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Woods will be a difference maker.


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33 minutes ago, pgt_rob said:

 

Sounds pretty lofty in my opinion. I'd say way less, 100-200ish yards for the season. 0 TDs.

 

Do you have any idea how much 12 personal we run? Woods will have plenty of opportunity to contribute.

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8 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Maybe 25 is a bit higher then his average and it's better to avoid that number, but he is still gonna get the ball. I just can't fathom especially at this point of his career Matt Ryan throwing 25-30 times a game. 

Ryan will be fine. He averaged 32 passes last season per game.

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9 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Ryan will be fine. He averaged 32 passes last season per game.

 

With no run game. It was basically all on Matt Ryan to win games.

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3 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Do you have any idea how much 12 personal we run? Woods will have plenty of opportunity to contribute.

23% last season, up from 21% the year before. 

We skewed up a lot due to high %s vs Houston and NE when we ran it non-stop. 

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2 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

With no run game. It was basically all on Matt Ryan to win games.

 

Nah. Last year was actually below his average. 

He had 560 total passes last season in 17 games. 

Prior to last season, he was averaging 36 passes per game in 16 gpy, and normally totally 600+ passes per year. 

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1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

 

Nah. Last year was actually below his average. 

He had 560 total passes last season in 17 games. 

Prior to last season, he was averaging 36 passes per game in 16 gpy, and normally totally 600+ passes per year. 

 

And you think it's smart to continue to have him throw so much? Matt Ryan is not coming here to be our savior. He's here to do what Wentz couldn't. Display leadership and make 5-6 big plays a game.

 

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1 hour ago, CR91 said:

 

And you think it's smart to continue to have him throw so much? Matt Ryan is not coming here to be our savior. He's here to do what Wentz couldn't. Display leadership and make 5-6 big plays a game.

 

 

I think you need to look at the NFL passing stats lol.

Brady, who is older, tossed it 719 times, which was over 42 passes per game. 

That's 10 more per game than Ryan. Brady, Mahomes, Herbert, Stafford, Allen, and several others threw more. 

 

I expect him to have a larger role than you. He's not coming here to be a game manager. I'm guessing the FO is looking at the team with expectations of a 2 year window to make some noise. Just like I think it's stupid for JT to run 25 times a game, I don't want Ryan to be top 3 in pass attempts either. I want balance. 

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47 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I think you need to look at the NFL passing stats lol.

Brady, who is older, tossed it 719 times, which was over 42 passes per game. 

That's 10 more per game than Ryan. Brady, Mahomes, Herbert, Stafford, Allen, and several others threw more. 

 

I expect him to have a larger role than you. He's not coming here to be a game manager. I'm guessing the FO is looking at the team with expectations of a 2 year window to make some noise. Just like I think it's stupid for JT to run 25 times a game, I don't want Ryan to be top 3 in pass attempts either. I want balance. 

 

You did not just compare Matt Ryan to Tom Brady. Look you can have all the faith in the world in Matt. Your expectations are galaxies above mine. This is Taylor's team 

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5 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

You did not just compare Matt Ryan to Tom Brady. Look you can have all the faith in the world in Matt. Your expectations are galaxies above mine. This is Taylor's team 

We're talking about passes per game. 

32 passes per game is simply not that high. He was outside the top 10 last season.

 

And no need to pivot with a Brady comparison trigger lol... . But Brady is 44. Ryan is 37. Rivers was older than Ryan when he was in Indy. Heck Roethlisberger threw more last season and is 3 years older lol. 

 

In short, Ryan is not some over the hill bum with some obvious noodle arm. We have him for 2 years. We'll use him. If we don't, we won't succeed. By your comments, seems like you want JT running 25 times and Ryan throwing less than he did last season. That's not a recipe for a playoff run. That's a game manager year that will further take tread off JT's tires and increase his chances of a flat. 

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11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


Interesting to me that you think we “know” things about MAC.   Honestly, I don’t think we know much at all about him.   Honestly.  
 

