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Fisher Signing 1 Year Deal


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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

I hope you’re right, but my thought is the opposite might be true.   That we might make a move or two, but small.   And we’d more likely to sit and weight for the final cutdown date in September to see who becomes available? 

I wasn't suggesting we would go out and sign some FA's right away.  We have time. That's why I mentioned Ertz.  He is most likely a cut down day release. 

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17 minutes ago, bertjones7 said:

ESPN Live - Positive update regarding Fisher injury:

- Stephania Bell said 6 to 9 month recovery

- Main reason his surgery was done by Dr Robert Anderson - pioneered a new achilles surgical technique that uses a smaller incision that has less risk of infection and speedier recovery.

2nd best news of the day. That's what we are looking for.  A legitimate reason for optimism. 

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6 hours ago, Superman said:

Such a weird deal. We're gonna pay him $9.4m to rehab his Achilles, and there's a strong chance he won't even play for us. 

 

Of course, the team and doctors know where he is. And maybe the deal is structured in a way that we're not on the hook if he can't go. But still... I'm on the fence on this one. Would have gone with a more reliable option.

 

If, for some reason, he can't go, do you think the Colts might have a 'split' contract (amount) on his P5 salary written in?  I expect he will be on the active/PUP pre-season, and very possibly to start the regular season on reserve/PUP list (missing the first 6 games.  But that just me and my expectations.  I want to be more optimistic, but a Mid August return in football shape is way to rosy for me.

 

 

5 hours ago, ProblChld32 said:


they say he should be ready to go around mid August 

 

5 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I know you are going by past history of this injury but I doubt the Colts would sign him for 1 year if he couldn't play at all. Rappaport is saying Mid-August from what he has been hearing. I am not sure if I believe that but I also wouldn't rule out that Fisher plays 3/4 of the season as in back by October if his rehab goes great. So far I have no reason to believe his rehab has had any setbacks. 

 

I do not trust Rapoport (nor his source) on this projection on Fishers return status. I caution those that do, do not be upset and angry if he isn't 'ready' by mid August.

 

Quote

As of now I love the signing, we will just have to wait and see when he gets healthy and comes back.

 

Keep an eye out for active (summer/training camp) and possibly later, the reserve (reg. season), PUP lists.

 

5 hours ago, TheNextGM said:

Love it.

IF he plays week 1 the Colts will have the best Oline in football.

 

Cant wait for the schedule release on Wednesday.

 

Hopefully he can and will be 100%. Will make Colts fans very happy. But mark me down as he might be ready mid-late October, and will be at 75-80%.  Even with a great surgeon, perfect operation, and off the charts rehab, you can't rush biology aspect. IE:, the low blood supply necessary for proper full healing, the excessive muscle atrophy that occurs, etc...

 

My feeling is he might be end up being 'cleared for full activity' in/by end of July, but it may take as long as another 3 months or more (ask @TomDiggs) of football drills/practice just to get somewhat back into playing shape by 9 months. And I feel that even that may be still too early and could be a contributing reason why football players that do return so early also have notably decreased performance during the year following their return. Cleared for full activity and cleared to play are two totally separate things.

 

Ran across this, to go with all of the other studies discussed in another { Left Tackle(Leno,Fisher,Okung?)/Sam Tevi at LT (MERGE) }  thread-

 

“Seventy-eight Achilles tendon ruptures were identified in professional football players during the 2010-2015 NFL seasons. 58% of these injuries occurred during the preseason. Of those that suffered an Achilles tendon rupture, 26% did not ever return to play in the NFL. Players who did return to play in the NFL took an average of 9 months to recover after the date of injury. Across all positions, there was a net decrease in power ratings by 22% and a net decrease in approximate value by 23% over 3 years following player return after Achilles tendon rupture. Across all positions, running backs saw the biggest decrease in production with a 78% decrease over 3 years post-injury in both power ratings and approximate value.”

 

The fact they signed him gives hope he will contribute, at some point. When and how ell are the questions.

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

He missed an entire season.

 

Oh I know. I am talking about performance level if he comes back. 

 

Peters' injury was in March...and he actually tore it twice I think. 

