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Kwity Paye and then Hope and Pray


Smonroe
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Kwity imo can get 10 sacks this year. There were so many instances where Kwity got to the QB and he threw it away just as he was going down. Kyler did it, Mac Jones when Kwity popped him, and Josh Johnson when Kwity had him dead

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10 hours ago, CR91 said:

Kwity imo can get 10 sacks this year. There were so many instances where Kwity got to the QB and he threw it away just as he was going down. Kyler did it, Mac Jones when Kwity popped him, and Josh Johnson when Kwity had him dead


Ill be happy if Paye gets 8.  I think 10 will be too much.  

 

Im expecting Ngokoue and Buckner to get 10 sacks each.  I think it’s rare (Never?) to have three players from the same team to all have 10 sacks each.   I’m think Dayo with about 4-6.

 

That’s 32-34 just from 4 players.   Doesn’t include any other DL.   Doesn’t include any blitzing linebackers, safeties or corners.  
 

My hope is that we get a minimum of 40 sacks and hopefully more.   

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6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


Ill be happy if Paye gets 8.  I think 10 will be too much.  

 

Im expecting Ngokoue and Buckner to get 10 sacks each.  I think it’s rare (Never?) to have three players from the same team to all have 10 sacks each.   I’m think Dayo with about 4-6.

 

That’s 32-34 just from 4 players.   Doesn’t include any other DL.   Doesn’t include any blitzing linebackers, safeties or corners.  
 

My hope is that we get a minimum of 40 sacks and hopefully more.   

I will also be happy if he gets 8. I’ve been slowly looking into how Bradley uses his DL. With that and an expected rotation, I don’t see him getting double digits unless he breaks out as a star. I just don’t think Paye is that type of player.  He should provide 6-8 years of solid play with maybe a year or two of bigger numbers, but he will probably never be a #1 ER on a good DL. He is the guy you stick on the other side that can contain the run and provide pressure on 20% of his 1 on 1 opportunities 

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6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


Ill be happy if Paye gets 8.  I think 10 will be too much.  

 

Im expecting Ngokoue and Buckner to get 10 sacks each.  I think it’s rare (Never?) to have three players from the same team to all have 10 sacks each.   I’m think Dayo with about 4-6.

 

That’s 32-34 just from 4 players.   Doesn’t include any other DL.   Doesn’t include any blitzing linebackers, safeties or corners.  
 

My hope is that we get a minimum of 40 sacks and hopefully more.   

I agree.  There are only so many sack opportunities to go around.  And these guys aren't the '85 Bears.  (In fairness, even on that vaunted Bears team with their 64 sacks, only two players got double digits:  Richard Dent at 17 and Otis Wilson at 10.5.)

If past performance predicts the future, Ngaukue has gotten double-digit sacks twice in six years.  Buckner only once.  I would predict 10 from Ngaukue, 9 from Buckner, 8 (at most) from Paye.  An another 4 or 5 from Dayo.  As you say, plus other random sacks from blitzers and such should give us 40-45.  If we get to 50 that would be amazing for this group of guys.

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9 hours ago, CanuckColt said:

I just hope he gets some help from Dayo who does not turn into a 2nd round lemon.

I think Dayo has semi-bust written all over him(maybe wasted pick is a better term). I think his ceiling is slightly above average replacement for Buckner in the next two years. His floor is backup swing DL for 3 tech and big end. Not a total bust but not worth a 2nd round pick. I’ve not been high on this guy since we drafted him bc I watched him a bit at Vanderbilt as well. He has elite traits but also gets knocked off his point of attack far too often by single lineman. He is another “traitsy” pick that was done when we had a different coach. I’m obviously jaded so take what I say with a grain of salt. 
 

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50 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

I agree.  There are only so many sack opportunities to go around.  And these guys aren't the '85 Bears.  (In fairness, even on that vaunted Bears team with their 64 sacks, only two players got double digits:  Richard Dent at 17 and Otis Wilson at 10.5.)

If past performance predicts the future, Ngaukue has gotten double-digit sacks twice in six years.  Buckner only once.  I would predict 10 from Ngaukue, 9 from Buckner, 8 (at most) from Paye.  An another 4 or 5 from Dayo.  As you say, plus other random sacks from blitzers and such should give us 40-45.  If we get to 50 that would be amazing for this group of guys.

