An outsiders view of the Colts

[twfish]

We all grilled Ballard on not getting any free agents this past offseason. Now knowing how the QB situation has been, would any of the free agents have done anything? I truly hope with an easier schedule it helps continue AR’s development. The jets game was a great game for him but I think him putting up a string of dominant performances would make a world of difference for him. If he continues playing well and continues to push up his competition percentage then I feel a lot more confident. If he can’t then in Ballard own words QB’s are what gets GM’s fired.

[twfish]

38 minutes ago, BlackTiger said:

That is being generous, they let off the gas because they knew colts were not going to put up many points

 

Ar wasnt terrible but im not going to praise an 11 completion game at 38%

Making this claims make it sounds like you didn’t watch the game. Not riding AR here but he looked a lot better than what a box score shows. Throw on top of nearly 100 yards in passing that came back due to b.s penalties.

[BlackTiger]

5 minutes ago, twfish said:

Making this claims make it sounds like you didn’t watch the game.

I did watch, people are giving him a low standard for a good passing game.  Good qbs dont really have days like that.  he missed throws too

[BlackTiger]

11 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

They let off the gas in the first half??

They did after their TD in the third quarter, they knew colts were not getting 20+ points

 

Youre making it sound like a low scoring game, they had 24.  not that low

[NFLfan]

12 minutes ago, BlackTiger said:

They did after their TD in the third quarter, they knew colts were not getting 20+ points

 

Youre making it sound like a low scoring game, they had 24.  not that low

 

For the Lions, 24 points is low. The Lions try to score at every opportunity. The Lions were up 42-6 against Jags after the 3rd quarter. They continued to add to their points. The Lions won 52-6.

[VikingsFanInChennai]

13 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

I disagree. The Lions dropped 50 points on the Jags and Titans. It was not necessary but they continued to do so. The Colts limited Detroit's chances to score by sustaining drives on offense.  That was because of Richardson. You and I used to complain about Kirk's failure to sustain drives. Richardson was making plays to extend drives.

 

Look at this game today. The Lions are already up 16-0 in the second quarter. The Bears are not sustaining drives and are giving the ball back to the Lions offense.

Lions have seen some stuttering in these two games as you said, but if the game gets any closer than it were in those games, I'm sure we'd have seen some big plays from Lions' passing game like the ones they scripted with Jameson Williams in earlier 2 games, I feel they just didn't go for expanded playbook and mostly relied on their ground attack to get them points. In Chicago game, Gibbs had an uncharacteristic fumble in the end zone, and otherwise Lions would've gone on to a big score. Some games just don't fall that way when even your juggernaut offense has some hiccups too.

 

Rams, Bucs, Vikings and Texans are the teams that took them close to 4th quarter finish or beyond and stopped their offense to have a match.

[Jz0204945]

On 11/27/2024 at 5:30 PM, crazycolt1 said:

It's easy to sit back and judge the GMs position and have an opinion of wanting him fired without looking past that move.  The odds are 31 to 1 before the season starts.  Ballard has been very good at evaluating talent.  The only thing that has held the Colts back is the QB position.  Luck leaving put this team back 3 years. Rivers was a great signing but retired after 1 season when it was thought we would get at least 2 years out of him.  Next was the signing of Ryan and everyone including me thought that was a great signing.  

I truly believe that AR is going to be the future of the Colts.  

This opinion of firing Ballard is short sighted in the bigger picture.  IMO firing Ballard is not feasible to Irsay.  This nonstop talk of firing Ballard is a waste of time. 

Ya just does noth free agent wise and it shows the teams competing for superbowls are buying superbowls. Also if he is such a great talent evaluator then why is this team no closer today than the day he was hired to being a contender.

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, Jz0204945 said:

Ya just does noth free agent wise and it shows the teams competing for superbowls are buying superbowls. Also if he is such a great talent evaluator then why is this team no closer today than the day he was hired to being a contender.

