Jump to content
Indianapolis Colts
Indianapolis Colts Fan Forum

Recommended Posts

Stephen Holder wrote an article on Leonard extension on the Athletic.

 

I don't have access, but a few key notes from article.

 

1. Colts surely are looking at locking him up this offseason.

2. Probably looking at $17-18m a season

3. If we don't lock him up this offseason, it increases the chances he leaves after rookie deal. Although we would have a Franchise Tag option if long term couldn't be agreed upon.

 

https://theathletic.com/2422770/2021/03/03/colts-darius-leonard-decision-a-massive-payday-now-or-wait-until-later/?source=emp_shared_article

 

 

As far Leonard, I know its been discussed, what does his extension look like? Will he leave when he can, if not signed?

 

 

Going to change my projection a little from offseason mock:

 

Darius Leonard:(5 years(raise in 2021) $71.3m $49.3m guaranteed $25m SB (2021/22/23 base,))

2021:$3.42m base, $838k SB, $5m SB = $9.3m ~ guaranteed

2022:$10m base, $5m SB = $15m ~ guaranteed

2023: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m ~ guaranteed

2024: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m

2025: $10m base $5m SB = $15m

 

 

I think something like this could get close.

 

The $5m extra in 2021, then $15.5m/season after and $25m upfront. $67m in new money.

 

Is that something Colts fans fell ok about?

 

I know I feel pretty good about it. 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, w87r said:

Stephen Holder wrote an article on Leonard extension on the Athletic.

 

I don't have access, but a few key notes from article.

 

1. Colts surely are looking at locking him up this offseason.

2. Probably looking at $17-18m a season

3. If we don't lock him up this offseason, it increases the chances he leaves after rookie deal. Although we would have a Franchise Tag option if long term couldn't be agreed upon.

 

https://theathletic.com/2422770/2021/03/03/colts-darius-leonard-decision-a-massive-payday-now-or-wait-until-later/?source=emp_shared_article

 

 

As far Leonard, I know its been discussed, what does his extension look like? Will he leave when he can, if not signed?

 

 

Going to change my projection a little from offseason mock:

 

Darius Leonard:(5 years(raise in 2021) $71.3m $49.3m guaranteed $25m SB (2021/22/23 base,))

2021:$3.42m base, $838k SB, $5m SB = $9.3m ~ guaranteed

2022:$10m base, $5m SB = $15m ~ guaranteed

2023: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m ~ guaranteed

2024: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m

2025: $10m base $5m SB = $15m

 

 

I think something like this could get close.

 

The $5m extra in 2021, then $15.5m/season after and $25m upfront. $67m in new money.

 

Is that something Colts fans fell ok about?

 

I know I feel pretty good about it. 

I’d take it

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, w87r said:

Stephen Holder wrote an article on Leonard extension on the Athletic.

 

I don't have access, but a few key notes from article.

 

1. Colts surely are looking at locking him up this offseason.

2. Probably looking at $17-18m a season

3. If we don't lock him up this offseason, it increases the chances he leaves after rookie deal. Although we would have a Franchise Tag option if long term couldn't be agreed upon.

 

https://theathletic.com/2422770/2021/03/03/colts-darius-leonard-decision-a-massive-payday-now-or-wait-until-later/?source=emp_shared_article

 

 

As far Leonard, I know its been discussed, what does his extension look like? Will he leave when he can, if not signed?

 

 

Going to change my projection a little from offseason mock:

 

Darius Leonard:(5 years(raise in 2021) $71.3m $49.3m guaranteed $25m SB (2021/22/23 base,))

2021:$3.42m base, $838k SB, $5m SB = $9.3m ~ guaranteed

2022:$10m base, $5m SB = $15m ~ guaranteed

2023: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m ~ guaranteed

2024: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m

2025: $10m base $5m SB = $15m

 

 

I think something like this could get close.

 

The $5m extra in 2021, then $15.5m/season after and $25m upfront. $67m in new money.

 

Is that something Colts fans fell ok about?

 

I know I feel pretty good about it. 

Thanks so much for doing this. 
 

As you might expect, I have questions...
 

Your #2 take away is Leonard will get $17-18m per.   But your breakdown of your proposed contract looks to me like $14.25m per year.   5 years, $71.3m.

 

Can you explain the discrepancy?

