind of stats that we saw coming from Granson and Mallory when they were coming out. Not sure this is an upgrade.

Our other option is to look at free agency. Um.... Maybe not. Our own MAC and Granson are listed among the better options. Maybe Mike Gesike from the Bengals is the best free agent prospect?

As you can see, an upgrade at TE is a need, but just how do we do it? Do we wait and see what Woods can be? Dare we?

IndyEV · November 27

5 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Unfortunately, our options for addressing the issue are limited. Do we dedicate a high draft pick to it? Does TE outrank our other needs at LB, CB, DL? What about the traits of those TE's that would be available during the high rounds?

Colston Loveland, Michigan - The highest ranked, and most plugged. I've watched a little film on him. I'm not all that impressed. Yes, he can "do stuff". But can he do stuff at such a high level that it warrants a mid-first round pick?

Tyler Warren, Penn State - More productive than Loveland, and also a lot bigger. I haven't watched film yet, but I would lean more towards him than Loveland. He's projected at pick 30 by Tankathon. Again, do we really want to pick this high with other pressing needs on the table?

Harold Fanning, Bowling Green - Insanely productive. However, he's smaller than Granson. And his productivity is against lesser competition. Not sure we'd want to go this route.

Mason Taylor, LSU - Projected in the 3rd round. Roughly the same kind of stats that we saw coming from Granson and Mallory when they were coming out. Not sure this is an upgrade.

Our other option is to look at free agency. Um.... Maybe not. Our own MAC and Granson are listed among the better options. Maybe Mike Gesike from the Bengals is the best free agent prospect?

As you can see, an upgrade at TE is a need, but just how do we do it? Do we wait and see what Woods can be? Dare we?

Zack Horton at IU is an all-around good TE! He’s a possible Mackey award finalist. Would fit well with the Colts!

richard pallo · November 27

2 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

We can't underestimate how much effect there is from Jelani Woods' 2-year injury. He was supposed to be The Guy. The rest of them - Granson, Ogletree, Mallory -- were all supposed to be complementary pieces to Woods. He was supposed to be the guy who replaced the capped out MAC.

Not saying that Woods would have absolutely developed into a pro bowl TE. But this was supposed to be his job. Of course the TE room is awful. None of these guys were supposed to be the starter.

Exactly and we know Ballard tried to move up for Bowers but if you can't find a trade partner there is nothing you can do about that. I'm sure he will address the position this offseason. He knows it's a weakness. He'll address it by trade, FA or the draft.

Solid84 · November 27

17 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Unfortunately, our options for addressing the issue are limited. Do we dedicate a high draft pick to it? Does TE outrank our other needs at LB, CB, DL? What about the traits of those TE's that would be available during the high rounds?

Colston Loveland, Michigan - The highest ranked, and most plugged. I've watched a little film on him. I'm not all that impressed. Yes, he can "do stuff". But can he do stuff at such a high level that it warrants a mid-first round pick?

Tyler Warren, Penn State - More productive than Loveland, and also a lot bigger. I haven't watched film yet, but I would lean more towards him than Loveland. He's projected at pick 30 by Tankathon. Again, do we really want to pick this high with other pressing needs on the table?

Harold Fanning, Bowling Green - Insanely productive. However, he's smaller than Granson. And his productivity is against lesser competition. Not sure we'd want to go this route.

Mason Taylor, LSU - Projected in the 3rd round. Roughly the same kind of stats that we saw coming from Granson and Mallory when they were coming out. Not sure this is an upgrade.

Our other option is to look at free agency. Um.... Maybe not. Our own MAC and Granson are listed among the better options. Maybe Mike Gesike from the Bengals is the best free agent prospect?

As you can see, an upgrade at TE is a need, but just how do we do it? Do we wait and see what Woods can be? Dare we?

I prefer Warren, because he's a bigger guy. If we were to look at a smaller prospect I'd take Fannin over Loveland.

I'm not really high on anyone other than Loveland, Warren and Fannin. If that's where the Colts are looking it's mostly just picking a guy to pick a guy in my opinion we have plenty of that.