Because of the QB situation. Try looking at the reasons instead of wanting him gone. 

[Flash7]

On 11/27/2024 at 9:29 PM, crazycolt1 said:

Hindsight is a wonderful thing when pushing a narrative. 

How else do you evaluate someone's work history? Isn't reviewing past successes and failures the prudent thing to do when determining whether someone has performed well or not?

[richard pallo]

15 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Because of the QB situation. Try looking at the reasons instead of wanting him gone. 

It’s amazing how so many people don’t understand the importance of the quarterback position to a team’s success.  Like it’s so easy to find one too.  Any GM can do it.  Why not Ballard?  Well just maybe he has.  We will have a better idea at the end of the season.  So let’s see how it plays out.  

[Flash7]

43 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Because of the QB situation. Try looking at the reasons instead of wanting him gone. 

Ballard was left in a really bad spot after Andrew Luck retired and the QB position is the most important position in football, but that doesn't excuse Ballard's poor choices.

 

2019 - He had no choice but to go with Jacoby Brissett after Luck's retirement.

2020- He CHOSE to bring in Philip Rivers, who was already old and ready to retire. There was 0% chance this was the answer to the QB position. Zero.

2021 - Carson Wentz - A horrible decision that did not work out.

2022 - Matt Ryan - The Philip Rivers situation all over again, but much worse. ZERO chance this was going to be the answer at the QB position.

2022 - Nick Foles - Blah

2023 - AR at pick #4 - a highly athletic, inexperienced, QB with a history of injuries. 

2023 - Gardner Minshew - He was actually decent. Not good, but not bad either.

2024 - AR - Currently going through the struggles of a QB learning on the job. 

2024 - Joe Flacco - Another old QB that has ZERO chance of being the answer at the QB position. I know he was brought in to be a backup to AR but with AR's injury history, he's the de facto starter, like Minshew was.

 

Overall, if any other GM had made these decisions it would be easy to see how bad they were. But, because the Colts GM made these decisions and we wear Colts colored glasses, we give it a pass......all because Andre Luck retired in 2019.

[ColtStrong2013]

12 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

How else do you evaluate someone's work history? Isn't reviewing past successes and failures the prudent thing to do when determining whether someone has performed well or not?

How you evaluate a GM and how Jim Irsay evaluates him is on different spectrums. You evaluate strictly on wins and losses, and some owners may put a great emphasis on that, but it’s greatly diminishing the responsibilities of a GM in a multi billion dollar nfl organization. 

[Flash7]

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

How you evaluate a GM and how Jim Irsay evaluates him is on different spectrums. You evaluate strictly on wins and losses, and some owners may put a great emphasis on that, but it’s greatly diminishing the responsibilities of a GM in a multi billion dollar nfl organization. 

My evaluation is irrelevant. I'm just a fan.

 

But on this forum, I don't see how else we as fans can evaluate the GM without looking at his past successes and failures.

[crazycolt1]

4 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

Ballard was left in a really bad spot after Andrew Luck retired and the QB position is the most important position in football, but that doesn't excuse Ballard's poor choices.

 

2019 - He had no choice but to go with Jacoby Brissett after Luck's retirement.

2020- He CHOSE to bring in Philip Rivers, who was already old and ready to retire. There was 0% chance this was the answer to the QB position. Zero.

2021 - Carson Wentz - A horrible decision that did not work out.

2022 - Matt Ryan - The Philip Rivers situation all over again, but much worse. ZERO chance this was going to be the answer at the QB position.

2022 - Nick Foles - Blah

2023 - AR at pick #4 - a highly athletic, inexperienced, QB with a history of injuries. 

2023 - Gardner Minshew - He was actually decent. Not good, but not bad either.

2024 - AR - Currently going through the struggles of a QB learning on the job. 

2024 - Joe Flacco - Another old QB that has ZERO chance of being the answer at the QB position. I know he was brought in to be a backup to AR but with AR's injury history, he's the de facto starter, like Minshew was.

