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1 hour ago, DaColts85 said:

The colts requested a private workout with Jalen Wydermyer

 

17 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Might be a priority UDFA. His pro day was awful. Like really bad.

Looks like the Cowboys and Commanders have eyes on him

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22 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

Might be a priority UDFA. His pro day was awful. Like really bad.


I think the idea of Wydermeyer falling all the way to free agent is really weird.    I’m well aware of his bad pro day and I’m aware that Zierlein made the comment.  And he’s from Texas and likely has good sources.  But for the kid to fall all the way out of the draft, there would have to be much,  MUCH more to this story.  
 

Like drugs, or alcohol, or terrible attitude, or a health issue, etc.   Just a bad pro day alone won’t do it.  Plenty of guys have a bad pro day and still get drafted.   I’d love to see his file to know what all the problems are? 
 

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24 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


I think the idea of Wydermeyer falling all the way to free agent is really weird.    I’m well aware of his bad pro day and I’m aware that Zierlein made the comment.  And he’s from Texas and likely has good sources.  But for the kid to fall all the way out of the draft, there would have to be much,  MUCH more to this story.  
 

Like drugs, or alcohol, or terrible attitude, or a health issue, etc.   Just a bad pro day alone won’t do it.  Plenty of guys have a bad pro day and still get drafted.   I’d love to see his file to know what all the problems are? 
 

Normally I would agree but unless there’s some explanation as to why he tested like that, I can’t see him being drafted. We’re not talking just bad, we’re talking worst of the worst. He’s a TE who tested like an offensive lineman. That’s like historically bad.

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26 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Normally I would agree but unless there’s some explanation as to why he tested like that, I can’t see him being drafted. We’re not talking just bad, we’re talking worst of the worst. He’s a TE who tested like an offensive lineman. That’s like historically bad.


Look at Orlando Brown.   His combine was practically the worst for an OT in Combine history.  And I think he was drafted in the 4th or 5th round.   
 

Someone will take a chance on a guy with raw talent or great measurables.    But it’s the off-field stuff that will sink you.  That will turn a guy who used to be a prospect into a free agent.  
 

If wydermeyer has his head on straight then I’d have to believe some team would still spend a 6 or a 7 on him.   But if he’s a head case,  with lots of bad stuff in his closet,  then I think the majority of teams will stay away.   
 

I wonder if anything leaks out in the next month?   I’m guessing it will…. 

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:


Look at Orlando Brown.   His combine was practically the worst for an OT in Combine history.  And I think he was drafted in the 4th or 5th round.   
 

Someone will take a chance on a guy with raw talent or great measurables.    But it’s the off-field stuff that will sink you.  That will turn a guy who used to be a prospect into a free agent.  
 

If wydermeyer has his head on straight then I’d have to believe some team would still spend a 6 or a 7 on him.   But if he’s a head case,  with lots of bad stuff in his closet,  then I think the majority of teams will stay away.   
 

I wonder if anything leaks out in the next month?   I’m guessing it will…. 

It depends on the price you have to pay, but I don't think making decisions based on outliers is a recipe for success in the long-term. Orlando Brown was picked in the 3d after being considered a 1st round talent, but usually such horrible testers don't pan out as well as Brown has panned out in the League. Wydermeyer was probably thought of as a 2nd-3d round TE before his tests?! I think it's fair that you should considerably drop him based on that testing. Now, GMs have to do their job and investigate why that is because there are explanations that are even worse than him being a bad athlete - like you said it could point to bad attitude/preparation... 

 

I liked Wydermeyer but maybe I misjudged him. I'm kind of too lazy to go back and look through his games to see if that lack of speed is so clearly visible. 

 

Good on the Colts for having him on a visit, hopefully they get to the bottom of this thing when they meet him in person and hopefully put him through a workout. 

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1 hour ago, stitches said:

It depends on the price you have to pay, but I don't think making decisions based on outliers is a recipe for success in the long-term. Orlando Brown was picked in the 3d after being considered a 1st round talent, but usually such horrible testers don't pan out as well as Brown has panned out in the League. Wydermeyer was probably thought of as a 2nd-3d round TE before his tests?! I think it's fair that you should considerably drop him based on that testing. Now, GMs have to do their job and investigate why that is because there are explanations that are even worse than him being a bad athlete - like you said it could point to bad attitude/preparation... 