He’s never been the number one guy before.   He’s going to be asked to do more than he’s ever done before.   And since he got such a late start learning the game, I think he’ll continue to grow and get better.   I don’t think that he’ll ever be great….  But certainly average to above average and maybe even good.   That’s my hope.   
 

And if you’ll allow me this personal observation….    I think you’ve had a great off-season.   Seriously good.   I continue to read really good,  really thoughtful posts from you and I’ve enjoyed them immensely.   Even if we disagree I’ve enjoyed reading your posts.   Many thanks.    :thmup:

Thanks for the kind words, though this means I'll have to try harder to live up to my avatar.

 

TE is a really unique position and basically there are two types of TEs, those being the ones who can block and those who cannot.  If you can block then you can be on the field when the coaches want to go 12 and run the ball.

 

If you can't block then you are basically in competition with the wideout group.  This is because you're effectively a receiver, i.e. you will be in the pattern not trying to block a DE if they know you're just gonna get trucked.  And most TEs suffer by comparison there and will see fewer snaps due to it.  Unless you have a really bad WR group.  Translation is that if you're on the field it's not really 12.  It's 11.  There are some TEs that are good enough to compare to the wideouts, too.  But if you're not that rare guy, once again, you're gonna suffer by comparison.

 

Back to MAC you observe that he has never been a number one guy.  I think there's good reason for that.  Now maybe he'll live up to some of the big expectations that fans develop for pet players, but statistically I see it as unlikely.  He's been around for four seasons.  Impact TEs don't suddenly flip that light on in year five.  Impact TEs are felt on the field down the stretch their rookie year but certainly by year two they are changing games.

 

The chances are good that he will end his career floating around the league and filling depth roles for TE groups.

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10 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

We're talking about passes per game. 

32 passes per game is simply not that high. He was outside the top 10 last season.

 

And no need to pivot with a Brady comparison trigger lol... . But Brady is 44. Ryan is 37. Rivers was older than Ryan when he was in Indy. Heck Roethlisberger threw more last season and is 3 years older lol. 

 

In short, Ryan is not some over the hill bum with some obvious noodle arm. We have him for 2 years. We'll use him. If we don't, we won't succeed. By your comments, seems like you want JT running 25 times and Ryan throwing less than he did last season. That's not a recipe for a playoff run. That's a game manager year that will further take tread off JT's tires and increase his chances of a flat. 

 

You just seem to not wanna use Taylor at all. He's arguably the best RB in football. As long as he doesn't hit 400 carries in a season, we need to use him. Like I said your expectations of Matt Ryan are way above mine. You wanna view him as more then a game manager, be my guest.

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4 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

You just seem to not wanna use Taylor at all. He's arguably the best RB in football. As long as he doesn't hit 400 carries in a season, we need to use him. Like I said your expectations of Matt Ryan are way above mine. You wanna view him as more then a game manager, be my guest.

 

Dude, come on....

 

I predicted 18-21 carries for JT in this same thread. He averaged 19.5 last season, which is right in the middle of 18-21 lol... and 19.5 was the most in the league last season.... how the holy hell is that me "not wanting to use Taylor at all"... you seem to be jumping the shark on this topic.

 

Your knowledge of RB and QB attempts, and run pass ratio, in the NFL, seems very low. 

 

The median of the league last season was right around 59% passing to 41% running. If JT gets 19.5 for example, and Hines gets 3.5, that's a total of 23 rush attempts.... A 32 pass / 23 run.... that would be 58% passing, which is under the league median.... That mean on average, we pass less than most teams, we run more than most teams, and JT is still likely top 5 in attempts. 

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15 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

Dude, come on....

 

I predicted 18-21 carries for JT in this same thread. He averaged 19.5 last season, which is right in the middle of 18-21 lol... and 19.5 was the most in the league last season.... how the holy hell is that me "not wanting to use Taylor at all"... you seem to be jumping the shark on this topic.

 

Your knowledge of RB and QB attempts, and run pass ratio, in the NFL, seems very low. 

 

The median of the league last season was right around 59% passing to 41% running. If JT gets 19.5 for example, and Hines gets 3.5, that's a total of 23 rush attempts.... A 32 pass / 23 run.... that would be 58% passing, which is under the league median.... That mean on average, we pass less than most teams, we run more than most teams, and JT is still likely top 5 in attempts. 