I don't think there are any quality TEs available in FA this offseason. To me it's either a top draft prospect or maybe a trade (unlikely).

I think you can find decent enough safeties and linebackers in round 2-4 this draft.

Indyfan4life · November 27

AR with a TE like Bowers/Kelce/McBride would be incredibly dangerous. Too bad Ballard doesn’t give a %.

2006Coltsbestever · November 27

8 minutes ago, Indyfan4life said:

AR with a TE like Bowers/Kelce/McBride would be incredibly dangerous. Too bad Ballard doesn’t give a %.

I did this at your last sentence = because it seems like he might not. His days are almost numbered unless we win out and make the Playoffs and AR plays good.

richard pallo · November 27

17 minutes ago, Indyfan4life said:

AR with a TE like Bowers/Kelce/McBride would be incredibly dangerous. Too bad Ballard doesn’t give a %.

lol.

lester · November 27

16 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

His days are almost numbered unless we win out and make the Playoffs and AR plays good.

It has been stated that Irsay does not require the playoffs this year. The goal has been 'progress'. The question isn't, "Is Ballard perfect?; or Did we finally win some?" - the question is, "Did the team (specifically AR) show progress to warrant more time to let the plan work?"

If AR is getting better, demonstrably so, then Irsay isn't (my opinion, but not an uniformed opinion) going to pull the plug this year.

And for those among you who often post as if you are patience impaired (maybe because you think it has been long enough already, or whatever reason), pulling the plug now means you need patience. Again.

So, is AR putting it all together and the team getting closer; or is AR a failed experiment already? That is what you should be asking.

My opinion? Stopping now would be foolish.

Keep going.

I am reminded of this refrain from Adlai Stephenson:

On the plains of hesitation

lie the blackened bones of countless millions

who at the dawn of victory

lay down to rest, and in resting died.

It means; keep going even when you think its over. It isn't.

2006Coltsbestever · November 27

24 minutes ago, lester said:

It has been stated that Irsay does not require the playoffs this year. The goal has been 'progress'. The question isn't, "Is Ballard perfect?; or Did we finally win some?" - the question is, "Did the team (specifically AR) show progress to warrant more time to let the plan work?"

If AR is getting better, demonstrably so, then Irsay isn't (my opinion, but not an uniformed opinion) going to pull the plug this year.

And for those among you who often post as if you are patience impaired (maybe because you think it has been long enough already, or whatever reason), pulling the plug now means you need patience. Again.

So, is AR putting it all together and the team getting closer; or is AR a failed experiment already? That is what you should be asking.

My opinion? Stopping now would be foolish.

Keep going.

I am reminded of this refrain from Adlai Stephenson:

On the plains of hesitation

lie the blackened bones of countless millions

who at the dawn of victory

lay down to rest, and in resting died.

It means; keep going even when you think its over. It isn't.

I also did post if AR plays good as well. I think out of anyone in here I have had more patience than most.

Kyle · November 27

6 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

We can't underestimate how much effect there is from Jelani Woods' 2-year injury. He was supposed to be The Guy. The rest of them - Granson, Ogletree, Mallory -- were all supposed to be complementary pieces to Woods. He was supposed to be the guy who replaced the capped out MAC.

Not saying that Woods would have absolutely developed into a pro bowl TE. But this was supposed to be his job. Of course the TE room is awful. None of these guys were supposed to be the starter.

I think we also wanted to draft Brock Bowers but missed out.

KB · November 27

Granson has completely regressed this year. He was a fairly reliable target between the red zones last year. He can't do anything right this year. He has become a waster of a roster spot. I don't see how Mallorie dosnt get some of his snaps.

Moe has be Moe. I'd be ok with him staying tbh. Nothing great but the best we have and have had since Jack Doyel.

stitches · November 27

With the way we are playing and with the nature of AR as a thrower I personally would be looking at receiving options with good hands... natural catchers of the ball before anything else. With TEs I usually look for YAC ability. I think it's a very good for projecting productivity. But with AR... he needs better placement on throws that are conducive to YAC - crossers, slants, etc. So yeah... hands... and YAC. This is what I want from our next TE.