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3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Leno is a realistic option right now.

 

Is he significantly more reliable than Fisher though? 

 

I guess that depends what we mean by reliable. Leno's health is less of a concern than Fisher's so he's more reliable in that sense. Fisher's level of play should be higher if he is healthy, however, so he's more reliable in that sense.

 

I definitely understand the concern but I would have been happy enough with either guy. It's not great but it's going to have to suffice.

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we just got a younger upgrade over AC who ranks higher in both run and pass and  a better tackle .   He will be ready colts know he will only miss 3 or 4 games in a 17 game season .  we lost AC for many games last year and with bad backups did fine still 2nd least sacks allowed in the nfl . now we have much better backup depth and tevi was a starter and holden played great last year shut down the steelers .  we will be fine and get a elite tackle be happy our oline is better now than last year by far with much more depth and a better elite tackle .   trust in ballard .

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5 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

If, for some reason, he can't go, do you think the Colts might have a 'split' contract (amount) on his P5 salary written in?  I expect he will be on the active/PUP pre-season, and very possibly to start the regular season on reserve/PUP list (missing the first 6 games.  But that just me and my expectations.  I want to be more optimistic, but a Mid August return in football shape is way to rosy for me.

 

 

 

 

I do not trust Rapoport (nor his source) on this projection on Fishers return status. I caution those that do, do not be upset and angry if he isn't 'ready' by mid August.

 

 

Keep an eye out for active (summer/training camp) and possibly later, the reserve (reg. season), PUP lists.

 

 

Hopefully he can and will be 100%. Will make Colts fans very happy. But mark me down as he might be ready mid-late October, and will be at 75-80%.  Even with a great surgeon, perfect operation, and of the charts rehab, you can't rush biology. IE:, the low blood supply necessary for healing, the muscle atrophy that occurs, etc...

 

My feeling is he might be end up being 'cleared for full activity' in/by end of July, but it may take as long as another 3 months or more (ask @TomDiggs) of football drills/practice just to get somewhat back into playing shape by 9 months. And I feel that even that may be still too early and could be a contributing reason why football players that do return also have notably decreased performance during the year following their return. Cleared for activity and cleared to play are two totally separate things.

 

Ran across this, to go with all of the other studies discussed in another { Left Tackle(Leno,Fisher,Okung?)/Sam Tevi at LT (MERGE) }  thread-

 

“Seventy-eight Achilles tendon ruptures were identified in professional football players during the 2010-2015 NFL seasons. 58% of these injuries occurred during the preseason. Of those that suffered an Achilles tendon rupture, 26% did not ever return to play in the NFL. Players who did return to play in the NFL took an average of 9 months to recover after the date of injury. Across all positions, there was a net decrease in power ratings by 22% and a net decrease in approximate value by 23% over 3 years following player return after Achilles tendon rupture. Across all positions, running backs saw the biggest decrease in production with a 78% decrease over 3 years post-injury in both power ratings and approximate value.”

 

The fact they signed him gives hope he will contribute, at some point. When and how ell are the questions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am not in medicine, but the RTP rate on that study is higher than I have seen. which is good. And that's a pretty large sample of players though. Still, 26% not returning is a scary number.

 

Just an aside...but the Colts now have (3) players returning from Achilles tears this upcoming. At a high level, the odds all three RTP is 44%, right? Somebody that is better with statistics...tell me if I have that wrong.

 

Even setting aside Mack, who is on a cheap flyer contract, the odds that Dayo and Fisher both RTP is ~53%. That's quite the gamble for a $9.5M and a 2nd round pick.

 

Of course, that's just odds...and there are medical evaluations that provide a lot more data than a dice roll. But the odds are the still the odds, as both Dayo and Fisher are early in recovery.

 

Anyways...assuming Fisher is in that 76% RTP...there is also performance to consider. The studies I have read tend to point to a 1.5 year+ recovery time to return to pre-injury performance (assuming they are able to). There won't be enough time to get back to pre-injury performance this season...so he's likely to be 80% of what he was from a performance standpoint last.