 

All I'm saying is this team will be on Taylor's massive shoulders. Don't get me wrong. I'm not against Matt. I think he brings exactly what this team needs in terms of leadership and a voice that the team can lean on, but if you're looking at this move as Peyton going to Denver or Brady going to Tampa then you're overvaluing this move.

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1 minute ago, CR91 said:

 

All I'm saying is this team will be on Taylor's massive shoulders. Don't get me wrong. I'm not against Matt. I think he brings exactly what this team needs in terms of leadership and a voice that the team can lean on, but if you're looking at this move as a Peyton going to Denver or Brady going to Tampa then you're overvaluing this move.

All I'm saying is be realistic about RB and QB attempts. And be realistic about the trends in the NFL. It's pretty rare for a team to go far without at least a 55% passing ratio. And almost all of the front runners this coming season had a 59% or more passing % last season. Ryan is good, and you don't have to run JT to death to be successful. 19.5 was plenty. It was most in the league. 32 passes wasn't even top 10. We don't need extremes, we need balance. 

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1 minute ago, EastStreet said:

All I'm saying is be realistic about RB and QB attempts. And be realistic about the trends in the NFL. It's pretty rare for a team to go far without at least a 55% passing ratio. And almost all of the front runners this coming season had a 59% or more passing % last season. Ryan is good, and you don't have to run JT to death to be successful. 19.5 was plenty. It was most in the league. 32 passes wasn't even top 10. We don't need extremes, we need balance. 

 

I don't know. I just can't see an average of 32 passes. Guess we'll see 

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59 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

Thanks for the kind words, though this means I'll have to try harder to live up to my avatar.

 

TE is a really unique position and basically there are two types of TEs, those being the ones who can block and those who cannot.  If you can block then you can be on the field when the coaches want to go 12 and run the ball.

 

If you can't block then you are basically in competition with the wideout group.  This is because you're effectively a receiver, i.e. you will be in the pattern not trying to block a DE if they know you're just gonna get trucked.  And most TEs suffer by comparison there and will see fewer snaps due to it.  Unless you have a really bad WR group.  Translation is that if you're on the field it's not really 12.  It's 11.  There are some TEs that are good enough to compare to the wideouts, too.  But if you're not that rare guy, once again, you're gonna suffer by comparison.

 

Back to MAC you observe that he has never been a number one guy.  I think there's good reason for that.  Now maybe he'll live up to some of the big expectations that fans develop for pet players, but statistically I see it as unlikely.  He's been around for four seasons.  Impact TEs don't suddenly flip that light on in year five.  Impact TEs are felt on the field down the stretch their rookie year but certainly by year two they are changing games.

 

The chances are good that he will end his career floating around the league and filling depth roles for TE groups.


I think the reason MAC hasn’t done very much up to now is that he’s literally been learning the game at the NFL level.   As you noted guys typically make the jump around year 2 or 3.   But those guys also played 2-4 years of college football.   I believe MAC played zero football in college.   He was a basketball player in college.   Trying to learn football at the NFL level is as hard as it gets.  
 

Again, we don’t need for him to be great — just solid.   Good at blocking, decent at receiving.   I think he’s capable of doing that. 
Interesting that our perspectives are so different. 

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48 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

I don't know. I just can't see an average of 32 passes. Guess we'll see 

 

Like I said, I think you need to educate yourself on league norms. 

32.0 passes per game would have ranked 23rd in the league last season. So more or less bottom 10. 

The absolute lowest average last season was 29.1 per game.... 

Like I said, 32 simply isn't that much.

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30 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

Like I said, I think you need to educate yourself on league norms. 

32.0 passes per game would have ranked 23rd in the league last season. So more or less bottom 10. 

The absolute lowest average last season was 29.1 per game.... 

Like I said, 32 simply isn't that much.

 

Well if you wanna compare it to last year, Wentz only threw 32 times in 7 games

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15 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

Well if you wanna compare it to last year, Wentz only threw 32 times in 7 games

Ryan isn't Wentz. 