Solid84 · November 27

2 hours ago, stitches said:

With the way we are playing and with the nature of AR as a thrower I personally would be looking at receiving options with good hands... natural catchers of the ball before anything else. With TEs I usually look for YAC ability. I think it's a very good for projecting productivity. But with AR... he needs better placement on throws that are conducive to YAC - crossers, slants, etc. So yeah... hands... and YAC. This is what I want from our next TE.

Yeah, matches Fannin and Warren pretty good. At 230 Fannin is more like a big receiver though. Don't know if I'm a fan of that. Warren is more traditional TE size at 261.

I like Missed Tackles Forced as well. Speaks to their elusiveness with the ball in their hands.

indyagent17 · November 28

8 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

Unfortunately, our options for addressing the issue are limited. Do we dedicate a high draft pick to it? Does TE outrank our other needs at LB, CB, DL? What about the traits of those TE's that would be available during the high rounds?

Colston Loveland, Michigan - The highest ranked, and most plugged. I've watched a little film on him. I'm not all that impressed. Yes, he can "do stuff". But can he do stuff at such a high level that it warrants a mid-first round pick?

Tyler Warren, Penn State - More productive than Loveland, and also a lot bigger. I haven't watched film yet, but I would lean more towards him than Loveland. He's projected at pick 30 by Tankathon. Again, do we really want to pick this high with other pressing needs on the table?

Harold Fanning, Bowling Green - Insanely productive. However, he's smaller than Granson. And his productivity is against lesser competition. Not sure we'd want to go this route.

Mason Taylor, LSU - Projected in the 3rd round. Roughly the same kind of stats that we saw coming from Granson and Mallory when they were coming out. Not sure this is an upgrade.

Our other option is to look at free agency. Um.... Maybe not. Our own MAC and Granson are listed among the better options. Maybe Mike Gesike from the Bengals is the best free agent prospect?

As you can see, an upgrade at TE is a need, but just how do we do it? Do we wait and see what Woods can be? Dare we?

Do these guys have a work ethic that can’t be destroyed by this soft and lazy culture?

LJpalmbeacher2 · November 28

Just wait until Jelani Woods gets and stays healthy one of these years. haha

Boondoggle · November 28

This is a rather weak TE group. So I expect the top two will go off the board quickly as both should be projected to help teams out. Colts should be in play for one of them I'd imagine, unless they end up drafting very high.

NewColtsFan · November 28

2 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

Do these guys have a work ethic that can’t be destroyed by this soft and lazy culture?

I love how you reference this “soft and lazy culture” like it’s established fact. Because it’s not. But carry on….

crazycolt1 · November 28

3 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

Do these guys have a work ethic that can’t be destroyed by this soft and lazy culture?

You have to be kidding? Right?

GoColts8818 · November 28

Are bad

Hawkeyecolt · November 28

That was the first ball that I’ve seen Ogletree drop and he’s graded as one of the best blocking TE’s by PFF. He got called for a holding penalty after MAC blew his block.

Granson has been terrible. One reason is that his type of TE isn’t really in vogue now. More teams are playing a 4-2-5 or playing a LB/S hybrid. I’m not sure why he’s playing ahead of Mallory at this point.

MAC is pretty limited as a receiver due to his lack of speed. His hand have always been ok not great. He was terrible as a blocker in 2023. He’s done a decent job this year.

Ogletree and MAC are ideally #2 TE’s. Ogletree can do what MAC does for a fraction of the salary. However, the planned #1 TE hasn’t been able to get on the field and after two years the Colts can’t count on him next year.

I hope they let MAC and Granson walk and draft Warren in rd 1. However, I don’t call TE the most disappointing because the room was full of question marks. Especially after Woods went down. I’d like to have four TE’s next year not five. Warren, Ogletree, Mallory, Woods.

To, me the biggest disappointment has been the LB’s. They were build as a solid to good pair but quite frankly they stink. Zaire has regressed and Speed hasn’t improved at all. Probably regressed too.

