Are you happy with the Wentz acquisition?

[coltsfansince65]

[waterdog]

5 hours ago, chad72 said:

Darnold can push the ball farther better than Trubisky, and both can use their legs.

If you mean Darnold has a stronger arm, I disagree.

Mahomes', wearing T shirt and shorts, has an "80 yard Pro Day pass" on youtube and that pass looks just like a Trubisky pass vs Arizona, wearing shoulder pads and helmet.

Trubisky also had measured better 40 time.

If Trubisky's career doesn't progress, other factors may be involved, but I think not many starters last year were  better athletes...Lamar probably is one, because of his speed, and his arm, Josh Allen and Herbert also could be.

I'll never forget a Parcells press conference, August 2006, when he announced that "Drew Henson is being released....he'll never play for the Cowboys."

A reporter had seen Parcells having a private talk with Henson and asked what Parcells was saying to Henson.

Parcells said that "he was trying to teach Henson how to have a 'mental vacation' in between plays." Parcells was still coaching, still doing his job, even knowing that Henson was leaving!

 

 

 

 

 

[Thebrashandthebold]

I have been reading comment all over the web and most of the talking heads agree that Philly was the winner of this trade. They got some value for a player who was the worst QB in the NFL last year who they didn't want on their team. My own doubts are that he won't stay on the field enough to lead the Colts to anything and I really expect a step back from last season. Those draft picks don't sound like much but no one else anything close to that package. I am cautiously hoping for the best but I have those nagging doubts.

 

[Clem-Dog]

Carson was borderline elite during seasons 2-4 so if he can regain that form then we've got a franchise QB.   All things considered I am genuinely happy that the Colts finally have a QB and the fact that they didn't have to overcompensate the Eagles was brilliant.

[BluesGirl]

9 minutes ago, Clem-Dog said:

Carson was borderline elite during seasons 2-4 so if he can regain that form then we've got a franchise QB.   All things considered I am genuinely happy that the Colts finally have a QB and the fact that they didn't have to overcompensate the Eagles was brilliant.

Like the name and the avatar!!!   Edge was awesome!!!!!   One of the best picks of the Polian era 

[Thunderbolt]

The jury still out. Let's see what Reich can do. This means Eason is officially the back up or will compete for the starting job? 

[jvan1973]

3 minutes ago, Thunderbolt said:

The jury still out. Let's see what Reich can do. This means Eason is officially the back up or will compete for the starting job? 

He isn't competing for the starting job

[coltsva]

It's fun to speculate before these things happen. Once they are done, it's all aboard and let's go Colts! Here's to Carson Wentz being a top 10 QB for the next 10 years in a Colts uniform.

[chad72]

1 hour ago, waterdog said:

If you mean Darnold has a stronger arm, I disagree.

Mahomes', wearing T shirt and shorts, has an "80 yard Pro Day pass" on youtube and that pass looks just like a Trubisky pass vs Arizona, wearing shoulder pads and helmet.

Trubisky also had measured better 40 time.

If Trubisky's career doesn't progress, other factors may be involved, but I think not many starters last year were  better athletes...Lamar probably is one, because of his speed, and his arm, Josh Allen and Herbert also could be.

I'll never forget a Parcells press conference, August 2006, when he announced that "Drew Henson is being released....he'll never play for the Cowboys."

A reporter had seen Parcells having a private talk with Henson and asked what Parcells was saying to Henson.

Parcells said that "he was trying to teach Henson how to have a 'mental vacation' in between plays." Parcells was still coaching, still doing his job, even knowing that Henson was leaving!

 

 

No, my statement was based on this article shared by @BeanDiasucci

 

https://www.windycitygridiron.com/2021/1/8/22213809/chicago-bears-extend-mitchell-trubisky-2021-nfl-playoffs-free-agency-data-analytics-nfl-tape-study

 

Key excerpts:

 

Regardless, the fact remains that Trubisky struggles with stretching the field. Going 42-for-97 with three touchdowns and seven interceptions on throws 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage is abysmal. While the level of difficulty is higher on throws beyond 20 yards, completing 16.7 percent of deep passes is simply unacceptable for a starting quarterback.

 

Naturally, a quarterback’s completion percentage will go down with the more deep shots they take, simply because deep shots are tougher throws to make. As a point of reference, Patrick Mahomes had a completion percentage of 66.3 percent from the field, but from deep he went 36.2 percent on 69 deep attempts. He did throw for 12 touchdowns and just two interceptions from deep, albeit on a much larger sample size than Trubisky. Aaron Rodgers, another MVP candidate, completed 42.3 percent of his 78 deep ball attempts with 12 touchdowns and one interception.