 

Indy averaged 30.1, 27th in the league. 

Ryan will have more.

 

And as reported, Ryan has already changed 20% of the playbook, so we can likely assume he's putting in plays that he likes. 

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41 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Ryan isn't Wentz. 

 

Indy averaged 30.1, 27th in the league. 

Ryan will have more.

 

And as reported, Ryan has already changed 20% of the playbook, so we can likely assume he's putting in plays that he likes. 

 

Every QB changes plays to things they like. It's not exactly an indication of what to come

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2 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

Every QB changes plays to things they like. It's not exactly an indication of what to come

 

It was never reported that Rivers or Wentz had the autonomy to start whacking away at the playbook. And 20% is a pretty high number when you're talking about scheme changes.

 

Regardless, based on your RB and QB attempt expectations, you're likely to be disappointed this year. 

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I thot this thread was about Woods..... 

:thmup:

 

 

IMHO Woods can be special

 

I hope we see a bit of this "special" this year

 

Almost all of high potential TEs seem to get much better from year 1 to year 2

 

Lets hope he can bend the normal "learning curve" a bit and play well this year

 

At a bare minimum, we should have a nice set of very tall WRs/TEs that can get TDs vs FGs in the redone

 

 

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19 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Do you have any idea how much 12 personal we run? Woods will have plenty of opportunity to contribute.

 

Rookie year, don't get your hopes up. He's going to be learning more than anything.

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This is NOT Taylor's team. This is now Matty's Team. Get used to it. Matt Ryan (and Frank) will run the offense. JT will be used as an offensive weapon, but he will call no shots and pick no plays. Focusing the offense primarily on JT only makes it easier on defenses who will know what is coming. Now that we have a REAL QB, we do not have to solely rely on (and overuse) Taylor in order to win games, because we have other options now. I can't wait to see this new offense and how JT will be utilized in the context of everything else we are going to do. I CANNOT WAIT!

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9 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

It was never reported that Rivers or Wentz had the autonomy to start whacking away at the playbook. And 20% is a pretty high number when you're talking about scheme changes.

 

Regardless, based on your RB and QB attempt expectations, you're likely to be disappointed this year. 


Sorry….  But who has reported that?   Give me a link.   I read articles on the Colts every day and I have not read that anywhere.   
 

I’ve read Ryan has talked with Frank and made suggestions and Frank makes the adjustments, but that’s it.   Not much different than with Rivers and Wentz and Brissett and Luck.    Reich caters to his quarterbacks.   Always has, and always will. 

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:


Sorry….  But who has reported that?   Give me a link.   I read articles on the Colts every day and I have not read that anywhere.   
 

I’ve read Ryan has talked with Frank and made suggestions and Frank makes the adjustments, but that’s it.   Not much different than with Rivers and Wentz and Brissett and Luck.    Reich caters to his quarterbacks.   Always has, and always will. 

I’ve seen what he’s referring to, but I couldn’t find it. Here’s an article that sort of mentions it and really goes in depth about what Matt is bringing to the offense: https://www.si.com/.amp/nfl/2022/06/13/matt-ryan-colts-transition-romeo-crennel-mmqb

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11 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

Every QB changes plays to things they like. It's not exactly an indication of what to come

 

I completely gutted my madden playbook to bare minimum AND then started adding plays I liked......its nice to know the pro's do similar.  :thinking:

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I honestly believe this offense will go back to looking more Rivers like in ball distribution and total production.

 

The stats Rivers put up in this offense will be the floor and Ryan has the capability to take it further or higher.

 

Rivers ran the offense like how Frank wanted it to be run, taking the short passes and layups and getting rid of the ball quick.  Wentz tried to run around too much and held the ball for far too long resulting in unnecessary throw aways or sacks.

 

Take for example 2 players who both played for Rivers and Wentz.  Pascal and Hines.

 

Pascal under Rivers

44 rec 629 yards 5 TDS

 

Pascal under Wentz

38 rec 384 yards 3 TDs  --> Almost 300 more yards under Rivers

 

Hines under Rivers

Rush yards - 380, Rush TDs 3, Receiving yards 482, Receiving TD's - 4 => 862 yards from scrimmages with 7 TDs !

