Hard Knocks starts this Wednesday

[jvan1973]

Best part for me was Kenny's mom. 

 

"That's so sweet,   now let's play football"

 

[jvan1973]

My only comment on the play calling is this.    If Peyton saw 5 dlinemen, he would pass every single time.   I realize Carson isn't Peyton,  but he wouldn't be trying to "keep the defense honest"

[chad72]

3 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  If one listens to Dakich long enough you should learn enough to go find someone else to listen to. I find him rather sad.  The same for Doyle and Holder.

 

Yep, Dan Dakich is the Bill O' Reilly of sports talk radio. His goal is to get your temperature riled up, he will make valid points but will IGNORE pretty much every valid point his guest or a caller makes as a rebuttal, and say this is my show and what I say goes. I wouldn't put too much value in that shock jock aspect of his show whatsoever, even if he agreed with a few opinions of mine. His goal is to generate listeners by getting them riled up. Enough said.  

 

If you thought this forum had overreactions, every show of DD is an overreaction, LOL. 

[Smonroe]

3 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Best part for me was Kenny's mom. 

 

"That's so sweet,   now let's play football"

 

I just forced myself to watch it.  Kenny and his family are awesome.  

[csmopar]

8 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Colt 45 is the only person that has defended it, name someone else?

Our favorite Twitter poster... I won’t name drop. I’ll let you go down thru the mega thread on That topic and see it

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Our favorite Twitter poster... I won’t name drop. I’ll let you go down thru the mega thread on That topic and see it

If your talking about me I haven’t defended it either. I have said we should of run more but it didn’t cause us to lose the game. 

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

So I just watched this episode, and was really excited to jump on this thread to talk about what a lovely person Kenny is and how horribly sad it was about Mason passing away. Instead I read 6 pages of arguing about a comment from an offensive lineman. A little part of me died today reading those 6 pages........

[SteelCityColt]

12 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

My only comment on the play calling is this.    If Peyton saw 5 dlinemen, he would pass every single time.   I realize Carson isn't Peyton,  but he wouldn't be trying to "keep the defense honest"

 

This isn't meant as a slight on Wentz but I'd have a lot more confidence in Manning to execute. The 3rd Qtr was just very strange and one or two plays going the other way would have made things very different. The pick play was just odd. 

Even with stacking of the box I would have liked to have seen at least one attempt to run JT wide, though I appreciate they tried  quick hitters to get him into space which didn't end so well. 

[Barry Sears]

6 hours ago, New Zealands #1 Colts Fan said:

So I just watched this episode, and was really excited to jump on this thread to talk about what a lovely person Kenny is and how horribly sad it was about Mason passing away. Instead I read 6 pages of arguing about a comment from an offensive lineman. A little part of me died today reading those 6 pages........

 

^^^^^

THIS

 

I jumped back a few pages to get the reaction to episode 3, and it was barely mentioned.  I thought the parts focusing on Moore were great...he is such a classy man.

 

Maybe in Episode 4 we'll get the players' opinions on Dakich?? 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

6 minutes ago, Barry Sears said:

 

^^^^^

THIS

 

I jumped back a few pages to get the reaction to episode 3, and it was barely mentioned.  I thought the parts focusing on Moore were great...he is such a classy man.

 

Maybe in Episode 4 we'll get the players' opinions on Dakich?? 

Thank you. This board is getting hard to read.  It’s like where is the reaction to the show.

[2006Coltsbestever]

16 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Best part for me was Kenny's mom. 

 

"That's so sweet,   now let's play football"

 

I know she is like me, during any Colts game when there is a pause in the game of any kind, I am always like that was fantastic now play  . She also acts like me, can't hardly watch at times and nervous as hell at times.

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 hours ago, New Zealands #1 Colts Fan said:

So I just watched this episode, and was really excited to jump on this thread to talk about what a lovely person Kenny is and how horribly sad it was about Mason passing away. Instead I read 6 pages of arguing about a comment from an offensive lineman. A little part of me died today reading those 6 pages........

