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How you feel about Ballards approach to FA


How you feel about Ballards approach to FA  

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  1. 1. How do you feel about Ballards approach to FA?

    • We are loaded in cash and have a team ready to make a run Ballard is asleep at the wheel (Angry)
      11
    • We have good draft picks that need to get paid, Ballard has built this team through the draft thus far, he will continue to do so. (Happy)
      84
    • Other, add your answer in the comments
      21


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Ballard isn’t going to pay B players A money. It’s really that simple. If a guy he felt was a A player had been in FA he probably would of tried to get him. I think we will probably find players via trade more then FA. Like Buckner and Wentz.

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breaking news colts win their division in the year 2030, we always knew if we were patient his method would work

I'd just like to point out that the Bucs hadn't even made the playoffs before 2020 under Licht's watch. Six years, five losing seasons, 14 games under .500. He drafted Noah Spence and Justin Evans in

This will probably ruffle some feathers, but I don’t think the Colts are close to being SB contenders yet and actually may take a step back in 2021.   I won’t disagree with you on Ballard be

 

 I believe his job description from Irsay is to maintain a winning team year in and year out.
 That means being really good at drafting then being very good at developing those players. 
If that gets you near or to the mountaintop on occasion that is Super.
 It has been a pretty decent FA period so far. I believe he is likely waiting out the time pre-draft to get the best pass rusher for the dollar he can, and that  will put us in a position to draft for the positions/players he most wants to add.
Grade B

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22 minutes ago, coltsfeva said:

  Average? Few playmakers? Are we watching the same team? Are not Darius Leonard, Bobby Okereke, Kenny Moore, Xavier Rhodes, Johnathan Taylor, Julian Blackman, Deforest Buckner, Grover Stewart, Quentin Nelson, Jack Doyle, Micheal Pittman and Neihem Hines playmakers?

   The Colts are above average in tackling and are well disciplined.

 Maybe they don’t have a “superstar receiver” (which may be a result of the play calling to spread the ball around), but their receivers are pretty solid.

  They have guys that haven’t reached their prime yet and if you consider guys coming back from injury (Mack, Campbell) and players getting another year’s experience and with a good draft, this team is far from average.

   

 

I was about to reply something similar about not having playmakers.  Plenty of playmakers on this team. I agree with the average part tho.  This team has been average or slightly above but that was bc we didn’t have a QB.  Rivers played well considering he was at the end but we all knew he didn’t have enough in the tank to do anything special. Now we have our guy.  Wentz has everything you could want in a QB.  I see a big jump coming from these younger players and a QB that can make plays.  Barring injuries, this team is about to step into contender status.  This team is now 2-3 players from being a serious threat. I think that will be covered with younger players already on the roster developing and these next two drafts. 

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I chose "Other." Mostly because it's not exclusive to FA...but also because disagreeing with Ballard’s FA/offseason approach does not equate to being some “angry” fan. You can definitely disagree without being angry. Being "angry" or upset implies that you are irrational.

 

Ballard likes the draft. So does every other NFL team. They all want to hit on draft picks or use them as capital to hit on other players. And these discussions always end up with people equating spending cap space to "sacrificing the future." The way teams manipulate the cap shows how much of a sacrifice there truly is (or isn't shall I say). Besides, you can't really sacrifice what you don't use anyways.

 

And due to the CBA structure with rookie deals (and just the general injury risk of football), the NFL actually now revolves around competitive windows. If you think your team has SB potential (like Reich has said), then you are just doing yourself a disservice by being prudent.

 

If you truly want to plan for long-term success in the future...either tank a season to get a top pick...or pony up draft capital to move up...and get a young QB in the draft and pray he’s elite. That’s really the only way you can actually plan for success in the future. Everything else is about maximizing competitive windows...rookie deals, player's primes, etc.

 

Also, we are still waiting for the proof that this way is the "right way." Going to take a lot more than winning (11) games against the weakest schedule in the NFL...and a WC weekend loss. They have Wentz now...so this season should serve as proof one way or the other.

 


 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 I believe his job description from Irsay is to maintain a winning team year in and year out.
 That means being really good at drafting then being very good at developing those players. 
If that gets you near or to the mountaintop on occasion that is Super.
 It has been a pretty decent FA period so far. I believe he is likely waiting out the time pre-draft to get the best pass rusher for the dollar he can, and that  will put us in a position to draft for the positions/players he most wants to add.
Grade B

Don't forget Irsay also said he wants to win three SB's in a row. 

