With the Next Pick (MERGE)

[RollerColt]

I can't see Ballard, a calculating man, agreeing to getting a QB based off of a coach's crush. 

 

We were in a tough situation. There weren't a lot of fantastic QBs out there to choose from in FA. Stafford required way too much. The rest weren't worth the money and or were never realistically considered for trade. 

 

We were never going to be able to command enough capital to move up in the draft to get a rookie starter. So here we are. Wentz was simply the best option with a bad hand dealt. He's familiar with the system, he has a good rapport with the coaching staff, he has shown potential in the past and the organization deems he's worth the risk to "fix". 

 

Numerous NFL analysts are all agreeing that this was a good trade and a good fit for Carson and the Colts. Could this all fail? Sure, absolutely it could. But as of this moment this was basically our best option.

[Yoshinator]

I watched both episodes so far. The first one was more in line with the normalcies on "with the next pick". The scouts showing their experiences of traveling in the covid conditions and how it affects them this year. Really had no issue with it. A bit boring and corny, but informative.

 

The 2nd episode grinds my gears a bit. It makes me warm up to Wentz and the type of person he is, but it makes me very nervous that most of the episode was about Reich and Wentz bonding over their faith. Obviously we can point to 2016 and 2017 and say they work well together, but I would of liked to see more about why Ballard and Reich thought Wentz was a great football player. He was the best option available no doubt, but I think this episode did a poor job of showcasing why he could be our franchise QB. He could be the nicest and most religious guy in the world, but that doesn't win football games. Show me something more on a show like this.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I watched both episodes so far. The first one was more in line with the normalcies on "with the next pick". The scouts showing their experiences of traveling in the covid conditions and how it affects them this year. Really had no issue with it. A bit boring and corny, but informative.

 

The 2nd episode grinds my gears a bit. It makes me warm up to Wentz and the type of person he is, but it makes me very nervous that most of the episode was about Reich and Wentz bonding over their faith. Obviously we can point to 2016 and 2017 and say they work well together, but I would of liked to see more about why Ballard and Reich thought Wentz was a great football player. He was the best option available no doubt, but I think this episode did a poor job of showcasing why he could be our franchise QB. He could be the nicest and most religious guy in the world, but that doesn't win football games. Show me something more on a show like this.

This is probably true There is a much better video of Reich from 2016 when they drafted Wentz talking about what he brings to the team. He talked about mental toughness ect. 

[Four2itus]

3 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I watched both episodes so far. The first one was more in line with the normalcies on "with the next pick". The scouts showing their experiences of traveling in the covid conditions and how it affects them this year. Really had no issue with it. A bit boring and corny, but informative.

 

The 2nd episode grinds my gears a bit. It makes me warm up to Wentz and the type of person he is, but it makes me very nervous that most of the episode was about Reich and Wentz bonding over their faith. Obviously we can point to 2016 and 2017 and say they work well together, but I would of liked to see more about why Ballard and Reich thought Wentz was a great football player. He was the best option available no doubt, but I think this episode did a poor job of showcasing why he could be our franchise QB. He could be the nicest and most religious guy in the world, but that doesn't win football games. Show me something more on a show like this.

Ya, the religious slant bugged me a bit too. 

[JediXMan]

So how many more episodes 2?, 3?

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 hours ago, JediXMan said:

So how many more episodes 2?, 3?

Maybe 2. Maybe one next week before the draft and one after.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

There will be a episode Wed. Then another after the draft.

[Valpo2004]

On 4/16/2021 at 10:41 AM, RollerColt said:

I can't see Ballard, a calculating man, agreeing to getting a QB based off of a coach's crush. 

 

We were in a tough situation. There weren't a lot of fantastic QBs out there to choose from in FA. Stafford required way too much. The rest weren't worth the money and or were never realistically considered for trade. 

 

We were never going to be able to command enough capital to move up in the draft to get a rookie starter. So here we are. Wentz was simply the best option with a bad hand dealt. He's familiar with the system, he has a good rapport with the coaching staff, he has shown potential in the past and the organization deems he's worth the risk to "fix". 

 

Numerous NFL analysts are all agreeing that this was a good trade and a good fit for Carson and the Colts. Could this all fail? Sure, absolutely it could. But as of this moment this was basically our best option.

 

To be fair, Rivers had a terrible season before coming to Indy and Reich said he could fix Rivers and he did. 

