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Make four moves to improve the roster


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To me the Colts have a very solid all around defense. Offense is where they need that little extra to take them to the top of the AFC. 

Now that you have Carson the Colts should build a team of weapons around him.

 

Id start with trading for Zach Ertz who has been one of Carson's top targets since he was drafted in 2016. They have a great connection and would help ease him into the Colts offense. Etrz will be traded out of Philly and the cost should be pretty low since the Eagles are way over the cap and need to get that number down. A 4th or even 5th round pick should get the services of Ertz in the Indy. 8 mill is his base and final year of his contract. He will play his heart out to prove he deserves a new deal. For a 5th rounder his production would be worth it. 

 

This draft has some really good offensive lineman in it. The Colts have a very good line to start off but never hurts to build a dominate offense with the line. Protect your new QB with a new LT. In the range of the Colts pick you could see Slater, Darrisaw, Tucker or Jenkins. Sure up that final spot on the line. 

 

I love the pick of Pittman last year for the Colts. Im not the type of person who wants speed, speed, speed. Id rather have a great route runner with great hands and Pittman was perfect for that. Pascal had a nice season and is a nice piece in that core. Ty is the issue. He is on the decline and getting older. If hes willing to take a lower contract to stay with the Colts it would be smart to keep a solid 700-800 yard WR that knows the system.

 

However at some point you have to look at his age and know he is going to start declining hard. You have a lot of nice WRs that will hit the market this year in a bad cap year for many teams so the Colts situation cap wise is perfect to bring in a solid vet WR with years left in the tank. Robinson, Watkins, Davis, even a Smith Schuster. Nelson Agholor, Curtis Samuels. I would not even consider Chis Godwin....TB will tag him before they let him walk. I would land 2 WRs. Combo of FA and/or Draft pick. 

 

 

 

 

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For me, these positions have to be addressed: Edge, LT, CB, TE. In that order.   I'm going TE instead of WR, because I'm going to be hopeful that our young horses at WR will get better. Even

Sign either Allen Robinson, David Moore, or Kenny Golladay   Sign Romeo Okwara   Draft Samuel Cosmi at 21    Draft Greg Newsome II in the second round 

Not at all, I think it would be a big mistake.

7 minutes ago, DeathByEagle said:

To me the Colts have a very solid all around defense. Offense is where they need that little extra to take them to the top of the AFC. 

Now that you have Carson the Colts should build a team of weapons around him.

 

Id start with trading for Zach Ertz who has been one of Carson's top targets since he was drafted in 2016. They have a great connection and would help ease him into the Colts offense. Etrz will be traded out of Philly and the cost should be pretty low since the Eagles are way over the cap and need to get that number down. A 4th or even 5th round pick should get the services of Ertz in the Indy. 8 mill is his base and final year of his contract. He will play his heart out to prove he deserves a new deal. For a 5th rounder his production would be worth it. 

 

This draft has some really good offensive lineman in it. The Colts have a very good line to start off but never hurts to build a dominate offense with the line. Protect your new QB with a new LT. In the range of the Colts pick you could see Slater, Darrisaw, Tucker or Jenkins. Sure up that final spot on the line. 

 

I love the pick of Pittman last year for the Colts. Im not the type of person who wants speed, speed, speed. Id rather have a great route runner with great hands and Pittman was perfect for that. Pascal had a nice season and is a nice piece in that core. Ty is the issue. He is on the decline and getting older. If hes willing to take a lower contract to stay with the Colts it would be smart to keep a solid 700-800 yard WR that knows the system.

 

However at some point you have to look at his age and know he is going to start declining hard. You have a lot of nice WRs that will hit the market this year in a bad cap year for many teams so the Colts situation cap wise is perfect to bring in a solid vet WR with years left in the tank. Robinson, Watkins, Davis, even a Smith Schuster. Nelson Agholor, Curtis Samuels. I would not even consider Chis Godwin....TB will tag him before they let him walk. I would land 2 WRs. Combo of FA and/or Draft pick. 

 

 

 

 

just did a new offseason amd mock in the NFL Draft/ Free Agent sub forum.

 

I have a few of your moves on there.

 

As far as Ertz, I think if we were going to bring him in, it would of been as part of the Wentz deal.