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1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 I believe his job description from Irsay is to maintain a winning team year in and year out.
 That means being really good at drafting then being very good at developing those players. 
If that gets you near or to the mountaintop on occasion that is Super.
 It has been a pretty decent FA period so far. I believe he is likely waiting out the time pre-draft to get the best pass rusher for the dollar he can, and that  will put us in a position to draft for the positions/players he most wants to add.
Grade B

 

Irsay definitely has seemed to relax the job description a bit. Although, he did say that he believed the Colts were heading into a golden era of Colts football.

 

But in the past, Irsay lamented that they only won one SB with Manning. The famous "Star Wars" reference was a direct shot at the Manning era Colts teams being a winning team every year put up huge numbers but couldn't get to the mountaintop enough.

 

When Grigson showed up, he wanted to change that immediately. And they were very aggressive in quickly building a team.

 

But when Luck got hurt and Ballard was hired, Irsay definitely began to show much more patience.

 

I think Irsay just follows the lead of his top exec...and Ballard likes to preach patience and prudence. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

Don't forget Irsay also said he wants to win three SB's in a row. 


I never heard Irsay say that, but I know he was disappointed only getting one SB with Manning. And the Colts should have had 2-3 victories with Manning. 
 

I think that fueled a comment Irsay later said, after getting Luck, he expected more than one SB with Luck at the helm. 
 

The Colts don’t have that luxury at QB now. I certainly think you need an elite QB to do the unthinkable. (3 SB’s)

 

Is Wentz the guy? We’ll soon find out.

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12 hours ago, MPStack said:


Bucs GM Jason Litcht has done a really nice job since taking over a 2-14 Bucs team in 2014. And for the most part he has drafted well. 

 

I'd just like to point out that the Bucs hadn't even made the playoffs before 2020 under Licht's watch. Six years, five losing seasons, 14 games under .500. He drafted Noah Spence and Justin Evans in the 2nd (for all the 'Ballard misses 2nd rounders' folks), Roberto Aguayo in the 3rd (yes, a kicker). He has his hits, for sure, but before 2020, he was a mediocre GM with a mediocre record, over six seasons. And that's after drafting a would-be franchise QB.

 

Then Tom Brady comes to town, they win the SB, and now Jason Licht is the model GM in everyone's eyes, and we're nitpicking Chris Ballard because the Colts have only won one playoff game in four seasons.

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8 hours ago, ClaytonColt said:

We're too passive in free agency for my taste but it does seem to be a mindset amongst Colts fans to focus almost exclusively on drafting and resigning so perhaps its more of a "Colts" thing rather than a "Ballard" thing.

 

To me, focusing purely on the draft is difficult when the "lifespan" of a player career is so short and there's so many key positions in today's NFL. By the time you've got to a stage where you've filled all the holes the players at from the start of that process are past their peak, expensive or even retiring. 

 

Secondly you need to maximise on the use of resources and having a massive chunk of cap sat there puts us at a competitive disadvantage. 

 

When you advocate for being a bit more aggressive in free agency people seem to take it like you want to blow everything.....but there is a middle ground. You can't tell me that there aren't at least a couple of higher priced players available in free agency over these last few years that wouldn't have made better. So what's wrong with paying the market rate for them?

 

Exactly right. The "future" in the NFL isn't really a thing, unless you have an elite QB. But as Colts fans learned, even an elite QB can get hurt. Between injuries and the way the CBA is structured, teams should be looking to maximize competitive windows when they open.

 

And why does spending that cap space matter if that cap space never gets spent anyways. I would love to see the numbers since 2017 because I am sure there is a good chunk that went unspent. I am not saying they should have spent ALL of that money, but leaving a chunk on the table doesn't help the team...it only helps the bottom line. If that's just Ballard's way of doing it...fine then...but we should be able to critique that strategy over time.

 

I agree that there should definitely be a middle ground...but there's really not anymore when it comes to Ballard. If you want to be more aggressive in FA, you just want them to spend all the money on B/C players and stupidly risk the future. And when they don't, you are just an angry, irrational fan who doesn't listen to what Ballard says. Lots of condescension from Colts fans these days.

 

The perception is that if Ballard signed 3-4 depth players who likely won't start for $15M total...it's economical and smart. But if another player that would start was on the market for $15M and Ballard passed...it would be because he's not going to "pay a B or C player A money." Essentially, if Ballard won't sign a player, he's obviously overpaid. It's an appeal to authority. I mean...just look at how many Colts fans responded to Odum being upset about getting the original round tender. I saw a lot of "go out there and prove it" type comments. And that was an actual Colts player who had proved it.