 

Before that Reich got Andrew going on a return from injury and a long time without football.

 

So my view is that if Frank Reich says he can fix Carson Wentz the logical thing to do is to believe him.

[joecolts]

1 hour ago, Valpo2004 said:

So my view is that if Frank Reich says he can fix Carson Wentz the logical thing to do is to believe him.

My thoughts as well.

 

[NewColtsFan]

One would think if the Colts were going to release the next video in the “with the next pick” series, they’d be doing it right about now!   
 

So maybe it gets released....   tomorrow?  

[IndyD4U]

Just now, NewColtsFan said:

One would think if the Colts were going to release the next video in the “with the next pick” series, they’d be doing it right about now!   
 

So maybe it gets released....   tomorrrow?  

They’ve been released at 7pm in the past

[NewColtsFan]

3 minutes ago, IndyD4U said:

They’ve been released at 7pm in the past

Yes...   but typically it’s been advertised for hours, if not a full day.   They typically don’t release it cold without alerting anyone. 

[aReggie7]

4 minutes ago, IndyD4U said:

They’ve been released at 7pm in the past

 

Yep they have it set to be released at 7 tonight on YouTube.

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

Thanks for the heads up!!

 

Always helpful!!

 

It’s coming!   It’s coming!!     

[NewColtsFan]

It’s good, but certainly not great.   They spent way, WAY too long on the wrestling contest.  That needed to be much shorter. 
 

And not nearly enough time about what made their process this year different than any other year?   
 

A little disappointing from what I was expecting.  

[John Hammonds]

From WTNP Episode 3:  We want a guy who wants to be coached, wants to get better, has high character, and has something you can point to that makes him unique.

Is it me?  Or do these traits all add up to Kwity Paye?

[joecolts]

8 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

From WTNP Episode 3:  We want a guy who wants to be coached, wants to get better, has high character, and has something you can point to that makes him unique.

Is it me?  Or do these traits all add up to Kwity Paye?

If Kwity Paye fell to 21, I'd be SHOCKED.  Extremely excited but, shocked.  That guy desires greatness and is on a mission to attain it for not only himself but, his mother and family.  Would LOVE to see him in COLTS BLUE!

[EastStreet]

8 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

From WTNP Episode 3:  We want a guy who wants to be coached, wants to get better, has high character, and has something you can point to that makes him unique.

Is it me?  Or do these traits all add up to Kwity Paye?

 

Sorry, I want a DE that runs over grandmothers and kicks puppies. He has rage issues, and born to kill tattooed 100 times on his body. He's only allowed out of lock up for practices and game days.

[danlhart87]

1 minute ago, joecolts said:

If Kwity Paye fell to 21, I'd be SHOCKED.  Extremely excited but, shocked.  That guy desires greatness and is on a mission to attain it for not only himself but, his mother and family.  Would LOVE to see him in COLTS BLUE!

I actually think the chances of him falling are good. He will be a no Brainer at that point.

 

@csmoparif Paye falls to 21 and we pass on him...

 

[joecolts]

1 minute ago, danlhart87 said:

I actually think the chances of him falling are good. He will be a no Brainer at that point.

 

@csmoparif Paye falls to 21 and we pass on him...

 

I hope you're right.  I think Dallas is a real possibility for him at 10.  They may very well go CB but, I could see them grabbing Paye.  If we were fortunate enough to grab Paye in the first and Eichenberg or another tackle in the 2nd, I'd be very pleased

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

There are a couple players that if they fell to 21 that would be no brainer where you would take them and not a OT. If Paye falls that’s a no brainer. He has colts character written all over him. I also think If a guy like Smith falls I won’t be shocked if we took him at 21. He is another Marvin.  Put smith on the outside with Pittman and Campbell in the slot. That is so much speed.

[csmopar]

3 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

I actually think the chances of him falling are good. He will be a no Brainer at that point.

 

@csmoparif Paye falls to 21 and we pass on him...

 

No... this will be me

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

What if Paye fell to like 16-18. Wonder if that could be a trade up possibility.

 

Ballard said they won’t pass up any player with unique and special traits ni matter if it is a need. Now I doubt we would take a QB at 21 or a Guard. But I can see WR.

[NewColtsFan]

4 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

What if Paye fell to like 16-18. Wonder if that could be a trade up possibility.

