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Mini Camp Day 2


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7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


For purposes of team roster accounting,  Hines will count as a RB.   And it remains a mystery why you think Coutee is ahead of Strachan?   It MAY work out that way, but I don’t think it’s likely.  
 

This team believes in Strachan.   Now maybe they risk him being claimed and hope to sneak him on to the PS.   Maybe.   But I wouldn’t count on that.  

 

IMO aside from Pitt, Parris, Dulin, and Pierce, the final two spots will be a mystery and decision will go late into TC unless a trade or something happens. 

 

I love both Strachan and Patmon, but we're very heavy on "big" personnel for X and bully slot. 

And I love that to be honest, as we've been void on big talent for a long time. 

And were pretty lean on small-to-mid size/shifty/speed types for slot and Z.

 

Now folks can project Pierce anywhere due to speed, but he'll need to develop in a lot of areas to be a true Z type option. Not at all saying he can't do that, it's just he's not out of the box ready for that. It would be simply awesome if he becomes that guy.

 

So in short, we have Parris (who has big injury concerns), Dulin (who mostly did dirty work the past couple years), and Koutee for the traditional slot and or Z type. With Parris's health issues, best to keep him outside. Dulin IMO is perfect trait wise to be inside. So is Coutee (he certainly killed our D). 

 

The math tells me it'll likely be either Strachan OR Patmon. Both are really different despite their size comps. But both are pretty limited in ways too. So I'd say it's one of them, and whoever is left, will be in a heated battle with Coutee for that last spot. Now if they have Hines getting a lot of snaps in the seam (not just deep and sideline stuff we've seen vids of so far), then that impact the whole group. 

 

Anyway, I just see 4 obvious guys. The remaining two are both wildcards, and could even end up being a FA.

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8 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

IMO aside from Pitt, Parris, Dulin, and Pierce, the final two spots will be a mystery and decision will go late into TC unless a trade or something happens. 

 

I love both Strachan and Patmon, but we're very heavy on "big" personnel for X and bully slot. 

And I love that to be honest, as we've been void on big talent for a long time. 

And were pretty lean on small-to-mid size/shifty/speed types for slot and Z.

 

Now folks can project Pierce anywhere due to speed, but he'll need to develop in a lot of areas to be a true Z type option. Not at all saying he can't do that, it's just he's not out of the box ready for that. It would be simply awesome if he becomes that guy.

 

So in short, we have Parris (who has big injury concerns), Dulin (who mostly did dirty work the past couple years), and Koutee for the traditional slot and or Z type. With Parris's health issues, best to keep him outside. Dulin IMO is perfect trait wise to be inside. So is Coutee (he certainly killed our D). 

 

The math tells me it'll likely be either Strachan OR Patmon. Both are really different despite their size comps. But both are pretty limited in ways too. So I'd say it's one of them, and whoever is left, will be in a heated battle with Coutee for that last spot. Now if they have Hines getting a lot of snaps in the seam (not just deep and sideline stuff we've seen vids of so far), then that impact the whole group. 

 

Anyway, I just see 4 obvious guys. The remaining two are both wildcards, and could even end up being a FA.

This was perfectly said. They could decide to keep both the big guys if Hines is getting more WR snaps. But Coutee makes sense as Campbell insurance if they don’t bring TY back. Everything you said here is exactly what I said. Hines is kind of the WC and might allow them to keep both big guys.

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Just now, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

This was perfectly said. They could decide to keep both the big guys if Hines is getting more WR snaps. But Coutee makes sense as Campbell insurance if they don’t bring TY back. Everything you said here is exactly what I said. Hines is kind of the WC and might allow them to keep both big guys.

 

I think you and I differ in a few places. 

 

IIRC, you think Parris plays primarily slot. While I do think he'll get slot snaps (just like Pittman will), I think they'll likely try to keep him outside as much as possible due to his injury profile. 