 

 

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41 minutes ago, MPStack said:


I never heard Irsay say that, but I know he was disappointed only getting one SB with Manning. And the Colts should have had 2-3 victories with Manning. 
 

I think that fueled a comment Irsay later said, after getting Luck, he expected more than one SB with Luck at the helm. 
 

The Colts don’t have that luxury at QB now. I certainly think you need an elite QB to do the unthinkable. (3 SB’s)

 

Is Wentz the guy? We’ll soon find out.

 

True.

 

Irsay did say that the greatest team of all time would be one that wins 3 SBs in a row and of course he'd like the Colts to be that team. He just wanted multiple SBs for the Colts, whether it was Manning or Luck citing Star Wars numbers as not that important.

 

Star Wars numbers wasn't just a product of Peyton, also a product of Polian's drafting emphasis, pushing the chips all in behind the dome offense that only learnt to run the ball during 1 SB run with several first rounders for the offense (starting with Edge, Wayne, Clark, Addai, Gonzo, Brown) outside Peyton, that is 7 out of 14 years, half of his first rounders for the offense were for skill positions, let that sink in. Not to mention he already had Marvin Harrison, another first rounder on the roster when he took over as GM of the Colts. LT position with Tarik Glenn, Tony Ugoh and Anthony Castanzo were the only ones that warranted a first rounder for OL, that is 3 more 1st rounders. So, 4 times under his tenure, we went with defense - Freeney, Rob Morris, Marlin Jackson and Jerry Hughes.

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35 minutes ago, MPStack said:
42 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Don't forget Irsay also said he wants to win three SB's in a row. 


I never heard Irsay say that,

https://www.nfl.com/news/jim-irsay-goal-is-to-win-three-super-bowls-in-a-row-0ap3000001025166

 

"I really feel like this is a young team that's ascending," he said last week, via the Indy Star. "You guys know, I will unabashedly say, I'd like to win three in a row. How hard is it? I mean, it's hard as hell just to win one."

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18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I'd just like to point out that the Bucs hadn't even made the playoffs before 2020 under Licht's watch. Six years, five losing seasons, 14 games under .500. He drafted Noah Spence and Justin Evans in the 2nd (for all the 'Ballard misses 2nd rounders' folks), Roberto Aguayo in the 3rd (yes, a kicker). He has his hits, for sure, but before 2020, he was a mediocre GM with a mediocre record, over six seasons. And that's after drafting a would-be franchise QB.

 

Then Tom Brady comes to town, they win the SB, and now Jason Licht is the model GM in everyone's eyes, and we're nitpicking Chris Ballard because the Colts have only won one playoff game in four seasons.

 

Plus, when Tom Brady came, he did bring with him trusted guys in Gronk and AB that put them over the top, not to mention Fournette whose talent was well utilized after he went to Tampa. Let me see Brady win a SB without those in Tampa with just Evans and Godwin. It is the Brady effect, like Peyton drew Emmanuel Sanders, Talib, Ware, T J Ward to the Broncos in FA that helped them win the SB.

 

It is definitely more Brady than Licht that put them over the top, 100% and Brady chose them because he knew the base talent of a .500 team that just needed an elite QB with a few of his trusted pieces to put them over the top. Even then, they had to choose to do things the Brady way on offense to realize what it took to win after their bye week, with more intermediate passing and clock control.

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8 minutes ago, Dogg63 said:

https://www.nfl.com/news/jim-irsay-goal-is-to-win-three-super-bowls-in-a-row-0ap3000001025166

 

"I really feel like this is a young team that's ascending," he said last week, via the Indy Star. "You guys know, I will unabashedly say, I'd like to win three in a row. How hard is it? I mean, it's hard as hell just to win one."

 

In the same set of opinions, he put in his wishful thinking and realism. Of course he wants the sky for the Colts but knows he will end up settling for less even if it is just 1 SB win. :) 

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13 hours ago, Zoltan said:

This story that Bucs won the Super Bowl by FA is overblown. Aside from Tom Brady, mos

Why would we not count Tom Brady though??  He was a free agent, we probably should have gone after him ourselves

 

There were reports saying he was interested, I think he even said so directly 

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18 hours ago, MPStack said:

 

He’s a pretty good GM, but I do think he gets a little to much praise at times. 
 

1 playoff victory in 4 seasons. I’m sure if Luck was still QB things would be different, but that’s water under the bridge.