 

Overall, if any other GM had made these decisions it would be easy to see how bad they were. But, because the Colts GM made these decisions and we wear Colts colored glasses, we give it a pass......all because Andre Luck retired in 2019.

Look, I'm not trying to be arguimentive but Ballard is not a bad GM Irsay is not going to fire Ballard anything soon. Might as well either accept it or continue to whine.

[Dingus McGirt]

The only way to evaluate the General Manager of a business is by review the annual Profit and Loss Statement.

[ColtStrong2013]

1 hour ago, Flash7 said:

My evaluation is irrelevant. I'm just a fan.

 

But on this forum, I don't see how else we as fans can evaluate the GM without looking at his past successes and failures.

 

And you are not wrong with that perspective. But there are many Colts fans that think it's black and white, and that he needs to be fired solely on not making this franchise a championship winning team, and it's far more nuanced than that. No one wants to be honest about that, nor that Chris Ballard could very well be exceptionally good at all aspects except roster building a championship team, which is what those people say is what a GM is judged by. I dispute it. If they are great at everything else, and average at roster building, it's not black and white. 

 

23 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

The only way to evaluate the General Manager of a business is by review the annual Profit and Loss Statement.

 

That's not entirely true. You could have great financials and horrible culture, high turnover, and really poor processes that doesn't show up on paper because they are masked by a really good multi-year run in sales which could be anomalies. 

[Dingus McGirt]

1 hour ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

And you are not wrong with that perspective. But there are many Colts fans that think it's black and white, and that he needs to be fired solely on not making this franchise a championship winning team, and it's far more nuanced than that. No one wants to be honest about that, nor that Chris Ballard could very well be exceptionally good at all aspects except roster building a championship team, which is what those people say is what a GM is judged by. I dispute it. If they are great at everything else, and average at roster building, it's not black and white. 

 

 

That's not entirely true. You could have great financials and horrible culture, high turnover, and really poor processes that doesn't show up on paper because they are masked by a really good multi-year run in sales which could be anomalies. 

True.  But, my point remains…it’s a business.  Granted, one of “entertainment.”

[ColtStrong2013]

50 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

True.  But, my point remains…it’s a business.  Granted, one of “entertainment.”

 

Indeed. And I think the entertainment aspect gets lost discussing management sometimes because of the wins and losses. 

I've used the point several times here, but I have gone to plenty of games during the Ballard tenure and the entertainment component is every bit there if not ramped up. Plenty of people that go to the games (and would like to go for that matter) that aren't remotely interested in what is happening on the field. The Colts marketing is exceptional. I don't know how much Ballard's involved in that, but if he's working with P&L's and that's a huge measurement of his efficiency, then you can bet he's involved to some degree. He's certainly been a hell of a salesman. 

[throwing BBZ]

 

 An incredibly boring video. With a dart board jabbering rehash.

 

 Let's hope and pray Richardson's play shows us the signs that he Will be a playoff caliber guy someday.

 Ballard has drafted some high quality anchors. 

Something that isn't discussed is how his drafts and QB moves were influenced by Frank's approach. This Imo is why he gets some pass.

 He, we, got Franked. How good of a job was done developing those players? Some surprise breakout players?

 

 Anyway, rosters get heavily churned every 3-4 years and this next off season will have the opportunity for important moves, especially if Richardson steps it up.

 

 

[#12.]

In recent years,  Ballard has drafted more players higher on PFF's board.  If they like him more than the average person does,  it's not surprising.  Last year, they had Latu #9 and Mitchell #21.  

 

[Jz0204945]

8 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Because of the QB situation. Try looking at the reasons instead of wanting him gone. 

I want him gone because he isnt doing near enough to improve this team and what he is doing has been an epic failure for 8 years and he wont change or adapt.

[crazycolt1]

19 minutes ago, Jz0204945 said:

I want him gone because he isnt doing near enough to improve this team and what he is doing has been an epic failure for 8 years and he wont change or adapt.

