Matt Ryan had the 2nd highest average time to throw week 2

[runthepost]

 

Say what you want about the OL, this just shows how bad we are at WR and TE

[MPStack]

He was sacked 5 times and shell shocked. 

[richard pallo]

5 minutes ago, MPStack said:

He was sacked 5 times and shell shocked. 

Because the receivers weren’t getting open most likely.  He’s not going to be able to get away from a rush.

[EastStreet]

5 minutes ago, runthepost said:

 

Say what you want about the OL, this just shows how bad we are at WR and TE

 

Be careful...

Context....

 

Historically, Ryan is not fast at TTT

 

And guys like Mahomes, Herbert, and Jackson,,,, all have games with high TTTs, and have averages above AVG. Do they have bad WRs and TEs????

 

Ryan had a average-ish 2.75 in G1.... 

This week 3.08 in G2

 

This week.. No Pittman... And Reich made Patmon a centerpiece (on pass O), a guy didn't dress last week... And Granson is his fav too.. 

 

[MPStack]

4 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

He’s not going to be able to get away from a rush.

Ya think? 
 

So, if he had the 2nd longest amount of time to throw last week of all QBs and was sacked 5 times. Who’s fault is it….

 

O-Line, WRs, Ryan, Coaches or A. Luck? 

[DougDew]

It means either he wasn't processing, the oline forced him off his spot a bit, or the WRs and TEs couldn't get open.  

 

Frank's short routes would actually improve a QBs TTT.  so it would be kinda dumb to use him as an excuse.  

[Matabix]

This is eye opening. It looked like he had no time at all.

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, Matabix said:

This is eye opening. It looked like he had no time at all.

There were plenty of snaps when OL allowed early pressure. 

He had other snaps when he had plenty of time, mostly late when Jax's D went prevent. 

It's a mix. 

[Smoke317]

He was locking in on the wrong receivers.  Campbell didn’t even get a target until that last ridiculous interception at the end of the game.  Man can’t even get a target?  Also our route combinations were terrible. Looked like our receivers were constantly just running straight to the DB’s & just turning around.  Frank clearly can only scheme open Pittman…. This would’ve been the week to feature Campbell and get him and Ryan in sync.  Get him a minimum of 10 targets.  But instead we’re trying to turn Dulin into our number 2 or 3.  I’ve had my fill of Frank’s play calling. Too helter skelter.

[DougDew]

49 minutes ago, Smoke317 said:

He was locking in on the wrong receivers.  Campbell didn’t even get a target until that last ridiculous interception at the end of the game.  Man can’t even get a target?  Also our route combinations were terrible. Looked like our receivers were constantly just running straight to the DB’s & just turning around.  Frank clearly can only scheme open Pittman…. This would’ve been the week to feature Campbell and get him and Ryan in sync.  Get him a minimum of 10 targets.  But instead we’re trying to turn Dulin into our number 2 or 3.  I’ve had my fill of Frank’s play calling. Too helter skelter.

Just some facts.

 

TTT is the same as snap to release.  Running QBs ....or in this case QBs who are running....tend to have higher snap to release times.  Mahomes, Jackson, etc. have high TTTs.   Luck had a high time too, looking down the field a lot...waiting to get injured.

 

Rivers had the 4th best NFL TTT in 2019.  Under Frank/Siranni.  Lots of short patterns.  Remember, he "never" threw it down the field.  But guys seemed to be pretty open.  Getting open wasn't really the issue.  It was the lack of big plays.  Rivers has always had low TTT numbers.

 

Brady became OC in 2020, after Siranni left.  Frank has said that Marcus Brady designs the plays.  Wentz had a poor TTT last year.  Ryan has a poor TTT this year.  But, they are also QBs who have historically had high TTTs compare to other QBs, and Wentz "extended" plays alot.

 

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, MPStack said:

Ya think? 
 

So, if he had the 2nd longest amount of time to throw last week of all QBs and was sacked 5 times. Who’s fault is it….

 

O-Line, WRs, Ryan, Coaches or A. Luck? 

Wrs

[NewColtsFan]

3 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Just some facts.

 

TTT is the same as snap to release.  Running QBs ....or in this case QBs who are running....tend to have higher snap to release times.  Mahomes, Jackson, etc. have high TTTs.   Luck had a high time too, looking down the field a lot...waiting to get injured.

 

Rivers had the 4th best NFL TTT in 2019.  Under Frank/Siranni.  Lots of short patterns.  Remember, he "never" threw it down the field.  But guys seemed to be pretty open.  Getting open wasn't really the issue.  It was the lack of big plays.  Rivers has always had low TTT numbers.