 

On the flip side, Sam Darnold finished with a completion percentage of 29.4 from deep, completing 10 of his 34 deep attempts for two touchdowns and two interceptions in a sample size more similar to that of Trubisky. Carson Wentz, another former No. 2 pick who saw himself get benched this year, completed 43.8 of his 48 deep-ball attempts for five touchdowns and three interceptions.

[Boondoggle]

I was a lot more impressed by this trade before I realized that round 2 pick in 2021 was part of the deal.  That should teach me to think reading a tweet told me everything I need to know.  Missing on this will be costly.  Not terrible but they'll feel it.

 

But one thing about Wentz that people forget is the level of his talent.  He's got MVP type ability.  Problem has been the mental side but if Reich gets him back on track lookout.

 

I think Ballard made the best he could of this situation.  Stafford would have been more of a sure thing.  But in this deal he does get that same kind of upside for cheaper and a little more risk.

[chad72]

6 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

I was a lot more impressed by this trade before I realized that round 2 pick in 2021 was part of the deal.  That should teach me to think reading a tweet told me everything I need to know.  Missing on this will be costly.  Not terrible but they'll feel it.

 

But one thing about Wentz that people forget is the level of his talent.  He's got MVP type ability.  Problem has been the mental side but if Reich gets him back on track lookout.

 

I think Ballard made the best he could of this situation.  Stafford would have been more of a sure thing.  But in this deal he does get that same kind of upside for cheaper and a little more risk.

 

Am I missing something? It is Round 2 pick in 2022 (conditional that could go up to Round 1) and Round 3 pick in 2021. 

 

There is no round 2 pick in 2021 involved in this trade.

[CanuckColtsFan]

I'm absolutely over the moon about it. I was hoping he would come here since he was benched. His ceiling is league MVP caliber. He does have a low floor but I think Frank will right the ship. I think we might have our QB for the next 10 years. All for a 3rd and conditional 2nd round pick. BRAVO!

[PrincetonTiger]

7 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

I was a lot more impressed by this trade before I realized that round 2 pick in 2021 was part of the deal.  That should teach me to think reading a tweet told me everything I need to know.  Missing on this will be costly.  Not terrible but they'll feel it.

 

But one thing about Wentz that people forget is the level of his talent.  He's got MVP type ability.  Problem has been the mental side but if Reich gets him back on track lookout.

 

I think Ballard made the best he could of this situation.  Stafford would have been more of a sure thing.  But in this deal he does get that same kind of upside for cheaper and a little more risk.

Bad info

 

  the info @chad72 gave was correct 

1 hour ago, coltsfansince65 said:

[crazycolt1]

My personal opinion is it's a good deal. 

The NFL is full of players who shined with a change of scenery. 

The Eagles turned into a dumpster fire very quickly and Wentz was caught up in it. 

The familiarity of Wentz and Reich will pay off. 

At least all the QB talk of the off season will cool off. 

[Jackie Daytona]

8 hours ago, Randy Perdue said:

No !!!!!

Welcome, at least wentz is getting a lot of new posters/trolls to contribute lol

[NewColtsFan]

45 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

No, my statement was based on this article shared by @BeanDiasucci

 

https://www.windycitygridiron.com/2021/1/8/22213809/chicago-bears-extend-mitchell-trubisky-2021-nfl-playoffs-free-agency-data-analytics-nfl-tape-study

 

Key excerpts:

 

Regardless, the fact remains that Trubisky struggles with stretching the field. Going 42-for-97 with three touchdowns and seven interceptions on throws 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage is abysmal. While the level of difficulty is higher on throws beyond 20 yards, completing 16.7 percent of deep passes is simply unacceptable for a starting quarterback.

 

Naturally, a quarterback’s completion percentage will go down with the more deep shots they take, simply because deep shots are tougher throws to make. As a point of reference, Patrick Mahomes had a completion percentage of 66.3 percent from the field, but from deep he went 36.2 percent on 69 deep attempts. He did throw for 12 touchdowns and just two interceptions from deep, albeit on a much larger sample size than Trubisky. Aaron Rodgers, another MVP candidate, completed 42.3 percent of his 78 deep ball attempts with 12 touchdowns and one interception.

 

On the flip side, Sam Darnold finished with a completion percentage of 29.4 from deep, completing 10 of his 34 deep attempts for two touchdowns and two interceptions in a sample size more similar to that of Trubisky. Carson Wentz, another former No. 2 pick who saw himself get benched this year, completed 43.8 of his 48 deep-ball attempts for five touchdowns and three interceptions.