Sorry, I don't agree.  If AR pans out Ballard will be here for a very long time.  

Firing is not the answer. 

[Boondoggle]

Ballard is mediocre at best as a GM.  From there the question of who likes him doesn't really matter to me.  Building a roster isn't about politicking, it's about winning.  Wins are all that matters.

 

First and most important thing is the head coaching hires.  It's a crucial call for a GM and in that regard I do like Ballard's taste in coaches.  I don't like that he feels the need to hire coordinators, or his taste in DCs, though Eberflus did a good job overall.

 

On the FA side I think he's below average.  I don't like his feel for the vet players.  Also he lets his original evaluations ride too long with players I think, and that affects his efficiency with his cap investment.  Colts as a result lock a lot of money up in players who aren't game changers.

 

Draft I'd say he's solid but he's not been able to hit on the game changers.  And I think he whiffed with a high QB pick.

 

Once again I'm not calling for his job or anything.  I just don't think he's anything special.  I'd keep him around because I don't want to hurt the current head coach's chances to grow, as a new GM would want his own guy.  If and when the coach goes, I would fire Ballard as well.

[hoosierhawk]

thers a

On 11/29/2024 at 10:44 AM, Flash7 said:

Ballard was left in a really bad spot after Andrew Luck retired and the QB position is the most important position in football, but that doesn't excuse Ballard's poor choices.

 

2019 - He had no choice but to go with Jacoby Brissett after Luck's retirement.

2020- He CHOSE to bring in Philip Rivers, who was already old and ready to retire. There was 0% chance this was the answer to the QB position. Zero.

2021 - Carson Wentz - A horrible decision that did not work out.

2022 - Matt Ryan - The Philip Rivers situation all over again, but much worse. ZERO chance this was going to be the answer at the QB position.

2022 - Nick Foles - Blah

2023 - AR at pick #4 - a highly athletic, inexperienced, QB with a history of injuries. 

2023 - Gardner Minshew - He was actually decent. Not good, but not bad either.

2024 - AR - Currently going through the struggles of a QB learning on the job. 

2024 - Joe Flacco - Another old QB that has ZERO chance of being the answer at the QB position. I know he was brought in to be a backup to AR but with AR's injury history, he's the de facto starter, like Minshew was.

 contract 

Overall, if any other GM had made these decisions it would be easy to see how bad they were. But, because the Colts GM made these decisions and we wear Colts colored glasses, we give it a pass......all because Andre Luck retired in 2019.

Look around the league:

Cleveland sold their future buying a QB who has failed miserable.

Rams are 5-6 with after signing Stafford to a $160M contract with nothing to show for it.

The Saints signed Carr to a $160M contract and are 4-7 this year with nothing to show for it.

Falcons paid Cousins $180M  with nothing to show for it.

Jets signed Rogers for 3 years at $112.5M with nothing to show for it.

Jags signed Lawrences to a $275M contract and are 2and 9.

Miami signed Tua to a $212.4M and are 5 and 7. 

Bengals signed Burrow for $275M and are 4 and 7.

Denver took an $85M dead money hit when they let Russell Wilson walk from a $245M contract with nothing to show for it.

Cowboys' signed Prescott to a Guaranteed $231M and are 5-7

Giants signed Daniel Jones to a $160M contract and already cut him after a 2-10 start.

Seahawks signed Smith to a $75M contract and have nothing to show for it.

Bears have #1 draft choice  this year and are 4-8

Panthers had #1 draft choice last year and are 3-8

49ers are 5-6 with what is thought to be a franchise QB.

Cardinals signed Murray to a $230.5M contract and nothing to show for it.

 

Point being Ballard looks pretty good compared to many other GMs in the league. Just going out and breaking the bank on QBs and free agents guarantees you nothing. Injuries play a large part in W-L records and we have had more than our share this year and with a very inexperienced QB and the injuries we are for from thr bottom of the league. I think we have many good young players on this team and I believe our better days are not too far away.