 

 

You mention the loss of Luck but say it is water under the bridge.    Ballard got dealt a crappy hand and I think he has moved on pretty well.   Gotta hope Wentz get back to form.  

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The trade for Wentz signaled to me that we are still trying to win it all now.  Just like last year when we signed an aging Rivers and traded for Buckner.  We passed on moving up for a QB with pick 13 and we did it again by trading for Wentz and keeping pick 21.  This is not a wait and see year to see how Wentz performs.  They feel Reich can get Wentz back to his old self immediately.  Just like last year with Rivers.  His interceptions plummeted.  It's amazing what a QB can do with a great OL and a few playmakers.  Even an old QB.  GM's and HC's don't have 10 year contracts to win a SB. There is only one I know of and that's getting a little precarious now.  Ballard has done a good job holding the key components from last years team to this years team.  Although Houston still sits out there.  With Wentz he should even be more anxious to add a couple of key missing pieces.  He was his old self in not spending big in FA.  So that leaves the draft and trades.  He could still surprise us with a trade of our 1st or 2nd pick for a ER for example like he did with Buckner last year.  And of course Ertz is still waiting in the wings.  I am of the belief that Ballard has a few more moves to make that might surprise us.  I don't think he is going to just count on the draft to save the day and the season.  Wentz can't be the only significant move.  Not after what he did last year with the Buckner trade.  I think there is more to come.  JMO

 

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5 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

The trade for Wentz signaled to me that we are still trying to win it all now.  Just like last year when we signed an aging Rivers and traded for Buckner.  We passed on moving up for a QB with pick 13 and we did it again by trading for Wentz and keeping pick 21.  This is not a wait and see year to see how Wentz performs.  They feel Reich can get Wentz back to his old self immediately.  Just like last year with Rivers.  His interceptions plummeted.  It's amazing what a QB can do with a great OL and a few playmakers.  Even an old QB.  GM's and HC's don't have 10 year contracts to win a SB. There is only one I know of and that's getting a little precarious now.  Ballard has done a good job holding the key components from last years team to this years team.  Although Houston still sits out there.  With Wentz he should even be more anxious to add a couple of key missing pieces.  He was his old self in not spending big in FA.  So that leaves the draft and trades.  He could still surprise us with a trade of our 1st or 2nd pick for a ER for example like he did with Buckner last year.  And of course Ertz is still waiting in the wings.  I am of the belief that Ballard has a few more moves to make that might surprise us.  I don't think he is going to just count on the draft to save the day and the season.  Wentz can't be the only significant move.  Not after what he did last year with the Buckner trade.  I think there is more to come.  JMO

 

 

I agree.

 

For all we know, it could be a trade back with the Browns to No.26 for a 4th rounder and Njoku, never know. :) 

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12 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

True.

 

Irsay did say that the greatest team of all time would be one that wins 3 SBs in a row. He just wanted multiple SBs for the Colts, whether it was Manning or Luck citing Star Wars numbers as not that important.

 

Star Wars numbers wasn't just a product of Peyton, also a product of Polian's drafting emphasis, pushing the chips all in behind the dome offense that only learnt to run the ball during 1 SB run with several first rounders for the offense (starting with Edge, Wayne, Clark, Addai, Gonzo, Brown) outside Peyton, that is 7 out of 14 years, half of his first rounders for the offense were for skill positions, let that sink in. Not to mention he already had Marvin Harrison, another first rounder on the roster when he took over as GM of the Colts. LT position with Tarik Glenn, Tony Ugoh and Anthony Castanzo were the only ones that warranted a first rounder for OL, that is 3 more 1st rounders. So, 4 times under his tenure, we went with defense - Freeney, Rob Morris, Marlin Jackson and Jerry Hughes.

 

Irsay's "Star Wars" comment was really dumb. It was a petty shot at Manning...after both had agreed to part ways. But it was also just wrong. But when he made that comment, I don't think it was the best time in his life...because his arrest occurred 6 months later. 

 

But Polian's offensive strategy was on point. He was way ahead of his time. He understood that the need for an explosive, quick strike offense and where the NFL was headed. And his team played in a dome...with potentially the GOAT QB. So he invested in pass catchers and playmakers. He also knew that HFA was huge for his team. 

