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Are The Colts Doing Enough to Hang With the Other AFC Contenders?


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47 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Not sleeping on them at all. I do doubt our secondary, but more doubt really goes to the overall D scheme in general. 

Yes he was, but having a great OL and running game will give a lot of QBs a boost.

I'm pretty confident in Wentz getting back to 2019 levels. If so, his 2019 QBR was almost identical to Rivers 2020 QBR.

Rivers' QBR jumped 12 points coming to the Colts. I expect the same with Wentz.

There is no reason Wentz can’t bounce back.  I guess I just took issue with the original statement because it came across like Rivers held the team back last year when he didn’t he was a strength so it was more of an objection to what I took as a shot Rivers than saying anything about Wentz.

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“Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.” ― Jeff Lebowski

So you want the colts to go back to the grigson days of always making panic trades . Throw away a second round pick on a 32 year old wr when we could turn that second rounder into 10 year player inste

Well that's some creative logic. Smith doesn't give up sack, is an indicator Rivers didn't have time....???? Holy cow I hope you're not serious.    Rivers has always had a low time to throw.

33 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I can’t stand that guy. Still can’t deny he has won everywhere he has been.  Darn good coach but he will quit in a few years like he always does. 

I am skeptical that he will work in the NFL.  Better college coaches than him have tried to make the jump to the NFL and failed (Nick Saban comes to mind).  

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36 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

There is no reason Wentz can’t bounce back. I guess I just took issue with the original statement because it came across like Rivers held the team back last year when he didn’t he was a strength so it was more of an objection to what I took as a shot Rivers than saying anything about Wentz.

Rivers had a few bad moments, but his season was pretty darn good, and he was the biggest thing keeping us in the game vs Buffalo. Some folks were always pooh poohish about Rivers. The arm strength narrative got very tiresome. He was top 10ish in deep ball accuracy while bottom 10ish in deep ball attempts. IMO, we could have been more dynamic if we allowed a few more deep shot per game (I don't want to be air raid).

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On 6/19/2021 at 10:45 PM, GoColts8818 said:

I am skeptical that he will work in the NFL.  Better college coaches than him have tried to make the jump to the NFL and failed (Nick Saban comes to mind).  

To each their own, but I don’t view Saban as a failure in the NFL.  He was only with Miami for two seasons.   I think that’s way too short to pass judgement.

 

But I think he quickly realized the NFL world was not for him.   And an offer to go to Alabama was simply too good to pass up.  I think the last 10-12years with the Tide showed he might the right call. 
 

Pete Carroll failed at how many stops before finding success in Seattle?   Sometimes coaches need time and/or opportunity before finding success. 

 

Edited by NFLfan
Corrected typo: "Savanna" to "Saban"
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1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

Rivers had a few bad moments, but his season was pretty darn good, and he was the biggest thing keeping us in the game vs Buffalo. Some folks were always pooh poohish about Rivers. The arm strength narrative got very tiresome. He was top 10ish in deep ball accuracy while bottom 10ish in deep ball attempts. IMO, we could have been more dynamic if we allowed a few more deep shot per game (I don't want to be air raid).

I think the offense allows deep balls but obviously focuses on quick plays. Rivers was extremely good at reading defenses and getting the ball out quickly.  I think we will see Wentz take more shots downfield, especially if he can use his mobility to effectively buy time when plays break down. I don’t expect much from TY, but should see some growth from our younger receivers. 

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2 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

I am skeptical that he will work in the NFL.  Better college coaches than him have tried to make the jump to the NFL and failed (Nick Saban comes to mind).  

I think they knocked it out of the park hiring him.  He is a good coach for Trevor Lawrence to begin his career with. I think they will have a good offense but I’m interested to see how his staff develops players. At college blue blood programs like OSU and Florida, you have a fresh batch of high recruits every year that typically are better than your competition. It’s a level playing ground in the NFL.  Everyone is good...including opposing coaching staffs.  I think he will see limited success his first 2-3yrs but if Lawerence turns out to be more of a good QB instead of great, I can see Meyer quitting again. I can’t stand the guy so obviously my opinion is severely biased. 

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37 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I think the offense allows deep balls but obviously focuses on quick plays. Rivers was extremely good at reading defenses and getting the ball out quickly.  I think we will see Wentz take more shots downfield, especially if he can use his mobility to effectively buy time when plays break down. I don’t expect much from TY, but should see some growth from our younger receivers. 

Rivers had a ton of time last year, so needing mobility wasn't really an issue. The offensive scheme was conservative and quick trigger. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but Rivers had plenty of time and could have went deeper had the play calling asked for that. 

 

I highly doubt you'll see significantly more deep throws this season, especially early.

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9 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

I am skeptical that he will work in the NFL.  Better college coaches than him have tried to make the jump to the NFL and failed (Nick Saban comes to mind).  