 

I'd take 45 in a heartbeat, which would have put us top 10ish last season.

 

Given the change of scheme, and our personnel (at least on paper), there's not really a lot of reasons we shouldn't be in the 40-45 range.

 

50 (which would have been top 3), would be a pleasant surprise, but not shocking IMO, assuming everyone stays healthy. We should expect a lot from DB and YN, and we should expect year 2 improvement from KP. The scheme change should allow guys to pin their ears back a lot more. 

47 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I think Dayo has semi-bust written all over him(maybe wasted pick is a better term). I think his ceiling is slightly above average replacement for Buckner in the next two years. His floor is backup swing DL for 3 tech and big end. Not a total bust but not worth a 2nd round pick. I’ve not been high on this guy since we drafted him bc I watched him a bit at Vanderbilt as well. He has elite traits but also gets knocked off his point of attack far too often by single lineman. He is another “traitsy” pick that was done when we had a different coach. I’m obviously jaded so take what I say with a grain of salt. 
 

 

I agree he's a traitsy pick, but I think I have a little higher confidence in him than you. Not saying it's extremely high, but I think he's got upside to be a very solid tweener for us. The conspiracy theory voice in my head is still whispering we might have picked him to be the Defo replacement in time. He's locked up for 3 more seasons, but zero deadcap after this season. Not wishing him gone by any means, just not sure we'll be willing to go big dollars or big years on 30+ year old DL after the 2024 season.

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48 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

I'd take 45 in a heartbeat, which would have put us top 10ish last season.

 

Given the change of scheme, and our personnel (at least on paper), there's not really a lot of reasons we shouldn't be in the 40-45 range.

 

50 (which would have been top 3), would be a pleasant surprise, but not shocking IMO, assuming everyone stays healthy. We should expect a lot from DB and YN, and we should expect year 2 improvement from KP. The scheme change should allow guys to pin their ears back a lot more. 

 

I agree he's a traitsy pick, but I think I have a little higher confidence in him than you. Not saying it's extremely high, but I think he's got upside to be a very solid tweener for us. The conspiracy theory voice in my head is still whispering we might have picked him to be the Defo replacement in time. He's locked up for 3 more seasons, but zero deadcap after this season. Not wishing him gone by any means, just not sure we'll be willing to go big dollars or big years on 30+ year old DL after the 2024 season.

One of my hot takes is Buckner could be traded next offseason. A lot depends on how Bradley uses him and how Dayo develops.  Obviously I’m not high on Dayo but I’m wrong all the time. One thing we both can agree on is DB is getting paid a lot of money.  He was worth it his first year....not so much last year.  I am seeing the 3 tech covers up the Leo position so he can make plays.  That’s a lot of money in one spot with half of it to eat blockers. Should be interesting to see how the work in tandem together

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2 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I think Dayo has semi-bust written all over him(maybe wasted pick is a better term). I think his ceiling is slightly above average replacement for Buckner in the next two years. His floor is backup swing DL for 3 tech and big end. Not a total bust but not worth a 2nd round pick. I’ve not been high on this guy since we drafted him bc I watched him a bit at Vanderbilt as well. He has elite traits but also gets knocked off his point of attack far too often by single lineman. He is another “traitsy” pick that was done when we had a different coach. I’m obviously jaded so take what I say with a grain of salt. 
 


i think it’s one thing to make a post like this next January, AFTER you have a season of seeing him healthy….  But to make it now, after a half season of coming off Achilles surgery and coming out of Vanderbilt where he the only real NFL talent and other schools could double and triple team him is simply astonishing.   I don’t know why anyone would make such a prediction in anyones career? 
 

And Eberflus had nothing to do with the pick. The traits Dayo had are the same traits we want today.   He was scouted heavy by Morocco Brown and Chris Ballard and they’re still with the team. 
 

Someday you may have an argument,  but I don’t think that day is today.  Semi-bust?   Wow. 