Between that and Dakich, I needed a drink 

[Fluke_33]

3 hours ago, Barry Sears said:

 

^^^^^

THIS

 

I jumped back a few pages to get the reaction to episode 3, and it was barely mentioned.  I thought the parts focusing on Moore were great...he is such a classy man.

 

Maybe in Episode 4 we'll get the players' opinions on Dakich?? 

Maybe someone can start a new thread with ep 4

[Shive]

42 minutes ago, Fluke_33 said:

Maybe someone can start a new thread with ep 4

That's the plan. This thread got way too out of hand to sort anything out now, but there will be a new thread for each week's episode moving forward that way we don't have past discussions being carried forward and making it difficult to talk about the most recent episode.

[EastStreet]

7 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

 

This isn't meant as a slight on Wentz but I'd have a lot more confidence in Manning to execute. The 3rd Qtr was just very strange and one or two plays going the other way would have made things very different. The pick play was just odd. 

Even with stacking of the box I would have liked to have seen at least one attempt to run JT wide, though I appreciate they tried  quick hitters to get him into space which didn't end so well. 

 

To the bolded, I'm with you. JT or Hines hitting some wide runs, or any sweeps, buck or jet. Buck sweep is a great counter to run blitzes. Really, and type of outside run is. I also would have loved to seen simply less RPO and more play action. Not saying we shouldn't have been heavier passing, just should not have been that heavy, and should have been different.

 

I think I saw a figure that Wentz was rated the highest last week in play action passes. And just in general, our RBs averaged 5.1 a carry. Our RPO passing, which is sorta an extension of the run game, averaged 4.9 a completion. So the whole heavy RPO game plan, one might say, wasn't as successful as some like to believe. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, Shive said:

That's the plan. This thread got way too out of hand to sort anything out now, but there will be a new thread for each week's episode moving forward that way we don't have past discussions being carried forward and making it difficult to talk about the most recent episode.

It's because we lost is why it got out of hand. Had we went up 31-14 and the strip sack would've never happened we would've won and nothing would've been said about Frank's 26 passes in a row or Nelson's comment or Dakich ripping us. It is amazing in football that 1 or 2 plays can turn a thread into chaos when we lose. Just like against the Ravens we make a FG we win, everyone is happy, we missed it so people play the blame game and we can't beat a good team at that point. Comical really but that is this site at times. 

[IinD]

31 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It's because we lost is why it got out of hand. Had we went up 31-14 and the strip sack would've never happened we would've won and nothing would've been said about Frank's 26 passes in a row or Nelson's comment or Dakich ripping us. It is amazing in football that 1 or 2 plays can turn a thread into chaos when we lose. Just like against the Ravens we make a FG we win, everyone is happy, we missed it so people play the blame game and we can't beat a good team at that point. Comical really but that is this site at times. 

So funny because after we beat Buffalo we were the team 'no one wants to face' in January to yeah Colts suck again... Lol

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

16 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

 

 

And I promise you….   Even with his comments here, on the record, the Frank-Haters will not be persuaded.   
 

They think the Monday Presser was a bad look.   They think the Q moment shown was a bad look.  
 

I think the man is impressive and deserving of respect.  Too bad he doesn’t get more here.

[Goatface Killah]

I find it hilarious that the people claiming to be most bothered by this conversation about playcalling keep taking passive aggressive shots at people about it.

 

Maybe you all have something to do with the conversation? You know the saying? It takes two?

[Jason_]

25 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

And I promise you….   Even with his comments here, on the record, the Frank-Haters will not be persuaded.   
 

They think the Monday Presser was a bad look.   They think the Q moment shown was a bad look.  
 

I think the man is impressive and deserving of respect.  Too bad he doesn’t get more here.

 

 

Not liking his play calling and wanting him to hand over those duties does not make one a "Frank-hater" . 