 

I liked Wydermeyer but maybe I misjudged him. I'm kind of too lazy to go back and look through his games to see if that lack of speed is so clearly visible. 

 

Good on the Colts for having him on a visit, hopefully they get to the bottom of this thing when they meet him in person and hopefully put him through a workout. 


I want to be clear here….

 

First, I’m not saying Wydermeyer is not going undrafted.   He might. 
 

Second, what I am saying, is that for him to fall from a projected Day 2 guy all the way to being an undrafted free agent, it takes much more than a bad combine or pro day.   A lot more.    Injury, attitude, brushes with the law, health issue, drugs, alcohol….  Etc.  

 

Those are the things that will take you from Hero to Zero.   I’d love to know. 

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7 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


I want to be clear here….

 

First, I’m not saying Wydermeyer is not going undrafted.   He might. 
 

Second, what I am saying, is that for him to fall from a projected Day 2 guy all the way to being an undrafted free agent, it takes much more than a bad combine or pro day.   A lot more.    Injury, attitude, brushes with the law, health issue, drugs, alcohol….  Etc.  

 

Those are the things that will take you from Hero to Zero.   I’d love to know. 

Oh yah, I doubt he goes undrafted too... there must be something really wrong behind those tests for him to go undrafted. Some team will spend a 6th-7th rounder on him. Agree with you on that. 

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3 hours ago, danlhart87 said:

 

David Bell GIF by The Undroppables

Hard to not push for a hometown guy who openly has said he wants to play for the team to not be drafted. Don’t love the 40 times, but he’s got talent. Hopefully he’s there in the 3rd round.

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On 3/26/2022 at 9:33 AM, danlhart87 said:

I know the Colts have met with Tariq Woolen CB and Christian Watson WR recently 

 

Anybody else you see info on post here 

 

@NFLfan

Please pin this


So here’s a question for everyone who follows this discussion. 
 

We make this thread every year.   My question is this…. Is it predictive of anything? Has anyone ever tracked to see who we visit, and who we then actually drafted or signed as a free agent?    Are there actual dots to connect?

 

Over on Stampede Blue,  their annual Build a Ballard series I think are very good.  And very accurate.   I think they’ve been somewhat predictive.   But is this thread also predictive?   Are we drafting or signing guys we are visiting with?

 

Anyone?    Anyone at all.    Thanks….

 

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7 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

Hard to not push for a hometown guy who openly has said he wants to play for the team to not be drafted. Don’t love the 40 times, but he’s got talent. Hopefully he’s there in the 3rd round.

He will be there on day 3. Almost certain about it. 

 

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


So here’s a question for everyone who follows this discussion. 
 

We make this thread every year.   My question is this…. Is it predictive of anything? Has anyone ever tracked to see who we visit, and who we then actually drafted or signed as a free agent?    Are there actual dots to connect?

 

Over on Stampede Blue,  their annual Build a Ballard series I think are very good.  And very accurate.   I think they’ve been somewhat predictive.   But is this thread also predictive?   Are we drafting or signing guys we are visiting with?

 

Anyone?    Anyone at all.    Thanks….

 

That's a good question. I think the problem with it is that we have very incomplete information. We hear about a very limited number of players that get meetings/visits with the Colts. I follow Dallas Cowboys' draft podcast and it seems like for them a top 30 visit is incredibly important and players that get a top 30 visit with them have higher chance to get drafted by them... and they actually have a close to complete list of their top 30 visits.

 

No idea if the Colts do the same... and we have very few of the names that actually get top 30 visits. For example, if we get 6-7 of them we should count ourselves lucky. For example, I know Hooker was a late top 30 visit and we drafted him... I know the Colts went and worked out MPJ at his pro day and loved what they saw there and drafted him... but at the same there are multiple players we've drafted that say they didn't get any indication from the Colts that we are after them. For example, Ballard was at Q's pro-day but it seems like we didn't go out of our way to talk to him, etc. 