 

Ballard said they won’t pass up any player with unique and special traits ni matter if it is a need. Now I doubt we would take a QB at 21 or a Guard. But I can see WR.

People have wondered about trading up every year.   Every year Ballard says he’s not a trade up in the first round kind of GM.  Maybe not in those exact words, but he says it, or implies it, or infers it. 
 

And yet people wonder every year.  Even when we’re down picks and want more.   People still wonder....      

[csmopar]

5 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

What if Paye fell to like 16-18. Wonder if that could be a trade up possibility.

 

Ballard said they won’t pass up any player with unique and special traits ni matter if it is a need. Now I doubt we would take a QB at 21 or a Guard. But I can see WR.

I doubt we trade up, not having already traded for Wentz. That was our “trade up” this year

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

People have wondered about trading up every year.   Every year Ballard says he’s not a trade up in the first round kind of GM.  Maybe not in those exact words, but he says it, or implies it, or infers it. 
 

And yet people wonder every year.  Even when we’re down picks and want more.   People still wonder....      

I think this team is in a different position now where we need quality over quantity. Ten draft picks aren’t going to make the team every year now we have built this team.

[joecolts]

7 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

What if Paye fell to like 16-18. Wonder if that could be a trade up possibility.

 

Ballard said they won’t pass up any player with unique and special traits ni matter if it is a need. Now I doubt we would take a QB at 21 or a Guard. But I can see WR.

If it were I as the GM, I would be finding a way to trade up but, that's probably why Ballard is and not myself...lol.  I don't see him doing it.  As much as I would like to, his discipline and belief in his plan will dictate a stand pat or move down and gather more.  Solely my opinion and I've been wrong before.  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I doubt we trade up, not having already traded for Wentz. That was our “trade up” this year

Oh I doubt it. But we don’t need a lot of draft picks. Ballard has done so good drafting. Let’s get quality.

[EastStreet]

3 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

What if Paye fell to like 16-18. Wonder if that could be a trade up possibility.

 

Ballard said they won’t pass up any player with unique and special traits ni matter if it is a need. Now I doubt we would take a QB at 21 or a Guard. But I can see WR.

 

I just don't see us using draft capital to move up. It would cost us our 2nd to move up 7ish positions, and our 4th only moves us up like one position, maybe.... I think we're purely in stay OR move back mode given we're without a 3rd this year, and likely without a 1st next.

 

I think we'd take Paye at 21. I actually like Oweh better though. I think his ceiling is higher than Paye's. I wouldn't complain though we Paye, Oweh, or Philips (if he checks the health box) at 21. 

 

 

[Colt.45]

What'd I get from this episode? Well, sounds like they're possibly going to take some risks on guys they might not have before. Whether character or health. Sounds like they feel the locker room is ready now.

[EastStreet]

9 minutes ago, Wentzszn said:

I think this team is in a different position now where we need quality over quantity. Ten draft picks aren’t going to make the team every year now we have built this team.

It's about early picks more than about 10 picks, but more capital is important, even with the team being in a different position now. 

 

To have a healthy roster, you have to pick up a few new starters via the draft each year, and several key depth guys. If you don't, you get FA-heavy and the financial side of things gets out of hand. We're to a point now too that some of the "hits" in previous drafts are about to get paid, and paid very well. It's as important as ever that we reload via the draft as much as possible with key guys on cheap rook contracts.

[harrisoncolts88]

I really want to know who this bad charay person they were referring too. They said what if he fell in the second. Is that to pick 54 or is it because they want to trade back from 21 to early 2nd? Ahhh. I'm wondering if it's someone like Ronnie Perkins at 54

[John Hammonds]

11 minutes ago, harrisoncolts88 said:

I really want to know who this bad charay person they were referring too. They said what if he fell in the second. Is that to pick 54 or is it because they want to trade back from 21 to early 2nd? Ahhh. I'm wondering if it's someone like Ronnie Perkins at 54

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Gregory Rousseau, and that it's not truly about "bad character".  Great length and hands, but a year since playing, only getting sacks against lesser interior linemen, disastrous pro day, stock falling.  Does he work hard enough?  Does he care enough?  Is he coachable?  Can you turn him into an outside pass rusher?  Is he gonna be Barkevious Mingo?  Do we take a risk on a guy with a lot of athletic promise, but question marks on whether or not they can be fulfilled?