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13 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


i think it’s one thing to make a post like this next January, AFTER you have a season if seeing him healthy….  But to make it now, after a half season of coming off Achilles surgery and coming out of Vanderbilt where he the only real NFL talent and other schools could double and triple team him is simply astonishing.   I don’t know why anyone would make such a prediction in anyones career? 
 

And Eberflus had nothing to do with the pick. The traits Dayo had are the same traits we want today.   He was scouted heavy by Morocco Brown and Chris Ballard and they’re still with the team. 
 

Someday you may have an argument,  but I don’t think that day is today.  Semi-bust?   Wow. 

People make predictions before players even play a down all the time. Not sure why this is shocking.  All I said is I don’t think he will be a great player.  Ceiling is quality starter and floor is quality back up. Thats a pretty tame prediction. I’m wrong all the time and could be here so guess we will wait and see

 

Edit: I want to add I made sure I said wasted pick bc I know the “bust” word can be a bit harsh. Maybe over drafted is the best way to say it?  I just believe he ultimately won’t be worth a 2nd round pick. Some graded him 1st round before his injury and others said it was a head scratching pick. I’ve never been a fan of Ballard’s delayed gratification bc either his picks are good from the go or they don’t develop. Tyquan Lewis and Dayo could be the exception.  I hope they are 

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29 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

People make predictions before players even play a down all the time. Not sure why this is shocking.  All I said is I don’t think he will be a great player.  Ceiling is quality starter and floor is quality back up. Thats a pretty tame prediction. I’m wrong all the time and could be here so guess we will wait and see

 

Edit: I want to add I made sure I said wasted pick bc I know the “bust” word can be a bit harsh. Maybe over drafted is the best way to say it?  I just believe he ultimately won’t be worth a 2nd round pick. Some graded him 1st round before his injury and others said it was a head scratching pick. I’ve never been a fan of Ballard’s delayed gratification bc either his picks are good from the go or they don’t develop. Tyquan Lewis and Dayo could be the exception.  I hope they are 


I don’t know who these “people” are?   But as I noted,  you haven’t seen Dayo 100 percent healthy in the NFL.   And you haven’t seen him in a setting where he can play without being the focus as he was in college.   
 

In essence, we’re in the first mile of a marathon and you’ve decided you’ve seen enough to make a prediction on who is going to win.   If you’re right it’s not because you know enough to make an accurate prediction.   You’re flipping a coin and guessed right.   

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3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


I don’t know who these “people” are?   But as I noted,  you haven’t seen Dayo 100 percent healthy in the NFL.   And you haven’t seen him in a setting where he can play without being the focus as he was in college.   
 

In essence, we’re in the first mile of a marathon and you’ve decided you’ve seen enough to make a prediction on who is going to win.   If you’re right it’s not because you know enough to make an accurate prediction.   You’re flipping a coin and guessed right.   

You have never seen anyone grade a draft ?  You never seen anyone predict break out players or bust potential?  
 

You have no idea what I know and to say I’m just guessing is what is truly astonishing and honestly rude. Like your opinion is any more qualified but here you are giving it. Question for you...have you ever had an opinion on a draft pick? I’m betting you have. Did you flip a coin to get it? I’m betting not. 
 

 

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53 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

One of my hot takes is Buckner could be traded next offseason. A lot depends on how Bradley uses him and how Dayo develops.  Obviously I’m not high on Dayo but I’m wrong all the time. One thing we both can agree on is DB is getting paid a lot of money.  He was worth it his first year....not so much last year.  I am seeing the 3 tech covers up the Leo position so he can make plays.  That’s a lot of money in one spot with half of it to eat blockers. Should be interesting to see how the work in tandem together

I don’t see DB going anywhere.  It took us forever to find a 3t and he’s a great one who I think will do even better under Bradley.  His salary is a bargain three years down the road for a player of his caliber.  He’s a foundation piece like Q.  I expect we will restructure his contract this year or next to help with the cap.  JMO.