 

I would guess for players that seem incredibly clean with nothing in their background to flash red lights(Q), we are content not giving away our hand and staying back and pouncing when the value meets our draft position(thus not giving other teams a chance to know what we are planning and giving them an opportunity to jump us for certain players). But at the same time I feel like for players with some checkerred past it's very important to get to the bottom of it and the more you meet him and spend time with him the better chance you have to get a real feel about the player. 

 

In general I kind of feel like previous draft picks are better indication about what Ballard likes than reports of interest/visits/meeting. For example, if we draft a CB in the first 2 days I'm 99% guaranteeing he will have long arms(32" or above). Similar with LT...

 

There is a certain mold of DE that Ballard likes too and a lot of his draft picks fit that can be shortly summarized by HWS freaks - high density players that have high level of athleticism(Basham, Lewis, Paye, Banogu, Dayo all fit that mold). So if we draft a DE high, I would not expect him to have questionable athleticism for example. Now this doesn't say much because DEs with questionable athelticism don't go high to begin with so... not sure this is very helpful of a criteria to filter out players.

 

Zach Hicks seems to think that Ballard's mold for WRs is taller than 6" and with some helf on their bodies. I'm not entirely sure this is true though, since we have a limited sample of drafts and our speedy slight WR was our best WR until last year. Maybe he just didn't feel the need to add another TY type while we still had a TY.  

 

In general Ballard doesn't like short players... there is length throughout the whole roster - not just CB... but if you look at DE, DT, LB, LT... Ballard loves players with long arms. This is the most defining characteristic I can think of when I think of a Ballard type player. So yeah... if I had to summarize it - it would be "length and athleticism". 

 

 

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2 hours ago, stitches said:

He will be there on day 3. Almost certain about it. 

You think so? I’ve seen a lot of mock draft sites that don’t think he’ll make it past the 3rd round. That’s about where I’d be comfortable taking him.

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14 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

You think so? I’ve seen a lot of mock draft sites that don’t think he’ll make it past the 3rd round. That’s about where I’d be comfortable taking him.

I personally wouldn't draft him on day 2. But who knows... I guess "almost certain" is overselling it. If I have to backtrack I'd say "I doubt he goes day 2" 

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45 minutes ago, stitches said:

I personally wouldn't draft him on day 2. But who knows... I guess "almost certain" is overselling it. If I have to backtrack I'd say "I doubt he goes day 2" 

That’s fair. Round 4 is the latest I think he goes though. Ballard seems to like WRs with high RAS so maybe he wouldn’t draft Bell on day 2. Another team might though.

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5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:


So here’s a question for everyone who follows this discussion. 
 

We make this thread every year.   My question is this…. Is it predictive of anything? Has anyone ever tracked to see who we visit, and who we then actually drafted or signed as a free agent?    Are there actual dots to connect?

 

Over on Stampede Blue,  their annual Build a Ballard series I think are very good.  And very accurate.   I think they’ve been somewhat predictive.   But is this thread also predictive?   Are we drafting or signing guys we are visiting with?

 

Anyone?    Anyone at all.    Thanks….

 

 

My opinion is yes, it's predictive in that it's likely the Colts don't draft any of the prospects mentioned in these threads.

 

Now, much of that could be due to the smoke we throw out there to distract the opponent, but a lot is simply because there's 31 other teams, and we have to wait out turn. 

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11 hours ago, stitches said:

@NewColtsFan

 

 

Maybe the Top 30 visits are indeed somewhat predictive because they are so limited so probably the Colts spend them on players they have serious interest in. The Cowboys are similar. 


Tremon Smith?    Someone refresh my memory please!    Who is he?   When was he a Colt?    
 

Going to do a search….    :peek:

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48 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


Tremon Smith?    Someone refresh my memory please!    Who is he?   When was he a Colt?    
 

Going to do a search….    :peek:

We didn't draft him but we signed him as a FA the year after. He had sporadic appearances but was mainly used as a special teams player.

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  • 2 weeks later...

