Mini Camp Day 1

[MacDee1975]

59 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Family matter for Khari it sounds like.

 

 

 

 

Oh, you mean it wasn't because he mentally checked out due to all the safeties we brought in?

 

Colts.com forum geniuses whiff again.

[2006Coltsbestever]

8 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Not panicking just saying it’s not ideal.  It is what it is.

Not ideal at all and I never said you were panicking but some in here are. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not ideal at all and I never said you were panicking but some in here are. 

I don’t see anyone panicking.

[2006Coltsbestever]

18 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Yeah last I seen the Colts were 22-1 odds to win the SB by Vegas, which placed them around 12th in the league so they are getting respect. They are 9-1 odds to make the AFC Title Game, they could lose that but you would still win as long as they make that game. That is the bet to do IMO, put 100 on that to win 900. 

It is even odds that we win the division because of the Titans so if you bet 100 on that, you win 100  - regarding making the AFC Title Game, teams that have better odds are Buffalo, KC, Cincinnati, Denver, and the Chargers hence the 9-1. That AFC West is loaded!

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I don’t see anyone panicking.

That is good. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I have a very good feeling this season is going to be special. Now bad injuries could derail that but my gut says Colts are going to be very good.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I really am getting a Brady to Tampa and Stafford to Rams vibe with Ryan.

[2006Coltsbestever]

14 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I really am getting a Brady to Tampa and Stafford to Rams vibe with Ryan.

Me too 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Me too 

In order for that to happen these young WR have to over achieve or this defense has to be lights out. Still not sold on the WR group but willing to wait and see and give them a chance.

[Boondoggle]

3 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Wonder if Willis is indeed holding out.

 

If so that's a dumb career decision.  He isn't all that to begin with and has a young stud in Nick Cross on that depth chart now.

 

Should have read all the posts in the thread before responding (family matter).  But if I'm him I'd be real careful about missing any time.

[LiveAndLetAddai]

Glad to see Kenny back, not so glad to read about Leonard's back though....thanks for the updates @TaylorTheStudMuffin

[Moosejawcolt]

2 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

 

Hmmm interesting.  I know people dump on me because I was never in favor of  rewarding him a big contract. If u look at my earlier posts about Leonard. I was concerned about his health long term. Racking up all those tackles on a slight frame , 215 pounds, was bound to have these type of results. People dismissed me as a hater. I compared him to a running back who was being run into the ground. When u r playing at a safeties weight, it will make u more athletic but the pounding will wear on u. I have the same about Nelson and his back issues.

[Stephen]

2 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

He was excused.  Maybe we don’t need to jump to conclusions.

We know that  now but didn't  then

[Stephen]

2 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

 

If patmon is the 4 then who is the 3 pierce or dulin

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, Stephen said:

If patmon is the 4 then who is the 3 pierce or dulin

Probably pierce. Campbell has to stay healthy to be 2. Maybe Pierce moved up to two as the season progresses. I guess it all depends on how good Dulin looks and how well pierce adjusts to the NFL game.

[EastStreet]

@TaylorTheStudMuffin - are you saying Willis doesn't fit Gus's scheme?

 

4 hours ago, Myles said:

That doesn't help much but at least it is not an attitude ordeal.   He has to impress if he wants to stay.   I think he even needs to impress to make the practice squad.   He does have the potential for allot of upside but he need to prove himself on the field. 

He got starter reps in week 1 of OTA, so I'd say it's likely he's well thought of already. 

Not saying he doesn't have to impress, all the WRs do. But pretty obvious he started camp in a good position. 

4 hours ago, dw49 said:

 

Willis has no leverage to hold out. Must be something is up that he nor management cares to reveal at this point in time ? 

Sounds like purely a personal issue since he's been "excused". He's a good kid, so hope he and his family are OK. I think he was having some GF or wife problems earlier. 

2 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

"He'll miss some training camp.  No biggie."

Uh huh.

They're changing zone responsibilities with the new base defense.  Missing time is missing time.

Not saying new scheme install time isn't important. But I think you have to consider two things.

 

1) Flus changed coverages a lot, so Leonard is used to frequent changes. And of all the coverage variations Flus played, he played C3 most. Gus will also vary coverage, but he'll likely play even more C3.

2) And LB responsibility will likely not change a ton vs the DL and DBs. I'd bet Leonard's role changes least of all on the team to be honest. He'll still be the patrolling WILL. In passing downs, he'll likely either have flat or hole zones. So not very complicated or a change.