 

I don’t know if Leonard will reach $17-18m, but I feel DL will likely reach $15-16m per. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Wish we had players that would take a lot less so we can sign better players to win more.. like Tom did.. totally understand why they want to get as much as possible tho. Like it would be dope if Leonard and nelson took a cut just to help the colts out! Man can only dream!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bottom line is when you have players, especially young players that are top 5 at their positions they need to be re-signed even if it cost a lot. Otherwise you will never have a good team just getting rid of all your good-great players. Leonard is top 5 at his position and I believe Nelson is the best Guard in Football. Both need to be re-signed to long term deals like Kelly was.

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, tweezy32 said:

Wish we had players that would take a lot less so we can sign better players to win more.. like Tom did.. totally understand why they want to get as much as possible tho. Like it would be dope if Leonard and nelson took a cut just to help the colts out! Man can only dream!

i dont agree

  • Thanks 2
  • Confused 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, tweezy32 said:

Wish we had players that would take a lot less so we can sign better players to win more.. like Tom did.. totally understand why they want to get as much as possible tho. Like it would be dope if Leonard and nelson took a cut just to help the colts out! Man can only dream!

Most of it is their agents. Their agent gets the player the best deal money wise and their agent gets a % of that deal. Agents can be greedy but that is how they make their money. In other words lets say to someone like Aaron Rodgers 30 Mill a year compared to 25 Mill just to help his team win may not seem like much but to the agent it is. The agent would be losing a couple of Mill by Aaron agreeing to take less money. In Tom's case he could care less, he has earned over 200,000,000 mill in his career and his wife even makes more than he does.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

As of right now the top OLB makes $18 million a year.  Leonard is good but is he great enough to command close to $18 million or more?  I can see maybe around $16.5 million a season deal being made.

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Thanks so much for doing this. 
 

As you might expect, I have questions...
 

Your #2 take away is Leonard will get $17-18m per.   But your breakdown of your proposed contract looks to me like $14.25m per year.   5 years, $71.3m.

 

Can you explain the discrepancy?

 

I don’t know if Leonard will reach $17-18m, but I feel DL will likely reach $15-16m per. 

Because his new money is 4yrs $67m(including $5m 2021 raise)

 

 

Which is a $16.75m a year. (4yrs $62m + $5m in 2021)

 

 

The 2021 number doesn't reflect that figure, but he is getting a raise there of $5m for agreeing to deal, with additional $20m more in signing bonus as well.

 

 

And just because the article said $17-$18m doesn't mean that is what he will get, but like I said my offer puts it at $16.75m per if you add the extra $5m he will yet in 2021 to the 4 new years numbers.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Regardless of the final number, the Colts will not let Leonard get on the open market. He's uber talented, the spiritual leader of the D, and, along with Q, the most important player on the team. Whatever he finally costs, he'll be worth it. Trust me, Ballard has already factored all of this into the cap equation. 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Hoose said:

Regardless of the final number, the Colts will not let Leonard get on the open market. He's uber talented, the spiritual leader of the D, and, along with Q, the most important player on the team. Whatever he finally costs, he'll be worth it. Trust me, Ballard has already factored all of this into the cap equation. 

good post hoose. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, w87r said:

As far Leonard, I know its been discussed, what does his extension look like? Will he leave when he can, if not signed?

 

 

Going to change my projection a little from offseason mock:

 

Darius Leonard:(5 years(raise in 2021) $71.3m $49.3m guaranteed $25m SB (2021/22/23 base,))

2021:$3.42m base, $838k SB, $5m SB = $9.3m ~ guaranteed

2022:$10m base, $5m SB = $15m ~ guaranteed

2023: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m ~ guaranteed

2024: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m

2025: $10m base $5m SB = $15m

 

 

I think something like this could get close.

 

The $5m extra in 2021, then $15.5m/season after and $25m upfront. $67m in new money.

 

Is that something Colts fans fell ok about?

 

I know I feel pretty good about it. 

Always impressed with your thought process, research and figures when it comes to salaries and the CAP.  Thank you.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, OhioColt said:

As of right now the top OLB makes $18 million a year.  Leonard is good but is he great enough to command close to $18 million or more?  I can see maybe around $16.5 million a season deal being made.

The way nfl free agency works yes he is.