 

 

 

 

[Jz0204945]

On 11/29/2024 at 7:12 PM, crazycolt1 said:

Sorry, I don't agree.  If AR pans out Ballard will be here for a very long time.  

Firing is not the answer. 

Well your free to disagree but i disagree with you because this roster is average at the very best that mightveven be generous at this point.

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, Jz0204945 said:

Well your free to disagree but i disagree with you because this roster is average at the very best that mightveven be generous at this point.

If you say so. I'm not here to argue about it. This team is underachieving considering how talented they are.  

[Jz0204945]

On 12/1/2024 at 9:08 PM, crazycolt1 said:

If you say so. I'm not here to argue about it. This team is underachieving considering how talented they are.  

Agreed.

[richard pallo]

11 hours ago, Jz0204945 said:

Agreed.

When you take everything in consideration our biggest problem was trying to win starting a rookie quarterback coming off injury.  It’s remarkable we still have a shot at a playoff berth.  We have a very young team with a lot of talent and promise.

[lollygagger8]

Let's see how Ballard handles the Gus Bradley situation at end of year. '

 

I would like to see us get a new DC and (outside of RB) would be ok if entire draft was defense. 

 

aaaannndd.......SPEND SOME MONEY for once 

[richard pallo]

13 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

Let's see how Ballard handles the Gus Bradley situation at end of year. '

 

I would like to see us get a new DC and (outside of RB) would be ok if entire draft was defense. 

 

aaaannndd.......SPEND SOME MONEY for once 

He was never going to spend it unless he felt he had his quarterback.  I think we might be there now.  

[TigerColt]

Draft Warren (TE) in the first and then all defense after that.

[Mitch Connors]

On 11/29/2024 at 10:32 AM, richard pallo said:

It’s amazing how so many people don’t understand the importance of the quarterback position to a team’s success.  Like it’s so easy to find one too.  Any GM can do it.  Why not Ballard?  Well just maybe he has.  We will have a better idea at the end of the season.  So let’s see how it plays out.  

Since Ballard has been the GM and Luck left how many teams have new franchise QB's? 50% or more?

I think youre massively underestimating how many teams have franchise QB's in the Ballard era.

[2006Coltsbestever]

18 minutes ago, Mitch Connors said:

Since Ballard has been the GM and Luck left how many teams have new franchise QB's? 50% or more?

I think youre massively underestimating how many teams have franchise QB's in the Ballard era.

Andrew Luck had the potential of being a top 10 QB of all-time. He wasn't just a franchise QB in todays league, he was on the verge of being an all-time great QB like where Mahomes is now. I believe we would have won a SB by now had Luck not retired because our roster now surrounded by Luck is much better than what it was in 2014 and in 2018. Even with Luck's short career, he still easily makes most experts top 40 of all-time because of stats, win shares, playoff wins, talent, and he had 2 great seasons = 2014/2018 and 2 very good seasons = 2012/2013. Replacing a guy like that is damn near impossible. Let's just hope AR turns out good and can be considered a franchise QB in today's league.

[richard pallo]

2 hours ago, Mitch Connors said:

Since Ballard has been the GM and Luck left how many teams have new franchise QB's? 50% or more?

I think youre massively underestimating how many teams have franchise QB's in the Ballard era.

I was being facetious.

[Jz0204945]

5 hours ago, richard pallo said:

When you take everything in consideration our biggest problem was trying to win starting a rookie quarterback coming off injury.  It’s remarkable we still have a shot at a playoff berth.  We have a very young team with a lot of talent and promise.

Ya still alot of work to do before this team does become a true contender.

[richard pallo]

11 minutes ago, Jz0204945 said:

Ya still alot of work to do before this team does become a true contender.

Not really.  A good offseason of preparation from AR and the others and we will be right there.

[twfish]

On 11/29/2024 at 10:44 AM, Flash7 said:

Ballard was left in a really bad spot after Andrew Luck retired and the QB position is the most important position in football, but that doesn't excuse Ballard's poor choices.

