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Ballard is brilliant


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We basically bent the Eagles over on this trade and Ballard didn't budge on their demands. 

 

I'm not the biggest Wentz supporter but its an absolute steal compared to the Stafford trade.

 

We really do have the best GM in the league!

 

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We have the most likeable GM in the league. The best? That simply can't be proven yet.

 

In 4 years as GM his grade is still very much incomplete. He's built a nice roster, but to be the best he needs the three biggest impact positions to be solidified.

QB - Wentz needs to return to form

WR - Pittman needs to be a legit #1

DE - Have to find a pass rusher

 

Give me two out of these three, win a division title and/or advance a couple of rounds in the playoffs, and I'll move CB into the "best" GM conversation.

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If Wentz is good we give up a first, if he is not good we still give up a second.

 

We also took on his contract. Its a gamble whether or not he will return to starting caliber football, and either way were giving up two picks within the first 3 rounds.

 

Im not sure how everyone believes this is robbery. If its because you believed the Eagles actually thought they were getting a "Stafford type deal" then im sorry but all those rumors were more than likely fake. 

 

I do think Ballard is a top 3 GM in the league right now though!

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2 hours ago, Nesjan3 said:

If Wentz is good we give up a first, if he is not good we still give up a second.

 

We also took on his contract. Its a gamble whether or not he will return to starting caliber football, and either way were giving up two picks within the first 3 rounds.

 

Im not sure how everyone believes this is robbery. If its because you believed the Eagles actually thought they were getting a "Stafford type deal" then im sorry but all those rumors were more than likely fake. 

 

I do think Ballard is a top 3 GM in the league right now though!

 

We took on his contract this year, if he's cut next year before the bonus there's no dead money. So he's basically here for a 1 year tryout..

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The contract a colts picked up is real friendly at this point as Eagles ate most of the badness of it.  Easy to cut, and if he’s hit, has very team friendly cap hits for a starting veteran QB.   Eagles seem to have all the characteristics of a train wreck so a Wentz rebound has a good chance of happening.  Never know until games are played, but like the chances of this being a good deal for the Colts.

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On 2/22/2021 at 3:18 PM, danlhart87 said:

We basically bent the Eagles over on this trade and Ballard didn't budge on their demands. 

 

I'm not the biggest Wentz supporter but its an absolute steal compared to the Stafford trade.

 

We really do have the best GM in the league!

 


I agree that we have a great GM whether he’s ranked the best or top-5.

 

But I don’t agree that the Eagles got bent over.   At the end of the day, we’re going to pay a 3 and a 1.   That’s not highway robbery for a starting quarterback.   And it’s not like we’re not assuming risk.  Wentz still has to be fixed.  And we’re paying him nearly $25m per for two years.  

 

Most reviews I’ve seen give both sides a roughly similar grade of B.   I think this trade was pretty fair for Botha sides.  Honestly. 

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I really do not understand all these folks (nationwide media and fans) who keep repeating the narrative of "they picked up his contract".

 

The contract isn't just good....it's great if he pans out (and not crippling if he doesn't). Amongst currently projected starting QBs that are not on a rookie contract, there are very few earning less than the $23.7M average we will pay him over the next two years. 

 

That is Alex Smith money ($23.5M) and not much more than Teddy Bridgewater money ($21M).

 

Jimmy G is due to make $25.0M and $25.6M if he is on a roster under his current deal. 

 

Tannehill is due to make $24.5M and $29.0M on his deal the next two years.

 

Goff is $27.8M and $25.5M.

 

My point is that if a QB is not on his rookie deal and is not in his final years in the league like Brady, Brees, etc. then you don't get a QB who is even remotely decent for the price we are paying for Wentz.

 

And to get one that is only 28 is even less likely.

 

Now let me get to my major point of why I like this deal more than most people seem to:

 

The NFL cap is taking a dip this year with COVID, but it is going to skyrocket by most projections in the very near future. When the new TV contracts hit, the NFL is going to look like the NBA did a few years back when their new deals hit and the salaries went through the roof.

 

Every time a QB signs a new market setting deal, by the time they are half way through the deal it looks like a bargain if they are still decent. 