 

Part of me wonders if this is more of a trial run to set up a 2-3 year extension to solidify LT for a few years. They are fine paying $9.5M with the risk...IF they can get a discount on the extension if he gets back. 

 

 

 

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Ballards really rolling the dice, LT and a 2nd round pick both coming off Achilles injuries which used to be a career ender no doubt about it, and Wentz who may or may not get back to winning football.

 

I wouldnt be surprised if we regress slightly this year, these moves could work out long term though if both guys recover from their injuries and Wentz settles in to his new team.

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I would be surprised if CB doesn't have a contingency clause in the contract that if he could not play at all this coming season that the Colts would be on the hook for his entire salary. I would imagine that there would be an incentive clause based on games played. would be shocked if that were not the case.

As for the fact he may not start the season and miss the first few games, a drafted rookie may have been in the same boat.  Not to many rookie LT are going to come into this league and start playing at a high level, especially any that we could have picked up at 54. 

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Leno, the clear safer option. This is risky, but it is what it is, maybe Leno was not possible or they think Fisher is higher upside, even with the injury.

 

There clearly is some kind of trust in Tevi and Davenport at least provides insurance for him as well. As long as they can survive for a couple games and then Fisher is able to come in, we should be fine. The medical part of it, who knows. The FO are the ones that have the medical info, we don't. We can only trust he'll be fine and close to back to his best.

 

I wonder if they'd resign him, in that case. Not sure how much room there'd be for that, but if it's possible it would kick the can down the road on the left tackle problem, which we need. We have to stop having to replace players at super important positions every off season. 

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with the new break through in the surgery its 6 to 9 months to be able to play when it used to be a full year to be cleared to play . it will be 8 months by week 1 even if it takes the max 9 months that is the 4th game of the season and that is the max; he could be cleared week one .   ballard has to know fisher is healing well and on target to return in 8 months to sign him

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2 minutes ago, Les Poulains said:

Leno, the clear safer option. This is risky, but it is what it is, maybe Leno was not possible or they think Fisher is higher upside, even with the injury.

 

There clearly is some kind of trust in Tevi and Davenport at least provides insurance for him as well. As long as they can survive for a couple games and then Fisher is able to come in, we should be fine. The medical part of it, who knows. The FO are the ones that have the medical info, we don't. We can only trust he'll be fine and close to back to his best.

 

I wonder if they'd resign him, in that case. Not sure how much room there'd be for that, but if it's possible it would kick the can down the road on the left tackle problem, which we need. We have to stop having to replace players at super important positions every off season. 

the only reason a premium position player would be cut in his prime is because he is not that good .  many on here have overrated leno if he was on AC level he would have teams battling over him

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1 hour ago, PRnum1 said:

If Tevi starts this is what Wentz will look like at the end of September 

 

cast GIF

Well we would keep our 1 next year.... maybe that’s the plan 

Just now, coming on strong said:

the only reason a premium position player would be cut in his prime is because he is not that good .  many on here are overrated leno if he was on AC level he would have teams battling over him

Not entirely true. It’s also a cap hit issue too. A lot of teams exhausted all methods possible to reduce their cap hits and that was before the draft. 

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3 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

with the new break through in the surgery its 6 to 9 months to be able to play when it used to be a full year to be cleared to play . it will be 8 months by week 1 even if it takes the max 9 months that is the 4th game of the season and that is the max he could be cleared week one .   ballard has to know fisher is healing well and on target to return in 8 months to sign him

Still one heck of a gamble

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3 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

the only reason a premium position player would be cut in his prime is because he is not that good .  many on here have overrated leno if he was on AC level he would have teams battling over him

Leno has demonstrably been fine and is durable. That's really all we would have needed for a season or two before we actually fix the left tackle problem long term. We've taken the bigger risk on Fisher, which is fine because he's a good player, but it is the bigger risk, undoubtedly. 

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4 hours ago, Wentzszn said:

If Tevi ends up playing the first month it’s a huge opportunity for him. He could earn a starting spot with us in 22 and make a few more dollars. If fisher plays well and comes back strong we can’t afford if after this one year.

I think Holden will beat him out

 

Or....