 

For whatever it's worth....

 

This story is nearly 6 weeks old.   It is not new.   The date it was written is Jan 8.

 

So, I'm guessing much has changed since then.    Or not.   These are strange times we're living in.

 

[PrincetonTiger]

11 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

Welcome, at least wentz is getting a lot of new posters/trolls to contribute lol

[ReMeDy]

When I saw that we signed him, I immediately had to rewatch this video:

 

This guy, Brett Kollmann, knows his Eagles, although he does partially blame Doug Pederson. I think the one comfort I do have though is we don't need Wentz to be Peyton Manning.

[Two_pound]

I'm ok with this trade, I've been a Wentz fan since his college days. The fact that we got him and kept both our 1st and 2nd round picks this year is almost unbelievable. Great job Ballard. Reich will be able to get him back on track. And also, I believe he was by far the best remaining option available. Within reason of course.

[TheUnshuffler]

Not my 1st or 2nd choice to replace Rivers but Wentz ticks a lot of boxes (mobility, arm strength, familiarity with Reich, age, contract etc.) and the acquisition cost was relatively low considering the potential upside so you can’t really complain too much.

 

As others have said getting this deal done sooner rather than later has to be a good thing as well in regards to attracting/retaining free agents. (Plus it means its one less thing for us fans to worry about this off-season even though it makes Von Fish correct lol)

 

Looking forward to seeing what he can do in Colts uniform.

[BluesGirl]

Not that anyone cares But Collin Cowherd thinks this is the best thing to happen to his "team".  He LOVES Ballard and He LOVES Reich and he said he use to LOVE Wentz and thinks he's gonna fall back in love with him  

 

Also says its between the Chiefs Colts and Bill this yr for the AFC

 

I'd write him off but Collin is right A LOT.  He predicted the Chiefs and Bucs SB.  at the beginning of the season once his former love child signed with the Bucs 

 

 

[AlanNC]

I’m okay with it. Just giving a third and a conditional second pick has a good trade by Ballard.  He is still young.  Can throw deep and can run.  Under Frank I think he will be good.  Can’t wait for the season to start.

[The Oopty Oop]

I’m very neutral. I think the trade itself is a pretty good one. I believe I saw he’s gonna average 23 million a year for us through his contract if we’d keep him for the remainder? That seems to be a pretty low number to me for a middle of the pack qb(I get last year he stunk) because let’s be honest the position is expensive. I’m just not sure he can get us a ring and the rumors of him maybe not being the best teammate or not responding well to criticism are worrisome. But Indy media and friendship with Reich that shouldn’t be a problem I’d hope.

[waterdog]

3 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

No, my statement was based on this article shared by @BeanDiasucci

 

https://www.windycitygridiron.com/2021/1/8/22213809/chicago-bears-extend-mitchell-trubisky-2021-nfl-playoffs-free-agency-data-analytics-nfl-tape-study

 

Key excerpts:

 

Regardless, the fact remains that Trubisky struggles with stretching the field. Going 42-for-97 with three touchdowns and seven interceptions on throws 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage is abysmal. While the level of difficulty is higher on throws beyond 20 yards, completing 16.7 percent of deep passes is simply unacceptable for a starting quarterback.

 

Naturally, a quarterback’s completion percentage will go down with the more deep shots they take, simply because deep shots are tougher throws to make. As a point of reference, Patrick Mahomes had a completion percentage of 66.3 percent from the field, but from deep he went 36.2 percent on 69 deep attempts. He did throw for 12 touchdowns and just two interceptions from deep, albeit on a much larger sample size than Trubisky. Aaron Rodgers, another MVP candidate, completed 42.3 percent of his 78 deep ball attempts with 12 touchdowns and one interception.

 

On the flip side, Sam Darnold finished with a completion percentage of 29.4 from deep, completing 10 of his 34 deep attempts for two touchdowns and two interceptions in a sample size more similar to that of Trubisky. Carson Wentz, another former No. 2 pick who saw himself get benched this year, completed 43.8 of his 48 deep-ball attempts for five touchdowns and three interceptions.

windycitygridiron does state that "a vocal portion of the Bears’ fan base has been pushing for the contract extension of Mitchell Trubisky", and maybe they remember better days in 2018 and 2019, but their QBs this season may be Foles, with Bray now UFA. Pushing the ball down the field could have been limited for any of the 3 Bears QBs this year, with Mooney their only deep hope injured most of the time. Wims could be a deep threat when he isn't ejected for punching.