As a Buckeye fan,  I am a Meyer fan, so I am sorry he isnt there anymore.

 

He won EVERY place he coached

 

Utah, Florida, THE Ohio State

 

The pro game IS different than College.

 

They will be a team for the Colts to contend with.

 

 

 

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On 6/18/2021 at 12:32 PM, philba101 said:

Remember, this is how the Julio Jones rumors started? It’s like dejavu! It’s like dejavu! Sorry, I had to do that. Remember, how everyone said that it was not possible for Jones to end up with the Titans because they had no salary cap space? We all knew that was not true. All it takes is a contract restructure here, a signing bonus there, and poof, it magically happens. Now, the reality is that the Colts will match-up against the future hall-of-famer 2-3 times a year. If the latest rumors are true, the Titans are now thought to be the favorites to land disgruntled TE Zach Ertz. Are the Colts really going to sit by again and allow the Titans to continue to load up? As it stands the Chiefs will likely be as good as they were last year (thank you Patrick Mahomes). In my opinion, the Bills, Browns, Chargers, Patriots, Ravens, Steelers and Titans have all improved in the offseason. The Colts caught a break in that they likely will not have to play Deshaun Watson twice a year. If rumors are correct, Watson would like to play for the Broncos. Add another playoff contender in the AFC! There is also a chance that last year’s MVP, Aaron Rodgers, will be traded. You can almost bet that if the Packers are forced to trade Rodgers, that he won’t be going to an NFC team. Add yet another playoff contender. Even with the expanded playoff format, there are only so many wildcard spaces to be had. We only have to look back to last year to be reminded that we were that 7th and final seed. As we know, that position landed us a road game against one of the top AFC teams, and an early exit from the 2020 playoffs. So, it begs the question. Are the Colts really doing enough this offseason to keep pace with the other contenders in the AFC?

 

I get it, Ertz will be 31 in November, I heard the same nonsense about Julio Jones. Did you know that Tom Brady will be 44 in August, 44! Aaron Rodgers will be 38 in December. I sure wish those guys could still play! Guess who else turned 31 in May, Jack Doyle. Guess who else turns 32 in October, Travis Kelce. I digress. Ok, Ertz had horrible numbers in an injury-plagued season last year (36 receptions, 335 yards, 1 TD, in 11 games. This broke a 5-year streak where Ertz had tallied more than 800 receiving yards a year; highlighted by a career-high (116 receptions, 1,163 yards, and 8 TD’s in 16 games in 2018). So, maybe Ertz will never put up Travis Kelce type numbers again. But what if he gets back to his 800 receiving yard standard? What if he gets back to being an absolute imposing force in the RedZone? From examining the dismal stats of Carson Wentz last year, we all know the Eagles offense struggled to say the least. It stands to reason that Ertz would struggle as well in addition to being hampered by nagging injuries. The Colts have taken a huge gamble betting that Wentz will return to his 2018 form. Is it any more unrealistic to assume that Ertz may be able to do the same? Remember that it was Ertz, who happens to be good friends with Wentz, who helped propel him to MVP consideration in 2018. But, what about the huge $8 million salary hit that comes along with Ertz? Contract restructure, signing bonus, poof! (see aforementioned scenario above).

 

What about the fallacy that the Colts don’t need more tight ends? I like Jack Doyle, but Doyle tallied his worst numbers in five seasons last year as well (23 receptions, 251 yards, 3 TD’s, in 14 games). His best season was (80 receptions, 690 yards, and 4 TD’s in 15 games in 2017). Moe Allie-Cox had career highs last year with (31 receptions, 394 yards, and 2 TD’s in 15 games. Even though he has improved, I still feel like the Colts are reluctant to use him as a true offensive weapon much like they did with Eric Ebron in 2018. Why does it seem like everybody had a career year in 2018? Ebron quietly logged (56 receptions, 558 yards, and 5 TD’s in 15 games) for the Steelers last year, a stat line that bested any tallied by Colts tight ends. Kylen Granson certainly has potential, but it is just that, potential. The odds that a rookie tight end provides a major contribution are not good. The last rookie tight end to log more than 700 yards in a season was Evan Engram in 2017, a number he has not been able to duplicate since. Before that, it was Jeremy Shockey in 2002 with 894 yards. The fact that Ertz logged five straight seasons with over 800 yards before last season should not go unnoticed.

 

Imagine the following scenario. The Colts and Titans are locked in a close game that will decide the 2021 AFC South Winner. As it is, they will likely be trying to stop Julio Jones, A.J. Brown, and Derrick Henry. Can the Colts really take the chance to allow the Titans to add Ertz to that mix? One thing is clear. The Titans see their window of opportunity and they are swinging for the fences. Will the Colts take the same approach of will they continue to maintain the status quo? Which approach do you think has the best chance of success in 2021?