 

He did have some blind spots when it came to the defense though. 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, BlackTiger said:

Why would we not count Tom Brady though??  He was a free agent, we probably should have gone after him ourselves

 

There were reports saying he was interested, I think he even said so directly 

 

It's not discounting Tom Brady, but he was one signing at the most important position in football. Which we also did last year in signing Phil Rivers. The overblown narrative I've seen is that the Bucs made all these moves in FA to get to the Super Bowl, when in reality they have made some great moves drafting playmakers on both sides of the ball, while making a few smart signings in FA. that even for tom Brady he wasn't overpaid

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I would have preferred he go grab a short term fix at LT and try to grab one in the draft.  That gives some flexibility to draft BPA and gives the rookie time to learn.  

 

I think without doing that Ballard is locked in that he has to get a LT in the first 2 rounds.  Otherwise Wentz could spend the whole season under pressure from his blind side.  

 

Other than that, it makes sense to save money and not be getting into any long term deals.  

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51 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I'd just like to point out that the Bucs hadn't even made the playoffs before 2020 under Licht's watch. Six years, five losing seasons, 14 games under .500. He drafted Noah Spence and Justin Evans in the 2nd (for all the 'Ballard misses 2nd rounders' folks), Roberto Aguayo in the 3rd (yes, a kicker). He has his hits, for sure, but before 2020, he was a mediocre GM with a mediocre record, over six seasons. And that's after drafting a would-be franchise QB.

 

Then Tom Brady comes to town, they win the SB, and now Jason Licht is the model GM in everyone's eyes, and we're nitpicking Chris Ballard because the Colts have only won one playoff game in four seasons.


I think you need to re-read my other post, because I’m pretty supportive of Ballard. 
 

There seem to be two opinions on this forum of Ballard. The first and far majority, are the ones who post like Ballard can do know wrong and walks on water. Every trade, every move he makes is awesome. The second group are the Debbie downers who “nitpick” because Ballard does not sign big name FA’s.

 

Well, I’m neither Sir. I’d like to think I’m pretty fair and balanced with Ballard.

 

As far as Licht, I wouldn’t minimize anything thing he’s done, cuz he’s got a Lombardi. His approach has simply been different than Ballard’s. End of story. It is what it is! 

 

 

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42 minutes ago, Myles said:

You mention the loss of Luck but say it is water under the bridge.    Ballard got dealt a crappy hand and I think he has moved on pretty well.   Gotta hope Wentz get back to form.  


I think if you read through my post, I pretty much stated, it has not been an ideal situation to have three different starting QB’s in 4 years. If, Luck was still the QB, I think the Colts would’ve be even better. 
 

Ballard’s tenure has been unique for sure.

 

I will try to be more kind and gentle with my future comments regarding Ballard, even though I thought I was pretty fair and supportive. 
 

 


 

 

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As a fan, of course I wish we would have signed a few more key pieces. We didn't and that is OK.

 

I have seen a lot of "We are either the same or worse" comments because we lost Autry and Castonzo and replaced Rivers w Wentz when you compare this coming year to last year.

 

However, we have a few things going for us to make us better this year even before our draft.

 

- Taylor, Pittman, Blackmon, etc are one more year wiser to what it is like to be a Pro and will have full years starting compared to the learning and growing curves of last year

 

- If (big IF) Campbell can stay healthy, he is a huge huge weapon that we have not seen yet. His potential is right there up w most of the FA WRs we could have signed to make an immediate impact

 

- Wentz, at the minimum, adds some mobility and some RPO options we did not have last year and he has the arm to utilize Hilton's attributes better than Rivers last year

 

My offensive outlook is probably better than defensive improvements.

 

A full year of Okereke starting is probably a slight upgrade to Walker. Hopefully we can acquire some additional depth in the secondary and Rowe and team can work hand usage w Rock to get the best out of him. I have not given up on Ya Sin yet. He just needs to cut the hand penalties down.

 

Sure we still need help at Edge. And yes we still need a viable LT.

 

But there are options still out there. It is not "we must get our LT and Edge right away in the draft or else we are doomed".

 

Some of these older LTs may have to wait until after the draft to get a contract.

 

Villanueva and Okung are still out there and might still be after the draft if we do not hit a LT we love.

 

If the staff is really considering moving someone like Braden Smith or Q to LT (I hope not, but still), then there are other RT types out there like Schwartz and Massie who could be decent RTs if for some reason we thought Smith was the answer at LT (again I would not move him, but just saying there are options).

 

Edge is a little less ideal, but still have Houston, Vernon, Kerrigan, Ingram, Clowney, Aldon Smith all out there.

 

My only point is that some of these guys will likely still be unsigned after the Draft and if we are still weak at some of these positions we could be a good match for them and the cost will continue to drop the longer they remain out there.

 

All in all it has been a quiet FA period but a solid off-season where we really did not suffer any critical losses other than AC's retirement.