Foles apparently told Griese that Nagy was calling for pushing-the-ball-plays that couldn't be done, because of the O line chaos, and Chicago may be the most feared and loathed potential move for any of the remaining FA QBs.

New England seems similarly tough, but Bill may find 1 or even 2 receivers easier than Chicago will patch up all the holes in the line, and the WRs.

The Bears:

1. gave away too many picks for Trubisky

2. gave away too many picks for Mack

3. spent most of the money on defense, and it hasn't paid

I just want to see Trubisky play for another team, just to make sure he's as useless as everyone claims.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[colt18]

I like it. It’s a win-win situation; Wentz does well we stole a MVP level QB. Wentz sucks? We gambled and lost, but didn’t give up too much.

 

I’ll take it. I remember when Luck vs Wentz was a thing and it’s only fitting that Wentz is playing for Indy, I really hope he gets back to playing well.

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, coltsva said:

It's fun to speculate before these things happen. Once they are done, it's all aboard and let's go Colts! Here's to Carson Wentz being a top 10 QB for the next 10 years in a Colts uniform.

That's right. 

This is going to be a two year venture no matter the results. 

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, Thebrashandthebold said:

I have been reading comment all over the web and most of the talking heads agree that Philly was the winner of this trade. They got some value for a player who was the worst QB in the NFL last year who they didn't want on their team. My own doubts are that he won't stay on the field enough to lead the Colts to anything and I really expect a step back from last season. Those draft picks don't sound like much but no one else anything close to that package. I am cautiously hoping for the best but I have those nagging doubts.

 

Have a Snickers. 

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, The Oopty Oop said:

I’m very neutral. I think the trade itself is a pretty good one. I believe I saw he’s gonna average 23 million a year for us through his contract if we’d keep him for the remainder? That seems to be a pretty low number to me for a middle of the pack qb(I get last year he stunk) because let’s be honest the position is expensive. I’m just not sure he can get us a ring and the rumors of him maybe not being the best teammate or not responding well to criticism are worrisome. But Indy media and friendship with Reich that shouldn’t be a problem I’d hope.

We have the locker room that will stop the rhetoric that comes from a team that is a dumpster fire. 

Those teams draw the wrath of fans and the media. 

That team lacked leadership in and outside the locker room. 

[coltsfan_canada]

I really wanted Stafford but not for what Rams paid. After him I would like to get Carr but I guess LV was not interested to move him so given what options we have out there I think this suit well for colts, and wow what a bargain by Ballard amazing. So, yeah I am happy camper. 

[Pilgrim]

Personally, I believe that given where we are as a team, Wentz is the best option. We are too good of a team to get in a position to get a Manning, Luck, Lawrence sure thing sort of deal. Even with mediocre to poor qb play, with the roster that Ballard built, we are at least a 4-6 win team. We wouldn’t be in a position draft a guy of the future without mortgaging said future. Wentz gives us the best chance to win now, and in the future, while still giving us a chance to build around him.

[shasta519]

7 hours ago, coming on strong said:

the reason people are against the trade is because they didnt watch wentz and the media told them how to feel .   Wentz is a highlight machine look at his highlights highly mobile big arm and throws elite passes on the run .   he will be a top 5 guy next year and colts are back to real superbowl contenders instead of being in QB purgatory while our team is entering its prime .    The same people complaining now would be complaining worse if the colts did not sign wentz and the colts ended up resigning jacoby or another low tier starter because eason is not ready.   To go from a 8-8 team to a 12-4 now is a big deal enjoy the feeling knowing we are set for at least 10 plus years at QB and relax .  Ballard knows best and will have the colts ready next year to compete for a ring.

So I shouldn’t listen to the media...I should listen to you?

 

I prefer to think for myself actually. Yes, Wentz was a highlight machine in 2017 as a 2nd year QB. Then he unfortunately got hurt...and now that same mobility is now gone. He’s not immobile...but it is quite noticeable. And if you watch the tape...I know you can see it too. So I don’t need the media to tell me what I am seeing.

 

The issue he is still tries to make those same type of plays...and it doesn’t work.

And to compound it...his mechanics (which have always been a bit funky) are off as well and the accuracy sucks. 
 

So sure...he’s still a highlight machine...just not in the way you’d hope. 

 

Reich will hopefully be able to smooth out some of those mechanics...but I think it’s just wishful thinking if Colts fans think they just snagged the 2017 version of Wentz...or a top 5 QB. 
 

As for the last part...I would have absolutely complained if they re-signed JB to be the starter...and justifiably so. This is better than having JB...but at least JB didn’t turn the ball over. Wentz is like the anti-JB in that way. 