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, w87r said:

Darius Leonard:(5 years(raise in 2021) $71.3m $49.3m guaranteed $25m SB (2021/22/23 base,))

2021:$3.42m base, $838k SB, $5m SB = $9.3m ~ guaranteed

2022:$10m base, $5m SB = $15m ~ guaranteed

2023: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m ~ guaranteed

2024: $12m base, $5m SB = $17m

2025: $10m base $5m SB = $15m

 

 

I think something like this could get close.

 

The $5m extra in 2021, then $15.5m/season after and $25m upfront. $67m in new money.

 

My only nitpick is that the Colts don't like big signing bonuses. That makes it hard to do a big money deal with a low Year 1 cap hit.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, OhioColt said:

As of right now the top OLB makes $18 million a year.  Leonard is good but is he great enough to command close to $18 million or more?  I can see maybe around $16.5 million a season deal being made.

OLB money is a bit convoluted, because that includes 3-4 OLBs, who are edge rushers and typically are paid more than off-line LBs. In previous interviews when asked about his position, he's referred to himself as an ILB, which I think is a little more appropriate. Although Bobby Wagner is sitting at $18M AAV, so I'd say your point is still accurate.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Your #2 take away is Leonard will get $17-18m per.   But your breakdown of your proposed contract looks to me like $14.25m per year.   5 years, $71.3m.

 

He responded already, but the key is $67m in "new money," divided by four additional years = $16.75m average. That's how these contracts get reported and ranked, even though it doesn't work that way on the cap.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

He responded already, but the key is $67m in "new money," divided by four additional years = $16.75m average. That's how these contracts get reported and ranked, even though it doesn't work that way on the cap.

Why is it that they report it like that? Is it because the cap is always uncertain?

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Why is it that they report it like that? Is it because the cap is always uncertain?

 

Because contract details are generally leaked by agents, who like to present the details in the best light possible.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Because contract details are generally leaked by agents, who like to present the details in the best light possible.

Ah that makes a lot of sense, thanks Supe!

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, w87r said:

Because his new money is 4yrs $67m(including $5m 2021 raise)

 

 

Which is a $16.75m a year. (4yrs $62m + $5m in 2021)

 

 

The 2021 number doesn't reflect that figure, but he is getting a raise there of $5m for agreeing to deal, with additional $20m more in signing bonus as well.

 

 

And just because the article said $17-$18m doesn't mean that is what he will get, but like I said my offer puts it at $16.75m per if you add the extra $5m he will yet in 2021 to the 4 new years numbers.

If I understand correctly, it’s almost win-win.

 

The player and agent can claim 16.75 based on new money.    But the team can claim 14.25 by factoring in the current 4th year which will still exist, though sweetened a bit with $$$.   Good for both sides. 
 

Is this a fair viewpoint? 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

My only nitpick is that the Colts don't like big signing bonuses. That makes it hard to do a big money deal with a low Year 1 cap hit.

I wasn't going to do a SB because I know that is not really Ballards MO,  but for this instance, I figured it made sense here as I was giving Leonard a bump in pay this year anyway so that $5m could just tie into the SB, and the potential of receiving a big chunk up front might entice Leonard to take the deal. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

If I understand correctly, it’s almost win-win.

 

The player and agent can claim 16.75 based on new money.    But the team can claim 14.25 by factoring in the current 4th year which will still exist, though sweetened a bit with $$$.   Good for both sides. 
 

Is this a fair viewpoint? 

Yeah pretty accurate assumption.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah. I don't think I would ever love a record setting off-ball LB contract, but it's not like we can let him go... :dunno: It has to be done plus he deserves a big payday... 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

If we didn’t sign him this offseason, assuming we didn’t implode next year, I doubt he’d leave. We would offer him at least as much as most other teams, and he seems like he really likes it here. He doesn’t strike me as the kind of guy who’s looking to bail.

 

The only other team I could ever fathom DL playing for is Carolina, since that’s where he’s from

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

The way nfl free agency works yes he is.

Can tell we are all getting old when get more excited and flash back to your tag line of Ric Flair woo.  I can still remember back in the 80's when Irsay would come out to the boonies for his private birthday bashes a few weeks prior to his actual b-day and have Colt's players and some cheerleaders gathered around camp fire listening to music.  Fast forward to 1999 when the Colts moved their training camp to Terre Haute and remember Manning showing up at the local bar wearing his pink sweatsuit while the Edge would take a taxi cab from Indy to Terre Haute because of his fears.