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2 minutes ago, MPStack said:


I think you need to re-read my other post, because I’m pretty supportive of Ballard. 
 

There seem to be two opinions on this forum of Ballard. The first and far majority, are the ones who post like Ballard can do know wrong and walks on water. Every trade, every move he makes is awesome. The second group are the Debbie downers who “nitpick” because Ballard does not sign big name FA’s.

 

Well, I’m neither Sir. I’d like to think I’m pretty fair and balanced with Ballard.

 

As far as Licht, I wouldn’t minimize anything thing he’s done, cuz he’s got a Lombardi. His approach has simply been different than Ballard’s. End of story. It is what it is! 

 

This is a gross mischaracterization, and it's common in this thread and on this board. It's much easier to argue against the extremes, so the strawman gets propped up to be knocked down.

 

My point was very simple. Jason Licht is now being used as a model GM, when his team had achieved zero successes through six seasons of his oversight. He signed a few FAs in 2020, they won the SB, so now there's no room to talk about his underwhelming first six seasons? It's not minimizing anything he's done to say that he had no success for SIX YEARS prior to Tom Brady, and you can define "success" by any reasonable metric and that comment holds true. (I also think it's going to be interesting if the Bucs struggle in 2021, and now have a ton of future cap tied into players past their primes.)

 

Compared to Ballard, whose team has been to the playoffs twice in four years, despite the QB carousel, including an 11 win season in 2020 that a lot of people seem to be turning their noses up at lately. Through four years, Licht's Bucs were far behind Ballard's Colts. That perspective is lacking in this discussion right now.

 

My point was not that every trade/move Ballard makes is awesome, I am not propping him up as a messiah, and I have openly disagreed with plenty of Ballard's moves over the last four seasons. Still, I think he's done a good job so far. And as I've always said, my expectations are adjusted due to time and circumstance. We're going into Year 5 with Ballard. He needs to produce a winning program, consistently. Which, as long as we've had decent QBing, has been the case, btw.

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11 minutes ago, MPStack said:


I think if you read through my post, I pretty much stated, it has not been an ideal situation to have three different starting QB’s in 4 years. If, Luck was still the QB, I think the Colts would’ve be even better. 
 

Ballard’s tenure has been unique for sure.

 

I will try to be more kind and gentle with my future comments regarding Ballard, even though I thought I was pretty fair and supportive. 
 

 


 

 

I was not clear enough.   My bad.  I meant to go in a different direction but must have gotten tunnel vision.   

I meant to say that lots of people who badmouth Ballards record ignore the fact that he was dealt a crappy hand with the Luck injury and retirement.   Ballard did come in and quickly fixed the O-line for Luck.   

 

Yes, if Luck would have stayed, the Colts would have a few playoff wins and be in better shape.  

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1 hour ago, shasta519 said:

 

He also knew that HFA was huge for his team. 

 

He did have some blind spots when it came to the defense though. 

 

 

Our trenches were outmanned, just like his Buffalo Bills teams, that was a consistent pattern. Plus, we had HFA in 2005 and 2009, if I remember right and had 1 SB appearance to show for it. Instead, I wish he built a team that could win on the road consistently in different ways instead of betting on HFA all the time on the heels of a pass first offense. Neglecting special teams quality players that impacted field position factors was another HUGE black spot on his resume as Colts GM. 

 

Even Mahomes and his hot #1 offense couldn't find breathing room to operate without OL trench support. You can say Polian was way ahead of his time but history repeatedly has shown that clock control on offense and key 3rd down defense has won in the playoffs consistently. That is also why Polian's teams were 1-5 in SBs, IMO, due to trench weaknesses. We may have a fad for a few years that gets us enamored with offense (thank you fantasy football) but eventually, the complete team construction will prevail. But when the few breaks do go in your favor, you need that elite QB to cash in.

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3 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

This is a gross mischaracterization, and it's common in this thread and on this board. It's much easier to argue against the extremes, so the strawman gets propped up to be knocked down.

 

My point was very simple. Jason Licht is now being used as a model GM, when his team had achieved zero successes through six seasons of his oversight. He signed a few FAs in 2020, they won the SB, so now there's no room to talk about his underwhelming first six seasons? It's not minimizing anything he's done to say that he had no success for SIX YEARS prior to Tom Brady, and you can define "success" by any reasonable metric and that comment holds true. (I also think it's going to be interesting if the Bucs struggle in 2021, and now have a ton of future cap tied into players past their primes.)