 

 

 


A favor to ask. ..

 

Can you say wrong things in fewer words next time?

 

Please and thank you. 

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To answer the OP, I think we are getting closer (depends on Wentz), but on paper, KC is a stronger team, and still tops in AFC

 

Titans, Ravens, Browns and Colts, would be in this 2nd group

 

Can the Colts make it to SB, this year?......I think its a long shot

 

We have questions that might be answered this year

 

1) Will Fisher join the lineup in  Sept or Nov? - Unknown

2) Will Dayo heal and contribute in Nov / Dec? - Unknown

3) Will Paye impact and create pressure this year? - Unknown

4) Do we have enough this year at TE? - Unknown

5) Do we have enough this year at WR? - Unknown

6) Is our current CB room , enough? - Unknown

7) Will Okereke play to his potential? - Unknown

 

We have a bit too many questions to count us as a SB team for this year.....  If the answer to each of these above questions turn in to a "YES" vs. "UNKNOWN" we could be playing for a SB

 

Looking at our current situation, I would like some additional depth at CB.

 

There may be some zone CB that is available at final cuts, that could potentially start for this team, this year

And.... as mentioned, if Zach Ertz is released, he would be a decent pickup that would be inline and in slot

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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22 hours ago, Smonroe said:


I’m sure a lot of other “teams” (mainly fan bases) think they’re better than the Colts.  Add the Raiders, Broncos, NE and even the Chargers.  Just go to their boards and read about it.  Good thing that what people think matters as much as power polls, predictions, and player rankings.  
 

As far as the Browns, they may have the most talented roster in the league, and apparently a coach who knows what he’s doing for a change.  But you’re right, it comes down to Baker.  Just like our team comes down to Carson.  The book is still out on both of them.  

 

Not to turn this into my Browns prediction thread, as there's a few of you who can't even (I don't care), but yeah, I might be an early adopter here, but I don't see it. I see a team with a few more blue chips than most teams (because they've been so bad) and no culture of doing anything, a QB who's a meathead and a guy who throws helmets at opposing players. And OBJ. pff... 

 

They're not winning nothing of consequence. Just putting the 2 cents down.

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10 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Rivers had a ton of time last year, so needing mobility wasn't really an issue. The offensive scheme was conservative and quick trigger. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but Rivers had plenty of time and could have went deeper had the play calling asked for that. 

 

I highly doubt you'll see significantly more deep throws this season, especially early.

I don’t think we will see a significant Increase but we should see more. I expect to finish in the middle by years end and that is fine.   The offense is really about taking what the defense gives you.  If we establish the run and quick pass game we will see more deep shots as the defense starts to creep forward and sit on routes. I also see the WR screen as sort of a deep shot as well.  If they can break a tackle and catch a couple blocks those go for big chunks.  Either way it will be fun to watch the offense grow as the year goes on. 

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On 6/20/2021 at 11:48 AM, AwesomeAustin said:

I don’t think we will see a significant Increase but we should see more. I expect to finish in the middle by years end and that is fine.   The offense is really about taking what the defense gives you.  If we establish the run and quick pass game we will see more deep shots as the defense starts to creep forward and sit on routes. I also see the WR screen as sort of a deep shot as well.  If they can break a tackle and catch a couple blocks those go for big chunks.  Either way it will be fun to watch the offense grow as the year goes on. 

 

I disagree on the bolded. Reich has went against the grain in egregious fashion a few times. Throwing a lot vs Miami and Jax in the last 2 years at times, when both were abysmal vs the run, are two examples I'll never forget.

 

On deep ball attempts, my predictions

  1. we'll likely have above average deep ball attempts early in the year due to the likelihood of being behind vs a rough schedule. And many folks will not factor the fact we HAD to play catch up or hero ball, and think our O is going to be more open.
  2. Then, we get back to being conservative, and finish bottom 10ish again in deep ball attempts.
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1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

 

I disagree on the bolded. Reich has went against the grain in egregious fashion a few times. Throwing a lot vs Miami and Jax in the last 2 years at times, when both were abysmal vs the run, are two examples I'll never forget.

 

On deep ball attempts, my predictions

  1. we'll likely have above average deep ball attempts early in the year due to the likelihood of being behind vs a rough schedule. And many folks will not factor the fact we HAD to play catch up or hero ball, and think our O is going to be more open.
  2. Then, we get back to being conservative, and finish bottom 10ish again in deep ball attempts.

Fair analysis 

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On 6/18/2021 at 10:21 PM, runthepost said:

Colts are in tier 3 of the afc.

Tier 1: Chiefs

Tier 2: Ravens Bills

Tier 3: Colts, Titans, Steelers, Browns, Dolphins 

They were Tier 3 last year.  But fortunes rise and fall every season in this league, in spite of predictions that seem to me to follow the previous season results way too strongly.