 

I see Coutee as pretty limited to slot for multiple reasons, so I don't view him as a backup plan for PC. Can KC play outside Z, perhaps, but not sure he's got the speed/size combo traits we seem to be prioritizing outside these days.

 

At the end of the day, it's early. Nothing will be decided till we get into camp and guys are running actually 7-7 and 11-11 full contract. Not worried about Strachan being hurt, but it's pretty telling he was the first one to get 1st team reps over Patmon. So we know he did something to earn that with the coaches. I'm guessing Ryan will have a lot to say who fills out the 6. And I do think it will stay 6 regardless of Hines. 

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26 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

The fascination with 7th round draft picks always amazes me. Strachan has not done anything yet. 

 

No. Neither has Pierce... 

 

Like I said, Strachan was the first WR not named Pitt or Parris or Duln, to get 1st team reps. And that means he earned that distinction. So while you say he hasn't done anything, coaches felt it necessary to give him the prime time reps before anyone else. Could just be a reward for hard work and attitude, might be something more. But he did something the coaches liked.

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1 minute ago, EastStreet said:

 

I think you and I differ in a few places. 

 

IIRC, you think Parris plays primarily slot. While I do think he'll get slot snaps (just like Pittman will), I think they'll likely try to keep him outside as much as possible due to his injury profile. 

 

I see Coutee as pretty limited to slot for multiple reasons, so I don't view him as a backup plan for PC. Can KC play outside Z, perhaps, but not sure he's got the speed/size combo traits we seem to be prioritizing outside these days.

 

At the end of the day, it's early. Nothing will be decided till we get into camp and guys are running actually 7-7 and 11-11 full contract. Not worried about Strachan being hurt, but it's pretty telling he was the first one to get 1st team reps over Patmon. So we know he did something to earn that with the coaches. I'm guessing Ryan will have a lot to say who fills out the 6. And I do think it will stay 6 regardless of Hines. 

I think Reich wants his WR to play all positions. So I don’t think parris will primarily play slot but he will quite a bit. Especially if pierce is good right away.  I mean Pittman will play slot too. That’s where he was so good at YAC with rivers.

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50 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I never said Coutee was ahead of Strachan. My point remains body types. You need insurance for Campbell.  


Oh come on….   You’ve been listing Coutee as WR6 and Strachan NOT making the cut in repeated posts for weeks.   Weeks.  You and I have been making multiple exchanges about that. 

Now you’re saying you never said that.   Riiiight…. 

 

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10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


Oh come on….   You’ve been listing Coutee as WR6 and Strachan NOT making the cut in repeated posts for weeks.   Weeks.  You and I have been making multiple exchanges about that. 

Now you’re saying you never said that.   Riiiight…. 

 

My reasoning has always been skill set. I have stated that many times maybe you just chose to ignore it. That is the reason I think he will make the team. I have thought it will be TY or Coutee then Strachan or Patmon.  We have a lot of big WR and don’t have a lot of the slot skill set. And like I said Hines could change that and might help both Patmon and Strachan make it.

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14 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I think Reich wants his WR to play all positions. So I don’t think parris will primarily play slot but he will quite a bit. Especially if pierce is good right away.  I mean Pittman will play slot too. That’s where he was so good at YAC with rivers.

 

Playing all positions is great in concept, but not reality for a lot WRs. Some guys just don't have the traits or skills to be productive inside and out, or at possession X vs a true motion Z. If all guys have the same traits, then great.... But they typically don't. 

 

At this point, it's way too early to cement anything. But I see Pitt at X, Campbell at Z, and Dulin at slot. We'll use a 4 man rotation with a decent amount of subbing, so I'd bet Pierce ends up being the floater (all positions) giving us both breathers for all the WRs, but also situational matchup advantages. It would awesome if Pierce could do that. He'd likely get starter snaps, while simply playing all over. 