 

 

Draft compensation is cheap for him, but that $8.25m cap hit would be hard to fit in.

 

I don't know if they will have any takers on the trade market with cap space low across the league and will eventually just release him. At that point he would be worth a look I think.

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On 2/20/2021 at 1:36 PM, krunk said:

To me Sammy Watkins and Campbell would go good together. That other little guy we used a lot this year on jet sweeps seems like a good rotational piece to play the Campbell role if necessary.

I like(d) Sammy in Buffalo, maybe not so much the KC version. On this roster he's triple redundant with Pittman and Patmon. I prefer Samuel as being the redundancy for Campbell. As much as I like Dulin he's just not stepped up as a WR yet - even though he's a beast on teams......

 

A 4 wide set with Patmon and Pittman on the outside and Samuel and Campbell coming out of the slot would make a lot of defenses nervous......even if Patmon only ran the deep routes every time.

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18 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

I like(d) Sammy in Buffalo, maybe not so much the KC version. On this roster he's triple redundant with Pittman and Patmon. I prefer Samuel as being the redundancy for Campbell. As much as I like Dulin he's just not stepped up as a WR yet - even though he's a beast on teams......

 

A 4 wide set with Patmon and Pittman on the outside and Samuel and Campbell coming out of the slot would make a lot of defenses nervous......even if Patmon only ran the deep routes every time.

Not Dulin. The other guy

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4 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

DeMichael Harris that was a converted WR to RB kinda like Hines....yeah he flashed a heckuva lot more in the offense than Dulin.

Thats why I recommended Watkins or somebody similar bc Harris has upside to do similar stuff that Samuel can do. And of course weve got Hines too.

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14 minutes ago, krunk said:

Thats why I recommended Watkins or somebody similar bc Harris has upside to do similar stuff that Samuel can do. And of course weve got Hines too.

I thought about Watkins for a minute myself. He hasn't been healthy for most of his career though. For that money why not take Fuller on a squeeze type of "check your head" deal. That probably won't happen though. Agholor is an interesting fit if he can keep his eyes on the ball before he tries going downfield as is Marvin Jones, even at his age.

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41 minutes ago, JoeThornburg said:

I thought about Watkins for a minute myself. He hasn't been healthy for most of his career though. For that money why not take Fuller on a squeeze type of "check your head" deal. That probably won't happen though. Agholor is an interesting fit if he can keep his eyes on the ball before he tries going downfield as is Marvin Jones, even at his age.

Fuller is always injured. If we gave him a 1 year deal it would probably end up like Devin Funchess. A waste.

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On 2/18/2021 at 2:32 PM, Superman said:

For me, these positions have to be addressed: Edge, LT, CB, TE. In that order.

 

I'm going TE instead of WR, because I'm going to be hopeful that our young horses at WR will get better. Even if we lose TY, I think we're okay. So sign Hunter Henry, let Burton walk, and keep Doyle and MAC.

 

Edge is most important to me. Can't get the defense to perform better against good QBs without a better pass rush. So I'm signing Bud Dupree, and hoping I can keep one of our FAs.

 

LT is obvious. I don't think we need to be top ten at LT, but we need a guy who can play. Give me a LT in the draft on a rookie deal, who can grow with the squad, but I also want a vet with some experience. I think this is two moves... (?) Just don't re-sign Le'Raven Clark.

 

Corner is also important, because Rhodes is a FA. We need to keep him. We also need to address the position -- again -- in the draft. Ballard has drafted multiple corners so far, none of them have hit. We have to be strong at corner.

 

I'd add WR to the group for the following reasons: (1) I think we've pretty much seen Pascal's ceiling, (2) I  think Patmon can make a leap, but not sure if he or Dulin will be  more than a solid 4 at this point, (3) I think Pittman will take a leap, but he also missed time last year and I'm not sure if Wentz is good enough to get the most out of Pittman if he winds up being our #1, (4) Even if we resign TY, health has been an issue for him and I think he's best off as a #3 WR at this point in his career, maybe a #2, and (5) I have faith in Campbell's ability, but not so much in his ability to stay healthy.  