It seems to me that most of our official visits are late round draftees and/or UDFA's that they want to get eyes on and establish a relationship so they could sign them post draft......there are a few exceptions mixed in but that is my perception right now!

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2 hours ago, stitches said:

 

Another top 30 visit:

 

 

 

Also, Greg Dulcich:

 

 

 

 

 


I saw a couple of tweets from Colts reporters and sites that said the Colts absolutely love Velus Jones. There’s also a connection because he’s supposed to be really close with Pittman Jr.

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11 hours ago, stitches said:

 

Physical freak:

 

He had a down year this year... no idea why... @NewColtsFanmight be able to tell us if he knows... 

 

 

 

Yeah....     this one is a complete mystery to me.    Honestly.    I think he's one of the LEAST Colts players we're looking at, not the most.

 

The only way he's a Colts-type kid is that he's a super high quality character and effort kid.    Other than that?    Nada.

 

Not a scheme fit.   We run a 3-4 and he was never much a player maker.   

 

Not a fit for our DL.     He's normally 6-3 and 310, but he showed up to the combine at 301, which a lot of lineman do.  Lose 10-15 pounds to try to achieve peak test performance.    And Booker did well. 

 

But where would he play?    He was a 5-Tech for Stanford.   I think the only place I'd see him is if he puts on 15 pounds he could be the eventual back-up to Stewart as a small-ish Nose Tackle.    Otherwise,  he's not a 3-Tech,  and he's definitely not a DE on either side.    Again, this is a complete mystery.....    I suspect he might be a 7th round or FA type of signing player for us.    But that's juts a WAG.

 

I suppose he might try lose 100 pounds and try to be a cornerback....    but that might take a year or two as he loses all that weight while being on our practice squad?!      :thmup:

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Yeah....     this one is a complete mystery to me.    Honestly.    I think he's one of the LEAST Colts players we're looking at, not the most.

 

The only way he's a Colts-type kid is that he's a super high quality character and effort kid.    Other than that?    Nada.

 

Not a scheme fit.   We run a 3-4 and he was never much a player maker.   

 

Not a fit for our DL.     He's normally 6-3 and 310, but he showed up to the combine at 301, which a lot of lineman do.  Lose 10-15 pounds to try to achieve peak test performance.    And Booker did well. 

 

But where would he play?    He was a 5-Tech for Stanford.   I think the only place I'd see him is if he puts on 15 pounds he could be the eventual back-up to Stewart as a small-ish Nose Tackle.    Otherwise,  he's not a 3-Tech,  and he's definitely not a DE on either side.    Again, this is a complete mystery.....    I suspect he might be a 7th round or FA type of signing player for us.    But that's juts a WAG.

 

I suppose he might try lose 100 pounds and try to be a cornerback....    but that might take a year or two as he loses all that weight while being on our practice squad?!      :thmup:

Well, rumor is he's receiving A TON of interest from teams around the league. Maybe they think he was not used to his potential in Stanford. Since you say they run 3-4 defense... maybe with that athleticism they see him as a 1 gap pentrator(3-tech type) rather than what he had to play in Stanford - 2 gap containment. The reason I think they say he's a Colts type - first as you say - high character, second ... length(>33 1/4" arms), third - athleticism. 

 

But who knows... I have to take a look at his film later today to see if I can glen something from it. 

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15 hours ago, stitches said:

 

Another top 30 visit:

 

 

 

Also, Greg Dulcich:

 

 

 

 

 

I believe they like Velus Jones for real.  Same size and speed as Paris Campbell with special teams ability.

He doesn't look 6ft on film but I can certainly tell he's really fast.  

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13 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:


I saw a couple of tweets from Colts reporters and sites that said the Colts absolutely love Velus Jones. There’s also a connection because he’s supposed to be really close with Pittman Jr.

I could get down with that pick

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4 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Yeah....     this one is a complete mystery to me.    Honestly.    I think he's one of the LEAST Colts players we're looking at, not the most.

 

The only way he's a Colts-type kid is that he's a super high quality character and effort kid.    Other than that?    Nada.

 

Not a scheme fit.   We run a 3-4 and he was never much a player maker.   