[Jason_]

Just now, GoatBeard said:

I find it hilarious that the people claiming to be most bothered by this conversation about playcalling keep taking passive aggressive shots at people about it.

 

 

[cbear]

It struck me how respectful Q seems to be. Reminds me of the time he gave Costanzo a suggestion and added something like "if that's OK with you." I think that was his rookie season, but he maintains that attitude which is nice. 

[EastStreet]

8 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

I find it hilarious that the people claiming to be most bothered by this conversation about playcalling keep taking passive aggressive shots at people about it.

 

Maybe you all have something to do with the conversation? You know the saying? It takes two?

[cbear]

As far as Frank allowing that clip to be aired, it just goes to show how great a leader and man he is.

 

The guy is a strange combination of fearlessness and humility.

[Fisticuffs111]

13 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

I find it hilarious that the people claiming to be most bothered by this conversation about playcalling keep taking passive aggressive shots at people about it.

 

Maybe you all have something to do with the conversation? You know the saying? It takes two?

Quoted for truth.

[EastStreet]

Just now, cbear said:

As far as Frank allowing that clip to be aired, it just goes to show how great a leader and man he is.

 

The guy is a strange combination of fearlessness and humility.

 

Not sure I interpret it that way. Could be though. That specific topic has been discussed by some of the media lately. Some say cutting it, would have possibly resulted in a leak creating an even worse look, or been internally seen by others (think players) as bad and resulted in internal buzz (looks like your hiding something). Others, which I don't agree with (DD), suggest it was stupidity. 

 

We'll never know. I'm glad Q did what he did. I'm glad Frank listened. I just find it sad it took Q to stand up and be adamant, and wish it would have happened earlier. 

[Goatface Killah]

19 minutes ago, cbear said:

As far as Frank allowing that clip to be aired, it just goes to show how great a leader and man he is.

 

The guy is a strange combination of fearlessness and humility.

This is the way you support Frank if you agree with him.

 

I can respect this. Well said.

[Superman]

On 11/18/2021 at 12:22 PM, Superman said:

 

I think the team has final sign off on all the footage that airs.

 

@Fisticuffs111

Regarding final sign off of footage.

 

 

Edit: I guess I'm late on this, but I'm glad there's verification.

[NewColtsFan]

43 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

 

Not liking his play calling and wanting him to hand over those duties does not make one a "Frank-hater" . 

Maybe.   But then why don’t you tell me what you think DOES make a Frank-Hater?

[Goatface Killah]

6 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe.   But then why don’t you tell me what you think DOES make a Frank-Hater?

Maybe someone who says "I hate Frank Reich".

 

Im sorry, but calling someone a hater because they disagree with a decision or philosophy is only designed to be dismissive.

 

There are zero Frank "haters". He's simply not a person deserving of hatred.

[Jason_]

3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe.   But then why don’t you tell me what you think DOES make a Frank-Hater?

 

Maybe? what the hell? lol

 

I mean...someone who hates Frank.  Someone who wants him fired.  I don't hate him.  I like his offensive scheme and his play design.  I just don't like his situational playcalling and think he needs to hand over playcalling to someone else so he can focus on managing all aspects of the game.  

[Superman]

55 minutes ago, J@son said:

Not liking his play calling and wanting him to hand over those duties does not make one a "Frank-hater" . 

 

It's hard to explain, for me. Reich does a really good job of play calling a lot of the time. Then there are times when it seems like he's completely and hopelessly out of rhythm, and won't adjust. Titans game, Bucs game, easy examples, with obvious numbers to which one can point (78:22 pass/run ratio against Titans, 26 straight pass plays against Bucs).

 

His general management, player empowerment, leadership, direction, accountability, etc., I have no complaints about any of that. A couple times I've been upset with his 4th down management (OT in Houston is a huge example), but in general I think his approach on 4th down is a good thing. If anything, I want him to commit more fully to it. I think not being the primary offensive play caller would help him with overall game management, which is why I'm never a fan of the HC being the primary play caller. (Sean McVay might be the best offensive play caller in the league, and statistically he's awful with 4th down situations.)