 

Brady became OC in 2020, after Siranni left.  Frank has said that Marcus Brady designs the plays.  Wentz had a poor TTT last year.  Ryan has a poor TTT this year.  But, they are also QBs who have historically had high TTTs compare to other QBs, and Wentz "extended" plays alot.

 

“Luck…..   Waiting to get injured.”
 

Id expect such drivel from others here.   Guess I was wrong.   My bad.    

[Painterman]

1 hour ago, MPStack said:

Ya think? 
 

So, if he had the 2nd longest amount of time to throw last week of all QBs and was sacked 5 times. Who’s fault is it….

 

O-Line, WRs, Ryan, Coaches or A. Luck? 

Luck... Just not very lucky. 

[DougDew]

16 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

“Luck…..   Waiting to get injured.”
 

Id expect such drivel from others here.   Guess I was wrong.   My bad.    

You know, I though of you when I wrote that.  Honestly did.  Thought it might trigger you into defending the man.  Hoping it wouldn't, but, yep, it did.   

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

He was locking in on the wrong receivers.  Campbell didn’t even get a target until that last ridiculous interception at the end of the game.  Man can’t even get a target?  Also our route combinations were terrible. Looked like our receivers were constantly just running straight to the DB’s & just turning around.  Frank clearly can only scheme open Pittman…. This would’ve been the week to feature Campbell and get him and Ryan in sync.  Get him a minimum of 10 targets.  But instead we’re trying to turn Dulin into our number 2 or 3.  I’ve had my fill of Frank’s play calling. Too helter skelter.

90+% of early reads are shallow routes. And the Ds (for a while going to last season) condense and flood 0-10 or 0-15 zones.. 

 

And agree 1000%.. routes and route combos are horrible. 

 

Why can't Parris play outside or verts (especially with Pierce out)... His ADOT (very very shallow routes) was hilarious... 3.0 yards....  It's like using a Ferrari 5 yards and horizontal...   

 

In defense of Dulin, played very good. Not saying he should be #2, but he's doing well when targeted. 

[Shadow_Creek]

2 hours ago, runthepost said:

 

Say what you want about the OL, this just shows how bad we are at WR and TE

of course he had the second fastest time ..i mean its easy to get rid of the ball fast when your throwing to the other team ..half his throws were like punts smh and it has nothing to do with not having enough time..

[Painterman]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

You know, I though of you when I wrote that.  Honestly did.  Thought it might trigger you into defending the man.  Hoping it wouldn't, but, yep, it did.   

Me? I don't defend that quitter, I was being facetious. 

[PRnum1]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

“Luck…..   Waiting to get injured.”
 

Id expect such drivel from others here.   Guess I was wrong.   My bad.    

Hello @NewColtsFan

 

Thanks for joining us. I noticed you were strangely absent from the board for a few days after the game.

 

I was curious to see what you thought of the game ? What went right, what went wrong and what we can do to improve. Is there anyone at fault for what we saw last Sunday?

 

Thanks !

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

You know, I though of you when I wrote that.  Honestly did.  Thought it might trigger you into defending the man.  Hoping it wouldn't, but, yep, it did.   

Yeah….  I thought about the look if being triggered….   And I thought I don’t care.  
 

You know, in other thread a few days ago, you gave some snarky response to the OP who made a silly observation — and I Supported you.  I backed you up with several posts.  
 

But I thought this was a bridge too far.   To criticize a player in a discussion that wasn’t even about him?   It was a needless cheap shot.  
 

I have stated numerous times every year since August of ‘19 that Luck botched his retirement as badly as possible.   And for a smart guy, he should’ve known better.  So I don’t defend him much when people bash him over how he handled it. 
 

But to bash the guy as if he got hurt on purpose just seemed so unnecessary.   The guy moved Heaven and Earth to get well to try and prolong his career.   It didn’t work out.  I just thought it was an unnecessary cheap shot.   If you noticed, I actually tried to give you a compliment if sorts….   The whole…. “I wouldn’t have expected that from you” line….   I tried to make my criticism somewhat reasonable. 
 

 

[jbaron04]

4 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

Be careful...

Context....

 

Historically, Ryan is not fast at TTT

 

And guys like Mahomes, Herbert, and Jackson,,,, all have games with high TTTs, and have averages above AVG. Do they have bad WRs and TEs????

 

Ryan had a average-ish 2.75 in G1.... 