 

Colts made a significant change at QB.  No idea how Wentz is going to play but they are one of the teams that could make a serious jump and be far better than expected.  We could take the negative side of that and run with it too, but I see no reason to do that.  He and the head coach seem to be on the same wavelength and there's a ton of talent around him to include what should be a very good to elite run game.  Betting against him given all that seems silly to me.

 

My own list for this season would have a Tier 1 of the Chiefs and Bills.  I think those two teams are alone on top. 

 

Ravens have a RB at the QB position who executes simplified reads, they have a limitation there IMO that has them very much in a big Tier 2 of good teams poised to prove whether they can make a jump.  I'd go with Titans, Colts, Ravens, Steelers, Browns, Dolphins, and Chargers.

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On 6/19/2021 at 8:05 PM, EastStreet said:

While I agree Henry may be used up in a few years, I'm not sure the Titans will fade away. They have some good pieces not named Henry and Jones. Their OL is top 10 in run blocking, and should be improved when Radunz delelops. IMO, they had a pretty solid draft last year which should pay early dividends (at least their first 4).

 

Jax could turn around really quick. We can't beat them regularly when they're bad, so their rise is a bit concerning to me. They've added some great pieces not named Lawrence. To me, if he develops quickly, they'll compete right away. A lot also hinges on their new coach, which I think is almost as important as the QB situation, if not more. 

 

Houston needs to trade Watson and start over. They purged the front office and coaches for the most part, time to purge the roster. They could rebound quickly with the capital they get from Watson.

 

 

Watsons legal trouble is going to prevent that.  Unless he’s exonerated which won’t happen any time soon, hes not going to have much trade value.

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On 6/19/2021 at 9:55 PM, EastStreet said:

Not sleeping on them at all. I do doubt our secondary, but more doubt really goes to the overall D scheme in general. 

Yes he was, but having a great OL and running game will give a lot of QBs a boost.

I'm pretty confident in Wentz getting back to 2019 levels. If so, his 2019 QBR was almost identical to Rivers 2020 QBR.

Rivers' QBR jumped 12 points coming to the Colts. I expect the same with Wentz.

We didn’t have a great running game at all until the end of the year.  Statistically we were inefficient and just plain bad until GB or so.

On 6/19/2021 at 9:55 PM, EastStreet said:

Not sleeping on them at all. I do doubt our secondary, but more doubt really goes to the overall D scheme in general. 

Yes he was, but having a great OL and running game will give a lot of QBs a boost.

I'm pretty confident in Wentz getting back to 2019 levels. If so, his 2019 QBR was almost identical to Rivers 2020 QBR.

Rivers' QBR jumped 12 points coming to the Colts. I expect the same with Wentz.

We didn’t have a great running game at all until the end of the year.  Statistically we were inefficient and just plain bad until GB or so.

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On 6/19/2021 at 10:35 PM, EastStreet said:

Titans have a great run blocking OL, so a lot of RBs could do just fine there. And they should improve getting Radunz, and will also get Lewan back from injury last season.

 

The Jones contract isn't bad. It's 11M a year after this season, and there's also an out after this season with only 2M dead cap. In short, very little impact after this season if they want to part ways, and reasonable if they want to keep him 2 more years.

 

And like most teams, their financial commitments are greatly reduced after next season. They don't have an high, ultra long commitments.

It’s a very friendly cap hit for them.  He doesn’t really cost much more cap per year than TY does this year.

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1 hour ago, Nickster said:

Watsons legal trouble is going to prevent that.  Unless he’s exonerated which won’t happen any time soon, hes not going to have much trade value.

From everything I've read, it's all civil thus far, no criminal. Sure it will impact his value, but IMO teams will just wait till the smoke clears. He won't even be deposed until early next year, and the NFL hasn't even talked to him yet (this really perplexes me), so the smoke will be around for a while. I'm guessing he ends up on the commissioner's list for this season, but who knows. 

 

If I were Houston, I'd take a hard look at the situation, and do anything I could to unload him regardless what I think the outcome may be. I'd seek as many picks as possible of course, but make them conditional on his availability. So worst case, they might not get picks for the next two years (some are suggesting he'll end up on the C-list this year, and suspended next), but at least they'd unload the salary.

 

Sure will be interesting.

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36 minutes ago, Nickster said:

We didn’t have a great running game at all until the end of the year.  Statistically we were inefficient and just plain bad until GB or so.

 

I agree it wasn't great early. But it was still good. Wouldn't call it plain bad overall. And I'd fault a decent portion of it to play calling, and the situational rotation. The usage was head scratching at times along with lack of adjustment.