 

Hines under Wentz

Rush yards - 276, Rush TDs 2, Receiving yards 310, Receiving TD's - 1 => 586 yards from scrimmages with 3 TDs

 

This is an example of taking two players who are not main targets but displaying the huge discrepancy in numbers under the 2 qbs.  Of course Pascal is gone, but the new WR whether Campbell or Pierce will put up similar numbers that Pascal put up with Rivers.

 

Hines will have a much better or similar year for Ryan much like Rivers.

 

I also believe that JT's numbers will go down in that defenses will stack the box to shut down JT like late in the season and force the Colts to throw.  Wentz couldn't do it but Ryan will.

 

To summarize, the offense will be much more balanced and more dangerous.  Defenses wont be able to stack the box and take away JT and then take away Wentz's first read which was Pittman. 

 

If they do that Ryan will make them pay.

 

 

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3 hours ago, pgt_rob said:

 

Rookie year, don't get your hopes up. He's going to be learning more than anything.

 

  We now have plenty of speed on the outside to stretch D's deep, Paris can scare the _____ out of them clearing the middle, and Woods will be out running LB's wherever they send him, and be catching quick, high passes for easy first downs. There is every reason to believe he will get off to a fast start based on his abilities. Just that easy, like Ken Nunn!

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Isn't Pitts really more of a WR than TE, not like some others in this league(Kelce)???

 

I thought I heard someone say Pitts led in yards per route run when lined up outside. I don't know the Breakdown where he lined up but most of the highlights I seen seemed he was in slot or outside.? Again I don't  know his breakdown but I think using his stats to indicate Ryan likes throwing to his TEs are probably a bit skewed.

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35 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Isn't Pitts really more of a WR than TE, not like some others in this league(Kelce)???

 

I thought I heard someone say Pitts led in yards per route run when lined up outside. I don't know the Breakdown where he lined up but most of the highlights I seen seemed he was in slot or outside.? Again I don't  know his breakdown but I think using his stats to indicate Ryan likes throwing to his TEs are probably a bit skewed.

 

 Did Ryan ever play with Tony Gonzalez, the Hall of Fame dude?

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2 hours ago, C_Lew said:

I’ve seen what he’s referring to, but I couldn’t find it. Here’s an article that sort of mentions it and really goes in depth about what Matt is bringing to the offense: https://www.si.com/.amp/nfl/2022/06/13/matt-ryan-colts-transition-romeo-crennel-mmqb


Thank you.   
 

But look at my post again.   I think this supports MY view, not the other poster.  Ryan has ideas for Reich and Brady and THEY incorporate them into the offense.  Ryan works WITH Reich and Brady.   He’s not acting unilaterally.   It’s not his decision alone.   It’s a collaborative effort.   The way it’s always been.

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9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


Sorry….  But who has reported that?   Give me a link.   I read articles on the Colts every day and I have not read that anywhere.   
 

I’ve read Ryan has talked with Frank and made suggestions and Frank makes the adjustments, but that’s it.   Not much different than with Rivers and Wentz and Brissett and Luck.    Reich caters to his quarterbacks.   Always has, and always will. 

I posted the tweet in the OTA thread

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9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


Hooper was not.  
 

Fact:  Ryan likes throwing to his tight ends. 

I would love it if Woods becomes  the next Gronk , but history on the position suggests he won't as a rookie. A GM I listened to said TE is one of the hardest positions to transition to in the NFL. They have to know catching and blocking assignments. They just take-time to develop because they have a lot of responsibilities. 

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9 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  We now have plenty of speed on the outside to stretch D's deep, Paris can scare the _____ out of them clearing the middle, and Woods will be out running LB's wherever they send him, and be catching quick, high passes for easy first downs. There is every reason to believe he will get off to a fast start based on his abilities. Just that easy, like Ken Nunn!

I loved Parris coming out but he is injured all the time and Woods is a rookie TE who rarely contribute much  theor 1st season.

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