This week 3.08 in G2

 

This week.. No Pittman... And Reich made Patmon a centerpiece (on pass O), a guy didn't dress last week... And Granson is his fav too.. 

 

Frank is killing us right now with his game plans or lack of , like I cant believe he said it wouldn’t be fair to play the young guys in tempo offense 

[EastStreet]

5 minutes ago, jbaron04 said:

Frank is killing us right now with his game plans or lack of , like I cant believe he said it wouldn’t be fair to play the young guys in tempo offense 

Stop with Granson stuff. 

Give Pittman, Dulin, and Campbell speed routes. Pittman gives good routes at times. Horrible routes to Campbell. 3.0 ADOT routes... hilarious. 

[Maniac53]

2 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Stop with Granson stuff. 

Give Pittman, Dulin, and Campbell speed routes. Pittman gives good routes at times. Horrible routes to Campbell. 3.0 ADOT routes... hilarious. 

Your asking Frank too do to much stop!!!

[NewColtsFan]

38 minutes ago, PRnum1 said:

Hello @NewColtsFan

 

Thanks for joining us. I noticed you were strangely absent from the board for a few days after the game.

 

I was curious to see what you thought of the game ? What went right, what went wrong and what we can do to improve. Is there anyone at fault for what we saw last Sunday?

 

Thanks !

Thanks for the shout-out, but there wasn’t much to say. 
 

That was — by far — the worst game of Frank’s time as our HC.   No other game is even close.   One of the worst games I’ve seen from any NFL team thought to be playoff caliber in 55 years of being a fan.  I thought there was nothing good to say, so I tried not to say much. 
 

This is a game that should shake the entire franchise to its very core.   I can easily defend the first game as typical week one sloppy football.   Over 500 yards of total offense and 33 first downs?   And you admittedly played poor?   Then there should’ve been a big jump in week two.  Instead we dove head first off a tall cliff.  
 

Inexcusable.   Indefensible.  
 

For the record, I still support Ballard and Reich.   But the long contract extensions they received about 14-15 months ago may not save them.  Anything could happen including firing both, it was that bad.   I support them because I’ve seen too much I like in ‘18, 19, 20, and 21.   They’ve earned a level of trust for me.   But Sundays loss may change everything for Irsay.  
 

Sorry this has gone so long, but here’s a final thought:  it’s obvious there’s blood in the water now and many want somebody’s head….  I get that.   But here’s the deal….  Odds are, any new coach and maybe even a new GM that comes in would mean a setback of roughly 2-4 years, maybe longer.   People here melt down over one bad year.   How will they react if we have to rebuild all over again?   Who wants to be patient for several more years?   I don’t think that list here would be very long.   I’d caution….  Be careful what you wish for, you might just get it….. 

[Jack86]

This doesn’t correlate with what my eyes observed on Sunday.

 

I’d be interested to see how this is captured?!

 

There were a lot of plays were Ryan was pushed around in the pocket, he hadn’t thrown the ball yet, dose that mean the plays times from the snap to the end of the play?

 

interesting nuggets though, cheers dude @runthepost.

 

Go Colts

[AKB]

receivers are trash

Granson is trash 

Pryor is a guard playing tackle

Facyson is a starting corner on the defense

coach cant call a game

we like our guys

[Chucklez]

9 hours ago, Shadow_Creek said:

of course he had the second fastest time ..i mean its easy to get rid of the ball fast when your throwing to the other team ..half his throws were like punts smh and it has nothing to do with not having enough time..

You've got everything backwards and wrong here..... He had the 2nd slowest time to throw the ball... meaning he had the 2nd longest amount of time before releasing the football, so he was holding onto it for a long time. The eyes test from watching the game tells me it was because receivers just werent separating. He held onto it for so long because he had nowhere to throw it to.

[Myles]

7 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Thanks for the shout-out, but there wasn’t much to say. 
 

That was — by far — the worst game of Frank’s time as our HC.   No other game is even close.   One of the worst games I’ve seen from any NFL team thought to be playoff caliber in 55 years of being a fan.  I thought there was nothing good to say, so I tried not to say much. 
 

This is a game that should shake the entire franchise to its very core.   I can easily defend the first game as typical week one sloppy football.   Over 500 yards of total offense and 33 first downs?   And you admittedly played poor?   Then there should’ve been a big jump in week two.  Instead we dove head first off a tall cliff.  
 

Inexcusable.   Indefensible.  
 