 

Long live the Die-Hard Colts Fans

Link to post
Share on other sites

I was thinking about starting a new thread but, this video not only convinced me of keeping him but shows a few things:

What a special player he is

    Great recovery speed, ball-stripping/punching technique, football intelligence and humility. Pretty amazing stuff

 

  

How well the Colts are coached

  Darius made reference to the communication on the field between players and the ball security techniques that Rathman taught and how it influenced him, to be able to get turnovers . It’s a good example of something I’ve never thought about; how the good coaching of one coach (Rathman) can influence the play of players on the opposite side of the ball.

 

  The influence of Luck and Rivers

   Although he didn’t credit Rivers directly, he did mention Luck. I assumed he learned stuff from Rivers as well. 
 

  It’s Ron Jaworski and Brian Balldinger. A good watch.

 

  

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, coltsfeva said:

I was thinking about starting a new thread but, this video not only convinced me of keeping him but shows a few things:

What a special player he is

    Great recovery speed, ball-stripping/punching technique, football intelligence and humility. Pretty amazing stuff

 

  

How well the Colts are coached

  Darius made reference to the communication on the field between players and the ball security techniques that Rathman taught and how it influenced him, to be able to get turnovers . It’s a good example of something I’ve never thought about; how the good coaching of one coach (Rathman) can influence the play of players on the opposite side of the ball.

 

  The influence of Luck and Rivers

   Although he didn’t credit Rivers directly, he did mention Luck. I assumed he learned stuff from Rivers as well. 
 

  It’s Ron Jaworski and Brian Balldinger. A good watch.

 

  

 

At 7:12, Jaws says to Leonard, “You’re fortunate to have one of the real, young stars of this league. You guys will be together for another decade. How has it helped you working every day against a competitor like Andrew Luck?”

 

:facepalm:

  • Sad 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Thread of the Week

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • I'd love to watch the game from that pool.....over 50% in attendance always Colts fans anyway there, might as well take over their pool too....lol
    • I do think its weird how this Julio Jones chatter keeps staying attached to us
    • Between Canada and the USA?   I usually drive to Montréal twice a year and was planning on Quebec last summer ....   hopefully this summer.  
    • If Doyle doesn’t retire already had him being cut saving the Colts $5.45 million against the cap next season.  A replacement in FA would be TE Dallas Goedert (Eagles).  In Round 1 am projecting TE Jalen Wydermyer from Texas A&M to be a target.   Both Rhodes and Carrie I project to be unsigned.  RCB Rasul Douglas (Raiders) would be a backup RCB might be a target.  If we had the cap space RCB Darious Williams (Rams) went UDFA to NFL star 11m valuation (15m easily).  Still hold out on adding FS Marcus Williams (Saints) who is playing on a 10.6m tag.  Should get around 4yr/60m 35m guaranteed.   In the end I doubt the Colts sign any of these options and focus on the draft.   I like the Sam Tevi addition and think the Colts got a steal of a deal for him.  Am hoping Fisher is healthy and can start by week 5 giving the Colts an option to trade Tevi to a team that just drafted a rookie LT that is struggling or got injured and need trade capital.  See Will Holden as our 3rd LT and Davenport getting released during cut downs.  One idea is to sign Fisher to his one year contract this year and use additional capital to go after someone younger like RT Brian O’Neill (Vikings).  Was very high on O’Neill coming out of college as a LT.  O’Neill and Smith are two of the best players currently playing RT that moved from original college positions and have flourished.  O’Neill would be a long-shot addition but would create options to mix-n-match scenarios here.  Either way by not drafting a rookie OL that can start we are going to be financially hurting I believe next off-season unless we cut players like Doyle and Stewart with a Post-June 1 designation.  I don’t see the Colts being aggressive next off-season in Free Agency but below is an early look to next off-season have been working on.   FA Adds RT Brian O’Neill (move to LT) 4yr/64m 16m APY with 30m guaranteed.  Option 2: resign Fisher with 2 year extension 12m/15m   Cut IDL Grover Stewart – save 8.125m or 9.378m June 1 Cut TE Jack Doyle – save 5.45m   Resign/Extend LB Darius Leonard -not a true MLB. My original offer 5 years $82.5 million 40m guaranteed  RT Braden Smith 4/58m 30m guaranteed LG Nelson 5 years $85 million (17m) = 15m, 16m, 17m, 18m, 19m – top LG makes 14.781m / yr TE Mo Allie-Cox 3yr/20.8 or 6.93 APY (5.5-6.8-8.5)  WR Zach Pascal 3/24 8m APY (5.4-8.6-10)  LDE Tyquan Lewis 3/11.4m 3.8m APY (2.2m, 3.8m, 5.4m)  RB Nyheim Hines 3yr/13.645m (4.55m APY) (base 3.9m, 4.5m 5.65m with 1.35m roster bonus each year) Similar to A. Eckler  DE Kemoko Turay 1/2m  LT Will Holden 1/1.4m 1 C Joey Hunt 1/1.25m 9 RG/LG Chris Reed (OTC eval 6.3m backup capable of 13.4m pay play) signed for 1.127m renew 1/1.75m RG Glowinski 2yr/18m DE Al-Quadin Muhammad 1yr/4m 12.063m cap space IDL Isaac Rochell 2/3-3.5m 9.063m cap space   2022 Early Draft    Edge Kayvon Thibodeaux, Edge, Oregon RD 1 Drake Jackson, Edge, USC – or LB good 2019 RD 1 Myjai Sanders, EDGE, Cincinnati – all day every day good hand moves and pass deflections RD 2 George Karlaftis III, DL, Purdue – solid 2019 7.5 sacks 1 FF 2 PDs – great field awareness hands for Ints Aidan Hutchinson, IDL, Michigan 2019 only decent year 4.5 sacks 2 FFs 6 PDs.  6’6” 269 LBS.  Great catch-up speed RD 2-3   CB   Derek Stingley JR, CB, LSU – career year in 2019 6 INTs and 15 PDs.  Low 2020 but FF RD 1 Kaiir Elam, CB, Florida – low tkls, 2-3 INTs/yr improved 2020 with 11 PDs RD 1-2 Ahmad Gardner, CB, Cincinnati – 3 INTs each year 2020/2019 and 6-8 PDs RD 1 Roger McCreary, CB, Auburn – 1 FF capable of INTs and decent at PDs 6/11 2020/2019   S Kyle Hamilton, S, ND – hands for INTs and 6-7 PDs/yr RD 1 Kolby Harvell-Peel, S, Oklahoma State – sacks, FFs, hands for INTs and 2019 13 PDs RD 2-3   WR Justyn Ross, WR, Clemson RD 2 George Pickens, WR, Georgia RD 1 John Metchie III, WR, Alabama RD 2-3 Romeo Doubs, WR, Nevada   LB Christian Harris, LB, Alabama – size, sacks, FF, Int RD 1-2 Devin Lloyd, LB, Utah - size, sacks, FF, Int – low on PDs   OL RG Cain Madden, Marshall Finished top 10 among RGs RT Evan Neal, Alabama R2-3 RT Darian Kinnard, Kentucky R3-4   Come draft day be it Round 1 or Round 2 would like to see the Colts address either WR or CB early but with our Edges I wouldn’t be upset if we drafted someone like Myjai Sanders (Cincinnati).  Realize pay scale always influx and we hope the cap increases at the end of next year and players might just play to bigger contracts.  Good baseline to start with and reason why teams draft rookies to help off-set the rising costs of contract extensions.  
    • As you likely guessed, I think we either re-sign Fisher or re-sign one OR both of Tevi and/or Davenport.   Figured if we couldn’t find a LT that worked for us at pick 54 this year,  we’re likely not going to find one in the 2nd round next year.  I think we’d fill the hole with someone until 2023 and use our 1st in that draft to fill the LT.  But for now, I’m guessing EF.      As to CB, if we had to, we could go corner in the 2nd and TE in the 3rd.  But, for whatever reason, I’m far more optimistic on Rock and Tell than most here.  
  • Members

    • Franklin County

      Franklin County 80

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • PeterBowman

      PeterBowman 1,492

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • ClaytonC

      ClaytonC 28

      New Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Shive

      Shive 2,637

      Moderators
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Dogg63

      Dogg63 2,248

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • lincolndefan

      lincolndefan 67

      Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Tsarquise

      Tsarquise 454

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • TheUnshuffler

      TheUnshuffler 29

      New Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • will426

      will426 148

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • NFLfan

      NFLfan 8,931

      Moderators
      Joined:
      Last active:
×
×
  • Create New...