 

They wait out the finals cuts and a LT better than Tevi is available

 

They only have to play 6-8 games

 

Maybe Jared Valdeer is the answer

 

He was good in lineup 

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4 hours ago, cbear said:

I have yet to see anyone say his entire season is up in the air. Part of it..sure. If we're playing the guessing game, I'd say 99% he plays at least 10 games. I wouldn't have signed him for that personally, but I have no concerns he misses the entire season at this point. 

 

Maybe 11 games, if he returns after reserve/PUP served (because I think he makes it onto it.

 

4 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Ballard has access to his doctors and access to be able to talk to Fisher on a daily basis, none of us do in here. So at this point, Ballard must think Fisher will be ready to play most of the season. It would make no sense for Ballard to sign him to a 1 year deal if he wasn't sure Fisher would be back. I am rolling with Ballard on this one, he knows more than we do.

 

Colts physicians will have all of the discussions and get all of the medical data on Fisher. Ballard will talk with the Colts medical team about what they know/recommend.

 

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

He fit the profile of the kind of FA the Colts pursued last season -- guys who don't miss games due to injury. The connection between the Colts and Fisher is obvious, but I think it's unrealistic to expect him to be back nine months after a ruptured Achilles. 

 

Leno seemed to be guy that would be on the radar. And I think its almost unrealistic to think Fisher is going to be in game day shape in just short of 7 months (mid August). In my mind, if he had minimally open procedure and no (especially nerve) issues, with a solid accelerated successful rehab, he could possibly get on the field in 9 months or so, but at a degraded (75-80% ?) performance capacity, in my estimation. Time will tell.

 

3 hours ago, Fluke_33 said:

I get too optimistic at times so take my comments with a grain of salt but don't you think it is more likely that they've reviewed his specific injury, see that he is ahead of schedule, and going to be able to play this year and that is why they signed him than he fits the general studies/reports that you are relying on.   I know you are defending your position and it is logically sound but you don't have the information on this specific injury or his recovery while they do.

 

I just dont see ballard signing someone to 9.84 when he doesn't think there is a strong chance they play for most of the season/playoffs.

 

Certainly they feel the potential is there, but I'm pretty sure no Doctor is going to guarantee them that.  There's still risk and will be until he actually gets cleared to 'Play".  And if/when he does, at what level will he perform? Is a 75% or 80% Fisher better than a >95% Tevi (or other LT) ??  I don't know.

 

My gut feeling says anywhere after reserve/PUP time frame (which I feel Fisher gets put on) passes during the season (at a minimum). Maybe by Halloween? we will later see.

 

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5 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

I think Holden will beat him out

 

Or....

 

They wait out the finals cuts and a LT better than Tevi is available

 

They only have to play 6-8 games

 

Maybe Jared Valdeer is the answer

 

He was good in lineup 

If Jared was a option he probably would of signed. He clearly doesn’t want to go through the grind of a season.

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10 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

They clearly after watching tape ect didn’t think Leno was a upgrade over Tevi. They seem fine starting Tevi a few games.

I wonder if they were wearing their glasses while watching tape.

 

glasses GIF

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I like the signing! It has a lot of upside, and we have bodies in Holden, Davenport, & Levi until hes either ready or not. The old adage throw % against the wall & see what sticks!! One of these 4 guys will step up. If 2 or more of them do even better!!

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19 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

I think Holden will beat him out

 

Or....

 

They wait out the finals cuts and a LT better than Tevi is available

 

They only have to play 6-8 games

 

Maybe Jared Valdeer is the answer

 

He was good in lineup 

I think it wouldnt be bad at all to see if Veldheer would consider being the backup tackle to Fisher. Play a handful of games and then fallback when Fishers ready. Bring him in to camp and let him compete with Tevi.

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17 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

If Jared was a option he probably would of signed. He clearly doesn’t want to go through the grind of a season.

Who knows whats going on with that. He hasnt retired. Hes still a free agent. Its most likely Tevi for now though. He is the backup tackle covering for Fisher until ready.

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I'm surprised we didn't get a team option for a second year. Who knows how good he'll be coming back this year. Lets not forget it's not like he can workout very much.