 

Agree at LT, we don't need the top guy but somebody good.  Would like us to draft high there, but also bring in a solid vet.  Wouldn't mind seeing Le'Raven back in Indy, but nothing more than depth.  I think Doyle is one of the better blocking TEs in the league and MAC is a good blocking TE as well - if we bring him back, I don't see why we can't use Doyle and/or MAC to help the LT out in certain situations.  

 

Edge, Dupree would be a great sign.  Though, I think we'll be OK bringing back Houston/Autry and will trust Ballard and Co. on what they think about Turay's progress.  Definitely think we need to either bring back Houston and/or Autry and add another player there.  

 

Corner... would love to see us bring back Rhodes and Carrie.  I'm optimistic Rock Ya-Sin can bounce back and also optimistic about Tell returning.  Say we have Rhodes, Carrie, RYS, Tell, Moore, and I. Rodgers -- I think we're pretty set there.  If we have that group, I'd like to see us bring back Hooker (if healthy - on a short term deal) or look into signing or drafting more of true FS -- not saying Blackmon can't be that, but I think our best safety option would be to have Blackmon at SS, Willis in the box on some hybrid packages and a ball-hawking FS (I just thought Blackmon had more natural instinct for what was in front of him than he did in deeper coverage (of course, a year of experience, a full offseason, a totally healthy knee and an improved pass rush could all help this).

 

______________

My four moves:

1) Fix the LT position by drafting someone in first two rounds and signing a guy like Alejandro Villenueva to a 2-3 year deal.  

2) Resign Rhodes and Carrie at CB, count on RYS/Tell/Rodgers being OK on the outside and Moore to continue to play well in the slot.

3) DL - resign Houston to a 1-2 year deal, resign Autry to 2 year deal, go after Dupree and hope Turay gets fully healthy and play all right.

4) TE/WR - resign Hilton to a 2-3 year deal, draft a WR and hope Campbell and Pittman stay healthy with growth/improvements from Dulin and Patmon.  Resign MAC, keep Doyle, go after Jonnu Smith or Hunter Henry (or if we get a steal for Ertz, trade a later round pick this year and next for him)

 

Otherwise, have Ballard continue to do his job in the draft and hope Wentz returns to his former self.  Sounds like he and Pederson had major issues in Philly, so hopefully Reich gets him over that mental barrier he seemed to be having and we can see him push the ball down field a bit more than Rivers was able to.

 

Not sure we're quite SB contenders, though I think it's very reasonable to think we could have beat Buffalo in the playoffs and that we match up OK with KC.  I see us contending for the AFC South with a good chance at winning it and being ranked as the two or 3 seed in the AFC.  Come playoff time, I think KC and Buffalo are going to be the favorites to come out of the AFC but don't see it being unreasonable to have faith that we can beat anyone if we're clicking on all cylinders and are healthy at that point in the season.

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On 2/18/2021 at 1:35 PM, Superman said:

 

It's just my projection, we don't know anything for sure, but I'm not in favor of moving Nelson to LT.

 

I don't care about the bolded. Once we drafted him, we knew we'd have to pay him. That's done. He's a great guard, and he'll get paid that way.

 

If Nelson can play LT at a high level, then you need at least an adequate replacement at LG. What's likely is that Nelson would be, at best, an average LT, and then you'd replace him with an average LG. So now you've weakened two positions on the OL. I'd rather be weak at LT but great at LG, than average at both. We'd be better off just getting an adequate LT and helping him with protections.

 

I just don't think it's reasonable to expect Nelson to be good at LT. He hasn't played LT at a high level. He played a few snaps last year, but he didn't look good in those snaps; he looked like a guard playing tackle in an emergency. His lateral movement was bad, and his hands were all over the place. You don't take a guy with Nelson's traits and expect him to perform well at tackle. It's been done before, but generally speaking, the odds are strongly against that kind of move working out favorably.

 

I should start by saying that I agree with you.    Keep Nelson at LG.    I've read articles where former OL say it "could" be done,  but it "shouldn't" be done.   Too much down side, not enough upside.   Too much potential to screw things up.

 

That said,  do you not have any concerns that at some point,  soon if we sign a FA LT, or later if we draft one,  we will have four OL that are making $10m +.    That doesn't concern you?     If Nelson moves to LT,  then it's only 3.    Our two guards would likely not make that kind of money.