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1 hour ago, AwesomeAustin said:

One of my hot takes is Buckner could be traded next offseason. A lot depends on how Bradley uses him and how Dayo develops.  Obviously I’m not high on Dayo but I’m wrong all the time. One thing we both can agree on is DB is getting paid a lot of money.  He was worth it his first year....not so much last year.  I am seeing the 3 tech covers up the Leo position so he can make plays.  That’s a lot of money in one spot with half of it to eat blockers. Should be interesting to see how the work in tandem together

I think Flus's read/react + no-blitz scheme handcuffed a lot of players. Defo's first year, he had two pretty good guys supporting him in Autry and Houston (both who went on to look better in other schemes last season). So IMO, Defo will benefit both from new scheme, plus better supporting cast this year. But... trading Defo in 2024 wouldn't shock me IF someone else steps up (like Dayo). All in all, I think Defo, YN, and KP all will look good this year and have a chance to hit 10 sacks. Not saying they all do, but OLs will have to pick and choose differently than they did last year, and all three will have more opportunity. 

 

In passing downs, I see Paye - Dayo/Lewis - Defo - YN, or perhaps even Dayo/Lews - Paye - Defo - YN... Both those sets look pretty mean to me if they all can pin their ears back. And Gus rarely blitzed last year, but was considered one of the better DC in terms of picking his moments to blitz. I'm also interested to see if he uses SAM like a 5th DL at times in passing downs like he has from time to time in the past. All in all, I'm a lot more optimistic about the DL this season, and really interested to see how he uses some of the guys. 

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1 hour ago, AwesomeAustin said:

One of my hot takes is Buckner could be traded next offseason. A lot depends on how Bradley uses him and how Dayo develops.  Obviously I’m not high on Dayo but I’m wrong all the time. One thing we both can agree on is DB is getting paid a lot of money.  He was worth it his first year....not so much last year.  I am seeing the 3 tech covers up the Leo position so he can make plays.  That’s a lot of money in one spot with half of it to eat blockers. Should be interesting to see how the work in tandem together

 

7 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I don’t see DB going anywhere.  It took us forever to find a 3t and he’s a great one who I think will do even better under Bradley.  His salary is a bargain three years down the road for a player of his caliber.  He’s a foundation piece like Q.  I expect we will restructure his contract this year or next to help with the cap.  JMO.

I agree with RP here. Buckner was double and triple teamed last year because the rest of the D line scared no one. His supporting cast should be much stronger this year with the addition of Ngaukue, Year two for Kwity, a healthy Dayo, and a more aggressive scheme. I think you'll see double digit sacks from DeFo. He's not getting traded. 

 

And speaking of Dayo, a rookie D lineman coming off a recent Achilles injury (and who missed the entire training camp process) cannot be deemed a bust just because he didn't immediately set the world on fire. The fact that he managed to play in 10 games in a diminished capacity is, on its own, a very good thing. He'll obviously be far more prepared for his sophomore season than if he'd had a redshirt year. He is admittedly an unknown at this point, but his athletic talent is off the charts, and the coaches love his potential, so he deserves a full, healthy season before anyone tries to evaluate whether or not he was worth a second round pick. 

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25 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I don’t see DB going anywhere.  It took us forever to find a 3t and he’s a great one who I think will do even better under Bradley.  His salary is a bargain three years down the road for a player of his caliber.  He’s a foundation piece like Q.  I expect we will restructure his contract this year or next to help with the cap.  JMO.

Solid expectation!!  He is one heck of a player. I see it way more likely it plays out your way over mine. 

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28 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I don’t see DB going anywhere.  It took us forever to find a 3t and he’s a great one who I think will do even better under Bradley.  His salary is a bargain three years down the road for a player of his caliber.  He’s a foundation piece like Q.  I expect we will restructure his contract this year or next to help with the cap.  JMO.

It's not really about now, or next season, it's more about the next contract (he's under contract through 2024) when he's 30+. 

I hope he stays, but a lot can happen in the next 3 seasons. We'll likely need a new QB about that time too lol. Just not sure we'll spend big money on another long term contract for Defo. Hope it all works out though. 

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4 minutes ago, Hoose said:

 

I agree with RP here. Buckner was double and triple teamed last year because the rest of the D line scared no one. His supporting cast should be much stronger this year with the addition of Ngaukue, Year two for Kwity, a healthy Dayo, and a more aggressive scheme. I think you'll see double digit sacks from DeFo. He's not getting traded. 