 

Compared to Ballard, whose team has been to the playoffs twice in four years, despite the QB carousel, including an 11 win season in 2020 that a lot of people seem to be turning their noses up at lately. Through four years, Licht's Bucs were far behind Ballard's Colts. That perspective is lacking in this discussion right now.

 

My point was not that every trade/move Ballard makes is awesome, I am not propping him up as a messiah, and I have openly disagreed with plenty of Ballard's moves over the last four seasons. Still, I think he's done a good job so far. And as I've always said, my expectations are adjusted due to time and circumstance. We're going into Year 5 with Ballard. He needs to produce a winning program, consistently. Which, as long as we've had decent QBing, has been the case, btw.

chicago fire GIF by NBC

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14 hours ago, Zoltan said:

 

This story that Bucs won the Super Bowl by FA is overblown. Aside from Tom Brady, most of their starting players and playmakers were drafted, only two starters were FA pick ups on defense (Suh, and JPP) then on offense it's 4 (Stinnie, Jensen, Brady, Gronk or Brown depending on two TE set or 3 WR).

 

 

 

Well man, isn't a 3rd of the starters a pretty large percentage?

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31 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Our trenches were outmanned, just like his Buffalo Bills teams, that was a consistent pattern. Plus, we had HFA in 2005 and 2009, if I remember right and had 1 SB appearance to show for it. Instead, I wish he built a team that could win on the road consistently in different ways instead of betting on HFA all the time on the heels of a pass first offense. Neglecting special teams quality players that impacted field position factors was another HUGE black spot on his resume as Colts GM. 

 

Even Mahomes and his hot #1 offense couldn't find breathing room to operate without OL trench support. You can say Polian was way ahead of his time but history repeatedly has shown that clock control on offense and key 3rd down defense has won in the playoffs consistently. That is also why Polian's teams were 1-5 in SBs, IMO, due to trench weaknesses. We may have a fad for a few years that gets us enamored with offense (thank you fantasy football) but eventually, the complete team construction will prevail. But when the few breaks do go in your favor, you need that elite QB to cash in.

 

Meh, if the Norwood doesn't miss and the Colts recover the onside v. NO, then he'd be 3-2.  Plus, NO was certainly an offensively minded team when they beat us.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

Meh, if the Norwood doesn't miss and the Colts recover the onside v. NO, then he'd be 3-2.  Plus, NO was certainly an offensively minded team when they beat us.

 

 

Vanderjacht miss I believe? Not 100% sure.   Norwood was the poor Bills kicker to live in infamy. 

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1 hour ago, MPStack said:


I think you need to re-read my other post, because I’m pretty supportive of Ballard. 
 

There seem to be two opinions on this forum of Ballard. The first and far majority, are the ones who post like Ballard can do know wrong and walks on water. Every trade, every move he makes is awesome. The second group are the Debbie downers who “nitpick” because Ballard does not sign big name FA’s.

 

Well, I’m neither Sir. I’d like to think I’m pretty fair and balanced with Ballard.

 

As far as Licht, I wouldn’t minimize anything thing he’s done, cuz he’s got a Lombardi. His approach has simply been different than Ballard’s. End of story. It is what it is! 

 

 

 

I think there is a very much a "wait and see" contingent of fans. Maybe not a big one...but that's where I am. I am also in an even smaller contingent who actually gives Grigson a modicum of credit, even if I didn't like the guy.

 

And I actually like Ballard...he's a very likable guy. He is very PR savvy. I think he's also a good GM. There are parts of his approach and moves I really like...and there are some I don't.

 

But mostly, I just don't care for the lack of objectivity that now exists on Colts discussion forums (and among the vast majority of the fanbase). And this has extended into the local media as well. It is difficult to have a debate about moves anymore.

 

And some of these comments I read about Ballard sound like parodies of crazed Ballard fans...but they aren't. Maybe this is how it is with other teams...but I doubt it. You have GMs who have won SBs that don't seem to get the same adoration...and they definitely get much more criticism. It's almost as if Ballard has become the face of the franchise.

 

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1 hour ago, Nickster said:

 

Well man, isn't a 3rd of the starters a pretty large percentage?

Not really when you look how they are spread out 2 signed in 2018, 2 signed in 2019, then 2 signed in 2020

When you compare the Colts had 3 starters claimed from waivers (Glowinski, Moore, Pascal in the slot), and 4 starters from FA (Houston, Autry, Rhodes and Rivers)

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8 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

Not really when you look how they are spread out 2 signed in 2018, 2 signed in 2019, then 2 signed in 2020

When you compare the Colts had 3 starters claimed from waivers (Glowinski, Moore, Pascal in the slot), and 4 starters from FA (Houston, Autry, Rhodes and Rivers)

 

I stand corrected.  It seemed like a lot to me plus Fournette.