 

I'd like to get your thoughts on this issue....

 

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1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I should start by saying that I agree with you.    Keep Nelson at LG.    I've read articles where former OL say it "could" be done,  but it "shouldn't" be done.   Too much down side, not enough upside.   Too much potential to screw things up.

 

That said,  do you not have any concerns that at some point,  soon if we sign a FA LT, or later if we draft one,  we will have four OL that are making $10m +.    That doesn't concern you?     If Nelson moves to LT,  then it's only 3.    Our two guards would likely not make that kind of money.

 

I'd like to get your thoughts on this issue....

 

It's an issue to be navigated. We'll have a lot of money committed to the OL, which means sacrificing money for other positions. It's not exactly how I would balance my roster and cap commitments. 

 

But I made my peace with this when we drafted Quenton Nelson at #6. If you don't want a guard making big money, you can't just move him to a different position and then pay him that big money to do a job at which he's not as good. 

 

And I think that a lot of the 'move Nelson to LT' idea is prompted by the desire to not pay top money to a LG, which isn't a good reason. Show me he has the traits to play LT, and I'm fine with it. I don't think he has those traits. It's a full stop right there for me.

 

Now, if we re-sign Nelson, re-sign Smith, and draft a LT, we push off that concern about cap balance for at least three more years. That probably comes with a sacrifice in play quality at LT, at least in 2021. If we sign a FA LT, that probably gives us some better play in 2021, but costs us at another position. In other words, the struggles of the salary cap. 

 

The other part of this is that a few short years ago, we all would have been willing to pay a lot of money to fix the OL. So I don't necessarily view it as a bad thing to have good OL to pay. The difference has to come from somewhere, though.

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5 hours ago, Fluke_33 said:

1. Move Nelson to LT

2. Move Nelson to RDE

3. move Nelson to cornerback 

4. Move Nelson back to guard 

 

 

Move Nelson to back up QB and our third QB is already on the roster. :thinking:

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People overestimate how much cap we have. We have some but we need to resign Nelson and Leonard, both will probably highest paid at their position, Braden Smith also will be highly coveted. We gotta be careful how we throw around cash. 

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7 hours ago, krunk said:

Im ready to upgrade on Doyle. Dont really care if we let him go.

Colts can save 8 or 9 million be over 50 million in cap space .   Also Kelly contract can be worked with to buy another couple million. This off season and draft can be make or break for the colts . If they can draft a tackle pickup a elite edge rusher and corner in free agency and a true 1 wr while drafting another edge and corner and maybe get a cheap underrated tight end  they can be true contenders. If they mess up that is to many holes and will set them back . 

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Over the Cap has the Colts at 43M currently which still ranks us in the top 5 for available cap space

 

Looking at the numbers, we are challenged to fit JUST a FA or two under that cap space.

 

Can you imagine what some of the other GMs are doing with THEIR situation?

 

Maybe more so than other years, there SHOULD be some very good FA's this year that will be available MUCH cheaper than in normal years. I believe that there may be more, one year "prove it deals"

 

I imagine that CB will follow his normal pattern of waiting through the big FA names to be signed, then come in after the draft to fill in the holes on the team

 

This is the boring approach for fans, but one that keeps us in proper cap management.

 

We are lucky that there are quite a few decent LT candidates in the draft.  If all 5 QBs go, we should get a decent starter at 21.

 

I can imagine a healthy dose of DE and DB will come in the draft after that. (Maybe toss in a TE)

 

I think we use the FA pool after that, to pick up a FA bargain player or two to fill out any holes......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1. Resign Rhoads, Autry and Pascal

2. Draft LT, CB and DE

3. Extend Braeden Smith and Darius Leonard

4. Do whatever it takes to get a full offseason of preparation bc it’s time these 2nd round picks of Ballards step up.  It’s their year to take over.  

 

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4 hours ago, rayski said:

People overestimate how much cap we have. We have some but we need to resign Nelson and Leonard, both will probably highest paid at their position, Braden Smith also will be highly coveted. We gotta be careful how we throw around cash. 