 

And speaking of Dayo, a rookie D lineman coming off a recent Achilles injury (and who missed the entire training camp process) cannot be deemed a bust just because he didn't immediately set the world on fire. The fact that he managed to play in 10 games in a diminished capacity is, on its own, a very good thing. He'll obviously be far more prepared for his sophomore season than if he'd had a redshirt year. He is admittedly an unknown at this point, but his athletic talent is off the charts, and the coaches love his potential, so he deserves a full, healthy season before anyone tries to evaluate whether or not he was worth a second round pick. 

I’m not only forming my opinion off what Dayo has done in his rookie year. I’m from TN and have two good friends that graduated from Vanderbilt and we talk college sports a lot. I follow them and watched multiple games(I’m a UT Vols fan tho). I probably knew who he was before most people on this board. 
 

Dayo most certainly deserves the opportunity to go prove himself. However, his circumstances have zero to do if I’m allowed to have an opinion or not and shockingly be told I Shouldn’t express it on how successful he will. 

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3 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I’m not only forming my opinion off what Dayo has done in his rookie year. I’m from TN and have two good friends that graduated from Vanderbilt and we talk college sports a lot. I follow them and watched multiple games(I’m a UT Vols fan tho). I probably knew who he was before most people on this board. 
 

Dayo most certainly deserves the opportunity to go prove himself. However, his circumstances have zero to do if I’m allowed to have an opinion or not and shockingly be told I Shouldn’t express it on how successful he will. 

 

Go Vols

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1 hour ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I’m not only forming my opinion off what Dayo has done in his rookie year. I’m from TN and have two good friends that graduated from Vanderbilt and we talk college sports a lot. I follow them and watched multiple games(I’m a UT Vols fan tho). I probably knew who he was before most people on this board. 
 

Dayo most certainly deserves the opportunity to go prove himself. However, his circumstances have zero to do if I’m allowed to have an opinion or not and shockingly be told I Shouldn’t express it on how successful he will. 

No one said you shouldn’t have an opinion. I’m just disagreeing with you. I think it’s silly to call Dayo a bust before he’s had a chance to show what he can do when healthy. 

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1 hour ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I’m not only forming my opinion off what Dayo has done in his rookie year. I’m from TN and have two good friends that graduated from Vanderbilt and we talk college sports a lot. I follow them and watched multiple games(I’m a UT Vols fan tho). I probably knew who he was before most people on this board. 
 

Dayo most certainly deserves the opportunity to go prove himself. However, his circumstances have zero to do if I’m allowed to have an opinion or not and shockingly be told I Shouldn’t express it on how successful he will. 

Dayo will be a force. That's my opinion which is the correct opinion. Your opinion is wrong.

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2 hours ago, Hoose said:

No one said you shouldn’t have an opinion. I’m just disagreeing with you. I think it’s silly to call Dayo a bust before he’s had a chance to show what he can do when healthy. 

But I didn’t say he was a bust. I said he has semi bust written all over him, then made sure I said wasted pick and over drafted. Tried using any different words so people wouldn’t key in on one part and ignore everything else I said. It’s not silly at all to see a guy play in college and not be too impressed and then he gets hurt and not think he will live up to what I view a 2nd round pick should be. I think he will be a quality backup to slightly above average starter. I think he leans towards quality backup in a rotation. There is nothing outlandish or silly about that. 

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I think Paye gets 7 sacks this year, and I hope I’m wrong and he gets more.  I’m interested to see how Dayo does, and if he really lives up to first round potential as talent evaluators see.  I’m ready for this delayed gratification to come to fruition.

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On 5/23/2022 at 12:19 PM, Smonroe said:

This article talks about him being a breakout candidate this year.  
 

The phrase in the title is what evaluators thought of the pass rushers in the draft last year.

 

Unfortunately, it also described our pass rush last season, lol!

 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/ranking-2022-nfl-defenses-rams-bills-saints-most-likely-units-to-crack-the-top-10/

 

Hope he's right about TEN being unlikely to have a top 10 defense. But they were #12 last year in DVOA and return essentially the same defense. Plus, they should be getting back a couple of players from injury and added to their secondary in the draft. I think IND and TEN easily could both be top 10 defenses.