 

21 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Hmmm interesting.  I know people dump on me because I was never in favor of  rewarding him a big contract. If u look at my earlier posts about Leonard. I was concerned about his health long term. Racking up all those tackles on a slight frame , 215 pounds, was bound to have these type of results. People dismissed me as a hater. I compared him to a running back who was being run into the ground. When u r playing at a safeties weight, it will make u more athletic but the pounding will wear on u. I have the same about Nelson and his back issues.

 

If you look at the top 25-50 guys in solo tackles, it's LBs and DBs. LBs normally occupy the top 10 more than any other position, but still, plenty of DBs that are tackling machines. And most of those guys weigh less than Leonard, some much much less.

 

Harrison Smith for instance is a top 25 tackler last season and is a long tenured vet that's been crushing RBs, TEs, and WRs for a very long time (this will be his 11th season). He's the epitome of a physical safety that takes a pounding every year (don't forget he started at LB and also played RB early). If you look at combined tackles, he only has a few less than Leonard this year... 

 

And who led the NFL in total tackles last season? Foyesade Oluokun did. He's 215lbs.....  In short, MLBs will likely be heavier (even they are getting lighter), and WILLs in a 4-3 are simply a lot lighter than they used to be. 

 

So like I've said in the past, the weight and ankle excuses you throw out there are simply not good ones. So call it hater, or just bad reasoning.... that's why folks dump on you when it comes to this topic. 

[Moosejawcolt]

6 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

@TaylorTheStudMuffin - are you saying Willis doesn't fit Gus's scheme?

 

He got starter reps in week 1 of OTA, so I'd say it's likely he's well thought of already. 

Not saying he doesn't have to impress, all the WRs do. But pretty obvious he started camp in a good position. 

Sounds like purely a personal issue since he's been "excused". He's a good kid, so hope he and his family are OK. I think he was having some GF or wife problems earlier. 

Not saying new scheme install time isn't important. But I think you have to consider two things.

 

1) Flus changed coverages a lot, so Leonard is used to frequent changes. And of all the coverage variations Flus played, he played C3 most. Gus will also vary coverage, but he'll likely play even more C3.

2) And LB responsibility will likely not change a ton vs the DL and DBs. I'd bet Leonard's role changes least of all on the team to be honest. He'll still be the patrolling WILL. In passing downs, he'll likely either have flat or hole zones. So not very complicated or a change.

 

 

If you look at the top 25-50 guys in solo tackles, it's LBs and DBs. LBs normally occupy the top 10 more than any other position, but still, plenty of DBs that are tackling machines. And most of those guys weigh less than Leonard, some much much less.

 

Harrison Smith for instance is a top 25 tackler last season and is a long tenured vet that's been crushing RBs, TEs, and WRs for a very long time (this will be his 11th season). He's the epitome of a physical safety that takes a pounding every year (don't forget he started at LB and also played RB early). If you look at combined tackles, he only has a few less than Leonard this year... 

 

And who led the NFL in total tackles last season? Foyesade Oluokun did. He's 215lbs.....  In short, MLBs will likely be heavier (even they are getting lighter), and WILLs in a 4-3 are simply a lot lighter than they used to be. 

 

So like I've said in the past, the weight and ankle excuses you throw out there are simply not good ones. So call it hater, or just bad reasoning.... that's why folks dump on you when it comes to this topic. 

He has to take on guards which Harrison doesn't. Actually scratch that. Leonard is usually pile hopping and usually  runs away from opposing guards. K....now I am just being silly lol

[EastStreet]

4 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Probably pierce. Campbell has to stay healthy to be 2. Maybe Pierce moved up to two as the season progresses. I guess it all depends on how good Dulin looks and how well pierce adjusts to the NFL game.

 

7 minutes ago, Stephen said:

If patmon is the 4 then who is the 3 pierce or dulin

 

Pittman and Parris are locks in the top 3 at this point. Sure Parris needs to stay healthy, but he's been called the star of camp and consistently running with the 1s. 

 

3 and 4 aren't so straight forward. But Dulin has been getting a ton of buzz from both the media and Reich. Dulin, Strachan, and Patmon have all started the day with the 1s at one time or another. Pierce has been mostly with the 2s, but we all know he's a lock for the 53. And it sounds like Coutee might be making a push. 