 

But like I said, way too early. Rooks need a lot of development, and they will have time to do so over the summer. What will also be interesting is to see how much 2 TE we use this season. I think that will drop, and we'll see WR target share go up (if WRs stay healthy). 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

My reasoning has always been skill set. I have stated that many times maybe you just chose to ignore it. That is the reason I think he will make the team. I have thought it will be TY or Coutee then Strachan or Patmon.  We have a lot of big WR and don’t have a lot of the slot skill set. And like I said Hines could change that and might help both Patmon and Strachan make it.


Thats all well and good.   But explaining your argument is totally different than what you wrote just a few hours ago which was….  
 

 “I never said that.” 
 

Fair enough.   We can move on now.

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8 hours ago, Archer said:

I was thinking about this earlier.  Pinter did really well at center last year.  What if that ends up being his best position by far?  With Kelly bing a big center, I wonder if out best group could include Pinter at Center and Kelly at RG…

Well Brady said backup center in his comments about Pinter so I don’t think they considering a change full time.  It sounds like this is way to get Pinter some reps at center without having to have him work with both the starting unit and the backup unit.  It’s also minicamp where you play with things like this just because it’s camp and you can.  If they start to do it in pre-season games then they might be looking at a change but again I don’t think they are thinking that at all.  They just want to give their backup center some reps at center is all IMO.

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2 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

My reasoning has always been skill set. I have stated that many times maybe you just chose to ignore it. That is the reason I think he will make the team. I have thought it will be TY or Coutee then Strachan or Patmon.  We have a lot of big WR and don’t have a lot of the slot skill set. And like I said Hines could change that and might help both Patmon and Strachan make it.

A lot of time that last WR spot comes down to two things if it’s close:

 

Who plays special teams better.

Who is more likely to get claimed by another team.  
 

Special teams will be decided in the pre-season.

 

As for the later Coutee isn’t young and isn’t a player a lot of teams are looking for.  It’s how the Colts kept him on the PS almost all of last year.

 

While I am not as high in Strachan as others (I like him but he hasn’t done anything in a real game yet to deserve some of the love he gets) I am willing to admit a big second year WR would probably draw interest of other teams if you let him go and tried to stash him on the PS.  So if he’s a project you think you can keep developing that would probably work in his favor in terms of staying.

 

The more important thing so far seems to be Pierce and Patmon are stepping up and performing.  That might make the Colts feel like they don’t have to go get another WR.  In which case I think the Colts keep six and right now (clearly this can change) I think they keep Pittman, Campbell, Pierce, Dulin, Patmon and Strachan and Coutee goes to the PS where they can call him up should they need to if guys get hurt.  

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27 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

A lot of time that last WR spot comes down to two things if it’s close:

 

Who plays special teams better.

Who is more likely to get claimed by another team.  
 

Special teams will be decided in the pre-season.

 

As for the later Coutee isn’t young and isn’t a player a lot of teams are looking for.  It’s how the Colts kept him on the PS almost all of last year.

 

While I am not as high in Strachan as others (I like him but he hasn’t done anything in a real game yet to deserve some of the love he gets) I am willing to admit a big second year WR would probably draw interest of other teams if you let him go and tried to stash him on the PS.  So if he’s a project you think you can keep developing that would probably work in his favor in terms of staying.

 

The more important thing so far seems to be Pierce and Patmon are stepping up and performing.  That might make the Colts feel like they don’t have to go get another WR.  In which case I think the Colts keep six and right now (clearly this can change) I think they keep Pittman, Campbell, Pierce, Dulin, Patmon and Strachan and Coutee goes to the PS where they can call him up should they need to if guys get hurt.  

 

While STs is a consideration, it's not always a consideration at WR. Dulin was a STs stud no doubt, and has obvious value both at gunner and returns. Outside of Dulin, not much ST's participation by WRs. Strachan and Patmon both had 0 special teams snaps. I'm hoping Pierce can be of value there though. And if Dulin takes on a bigger role this year in the O, it's likely that his STs snaps will decrease. 

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