[EastStreet]

6 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Gregory Rousseau, and that it's not truly about "bad character".  Great length and hands, but a year since playing, only getting sacks against lesser interior linemen, disastrous pro day, stock falling.  Does he work hard enough?  Does he care enough?  Is he coachable?  Can you turn him into an outside pass rusher?  Is he gonna be Barkevious Mingo?  Do we take a risk on a guy with a lot of athletic promise, but question marks on whether or not they can be fulfilled?

 

Mingo still has a job though lol. In fairness, he was sub 250 guy with a track and field background, which was a very odd profile. He got hit hard with injuries early in his career too.  I'd call his draft selection a reach though.

[Hoose]

44 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

It's about early picks more than about 10 picks, but more capital is important, even with the team being in a different position now. 

 

To have a healthy roster, you have to pick up a few new starters via the draft each year, and several key depth guys. If you don't, you get FA-heavy and the financial side of things gets out of hand. We're to a point now too that some of the "hits" in previous drafts are about to get paid, and paid very well. It's as important as ever that we reload via the draft as much as possible with key guys on cheap rook contracts.

Well said. 

[John Hammonds]

4 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

Mingo still has a job though lol. In fairness, he was sub 250 guy with a track and field background, which was a very odd profile. He got hit hard with injuries early in his career too.  I'd call his draft selection a reach though.

He does indeed.  And has bounced from team to team to team, because each of them sees his athletic promise, and believes they can unlock his potential, but it never really works out.  He has no natural position.  He's been unsuccessful as an outside pass rusher, either as a DE or an OLB.  He's not had success as a 3-technique.  Nor as an off linebacker.  At the end of the day, he's a tall, long, athletic guy.  And that's what is gonna be written on his tombstone.  Rousseau has the possibility of following that same path.  It's a risk.

[GoColts8818]

On 4/16/2021 at 10:41 AM, RollerColt said:

I can't see Ballard, a calculating man, agreeing to getting a QB based off of a coach's crush. 

 

We were in a tough situation. There weren't a lot of fantastic QBs out there to choose from in FA. Stafford required way too much. The rest weren't worth the money and or were never realistically considered for trade. 

 

We were never going to be able to command enough capital to move up in the draft to get a rookie starter. So here we are. Wentz was simply the best option with a bad hand dealt. He's familiar with the system, he has a good rapport with the coaching staff, he has shown potential in the past and the organization deems he's worth the risk to "fix". 

 

Numerous NFL analysts are all agreeing that this was a good trade and a good fit for Carson and the Colts. Could this all fail? Sure, absolutely it could. But as of this moment this was basically our best option.

I am sure he didn’t do it solely because of Frank’s past and like of him but I am sure it played a factor as it did with Rivers.

[GoColts8818]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

I doubt we trade up, not having already traded for Wentz. That was our “trade up” this year

I’d be shocked if he traded up.

[EastStreet]

15 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

He does indeed.  And has bounced from team to team to team, because each of them sees his athletic promise, and believes they can unlock his potential, but it never really works out.  He has no natural position.  He's been unsuccessful as an outside pass rusher, either as a DE or an OLB.  He's not had success as a 3-technique.  Nor as an off linebacker.  At the end of the day, he's a tall, long, athletic guy.  And that's what is gonna be written on his tombstone.  Rousseau has the possibility of following that same path.  It's a risk.

While I agree Rousseau does have a bit of a boom/bust profile, I wouldn't compare him to Mingo. Rousseau is more prototypical at almost 270lbs. He's absolutely a 4-3 guy, whereas Mingo was sub 250 (barely 240), and nobody (nobody smart at least) really saw him as 4-3 DE. I don't think he ever played 3T. Every team he's been to he's been a OLB IIRC.

[stitches]

I wonder who the character concern guy is we are thinking about picking... I don't think it's Rousseau. Interestingly enough I haven't heard many players having character concerns this year - Ronnie Perkins? Micah Parsons? Kelvin Joseph? There are some minor things about Jaelan Phillips possibly having other interests than football... I don't know. The Kelvin Joseph thing is scary from what I've heard - I've heard him described as the guy with most character concerns in the last decade. I've heard people professionally talking draft make jokes about "if you knew you are getting Aaron Hernandez type of production, but in year 5 you know he's going to kill someone and go to jail, how low are you going to take him?"... That type of concern. He probably is off the board for us.