They all don't have to be done this year.  At least one I would think.  We still have a 5th yr option available for Nelson if necessary so he would be the last to sign I would think.  

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1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

They all don't have to be done this year.  At least one I would think.  We still have a 5th yr option available for Nelson if necessary so he would be the last to sign I would think.  

Yeah and you can probably pencil that 5th year option in already. But that is the reason why CB hasn't been giving out ludicrous contracts as so many have wanted here. we need to pay our own and they will be hefty bills for sure 

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11 hours ago, krunk said:

Fuller is always injured. If we gave him a 1 year deal it would probably end up like Devin Funchess. A waste.

Well to be fair last year he was suspended. Yeah he's had issues with injuries, I agree. But the point I was trying to make is so has Watkins and he's not been shopped around like Watkins. The other thing is, barring that suspension Fuller would have easily had a 1,000 yard season and was responsible for 38 first downs last year without much else around him. Watkins is at best a 3rd option on his team and hasn't really shown much in the way of progress since his 2nd season in Buffalo.

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3 hours ago, coming on strong said:

Colts can save 8 or 9 million be over 50 million in cap space .   Also Kelly contract can be worked with to buy another couple million. This off season and draft can be make or break for the colts . If they can draft a tackle pickup a elite edge rusher and corner in free agency and a true 1 wr while drafting another edge and corner and maybe get a cheap underrated tight end  they can be true contenders. If they mess up that is to many holes and will set them back . 

I don't think there are as many holes to fill as you may think. 

This draft is full of very talented players that will be there when we pick. Especially if a bunch of QBs go off the board early. 

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1. Not this season but for next season, replace Eberfluss! I got a feeling we will be seeing the same terrible zone defensive scheme giving opposing Offenses a wide open field! Then hire IU coach Tom Allen as D coordinator after IU wins the national championship with the NCAAs top rated Defense!:thmup:


2. keep QN at LG and draft the LT in draft. Either that or go after Orlando Brown jr! Dont know any draft names other than derrishaw.
 

3. Either get Ertz or Hunter Henry! Doyle   Or Burton are ok, just too darn slow! Dont know of any good TEs in the draft other than IUs Hendershot who may go undrafted! 

 

4. Need a WR that can get us YAC! Hilton may not be that guy anymore, he usually falls down or runs out of bounds when he catches the ball! With a dink and dunk Offense, we need the wrs that can break tackles and not give up too early! Harris could be a good use, maybe go after Mike Williams,...but Dulin and Campbell arent reliable enough which hurts our depth! Im not an Aghalor fan, hes too hit or miss and can disappear in games. Desean Jackson is too old and injury prone. Didnt the Packers let go of one of their wrs? Lazard/MVS? Maybe one of them!?  Financially, im not sure the Colts want to go after an Allen Robinson or Golladay!

 

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1 hour ago, IndyEric07 said:

1. Not this season but for next season, replace Eberfluss! I got a feeling we will be seeing the same terrible zone defensive scheme giving opposing Offenses a wide open field! Then hire IU coach Tom Allen as D coordinator after IU wins the national championship with the NCAAs top rated Defense!:thmup:


2. keep QN at LG and draft the LT in draft. Either that or go after Orlando Brown jr! Dont know any draft names other than derrishaw.
 

3. Either get Ertz or Hunter Henry! Doyle   Or Burton are ok, just too darn slow! Dont know of any good TEs in the draft other than IUs Hendershot who may go undrafted! 

 

4. Need a WR that can get us YAC! Hilton may not be that guy anymore, he usually falls down or runs out of bounds when he catches the ball! With a dink and dunk Offense, we need the wrs that can break tackles and not give up too early! Harris could be a good use, maybe go after Mike Williams,...but Dulin and Campbell arent reliable enough which hurts our depth! Im not an Aghalor fan, hes too hit or miss and can disappear in games. Desean Jackson is too old and injury prone. Didnt the Packers let go of one of their wrs? Lazard/MVS? Maybe one of them!?  Financially, im not sure the Colts want to go after an Allen Robinson or Golladay!

 

Ballard is the one who wants that zone defense here. If they ever let him walk the likely replacement will be someone with a similar philosophy.