 

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8 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

Not really when you look how they are spread out 2 signed in 2018, 2 signed in 2019, then 2 signed in 2020

When you compare the Colts had 3 starters claimed from waivers (Glowinski, Moore, Pascal in the slot), and 4 starters from FA (Houston, Autry, Rhodes and Rivers)

Those were all pretty good though.  

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1 hour ago, Nickster said:

 

Meh, if the Norwood doesn't miss and the Colts recover the onside v. NO, then he'd be 3-2.  Plus, NO was certainly an offensively minded team when they beat us.

 

 

It is not being offensively minded that is the problem, NO was top 7 in passing offense and top 6 in rushing offense that year (Colts were last in rushing, again reinforcing the points I made) and top 3 in INTs and top in INT TDs and top 6 in fumbles recovered. In other words, balance, something that was lacking in Polian's teams to the point of one phase being a liability. Special teams from Hester's opening kickoff TD to Basket''s muffed onside kick recovery reinforces how much it was a negative factor, and one was overcome, the other was not, those are just SB examples, plenty more I can find in regular seasons and playoffs. Quality of opposing QB was the big difference with Brees and the Saints possessing the ball more vs Grossman not doing much against us. Norwood SB, Giants possessed the ball for 42 minutes, just like the Saints held the ball considerably against us.

 

Polian's teams' mistakes kept being repeated, plenty of history to look at.

 

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13 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

It is not being offensively minded that is the problem, NO was top 7 in passing offense and top 6 in rushing offense that year (Colts were last in rushing, again reinforcing the points I made) and top 3 in INTs and top in INT TDs and top 6 in fumbles recovered. In other words, balance, something that was lacking in Polian's teams to the point of one phase being a liability. Special teams from Hester's opening kickoff TD to Basket''s muffed onside kick recovery reinforces how much it was a negative factor, and one was overcome, the other was not, those are just SB examples, plenty more I can find in regular seasons and playoffs. Quality of opposing QB was the big difference with Brees and the Saints possessing the ball more vs Grossman not doing much against us. Norwood SB, Giants possessed the ball for 42 minutes, just like the Saints held the ball considerably against us.

 

Polian's teams' mistakes kept being repeated, plenty of history to look at.

 

 

I hear you man.  But making 6 SBs in about 15 yrs is pretty good.  I didn't like the Colts refusal to come out of Cover 2 regardless of what was going on in the games.  I don't think the Colts had the greatest of coaching staffs.  Dungy's Tampa 2 worked really good with John Lynch, Warren Sapp, and the great great great Derrick Brooks covering the deep middle like a safety.  Caldwell was Dungy Lite IMO.

 

And Manning choked in a lot of big moments.

 

  And Polian's Buffalo teams had superb defensive players, and a fantastic running game.

 

So although I don't necessarily disagree with all of your points, I don't think your data point of losing 4 of 5 SBs is very effective.

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7 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

So although I don't necessarily disagree with all of your points, I don't think your data point of losing 5 of 6 SBs is very effective.

 

That is just the end result. How they got there and where the teams failed is what I was trying to get at with Polian's teams. Having a Jim Kelly and Peyton Manning is nice, ask anyone, they don't come around too often. :) 

 

I feel Ballard's approach to a trench centric build, when paired with an elite QB will bear more fruits come playoff time at time goes on. He just has not had the QB stability he would have liked. Life hadn't been fair for Ballard but no one is crying for us, for sure.

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5 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

That is just the end result. How they got there and where the teams failed is what I was trying to get at with Polian's teams. Having a Jim Kelly and Peyton Manning is nice, ask anyone, they don't come around too often. :) 

 

I feel Ballard's approach to a trench centric build, when paired with an elite QB will bear more fruits come playoff time at time goes on. He just has not had the QB stability he would have liked. Life hadn't been fair for Ballard but no one is crying for us, for sure.

Jim Kelly = The U

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1 hour ago, Myles said:

Those were all pretty good though.  

Yeah they are and just like the Buccaneers they are also spread out not all in one Free agency, slowly adding a few FA when it makes sense to fill holes but focusing on truly building the team through the draft.  you can't trap yourself in the thinking that more always mean better, because as we all know teams that do a lot of FA signings historically have a losing record. 

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