 

Not a fit for our DL.     He's normally 6-3 and 310, but he showed up to the combine at 301, which a lot of lineman do.  Lose 10-15 pounds to try to achieve peak test performance.    And Booker did well. 

 

But where would he play?    He was a 5-Tech for Stanford.   I think the only place I'd see him is if he puts on 15 pounds he could be the eventual back-up to Stewart as a small-ish Nose Tackle.    Otherwise,  he's not a 3-Tech,  and he's definitely not a DE on either side.    Again, this is a complete mystery.....    I suspect he might be a 7th round or FA type of signing player for us.    But that's juts a WAG.

 

I suppose he might try lose 100 pounds and try to be a cornerback....    but that might take a year or two as he loses all that weight while being on our practice squad?!      :thmup:

 

  We are going to be a quick penetrating, stopping the run in our race to the QB D-Line as i am understanding. Bookers 9.81 ras perked some ears.
 Ballard touted Lewis as a hybrid DT/DE. It looked over thought and certainly never panned out. Booker requires projecting potential, rather than past production. UGH!  Like Turay and Banogu too! Ugh!
 Where they are likely hoping to draft him, late, i could see him rated the best athlete available. One could see the logic behind such a pick. lol

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4 hours ago, stitches said:

Well, rumor is he's receiving A TON of interest from teams around the league. Maybe they think he was not used to his potential in Stanford. Since you say they run 3-4 defense... maybe with that athleticism they see him as a 1 gap pentrator(3-tech type) rather than what he had to play in Stanford - 2 gap containment. The reason I think they say he's a Colts type - first as you say - high character, second ... length(>33 1/4" arms), third - athleticism. 

 

But who knows... I have to take a look at his film later today to see if I can glen something from it. 

That was my first thought reading NCF's post. If he's extremely athletic, but didn't play well in the 3 man front, it tells me he probably was miscast in that scheme and that a shift to a 1 gap penetrating role would be exactly what he needs. Like @throwing BBZ mentioned above, it would be a lot of projection vs production. For a later round pick, I could get on board.

 

1 hour ago, krunk said:

I believe they like Velus Jones for real.  Same size and speed as Paris Campbell with special teams ability.

He doesn't look 6ft on film but I can certainly tell he's really fast.  

Velus is really fast, but from everything I've read and watched, that's about all he has to offer. Not a great route runner, so he's essentially offering the ability to run deep with go routes and to be a return specialist. I feel like there's a lot of other guys in this draft that are just as fast, if not faster, that are better route runners and more technically sound. He's also an older prospect (25 next month).

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20 minutes ago, Shive said:

That was my first thought reading NCF's post. If he's extremely athletic, but didn't play well in the 3 man front, it tells me he probably was miscast in that scheme and that a shift to a 1 gap penetrating role would be exactly what he needs. Like @throwing BBZ mentioned above, it would be a lot of projection vs production. For a later round pick, I could get on board.

 

Velus is really fast, but from everything I've read and watched, that's about all he has to offer. Not a great route runner, so he's essentially offering the ability to run deep with go routes and to be a return specialist. I feel like there's a lot of other guys in this draft that are just as fast, if not faster, that are better route runners and more technically sound. He's also an older prospect (25 next month).

Paris Campbell certainly wasnt polished either. All he really was was fast.  Arians when they drafted TY all they mostly saw initially was a fast special teams guy. Some of the reports have said we are likely to go wideout from the 3rd round on down. Not necessarily in the 2nd

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14 minutes ago, krunk said:

Paris Campbell certainly wasnt polished either. All he really was was fast.  Arians when they drafted TY all they mostly saw initially was a fast special teams guy. Some of the reports have said we are likely to go wideout from the 3rd round on down. Not necessarily in the 2nd

Thats definitely true, but Jones is also 4-5 years older than those guys were when they were drafted, so he's most likely not developing too much more and if he does, you're not getting but a couple of prime years out of him. I don't see him as someone that can contribute on offense in a meaningful way initially, but there's a lot of other fast guys that could be had around the same range that are already more polished at a younger age.

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