[Moosejawcolt]

14 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

@TaylorTheStudMuffin - are you saying Willis doesn't fit Gus's scheme?

 

He got starter reps in week 1 of OTA, so I'd say it's likely he's well thought of already. 

Not saying he doesn't have to impress, all the WRs do. But pretty obvious he started camp in a good position. 

Sounds like purely a personal issue since he's been "excused". He's a good kid, so hope he and his family are OK. I think he was having some GF or wife problems earlier. 

Not saying new scheme install time isn't important. But I think you have to consider two things.

 

1) Flus changed coverages a lot, so Leonard is used to frequent changes. And of all the coverage variations Flus played, he played C3 most. Gus will also vary coverage, but he'll likely play even more C3.

2) And LB responsibility will likely not change a ton vs the DL and DBs. I'd bet Leonard's role changes least of all on the team to be honest. He'll still be the patrolling WILL. In passing downs, he'll likely either have flat or hole zones. So not very complicated or a change.

 

 

If you look at the top 25-50 guys in solo tackles, it's LBs and DBs. LBs normally occupy the top 10 more than any other position, but still, plenty of DBs that are tackling machines. And most of those guys weigh less than Leonard, some much much less.

 

Harrison Smith for instance is a top 25 tackler last season and is a long tenured vet that's been crushing RBs, TEs, and WRs for a very long time (this will be his 11th season). He's the epitome of a physical safety that takes a pounding every year (don't forget he started at LB and also played RB early). If you look at combined tackles, he only has a few less than Leonard this year... 

 

And who led the NFL in total tackles last season? Foyesade Oluokun did. He's 215lbs.....  In short, MLBs will likely be heavier (even they are getting lighter), and WILLs in a 4-3 are simply a lot lighter than they used to be. 

 

So like I've said in the past, the weight and ankle excuses you throw out there are simply not good ones. So call it hater, or just bad reasoning.... that's why folks dump on you when it comes to this topic. 

Being serious. I said I would have tagged him. Let's say we did. Do u think he still gets a huge contract based on his recent injuries? Things would be different I think.

[EastStreet]

9 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

He has to take on guards which Harrison doesn't. Actually scratch that. Leonard is usually pile hopping and usually  runs away from opposing guards. K....now I am just being silly lol

 

It just shows your hate is stronger than your reason.... 

 

If you knew LB responsibilities, you'd know it's the MIKE (Oke) who has the strongside OG, and the WILL is tasked with forcing outside runs to the inside. 

[Introspect]

3 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Good.....

He signed the contract.. Get out there and play...

[GoColts8818]

56 minutes ago, Stephen said:

We know that  now but didn't  then

Which is why I said how about we don’t jump to conclusions.  It’s better to wait for more facts than throw out wild guesses.

[KelownaColtsFan]

3 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think I am about to faint. Rob Ninkovich (yes ol' Nink) just said his sleeper pick to win the SB are the Colts on ESPN. Coming from Nink shocks me! He loves the Matt Ryan pickup. Loves our D and said we are a scary team now. 

I'm not saying they'll win it, but I honestly believe this year, the Colts can make it all the way to week 18.

[DeepseaColt]

16 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Being serious. I said I would have tagged him. Let's say we did. Do u think he still gets a huge contract based on his recent injuries? Things would be different I think.

Tagging him would have undermined the culture Ballard, Reich, and Irsay have been building. Reward our own for producing. While Leonard has had injuries, he's played through most and still performs at an elite level. Now if he was missing half a season every year then he likely wouldn't have gotten a massive contract, at least not from us. Your strategy leads to a personnel vs. player mentality which leads to way more holdouts and players begging to jump ship somewhere else. Leonard deserved his contract and as long as Nelson gets the OK medically he will be deserving of his as well. 

[Moosejawcolt]

1 hour ago, DeepseaColt said:

Tagging him would have undermined the culture Ballard, Reich, and Irsay have been building. Reward our own for producing. While Leonard has had injuries, he's played through most and still performs at an elite level. Now if he was missing half a season every year then he likely wouldn't have gotten a massive contract, at least not from us. Your strategy leads to a personnel vs. player mentality which leads to way more holdouts and players begging to jump ship somewhere else. Leonard deserved his contract and as long as Nelson gets the OK medically he will be deserving of his as well. 