 

I don't think we'll look "great" early this year either. But that will be due to the good/great run Ds we face to start the season.

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25 minutes ago, Nickster said:

It’s a very friendly cap hit for them.  He doesn’t really cost much more cap per year than TY does this year.

Yup, bargain IMO. That is, if he stays healthy and available.

 

Like I said in earlier posts, I think TN might have finally realized that riding Henry isn't quite enough. Titans could look significantly different this year. If true, will be interesting to see how Tannehill reacts.

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1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

From everything I've read, it's all civil thus far, no criminal. Sure it will impact his value, but IMO teams will just wait till the smoke clears. He won't even be deposed until early next year, and the NFL hasn't even talked to him yet (this really perplexes me), so the smoke will be around for a while. I'm guessing he ends up on the commissioner's list for this season, but who knows. 

 

If I were Houston, I'd take a hard look at the situation, and do anything I could to unload him regardless what I think the outcome may be. I'd seek as many picks as possible of course, but make them conditional on his availability. So worst case, they might not get picks for the next two years (some are suggesting he'll end up on the C-list this year, and suspended next), but at least they'd unload the salary.

 

Sure will be interesting.

Yeah man, it is a very interesting situation.  
 

but value is determined by what one ream will offer and the dude is good.  I think somewhat overrated and unproven as a leader of men, but dadgum good.

 

The suits are strange though in numbers and certainly feel like a money grab.  I mean wouldn’t one of the dozens of masseuses tell the other masseuses that this dude is essentially raping them when he comes in for his massages?  Sounds more like happy ending parlor to me.  I’ve only read and heard about them but assume they exist.

 

so yeah man, what is going to happen here.  I would also think that there will be a significant MeToo type of backlash even if he isn’t guilty of sexual misconduct many  owners won’t deal with that but some will.

 

pure speculation but if he was traded right now what do you think the return might be?

 

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2 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Yup, bargain IMO. That is, if he stays healthy and available.

 

Like I said in earlier posts, I think TN might have finally realized that riding Henry isn't quite enough. Titans could look significantly different this year. If true, will be interesting to see how Tannehill reacts.

Yeah man.  I wish we would have had that same realization.  I don’t think you can win a SB with our a SUperstar type of WR or TE in the league right now.  We have no alpha and I don’t see any even potential types of alphas on the roster.

 

The one guy we have though is Campbell.  If I had to guess I would think he is going to need to develop this entire season and is essentially still a rookie in experience.  Can you learn great route running in the trainers room?  Dubious Cub fan vibe on that.

 

but he looked great in the ONE GAME he played last year.

 

problem is to me though this is looking like a draft blunder even if he does become a good player.  Metcalf, mclaurin, and Johnson were all drafted shortly after him.

 

metcalf is on a HOF trajectory , I think Johnson already is what the Colts hoped PC will be and a future superstar (I had the dude in fantasy watched a lot of  and he’s a matchup nightmare), and mclaurin has put up gaudy numbers with pedestrian Qbing.

 

so I like Paris somewhat and hope he gets healthy so we can see, but this draft pick even assuming health might be pretty disappointing compared to these 3 guys drafted after him.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Nickster said:

Yeah man, it is a very interesting situation.  
 

but value is determined by what one ream will offer and the dude is good.  I think somewhat overrated and unproven as a leader of men, but dadgum good.

 

The suits are strange though in numbers and certainly feel like a money grab.  I mean wouldn’t one of the dozens of masseuses tell the other masseuses that this dude is essentially raping them when he comes in for his massages?  Sounds more like happy ending parlor to me.  I’ve only read and heard about them but assume they exist.

 

so yeah man, what is going to happen here.  I would also think that there will be a significant MeToo type of backlash even if he isn’t guilty of sexual misconduct many  owners won’t deal with that but some will.

 

pure speculation but if he was traded right now what do you think the return might be?

 

Purely a gut feel, but yes, I agree it's likely a money grab. I'm not saying Watson wasn't flying these women in for a happy endings (breaking the law), but I do feel most if not all of these women knew what the expectations/motivations were. I really hope all the details come out, including the communications between parties regarding their "appointments".... If these women truly thought they were somehow picked out on IG and being flown first class for an overnight stay just for a therapeutic late night massage, I'd have to question their common sense. Regardless, Watson was an * the way he went about it. He should have just found a few true "escorts" he could fly in wherever he was lol.... And I don't feel sorry for the dude. 

 

I have zero ideal what the value would be. I think in the beginning they were looking for 3 first rounders, plus a few more early/mid picks. He's locked up for 5 years, with a potential out after 3 years IIRC. And many think there's a good chance he's on the C-list this year (paid, but doesn't count against the 53 or cap). And depending on how things go early next year, could be again on the C-list or suspended. 