 

2019 - He had no choice but to go with Jacoby Brissett after Luck's retirement.

2020- He CHOSE to bring in Philip Rivers, who was already old and ready to retire. There was 0% chance this was the answer to the QB position. Zero.

2021 - Carson Wentz - A horrible decision that did not work out.

2022 - Matt Ryan - The Philip Rivers situation all over again, but much worse. ZERO chance this was going to be the answer at the QB position.

2022 - Nick Foles - Blah

2023 - AR at pick #4 - a highly athletic, inexperienced, QB with a history of injuries. 

2023 - Gardner Minshew - He was actually decent. Not good, but not bad either.

2024 - AR - Currently going through the struggles of a QB learning on the job. 

2024 - Joe Flacco - Another old QB that has ZERO chance of being the answer at the QB position. I know he was brought in to be a backup to AR but with AR's injury history, he's the de facto starter, like Minshew was.

 

Overall, if any other GM had made these decisions it would be easy to see how bad they were. But, because the Colts GM made these decisions and we wear Colts colored glasses, we give it a pass......all because Andre Luck retired in 2019.

It is quite easier to look as this in hindsight but I still think a little more context is warranted.

2020- This is the year I believe Ballard missed the worst, trading up for Herbert should have been the answer. However it was expected that River's was going to play for 2 years and with Ballard fully believing the team was close to making a super bowl run I can see why he wanted a veteran QB. River's also did get us to the playoffs so it's not like he was super wrong.

 

2021- Looking at the QB's in that draft along with our draft position, the closest we could have gotten was Mac Jones. He's playing back up after a terrible stint in New England. Also with Carson Wentz that was Reich's pick at QB. How can you go against the H.C choice at QB? Without Irsay throwing his fit Wentz probably stays around at least for another year so that 1st round pick isn't as embarassing.

 

2022- Jim Irsay turned into his dad and put the franchise in a bad spot by demanding Wentz gone and they wanted a proven leader. The only good QB that came from the 22 draft is Brock Purdy. The rest of them were total duds

 

So looking back what's the best move aside from trading up for Herbert instead of getting Defo?

[Solid84]

On 12/1/2024 at 3:42 AM, hoosierhawk said:

thers a

Look around the league:

Cleveland sold their future buying a QB who has failed miserable.

Rams are 5-6 with after signing Stafford to a $160M contract with nothing to show for it.

The Saints signed Carr to a $160M contract and are 4-7 this year with nothing to show for it.

Falcons paid Cousins $180M  with nothing to show for it.

Jets signed Rogers for 3 years at $112.5M with nothing to show for it.

Jags signed Lawrences to a $275M contract and are 2and 9.

Miami signed Tua to a $212.4M and are 5 and 7. 

Bengals signed Burrow for $275M and are 4 and 7.

Denver took an $85M dead money hit when they let Russell Wilson walk from a $245M contract with nothing to show for it.

Cowboys' signed Prescott to a Guaranteed $231M and are 5-7

Giants signed Daniel Jones to a $160M contract and already cut him after a 2-10 start.

Seahawks signed Smith to a $75M contract and have nothing to show for it.

Bears have #1 draft choice  this year and are 4-8

Panthers had #1 draft choice last year and are 3-8

49ers are 5-6 with what is thought to be a franchise QB.

Cardinals signed Murray to a $230.5M contract and nothing to show for it.

 

Point being Ballard looks pretty good compared to many other GMs in the league. Just going out and breaking the bank on QBs and free agents guarantees you nothing. Injuries play a large part in W-L records and we have had more than our share this year and with a very inexperienced QB and the injuries we are for from thr bottom of the league. I think we have many good young players on this team and I believe our better days are not too far away.

 

 

 

 

The Rams won a Super Bowl with Stafford....

 

Burrow is crazy good for the Bengals. They just don't have a defense.