 

I just want our offensive play calling to not get trapped in a void for long stretches at a time. And while the easy alternative to suggest is a new play caller, that's not necessarily going to lead to better performance. In general, Reich has a good handle on it. But when he's bad, it's so obvious and glaring, it seems like the alternative really needs to be considered.

[Superman]

Mod note: This is locked for awhile.

 

Update: Thread unlocked. Please refrain from personal spats, attacks, and bickering. It's okay to back off of a personal dispute, and let the other person have the last word. Thanks.

[Goatface Killah]

16 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

 

This isn't meant as a slight on Wentz but I'd have a lot more confidence in Manning to execute. The 3rd Qtr was just very strange and one or two plays going the other way would have made things very different. The pick play was just odd. 

Even with stacking of the box I would have liked to have seen at least one attempt to run JT wide, though I appreciate they tried  quick hitters to get him into space which didn't end so well. 

I honestly think thats a poor comparison because not only do we not have Manning, we dont have Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne or Dallas Clark and an OL that could pass block as well as anyone in the league.

 

Making that decision WITH Manning is putting the ball IN your best players hands for 27 consecutive plays. Not taking it out of his hands for 27 consecutive plays.

[EastStreet]

6 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

I honestly think thats a poor comparison because not only do we not have Manning, we dont have Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne or Dallas Clark and an OL that could pass block as well as anyone in the league.

 

Making that decision WITH Manning is putting the ball IN your best players hands for 27 consecutive plays. Not taking it out of his hands for 27 consecutive plays.

We're just built very different. Like Steel said, not a bag on Wentz, but like you said, don't have dagger in the heart WR/QB combo. I think once we find a legit deep/speed guy that can stay healthy (assuming we're willing to use them deep), that could change the way Ds view our O. 

 

I've read several articles and looked at a ton of advanced stats. The more I learn, the more I think we needed more PAs than RPOs, and some more runs (especially wide). The run game actually AVG'd better than the RPO passes. And the running AVG vs stacked boxes weren't all that bad.

 

And just looking at JT's success rates...

1Q was bad (only 4 rushes and none over Q)

2Q 100% success rate on only 2 rushes.....  (which is outstanding, league avg is 51%, still none over Q)

3Q zero rushes

4Q 75% success rate on 8 rushes.... (which is also outstanding, league avg is 46.4%, only one over Q)

 

So in short. We had a bad 1Q, ignored the 2Q 100% success rate, abandoned the run totally in the 3Q, and dominated in the 4Q.

And only ran it it once the entire game over Q... WT fudge.

[Goatface Killah]

39 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

We're just built very different. Like Steel said, not a bag on Wentz, but like you said, don't have dagger in the heart WR/QB combo. I think once we find a legit deep/speed guy that can stay healthy (assuming we're willing to use them deep), that could change the way Ds view our O. 

 

I've read several articles and looked at a ton of advanced stats. The more I learn, the more I think we needed more PAs than RPOs, and some more runs (especially wide). The run game actually AVG'd better than the RPO passes. And the running AVG vs stacked boxes weren't all that bad.

 

And just looking at JT's success rates...

1Q was bad (only 4 rushes and none over Q)

2Q 100% success rate on only 2 rushes.....  (which is outstanding, league avg is 51%, still none over Q)

3Q zero rushes

4Q 75% success rate on 8 rushes.... (which is also outstanding, league avg is 46.4%, only one over Q)

 

So in short. We had a bad 1Q, ignored the 2Q 100% success rate, abandoned the run totally in the 3Q, and dominated in the 4Q.

And only ran it it once the entire game over Q... WT fudge.