 

 

 

 

[adamthyst]

Not necessarily. He wasn't the option I would've wanted the most, but the trade isn't that bad for us.

[shasta519]

Honestly...no. But this was telegraphed when they hired Taylor. 
 

I don’t even really care as much about the compensation part either...though that gets factored in now as well. Had the Colts signed Wentz as a FA to a 2/$47M with almost all of it gtd...I wouldn’t have liked it either.

As for the picks...it’s either a 3rd and a 2nd for nothing...or it’s a 3rd and a 1st for something. If that something is a top 10 QB...that will be huge. 

 

But we will see the offseason goes though. If they make some aggressive moves...I will feel better overall. Don’t have to love the QB to love my Colts. That’s been the case since Luck got hurt. 

[ClaytonColt]

Deeply undecided about this.

 

Loved Wentz coming out of college but can't ignore his woeful play last year or the fact that he has failed to make progression. Nobody can be too excited about acquiring one of the worst performing quarterbacks of 2020.  

 

There is hope that Reich can bring the best out of him but at the moment that feels a little bit like blind faith. I'm not to worried about what we gave up in terms of draft capital (which should really be framed as a 3rd and a 1st - saying the second pick is really a 2nd is disingenuous unless injuries are involved) but the issue for me is that we might have tied ourselves to a average/below average quarterback for at least 2 years  which ruins the window for this team. 

 

Hopefully though there are good reasons for Wentz's regression with the Eagles and the coaching staff can get the best out of him. It's 50/50 though in my eyes. 

[Fluke_33]

9 hours ago, BluesGirl said:

use to LOVE Wentz and thinks he's gonna fall back in love with him  

I hope he right on the rest but when you fall out of love with someone never return.  Sharks don’t swim backwards!  Lol. 

[chad72]

6 hours ago, waterdog said:

 

I just want to see Trubisky play for another team, just to make sure he's as useless as everyone claims.

 

 

 

He is not useless. You can go check the thread in the NFL free agents section linked here:

 

 

I was one of those that felt Trubisky could get a second lease and resurgence like Ryan Tannehill. My contention above was purely based on pushing the ball farther and his QBR as it exists today on those passes, nothing more, nothing less. He would do very well with a coach like Belichick, IMO.

[chad72]

9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

For whatever it's worth....

 

This story is nearly 6 weeks old.   It is not new.   The date it was written is Jan 8.

 

So, I'm guessing much has changed since then.    Or not.   These are strange times we're living in.

 

 

We haven't had any football since Trubisky last played, so the numbers still hold water. Like I said above, nothing to read between the lines, you complete X out of Y passes beyond 20 yards and that factors into your QBR, that is the only reason that was quoted.

[John Hammonds]

This should be the last time we do this, though.  We've run out of QB's that Reich has had previous relationships with.

[NFLfan]

18 hours ago, coltsfeva said:

rumors about him being a bad locker room guy and making bad decisions, when pressure comes

 

I don't believe he is a bad locker room guy. I think he will thrive here in Indy.

 

One of the mods on the Daily Norseman (Vikings site) knows Wentz. They are both from Bismarck, ND. He is very fond of him as a player but even more so as a person. I like Wentz too. I would have preferred him over Kirk Cousins but it is what it is.

 

I hope Wentz succeeds here. 

[coltsva]

11 hours ago, Thebrashandthebold said:

I have been reading comment all over the web and most of the talking heads agree that Philly was the winner of this trade. They got some value for a player who was the worst QB in the NFL last year who they didn't want on their team. My own doubts are that he won't stay on the field enough to lead the Colts to anything and I really expect a step back from last season. Those draft picks don't sound like much but no one else anything close to that package. I am cautiously hoping for the best but I have those nagging doubts.

 

If most of the talking heads are saying Philly won the trade, then I'm feeling pretty good about it. Truth is, they just need something to yap about, and what they say has no bearing on how this plays out. That will be up to Wentz and two yet to be drafted college players.

 

The facts:

1. The Eagles got something for a guy who didn't figure into their future plans (that's a win for them)

2. The Colts filled a gaping hole at the QB position for at least next year, with a QB who has played at a high level during his career (that's a win for them)

 

The unknowns:

1. Who do the Eagles draft with those picks, how do they perform and for how long?

2. How well does Wentz play? What success do the Colts have with Wentz at QB, and for how long?

 

The unknowns will determine which team, if either of them, won this trade. Not the talking heads on Feb 19, 2021. Get back to me in a few years.

 

Remember when the Colts traded their first round pick for Trent Richardson? Then Cleveland used the pick to draft Johnny Manziel. Sometimes, nobody wins a trade.