I don't buy that at all. Belichek sets a price on a player and would never go above it. He would either release or trade a player if they did not comply. It seems to work have worked out for his culture just fine. All I hear about Ballard is culture..culture.  Well how did that work out for him last year? The leaders of this team and arguably it's best players pulled an Amber Heard and  did a u know what lol. All I am hearing in training camp is Ryan's leader ship. Players are fawning over him which is great almost like it was something that has been lacking on this team. Yes, you can blame Wentz to a degree,  but Irsay and this board cannot blame Wentz for all the problems that surface in those last 2 games. I feel Wentz has been a scape goat. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Wrong thread 

[DeepseaColt]

1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I don't buy that at all. Belichek sets a price on a player and would never go above it. He would either release or trade a player if they did not comply. It seems to work have worked out for his culture just fine. All I hear about Ballard is culture..culture.  Well how did that work out for him last year? The leaders of this team and arguably it's best players pulled an Amber Heard and  did a u know what lol. All I am hearing in training camp is Ryan's leader ship. Players are fawning over him which is great almost like it was something that has been lacking on this team. Yes, you can blame Wentz to a degree,  but Irsay and this board cannot blame Wentz for all the problems that surface in those last 2 games. I feel Wentz has been a scape goat. 

Belichek had Brady, "arguably" which makes me gag the greatest QB of all time. Players and FA's jump to play with him. Now that he's gone NE has to overpay just like everyone else. As far as not complying, I believe Ballard would absolutely have no issues booting someone who doesn't fit what we want, hence Wentz leaving. As far as culture working out for this team, it's worked phenomenally. We got screwed with Luck retiring and have been searching for a longterm solution. The majority of teams fall apart or instantly go into rebuild mode. We didn't make the playoffs last year because we made a bad call with Wentz which I expect to be corrected under Ryan. The Colts are always competitive and either a superbowl contender or in the playoff hunt. We are very spoiled as a fan base. 

[PRnum1]

On 6/7/2022 at 2:14 PM, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Why did he wait until June.

Back surgery can be a very tricky thing.

 

Sometimes it goes well and the patient is back to normal in 4-6 weeks.

 

Sometimes it doesn't go well and there is lingering pain and limited movement 4-6 months later.

 

Hopefully it is the latter.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

6 minutes ago, PRnum1 said:

Back surgery can be a very tricky thing.

 

Sometimes it goes well and the patient is back to normal in 4-6 weeks.

 

Sometimes it doesn't go well and there is lingering pain and limited movement 4-6 months later.

 

Hopefully it is the latter.

Apparently the nerve was what was causing the ankle issue.

 

 

[DynaMike]

1 hour ago, PRnum1 said:

Back surgery can be a very tricky thing.

 

Sometimes it goes well and the patient is back to normal in 4-6 weeks.

 

Sometimes it doesn't go well and there is lingering pain and limited movement 4-6 months later.

 

Hopefully it is the latter.

Did you mean the former?

[rock8591]

Knew it was an unfounded rumor that Willis is holding out.

 

4th rounder in a rookie contract, playing a non-premium position (e.g. Safety, NB, LS, Kicker, Punter, Guard, TE, FB, possession WR); doubt he would hypothetically have any leverage in any case.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

11 hours ago, rock8591 said:

Knew it was an unfounded rumor that Willis is holding out.

 

4th rounder in a rookie contract, playing a non-premium position (e.g. Safety, NB, LS, Kicker, Punter, Guard, TE, FB, possession WR); doubt he would hypothetically have any leverage in any case.

He has a excused absence for personal reasons. Reich says he has stayed in touch with him almost every day.

[2006Coltsbestever]

18 hours ago, PRnum1 said:

Back surgery can be a very tricky thing.

 

Sometimes it goes well and the patient is back to normal in 4-6 weeks.

 

Sometimes it doesn't go well and there is lingering pain and limited movement 4-6 months later.

 

Hopefully it is the latter.

- Homer put his back into place (his invention) after barely being able to walk, too funny. I have no idea how these networks make this stuff up . The new technique. 

[compuls1v3]

On 6/8/2022 at 1:42 PM, PRnum1 said:

Back surgery can be a very tricky thing.

 

Sometimes it goes well and the patient is back to normal in 4-6 weeks.

 

Sometimes it doesn't go well and there is lingering pain and limited movement 4-6 months later.

 

Hopefully it is the latter.

I hope it's the former.  4-6 weeks