 

 

 

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On 5/24/2022 at 6:59 AM, EastStreet said:

 

I'd take 45 in a heartbeat, which would have put us top 10ish last season.

 

Given the change of scheme, and our personnel (at least on paper), there's not really a lot of reasons we shouldn't be in the 40-45 range.

 

50 (which would have been top 3), would be a pleasant surprise, but not shocking IMO, assuming everyone stays healthy. We should expect a lot from DB and YN, and we should expect year 2 improvement from KP. The scheme change should allow guys to pin their ears back a lot more. 

 

I agree he's a traitsy pick, but I think I have a little higher confidence in him than you. Not saying it's extremely high, but I think he's got upside to be a very solid tweener for us. The conspiracy theory voice in my head is still whispering we might have picked him to be the Defo replacement in time. He's locked up for 3 more seasons, but zero deadcap after this season. Not wishing him gone by any means, just not sure we'll be willing to go big dollars or big years on 30+ year old DL after the 2024 season.

Yes and DT'sserm to hit the wall rather quickly as they get older. Brutal position to play.

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On 5/24/2022 at 7:02 AM, AwesomeAustin said:

I think Dayo has semi-bust written all over him(maybe wasted pick is a better term). I think his ceiling is slightly above average replacement for Buckner in the next two years. His floor is backup swing DL for 3 tech and big end. Not a total bust but not worth a 2nd round pick. I’ve not been high on this guy since we drafted him bc I watched him a bit at Vanderbilt as well. He has elite traits but also gets knocked off his point of attack far too often by single lineman. He is another “traitsy” pick that was done when we had a different coach. I’m obviously jaded so take what I say with a grain of salt. 
 

I am taking a wait and see on Dayo

 

He will get some excellent coaching and has had an opportunity to build some strength

 

He is not a first round pick, just a kid that had the unteachable measurables that CB is seeking in all of his early picks

 

Last year was a throw away year for him, as he wasnt 100%

 

I am hopeful that he can pick it up

 

He may be our long term big end, or even 3 tech as he adds a little weight and skill

 

 

Dont give up yet 

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On 5/24/2022 at 5:07 PM, compuls1v3 said:

I think Paye gets 7 sacks this year, and I hope I’m wrong and he gets more.  I’m interested to see how Dayo does, and if he really lives up to first round potential as talent evaluators see.  I’m ready for this delayed gratification to come to fruition.

As mentioned, you could see him get a little better through the year..... he was very close on getting 3-4 more sacks more

 

I think he will take another step this year to get more pressures and sacks, as well as getting more opportunities as we have another DE on the line that will have to be accounted for...... It should help Paye to not get chipped as much

 

I am guessing 8 or 9 sacks , with a large increase in pressures

 

 

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31 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

I am taking a wait and see on Dayo

 

He will get some excellent coaching and has had an opportunity to build some strength

 

He is not a first round pick, just a kid that had the unteachable measurables that CB is seeking in all of his early picks

 

Last year was a throw away year for him, as he wasnt 100%

 

I am hopeful that he can pick it up

 

He may be our long term big end, or even 3 tech as he adds a little weight and skill

 

 

Dont give up yet 

Have not given up bc I’ve never started. A wait and see approach is more than fair. In all fairness, one of the first moves the Colts did was fire the DL coach.  I didn’t take this into consideration with Dayo. New staff, with a new scheme, might develop our younger players. His physical skills are top notch but he needs coaching and I haven’t been impressed with how these young DL guys have been brought along. So many unknowns that anything can happen

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On 5/27/2022 at 4:13 PM, Moosejawcolt said:

Yes and DT'sserm to hit the wall rather quickly as they get older. Brutal position to play.

If i am the Rams, I would not poney up for more money. Donald is saying he could retire. I laugh when a player says that. It is always...always about the money. So let me get this straight. You want more money , but will retire and take none if you don't get your way? Does that make sense lol?? I say call his bluff and I bet Donald's best years are behind him. He had a great superbowl, but I could pass rush against the Bengals Oline.

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1 hour ago, craigerb said:

“Spahn and Sain and pray for rain.”


Baseball makes the best literature but football is America’s game now.  
 

Bar trivia - Sain was the last pitcher to face Babe Ruth and the first to face Jackie Robinson.  

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