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Probably trying to meet a few criteria's with this move. I'd guess there's long term designs but he's gotta show it's still there.

It'd make more sense to me if it was a 2 year deal and marginally easier on the cap, but if he plays well and re-up's next year, we'll live with it. Legit talent isn't easy to get.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, The Fish said:

Probably trying to meet a few criteria's with this move. I'd guess there's long term designs but he's gotta show it's still there.

It'd make more sense to me if it was a 2 year deal and marginally easier on the cap, but if he plays well and re-up's next year, we'll live with it. Legit talent isn't easy to get.

 

 


I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s more of a handshake  deal for the next couple of years.

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16 minutes ago, ColtJax said:

I'm surprised we didn't get a team option for a second year. Who knows how good he'll be coming back this year. Lets not forget it's not like he can workout very much.

I doubt Fisher wanted more then a year. He will get a better pay day next season.

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42 minutes ago, ColtJax said:

I'm surprised we didn't get a team option for a second year. Who knows how good he'll be coming back this year. Lets not forget it's not like he can workout very much.

In the NFL that is called the franchise tag.  Unless you are a first round draft pick then teams have the fifth year option.

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7 hours ago, Superman said:

Such a weird deal. We're gonna pay him $9.4m to rehab his Achilles, and there's a strong chance he won't even play for us. 

 

Of course, the team and doctors know where he is. And maybe the deal is structured in a way that we're not on the hook if he can't go. But still... I'm on the fence on this one. Would have gone with a more reliable option.

have faith in ballard son

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1 hour ago, coming on strong said:

the only reason a premium position player would be cut in his prime is because he is not that good .  many on here have overrated leno if he was on AC level he would have teams battling over him

You're in favor of signing Fisher.  
 

You say the only reason a team would cut a premium player is that he’s not that good.   Except, you forgot about injury. 
 

Fisher was also cut.   Not due to performance, but due to injury plus salary.  
 

Leno was cut, in part, due to the salary cap going down.   Lots of teams are in a hole due to the unique cap problem caused by Covid in 2021. 

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4 hours ago, tvturner said:

Looks like there is a lot of certified doctors here

 

LOL.  I'm not a true MD, nor DO (and not a PhD either)

 

But I sometimes play one on teh interwebs- (j/k!!)

 

2PxBU83.jpg

 

This picture was of me taken 5 years pre Covid-19 in the control room of a hybrid operating room suite (which had advanced X-Ray imaging equipment permanently installed) before a case. I do not recall the city or state. I retired 3 years later on 12/31/2018.

 

Before retirement,  I worked for a Major International medical imaging device company for over 25 years as a Zone / Senior Clinical Education and Support Specialist in Image Guided Therapy {IGT}. I had worked right along side Interventional Cardiologists and Radiologists at a hospital for many years before that), and worked closely with some of the best and brightest Interventional Vascular specialists, Interventional Cardiologists, Neurosurgeons, and Vascular surgeons in their operating room suites and procedure labs around the U.S. (even invited to Grand Cayman to work once!!  Loved that trip. That and in Anchorage, AK).

 

Anyone in the medical field or on hospital staff knows if you (as in knowledge, skill set, and need) are not 'Absolutely Essential' to being part of the operating room team for and during a procedure, you just plain aren't wanted nor allowed in.

 

I also know a few Nephrologists, OB/GYN doctors (mostly because of my wife's occupation; an OB/GYN Sonographer, but she's ARDMS certified in all areas of Ultrasound), Radiologists, and Orthopedic surgeons. I really try not to 'talk shop' with them if at all possible. But can, and do at specific times.

 

I really haven't ever before, nor even now really feel like divulging my work past. But there it is, in a quite shortened bio. Not a doctor.  :)

 

 

 

 

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34 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

In the NFL that is called the franchise tag.  Unless you are a first round draft pick then teams have the fifth year option.

Not sure why teams don't use the transition tag as much.  In the case of Fisher it would make way more sense.  Would save us around 1.5m.

image.png.e9586fed77330375236e95551dda2012.png

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