 

So, with all that in mind (still just a hot take attempt at speculation), I'd say limit it to three conditional 1st round picks. One each year for the next 3 years. If he is available each year, Houston gets a first that year. If it's a partial year, conditional language that would drop it to a 2nd, 3rd, etc depending on how much he's available. If he's not available at all, no picks.

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3 minutes ago, Nickster said:

Yeah man.  I wish we would have had that same realization.  I don’t think you can win a SB with our a SUperstar type of WR or TE in the league right now.  We have no alpha and I don’t see any even potential types of alphas on the roster.

 

The one guy we have though is Campbell.  If I had to guess I would think he is going to need to develop this entire season and is essentially still a rookie in experience.  Can you learn great route running in the trainers room?  Dubious Cub fan vibe on that.

 

but he looked great in the ONE GAME he played last year.

 

problem is to me though this is looking like a draft blunder even if he does become a good player.  Metcalf, mclaurin, and Johnson were all drafted shortly after him.

 

metcalf is on a HOF trajectory , I think Johnson already is what the Colts hoped PC will be and a future superstar (I had the dude in fantasy watched a lot of  and he’s a matchup nightmare), and mclaurin has put up gaudy numbers with pedestrian Qbing.

 

so I like Paris somewhat and hope he gets healthy so we can see, but this draft pick even assuming health might be pretty disappointing compared to these 3 guys drafted after him.

 

I wouldn't call PC a draft blunder. He's looked very very good when available, and had no real history of injuries. It's just plan bad luck, not a miscalculation by Ballard. As you know I have a history of not worshipping every Ballard move, but I don't think this is on him.

 

I'm also not sure I buy into the whole narrative that Indy doesn't have a capable Alpha pass catcher. If anything, I'd fault the scheme/rotation, QB situation over the past couple years, and injuries. I think Parris is capable of 1000 yards if healthy. While I don't typically likes Xs as Alpha guys (from a WR1 perspective), I think Pittman has flashed plenty. It typically takes Xs longer to develop than Zs or slots, and IMO, Pittman is ahead of the curve. At minimum, he has the potential to be a top 5 X. And then you have MAC, who has graded out elite in almost every area, was underutilized, and then had a knee issue late in the season. He could easily breakout as a top 5 move TE. He's already graded top 5, and was top of the ranks before the knee. 

 

Purely a hot take on my part, but if I were Ballard, I'd do my best to stop forcing so much to TY, and ride Parris (phase him into Z as the season goes along), Pittman, and MAC as much as possible (1st read options). That all assumes PC stays healthy of course, which is a big if. TY should still be an integral part of the O, but not target hog he's been. And IMO, he should get more and more slot snaps as the season goes along. I think he could still tear things up running slot routes for the next 2-3 years.

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On 6/19/2021 at 1:38 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It is early but my Tier's would go like this:

Tier 1: Chiefs

 

Tier 2: Bills, Browns, Ravens, Titans, Colts, Dolphins, Pats 

 

Tier 3: Steelers, Chargers, Raiders

 

The kicker will be, will Rodgers get traded to someone like the Broncos?? If so the Broncos would be in Tier 2 easily. 

I agree with this ranking. Colts are around 6 or 7.

 

They have improved some but so has their competition. I'm most concerned with the defense. Will this rebuilt defensive line and LB Corp perform at the same level as last season ?

 

I think the Bills regress some this season but watch out for the Chargers. 

 

As others have said I am concerned with the jags as well. They had a really good draft

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What I will say is don’t get to worked up over the “big” name Free agents. This team is built threw the draft so our approach has to be different for current and long term winning. As fans we see thing here and now but in the long term it’s not wise for us to take on Jones contract at this point we have home grown talent to take care of that are proven in our system. You guys want us to sign every name player that’s rumored to be available it’s not realistic. 

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1 minute ago, jbaron04 said:

What I will say is don’t get to worked up over the “big” name Free agents. This team is built threw the draft so our approach has to be different for current and long term winning. As fans we see thing here and now but in the long term it’s not wise for us to take on Jones contract at this point we have home grown talent to take care of that are proven in our system. You guys want us to sign every name player that’s rumored to be available it’s not realistic. 

While I agree a lot of folks go crazy over too many FAs, all teams are built with mixes. Heck, our two biggest pieces (QB and 3T) are both FA adds. So is our CB1 and LT, which are top positions too. Last year, both DEs too. Every unit (OL, QB, DL, DB) aside from pass catcher and LB has a significant FA contributors. So fans contemplating a pass catching or LB upgrade via FA isn't totally crazy, especially given we have an aging Z/WR1, and questionable MIKE that will be taking on a full time role this year.

 

The biggest question is what is the perfect or best balance. 