For the record, I still support Ballard and Reich.   But the long contract extensions they received about 14-15 months ago may not save them.  Anything could happen including firing both, it was that bad.   I support them because I’ve seen too much I like in ‘18, 19, 20, and 21.   They’ve earned a level of trust for me.   But Sundays loss may change everything for Irsay.  
 

Sorry this has gone so long, but here’s a final thought:  it’s obvious there’s blood in the water now and many want somebody’s head….  I get that.   But here’s the deal….  Odds are, any new coach and maybe even a new GM that comes in would mean a setback of roughly 2-4 years, maybe longer.   People here melt down over one bad year.   How will they react if we have to rebuild all over again?   Who wants to be patient for several more years?   I don’t think that list here would be very long.   I’d caution….  Be careful what you wish for, you might just get it….. 

I agree with this post.   I will add that Reich needs to be ordered to get some help with his play calling and game planning.  Most of the issues with TE's and WR's that I seen was do to having the wrong players running the wrong routes.  

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, AustinnKaine said:

receivers are trash

Granson is trash 

Pryor is a guard playing tackle

Facyson is a starting corner on the defense

coach cant call a game

we like our guys

Don’t think you like our players that much when you call a lot of them trash.

[DougDew]

Folks.  Yes, there is some confusion as to what TTT means.  (This is part of the stats/analytics world that is sometimes unavoidable....where the data has to be formatted a certain way to be able to be used in spreads with other data.  Since it may not be intuitive, it then takes the same people who produce the stats to then interpret the data for you and tell you what it means.  Hopefully, they are being honest with you.)

 

Definition of TTT from Stampede Blue last year:  Time to Throw is a stat that measures the amount of time between snap and the release of the football on a pass attempt and last year Rivers' average TTT ranked 29th (4th quickest).

 

See how the ranking is intuitively backwards?  You'd think a low TTT is a bad thing because it says the oline is not protecting the QB...no.

 

At least three things could be going on with a high TTT (snap to release).

 

1.  The QB is Andrew Luck (who had one of the higher TTT) who looks down field by nature and stays in the pocket.  He holds the ball waiting for the deeper routes, but then the oline is overly-criticized when the QB is finally sacked.  This is a bad TTT situation.

 

2. The QB is Pat Mahomes (who has a high TTT) who runs to his right after the snap, then rolls back to his left, and then finds Travis Kelce standing there 20 yards down field stoically, somehow with no defender within ten yards of him.   This is a good TTT situation, but is reflective of mobile QBs who "extend" plays....like Wentz and Luck too (looking for the deep/intermediate throw to open up).

 

3. The QB is Matt Ryan at JAX.  A relatively immobile vet QB who looks for the longest pattern so he has a high historical TTT, but is now under constant duress because his receivers can't get open on even the short patterns where competent NFL receivers can usually get open.  A high TTT combined with a high sack/pressure rate in a shorter route offense is an awfully bad TTT situation.  But that can happen when the team's two starting WRs are not playing  (and the others can't beat out the rookie in preseason).

 

There are probably many more things to list.  

[WHAM-Bam ThankYou Sam]

14 hours ago, runthepost said:

 

Say what you want about the OL, this just shows how bad we are at WR and TE

And how bad we are at quarterback 

[jbaron04]

9 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Stop with Granson stuff. 

Give Pittman, Dulin, and Campbell speed routes. Pittman gives good routes at times. Horrible routes to Campbell. 3.0 ADOT routes... hilarious. 

Granson is not good , Mo is not a #1 te he is to slow. Tbh Hines ain’t that good rarely ever make guy miss in the open field or break tackles. We legit have 2 players at this point Pittman & Taylor  

[DougDew]

2 hours ago, Myles said:

I agree with this post.   I will add that Reich needs to be ordered to get some help with his play calling and game planning.  Most of the issues with TE's and WR's that I seen was do to having the wrong players running the wrong routes.  

He can't really turn to Marcus Brady, because Brady already helps him design the plays and with the game planning...according to previous reports.

 

Rathman used to dictate which RBs were in the game.  During the game, Frank is probably too busy to tell each of three receivers where to line up on which play call....and therefore which pattern to run.  That's probably on the OC or WRs coach.

[Smonroe]

Average does NOT mean he had 3 seconds on every throw.  It could mean he had 1 second on two throws and 4 on one throw.  Average doesn't take into account down and distance either.

 

Forget the stats, they can be manipulated.  Use the eye test.  Does it look like he has time to throw on most of the plays? 

[jbaron04]

9 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Stop with Granson stuff. 