 

The era of $40M QBs is already here. Right now they are the top guys. But soon, you are going to see even league average top-15 or so guys commanding that $40M. The top guys will go even higher. 

 

So if Wentz is even a top half-of-the-league guy, having him for 3 years beyond this one for a total of around $73M and under $25M a year is going to look like a steal and give us $10-$20M extra to spend at other positions.

 

Also, I think those trying to project Wentz to be what he was in 2017 pre-injury are destined for disappointment. I think at this point his 2017 season people keep mentioning is likely an outlier. 

 

But his 2018 and 2019 years might be what Wentz is. He is likely not as good as 2017 or as bad as 2020. If he is as good as 2018-2019, then he is a guy that over a 16 game season would average:

 

4215 passing yards

66% completions

28 TDs / 8 Ints

 

Plus another 200 or so yards on the ground.

 

We did not have many great options out there with Rivers retiring and with the amount of the future we would have to mortgage to move up for a decent roll of the dice on a top rookie QB. 

 

Wentz is a very nice consolation prize and if he can simply become what he was before 2020 then we are sitting pretty for the next 4 years at a minimum.

 

Sorry for the lengthy brain dump lol 

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39 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:


I agree that we have a great GM whether he’s ranked the best or top-5.

 

But I don’t agree that the Eagles got bent over.   At the end of the day, we’re going to pay a 3 and a 1.   That’s not highway robbery for a starting quarterback.   And it’s not like we’re not assuming risk.  Wentz still has to be fixed.  And we’re paying him nearly $25m per for two years.  

 

Most reviews I’ve seen give both sides a roughly similar grade of B.   I think this trade was pretty fair for Botha sides.  Honestly. 

Its a big win when you compare the fact that the Rams gave up a 2nd 1 plus their starting QB. Yes I would say its a steal!

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16 hours ago, coltsva said:

We have the most likeable GM in the league. The best? That simply can't be proven yet.

 

In 4 years as GM his grade is still very much incomplete. He's built a nice roster, but to be the best he needs the three biggest impact positions to be solidified.

QB - Wentz needs to return to form

WR - Pittman needs to be a legit #1

DE - Have to find a pass rusher

 

Give me two out of these three, win a division title and/or advance a couple of rounds in the playoffs, and I'll move CB into the "best" GM conversation.

 

IMO, until he wins a division championship, he can't be in conversation as the best GM in football.  Really, until the Colts win the AFC Championship game, he shouldn't be in discussion as the best GM in the AFC.  And until he wins a SB, he shouldn't be in discussion as best GM in the NFL.

 

I like Ballard a lot.  I think he's very good.  He inherited a dumpster fire, which had some gasoline poured onto it after Luck retired and McDaniels bailed, etc.... he's been very straightforward to the fanbase/media/etc. and I'd say he has this team in contending shape for a while.  The few shining stars when he inherited this team were (1) a legit franchise/future HOF QB in Luck, (2) Ryan Kelly and AC on the OL, (3) TY Hilton, and (4) Indy's seemingly a good organization with a caring owner (at least when you read about the NYJ, HOU, and several other teams  - it seems like Indy's a pretty good spot to be).  Fast forward and he lost Luck to retirement/injury, AC to retirement, and TY's declining.  In spite of all that, he's got us as legit contenders with average QB play and has really changed the look of an Indy team (the finesse Peyton years are now a 'Run the Damn Ball' team with a dominating OL, a tough DL, etc.).  

 

In short, he's very good (if not great) at what he does.  I don't think you're wrong in your assessments, but I wouldn't be shocked if we got average QB play from Wentz, Pittman was kind of a 1A WR and we did nothing to the DL aside from let Turay develop, retain Houston and Autry and hope the rest stay healthy that this team could make a run in the playoffs.  Hindsight is 20/20, but we had a very good chance of winning that game against Buff and we seem to match up well vs. KC - literally 2-3 critical and unlikely situations in that Buff game cost us.

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39 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

Its a big win when you compare the fact that the Rams gave up a 2nd 1 plus their starting QB. Yes I would say its a steal!