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The AFC is extremely stacked right now. I feel like we had a solid offseason, but we are still only the 4th best team IMO (behind the Chiefs, Bills, and Browns). We are probably the worst division winner if we win it and the Titans are the 5th best team in the AFC IMO who could easily win with a bad break or two like last year against us. 

 

The best way we could of combated this IMO was to sign a FA EDGE instead of Fisher, and draft Darrisaw instead of Paye. We could of still taken Dayo in the 2nd and been in the exact same situation except we'd have two young players at EDGE and LT starting for us and wouldn't have to worry about a 30 year old Fisher with a torn achilles. Other then that, Luck leaving has completely screwed us over until this year, and it will affect us until after next years draft when we will ultimately probably have to give up a 1st round pick to finish paying for Wentz to replace him. 

 

The good news is we have a lot of young players on this team that should have an opportunity to grow. Could be a very good team, but some guys will have to come through big time if we want to compete this year.

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4 hours ago, EastStreet said:

While I agree a lot of folks go crazy over too many FAs, all teams are built with mixes. Heck, our two biggest pieces (QB and 3T) are both FA adds. So is our CB1 and LT, which are top positions too. Last year, both DEs too. Every unit (OL, QB, DL, DB) aside from pass catcher and LB has a significant FA contributors. So fans contemplating a pass catching or LB upgrade via FA isn't totally crazy, especially given we have an aging Z/WR1, and questionable MIKE that will be taking on a full time role this year.

 

The biggest question is what is the perfect or best balance. 

Yes balance is the key , like yes I would like ertz but if he gets cut and we sign him good but I don’t want to trade a 3rd etc…

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22 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

I wouldn't call PC a draft blunder. He's looked very very good when available, and had no real history of injuries. It's just plan bad luck, not a miscalculation by Ballard. As you know I have a history of not worshipping every Ballard move, but I don't think this is on him.

 

I'm also not sure I buy into the whole narrative that Indy doesn't have a capable Alpha pass catcher. If anything, I'd fault the scheme/rotation, QB situation over the past couple years, and injuries. I think Parris is capable of 1000 yards if healthy. While I don't typically likes Xs as Alpha guys (from a WR1 perspective), I think Pittman has flashed plenty. It typically takes Xs longer to develop than Zs or slots, and IMO, Pittman is ahead of the curve. At minimum, he has the potential to be a top 5 X. And then you have MAC, who has graded out elite in almost every area, was underutilized, and then had a knee issue late in the season. He could easily breakout as a top 5 move TE. He's already graded top 5, and was top of the ranks before the knee. 

 

Purely a hot take on my part, but if I were Ballard, I'd do my best to stop forcing so much to TY, and ride Parris (phase him into Z as the season goes along), Pittman, and MAC as much as possible (1st read options). That all assumes PC stays healthy of course, which is a big if. TY should still be an integral part of the O, but not target hog he's been. And IMO, he should get more and more slot snaps as the season goes along. I think he could still tear things up running slot routes for the next 2-3 years.

It is obvious to my eyes that the corps as a pass catching unit has been better when a diminished TY with his professional route running, even if he’s not catching the balls himself, he’s occupying defenders and making correct reads which looks like it opens opened the O. But I don’t think any sentient being should believe e that tys positive effect would match Jones.  Even though their cap hits are similar.  I’ll leave the statistical analysis to dudes like you though.

 

As to the PC draft, what I am saying is that he was probably never drafted to be as good as those 3 already are.  I’m almost certain that no one thought he’d ever put up the numbers Metcalf has already.

 

the injury thing is absolutely not what I’m talking about.  As far as I know there was no reason to think the dude would miss most of his 1st 2 seasons.  
 

im speculating because I. Like to do that and feel that is much of the fun of discussing stuff on athletic boards derives from what if’s,  but I don’t think he was drafted to produce 2200 yds and 17 TDs in his first 2 seasons like metcalf has and think it’s patently obvious that this is the case and we would have been better off drafting DK. 
 

so I don’t know what you call that other than a mistake or Blunder.

 

now I wouldn’t be shocked necessarily if his does turn out to be as good as those 3, BUT I don’t think he was talked about that way by the team.  

when he was drafted I thought there were glaring red flags.  Now I don’t watch much college and even when I did I can freely admit that I was not particularly good at seeing how the player would translate in the NFL, but after Colts players are drafted I study them pretty intensely.  He was described  as a project gadget type of player with that athleticism and I thought o know he’s Harvin, or Tavon Austin, ie. never going to be a consistent contributor in the passing game, ie.  fools gold.  Looking over his college stats I was particularly unimpressed with the 11 yard average per reception.  I would have thought a guy like him at OSU would average at least 15 if not 18 or 20 YpR. To me this was a tremendous red flag with a guy with a 4.3 40.  Because it strongly supports  the idea guy isn’t good at getting open and ain’t good at routes and/releases knowing that OSU plays several teams that are completely overmatched by their  talen and PC had least good qbing while He was there.