AwesomeAustin · November 28

TE is one of the hardest positions to fill. I question if there are 32 starting caliber TEs available league wide. We are asking for someone around 6’4” and 255lbs that can run a 4.7 or less 40. They need to be able to anchor blocking against DEs and pull with the vision into second level of the defense to pickup who is free. They also need to be able be able to release off blocks, run routes and have the sense of where to find gap areas in coverage. Plus they have to be durable bc they are going to be undersize blocking DL and take hits over the middle of the field by LBs and safeties crashing down.

Thats a lot to ask of one person so why TEs are often over drafted and good ones dont hit free agency often. I personally feel we have multiple 2nd and 3rd TEs on our roster. None of them are all around starter worthy but a couple offer enough they are serviceable. Our “franchise” TE is not on the roster.

BTW, whenever I hear we should play someone to see what we have…we have no one. It’s so very seldom you take out a struggling starter and throw the backup in and it works out. I understand there are exceptions but typically, it ends up being a disaster.

jemack · November 28

I wanted to trade up for Bowers. We need a big frame TE that can take on DEs and can catch. Warren will be our best option. If we trade down, we can have at least 2 decent 2nd round picks and a very good TE.

indyagent17 · November 28

13 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

You have to be kidding? Right?

Lazy!

funktacious2 · November 28

9 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

That was the first ball that I’ve seen Ogletree drop and he’s graded as one of the best blocking TE’s by PFF. He got called for a holding penalty after MAC blew his block.

Granson has been terrible. One reason is that his type of TE isn’t really in vogue now. More teams are playing a 4-2-5 or playing a LB/S hybrid. I’m not sure why he’s playing ahead of Mallory at this point.

MAC is pretty limited as a receiver due to his lack of speed. His hand have always been ok not great. He was terrible as a blocker in 2023. He’s done a decent job this year.

Ogletree and MAC are ideally #2 TE’s. Ogletree can do what MAC does for a fraction of the salary. However, the planned #1 TE hasn’t been able to get on the field and after two years the Colts can’t count on him next year.

I hope they let MAC and Granson walk and draft Warren in rd 1. However, I don’t call TE the most disappointing because the room was full of question marks. Especially after Woods went down. I’d like to have four TE’s next year not five. Warren, Ogletree, Mallory, Woods.

To, me the biggest disappointment has been the LB’s. They were build as a solid to good pair but quite frankly they stink. Zaire has regressed and Speed hasn’t improved at all. Probably regressed too.

.

Thank you. I think some people are overreacting. They aren’t terrible but they did have a poor game. They are just a group of solid guys who should be our number 2+ options and not our number 1. We reportedly tried hard to get Bowers this year but it didn’t work out, so it seems we know it’s an area we want to see improve but if we just throw a 2-3rd round pick at the problem the chances become higher and higher that we just end up with another guy of the same caliber as what we already have.

I personally like Tyler Warren a lot for next year, especially if we can trade back a bit. (Yeah I know not the best draft class, but the positions we need are undervalued so so think we can find solid value)

crazycolt1 · November 28

44 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

Lazy!

Having a drop by a TE does not establish they are lazy. Your judgment needs improvement.

GoColts8818 · November 28

4 hours ago, jemack said:

I wanted to trade up for Bowers. We need a big frame TE that can take on DEs and can catch. Warren will be our best option. If we trade down, we can have at least 2 decent 2nd round picks and a very good TE.

So did Ballard. He couldn’t find a trade partner he tried. There is even footage of him trying to trade with the Giants.

jemack · November 28

1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

So did Ballard. He couldn’t find a trade partner he tried. There is even footage of him trying to trade with the Giants.

I know and I don't think Woods will be the answer either.

indyagent17 · November 28

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Having a drop by a TE does not establish they are lazy. Your judgment needs improvement.

Dude, have you watched our tight ends all season? I’ve never seen so many rounded routes and not giving full effort on every play. I watch the games and I see these things so your judgment needs to be adjusted. I do appreciate the personal attack happy Thanksgiving.

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