Right. How do they not lean on Taylor and Quenton? I dont mind using them as decoys at times, but 1 single run? Dont tell me we couldnt run until you at least give them a chance.

 

Wentz needs to be fully supported and a part of why I didnt like it was the fact that they put too much on his shoulders in that game, not that Im some sort of Wentz "hater". I have come to like him even more watching him on Hard Knocks. 

 

In fact, I am super glad we got him at this point and very excited moving forward with him enough where it doesnt bother me at all we wont have a 1st round pick. I think we outright stole him tbh. How many QBs of his caliber get had for less than 2 firsts? It just doesnt ever happen. We straight gaffled that dude from Philly. 

 

I think Wentz is super talented, but we are still in the confidence building faze with him and Im not sure another game with 3 turnovers did him any favors there. We should never forget who we are. Power running with a QB capable of making plays all over the field with his feet and his arm. If we get the LT fully figured out, fill out this WR corps or add a dynamic TE to the mix, then ok give him a bigger load to carry. But not until then. 

 

And if we lose trying to do what we do best.....so be it. I can live with it.

 

 

[EastStreet]

26 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

Right. How do they not lean on Taylor and Quenton? I dont mind using them as decoys at times, but 1 single run? Dont tell me we couldnt run until you at least give them a chance.

 

Wentz needs to be fully supported and a part of why I didnt like it was the fact that they put too much on his shoulders in that game, not that Im some sort of Wentz "hater". I have come to like him even more watching him on Hard Knocks. 

 

In fact, I am super glad we got him at this point and very excited moving forward with him enough where it doesnt bother me at all we wont have a 1st round pick. I think we outright stole him tbh. How many QBs of his caliber get had for less than 2 firsts? It just doesnt ever happen. We straight gaffled that dude from Philly. 

 

I think Wentz is super talented, but we are still in the confidence building faze with him and Im not sure another game with 3 turnovers did him any favors there. We should never forget who we are. Power running with a QB capable of making plays all over the field with his feet and his arm. If we get the LT fully figured out, fill out this WR corps or add a dynamic TE to the mix, then ok give him a bigger load to carry. But not until then. 

 

And if we lose trying to do what we do best.....so be it. I can live with it.

I'm super sold on Wentz. I was meh at first, but very optimistic once I dug into to Philly's team last year. 

 

And you're spot on. He just needs to right support. And that means good balance. Ballard and Reich both made big deals about saying Wentz needed to understand he didn't have to win games on his own. Yet they put him in that exact place last week.

 

On the running, or lack there of. Running it over Q only once the entire game is like twilight zone kinda stuff. I kinda understand now more why Q went to Reich now. It wasn't just for JT. It was for himself too.

 

And the 100% success rate in the 2nd pretty much kills the whole narrative that we couldn't run at all in the 1st half. It started to work then, we just ignored the success then, and abandoned it entirely in the 3rd and 4th until Q took a stand. 

 

Folks that say "turnovers" or "what if".... sure, turnovers were a huge factor. But how about this. What if some of those turnovers in the pass game were runs lol, and weren't turnovers... What if we ran it a little more, killing some more clock, and Brady didn't have enough time to win the game. The what if game goes both ways.

 

Then add in that one could also point out that play action was far more successful than RPOs, and we should have run a lot less RPO. Wentz was the highest rated QB last week in play action. 

 

But bottom line, you don't pass 26 straight times, and you don't get into a shootout with the Goat. I'm sorry, but good things rarely happen when you do either of those things, let alone both.

[MrTripleC]

Huge fan of this. Living in Australia, you don’t get a lot of content, outside of what is produced by Colts media, so nice to see a different style and different take on the Colts.

 

You do get a great sense of what Ballard is building. A lot has been made of the character of the Colts players, and this has come through on every episode. 
 

The humility of JT, the spirit of Kenny and the general sense of deep connection that exists in the running back group and the D-Line group have really extended my appreciation of what is being built. 
 

Kudos to all involved.