 

so anyway, again Cub Fan paranoia but I expected him to be pretty busty.  He showed very little his rookie year before he was injured.  And yes luck quit and we had an incompetent passer of the football, but he wasn’t getting much Playing time either.  However I reserve all judgement on rookie WRs because apparently it’s hard to be good as a rookie although metcalf, and mxlaurin were great and Johnson was very good.

 

we went to camp a couple of days in 2019 and it was fairly windy, and after seeing him struggle fielding punts, I said to my son, he’ll never return a kick for this team.  And it was talked about how his skill set could make him a dangerous returner.

 

So for me personally, I perceived glaring red flags,  BUt then during that one game last year when he was looking really sporty on those long crossers, I was like ok yeah I get it now.  With our protection, he’s not going to need to be a good route runner because he’s going to have time using that speed on those long crossers and will flash open a lot when the QB has so much time to patiently wait.

 

so what is my point if you are still tracking with this ramble?  I think he might be a good player for us, even though he can’t field a punt, it’s fairly unlikely that he is going to be a consistent deep producer, and is probably not going to be a better player than those other 3 guys.  
 

so l like the dude and could see him really blossoming and being a good to great system type of receiver, but we would be better off with any of those other 3 guys, even ignoring the injuries and missed time IMO.


 

 

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Right now, the Colts are just a pile of parts and pieces. We can't know what the final product will look like until we put it together and see how it works. Seems many fans here are far too cautious to be optimistic. Prepare to be surprised.

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On 6/20/2021 at 1:27 AM, EastStreet said:

Rivers had a ton of time last year, so needing mobility wasn't really an issue. The offensive scheme was conservative and quick trigger. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but Rivers had plenty of time and could have went deeper had the play calling asked for that. 

 

I highly doubt you'll see significantly more deep throws this season, especially early.

 

  The fact that Smith didn't give up a sack shows Rivers didn't have a ton of time. Rivers was firing the ball out somewhere near 2.3ish for a Reason.
Kelly, Glow, nor Smith are much more than average pass blockers. They get beat.

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43 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  The fact that Smith didn't give up a sack shows Rivers didn't have a ton of time. Rivers was firing the ball out somewhere near 2.3ish for a Reason.
Kelly, Glow, nor Smith are much more than average pass blockers. They get beat.

IMO the main reasons why Rivers was so fast at getting the ball out are basically 2 fold.  1.  Rivers got rid of it quick because Rivers gets rid of it quick.  Watching him closely last year, I have never seen anyone read and react and release better than Philly Rivers including Brady and Brees.  He’s great at all three of these skills.  And these have always been the Holy Trinity that made him great.  He’s also on par IMo in throwing to backs with Brady.  2 GOATs in that misunderstood skill. These are naturally short timey plays.

 


 

2.  Quick throws are the lynchpin of Reichs schemes.  It’s what he wants and believes in following the Belechikian, Brady model.

 

 

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1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  The fact that Smith didn't give up a sack shows Rivers didn't have a ton of time. Rivers was firing the ball out somewhere near 2.3ish for a Reason.
Kelly, Glow, nor Smith are much more than average pass blockers. They get beat.

What in the world?      :facepalm:

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2 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  The fact that Smith didn't give up a sack shows Rivers didn't have a ton of time. Rivers was firing the ball out somewhere near 2.3ish for a Reason.
Kelly, Glow, nor Smith are much more than average pass blockers. They get beat.

200.gif

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On 6/20/2021 at 9:42 AM, The Fish said:

 

Not to turn this into my Browns prediction thread, as there's a few of you who can't even (I don't care), but yeah, I might be an early adopter here, but I don't see it. I see a team with a few more blue chips than most teams (because they've been so bad) and no culture of doing anything, a QB who's a meathead and a guy who throws helmets at opposing players. And OBJ. pff... 

 

They're not winning nothing of consequence. Just putting the 2 cents down.

Bit you literally keep posting that Cleveland will indeed win "something" of consequence.  Which is it?

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4 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

Bit you literally keep posting that Cleveland will indeed win "something" of consequence.  Which is it?

It's what I literally said once? They're not winning anything of consequence. No Super Bowl trips or wins as constructed. 

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46 minutes ago, The Fish said:

It's what I literally said once? They're not winning anything of consequence. No Super Bowl trips or wins as constructed. 

I would disagree, but then history has shown they seem to just not take the chances they’re given. I mean, Mahomes was injured and suddenly the Chiefs were beatable, but the Browns just couldn’t score or do anything with the opportunity. 
 

At some they’ve got to put together a winning team though, I mean from a probability standpoint it’s bound to happen (though it could take 100 years, sorry Cubs fans!). 

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