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1 minute ago, BigO said:

Sign Lawson Edge

Sign Patrick Peterson CB

Sign Curtis Samuel Wr

Draft LT in 1st round

Resign Autry,Hilton, Muhammed and Carrie

Do not resign Houston and Rhodes

Not crazy about Peterson at his age, but I like all the rest.

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On 2/18/2021 at 2:55 PM, Superman said:

, don't trade Ben Banogu for Aaron Donald or anything dumb like that. In fact, trades are probably unrealistic, unless it's a guy we know is on the market. But account for the cost of the player.

 

So what would you do? What do we need? Can we get there in four moves?

 

...and you think that's a Dumb Trade?

If the colts could pull off a trade like that I think it would be a great trade!

:funny:

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On 2/22/2021 at 1:53 AM, NewColtsFan said:

 

I should start by saying that I agree with you.    Keep Nelson at LG.    I've read articles where former OL say it "could" be done,  but it "shouldn't" be done.   Too much down side, not enough upside.   Too much potential to screw things up.

 

That said,  do you not have any concerns that at some point,  soon if we sign a FA LT, or later if we draft one,  we will have four OL that are making $10m +.    That doesn't concern you?     If Nelson moves to LT,  then it's only 3.    Our two guards would likely not make that kind of money.

 

I'd like to get your thoughts on this issue....

 

Top LG makes $14.781 million / year so expect Nelson to make around $16.5 million when we extend his contract next year.

 

Top RT makes $18 million and Smith will probably make closer to $16.5 million imo

 

Don't forget Leonard will probably make around $13 million shy of what top OLB makes which is closer to $18 million.

 

Glowinski and Kelly probably won't be Colts much longer so yes can see the Colts go after a top FA LT such as Trent Williams.  Either way NFL teams have to protect their franchise QBs and the Colts learned that lesson the hard way so expect the Colts to do right moving forward.

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On 2/22/2021 at 10:44 AM, richard pallo said:

They all don't have to be done this year.  At least one I would think.  We still have a 5th yr option available for Nelson if necessary so he would be the last to sign I would think.  

If you look at the upcoming contracts 2021 and 2022 are the only really true years where we have to sign big named players.  The Colts are in ideal cap space position and not have to worry as 2023/2024 will not break the bank.

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    • Here's what PFF says, and how they rank them in terms of FAs available.   In short, Houston had the worst pass rush graded year of his career, but still was top 10 in pass rush win rate. Kerrigan on the other had a career worst year all around, was really lousy vs the run, while many expected a bump up in production per snap due to the reduced role.   If Houston would take a one year deal, I'd rather give him 10M than give Kerrigan 5M.     Don't forget we lost 2 (Autry and Houston) and added 3 (Paye, Dayo, Rochell). So even if Dayo takes longer, we're still even net/net with the addition of Rochell.    I agree he could start over Banogu. As long as Turay is deemed healthy enough to play, he'd be a better passing downs rusher than Kerrigan. Kerrigan wouldn't play on running downs at all for us. He'd be a rotational or depth pass rush specialist at best.
    • Man i respect you. But I just have to say the talent gradient in college is so vast compared to the NFL. I Trust Ballard. It makes sense and no way in hell am i making that trade. Whatever happened to sitting a kid for a year? I mean you got a bag, buy in or gtho.
    • Granson is a Burton type small hybrid, that probably doesn't block as well as Burton. Wasn't a huge fan of Burton, or really the level of usage from the slot. We'll see, but he just doesn't wow me, and will need to be used correctly to get the most out of him. He's definitely not a typical TE type.    Strachan is a raw small school project. Surprised we took another X type WR. Guessing Patmon isn't progressing as well as they hoped. Either that or think Patmon can play somewhere else (slot or Z) and I just have a hard time seeing that. Or maybe they think he can pack on pounds and become a TE or jumbo WR hybrid. I like his as a project though with low expectation.   IMO, the best pick of Day 3, or I should say the pick most likely to compete for starter snaps is Davis. SAF was a secondary need for me. I could see him pushing Willis by mid season if not earlier. He is physically more gifted, but probably less of a nose for the ball than Willis. There were other Ss I would have preferred, but he's decent. I'm just glad we grabbed one after losing a very solid Wilson.
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