Give Pittman, Dulin, and Campbell speed routes. Pittman gives good routes at times. Horrible routes to Campbell. 3.0 ADOT routes... hilarious. 

Also Ballard has been killing us with the drafts and resigns, At this point every single player that colts have given a contract to has declined sharply or flat out haven’t preformed out side of Grover. The drafts have been filled with projects and projection which is why we keep missing on guys. When ever we draft a guy that has proven college tape and success they have panned out , Pittman , Taylor etc… When ever he draft a guy and expect them to double and triple they college production they normally bust , long list of DEs on team. Like these guy get 3 sacks in college and Ballard expect them to come in and be double digit guys is laughable lol. It’s like a Wr who doesn’t get separation in college but they expect them to come in against NFL corners and get open which is why all out guys be blanketed on most routes 

[Nickster]

13 hours ago, DougDew said:

Just some facts.

 

TTT is the same as snap to release.  Running QBs ....or in this case QBs who are running....tend to have higher snap to release times.  Mahomes, Jackson, etc. have high TTTs.   Luck had a high time too, looking down the field a lot...waiting to get injured.

 

Rivers had the 4th best NFL TTT in 2019.  Under Frank/Siranni.  Lots of short patterns.  Remember, he "never" threw it down the field.  But guys seemed to be pretty open.  Getting open wasn't really the issue.  It was the lack of big plays.  Rivers has always had low TTT numbers.

 

Brady became OC in 2020, after Siranni left.  Frank has said that Marcus Brady designs the plays.  Wentz had a poor TTT last year.  Ryan has a poor TTT this year.  But, they are also QBs who have historically had high TTTs compare to other QBs, and Wentz "extended" plays alot.

 

 

i thought we were going to get all these quick release throws from Ryan.  You mean that he doesn't have quick release?  I just thought all the data for his entire career on that was lying. 

[DougDew]

10 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Yeah….  I thought about the look if being triggered….   And I thought I don’t care.  
 

You know, in other thread a few days ago, you gave some snarky response to the OP who made a silly observation — and I Supported you.  I backed you up with several posts.  
 

But I thought this was a bridge too far.   To criticize a player in a discussion that wasn’t even about him?   It was a needless cheap shot.  
 

I have stated numerous times every year since August of ‘19 that Luck botched his retirement as badly as possible.   And for a smart guy, he should’ve known better.  So I don’t defend him much when people bash him over how he handled it. 
 

But to bash the guy as if he got hurt on purpose just seemed so unnecessary.   The guy moved Heaven and Earth to get well to try and prolong his career.   It didn’t work out.  I just thought it was an unnecessary cheap shot.   If you noticed, I actually tried to give you a compliment if sorts….   The whole…. “I wouldn’t have expected that from you” line….   I tried to make my criticism somewhat reasonable. 
 

 

It wasn't intended to take a cheap shot or even about Luck.  My comment was relevant to this TTT thread.  Context to help remember how Luck played relative to the TTT stat, which contributes to QB injuries.  It also goes back to west coast bootleg types of Os too, where the QB was exposed to the OLBs/SSs and the TTT stat was undoubtedly high.

 

Waiting for the pattern to develop.  Waiting to get injured.  It doesn't apply just to Luck, but he was the best example of it for the Colts the past 20 years.  Wentz too, but he didn't get significantly injured because of it...with the Colts.

 

 

[Hark]

Not sure average is the best method to use here to see a true picture. A few snaps where there was a really long TTT could skew the overall statistic. That's why this doesn't pass the eye test for some folks. Median might be a better method. Just a thought.

[DougDew]

5 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

i thought we were going to get all these quick release throws from Ryan.  You mean that he doesn't have quick release?  I just thought all the data for his entire career on that was lying. 

I think he is expected to make the layups.  And see other receivers open along with being less excitable and erratic.  Do stuff that the Warner Video showed Wentz didn't do.  Maybe Warner will break down this JAX game.

 

 He's not going to really change the O much.  If the QB is waiting for intermediate/long patterns to develop, they aren't going to develop any more this year than they did last year.  That's the issue.  But he should locate the dump off quicker than Wentz, who completely ignored it.

 

Yeah, Rivers was good for the O.

[MPStack]

5 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

 

Yeah, Rivers was good for the O.

Hines best year! The screen passes disappeared after Rivers was gone. 
 

 

[Blueblazes]

15 hours ago, runthepost said:

 

Say what you want about the OL, this just shows how bad we are at WR and TE

 

Looked like this on most drop backs. No real change for Ryan vs. his career. If everything works right, he's good, if not, it's a different story.