The difference is that Stafford is a much safer play then Wentz.   Stafford doesn’t have to be fixed.   Wentz does.  
 

I agree the Rams paid full price.   We didn’t.  But we paid a fair price considering we bought damaged goods that have to be fixed.   It’s not a sure thing.   And I say that as someone who loves both Reich and Wentz. 

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12 hours ago, ColtJax said:

Giving up a 1 and a 3 isn't chump change. And if it's not a #1 then we got screwed in the trade.

Yeah, I like Ballard plenty enough, but I don't get the narrative about this trade specifically. 

 

If Wentz is our franchise QB, then this trade is a big win for us. But again... we are incurring huge amount of the risk here. If he's horrible, we just gave up 2 day 2 picks for the privillege to pay a bust 25M a year for 2 years. If he's mediocre(and not our franchise QB) he very likely plays enough to cost us the 1st next year so we gave up 1st and 3d and 2 years of 25M salary for a level of play that we could have had for nothing. 

 

This is not the no brainer brilliant move some are making it out to be. There's plenty of risk in this one. 

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14 hours ago, ColtJax said:

Giving up a 1 and a 3 isn't chump change. And if it's not a #1 then we got screwed in the trade.

I don’t think you phrased this quite the way you want...    I think you’re saying if our trade ends up where are only paying a 3 and a 2, that means Wentz has played badly and therefore we have been screwed.    The wording is a little awkward, but I think this is what you mean?

 

My response would be it’s the cost of doing business in the NFL.  We have to pay a minimum of a 3 and a 2 to find out just how good Carson Wentz really is?    We are willing to take that risk.  

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I think Ballard is a really good GM. This deal was kind of the most obvious move of his five offseasons, so far. It wasn't a no-brainer, it has plenty of risk, and if it doesn't work it could set the team back dramatically. And it seems like the only other team that was as interested as the Colts never made an offer, so Ballard didn't have strong competition on this one.

 

I think he made a good trade, it has the potential to be very beneficial for the Colts. It's not great for the Eagles, but they chose to take the loss by trading him. We made that loss about as palatable as possible, and that's why Wentz got sent to the Colts.

 

Something else, in reading about this trade -- the process, the projections, etc. -- it's pretty obvious that the Colts staff is really well respected around the league. And that's a good thing.

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On 2/23/2021 at 12:17 PM, ColtJax said:

Giving up a 1 and a 3 isn't chump change. And if it's not a #1 then we got screwed in the trade.

We gave up our 3rd rounder this year and a conditional 2nd rounder next year that becames a number one if he plays 75% or more of that offensive plays next season!

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14 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t think you phrased this quite the way you want...    I think you’re saying if our trade ends up where are only paying a 3 and a 2, that means Wentz has played badly and therefore we have been screwed.    The wording is a little awkward, but I think this is what you mean?

 

My response would be it’s the cost of doing business in the NFL.  We have to pay a minimum of a 3 and a 2 to find out just how good Carson Wentz really is?    We are willing to take that risk.  

That is what I meant, and I agree. The Dolphins gave up a very high 3rd rounder for Josh Rosen and cut him the next year. The Redskins (WFT) paid the #15 pick to take their under 2 year bust. My point was we didn't "steal" him, we have a talented player with injury history that has been mentally destroyed. We're rolling the dice, but we didn't steal anything..

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1 hour ago, ColtJax said:

That is what I meant, and I agree. The Dolphins gave up a very high 3rd rounder for Josh Rosen and cut him the next year. The Redskins (WFT) paid the #15 pick to take their under 2 year bust. My point was we didn't "steal" him, we have a talented player with injury history that has been mentally destroyed. We're rolling the dice, but we didn't steal anything..

Yup.   No steal.   This deal will eventually be a 3 and a 1.    I don’t think that’s a steal for expensive damaged goods that we have to hope we can fix. 
 

But I trust Frank.   I trust Ballard.  If they think Wentz can be fixed, then I support them.  I won’t bash them if this doesn’t work out.   It’s a calculated risk.   But if it pays off, it would be sweet!   

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