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Colts Trade for Wentz (details in first post)

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By ColtV
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luv_pony_express Team Captain

luv_pony_express

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, edindetroit said:

Rams get Stafford, you guys got Wentz, the Lions get Goff. Sounds like the Rams win. 

I guess we’ll have to wait and see.

 

I’m glad we didn’t have to part with 3 draft picks — including two future firsts — to get Wentz.  Looking at the picks we did give up, combined with the 2 years of committed cap we inherit, it was a pretty low risk gamble for the Colts.  If he doesn’t pan out, we mostly lose time.

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Sumo63 Practice Squad

Sumo63

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17 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Right now, I'm trying to drink the Kool aide, but until I see it on the field, the skepticism won't disappear.  

I'll be very very happy if my skepticism is all misplaced. 

We're on the same page.  I'm just hoping to have my optimism rewarded.  If the outcome is negative we're both gonna be disappointed.  And if it works out it's a career defining move for Ballard and Reich, and I suspect we'll both be dancing in the aisles.

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EastStreet Ring of Honor

EastStreet

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6 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

We're on the same page.  I'm just hoping to have my optimism rewarded.  If the outcome is negative we're both gonna be disappointed.  And if it works out it's a career defining move for Ballard and Reich, and I suspect we'll both be dancing in the aisles.

While I may be skeptical, I doubt many are more hopeful lol. I'd love to dance with ya! And I don't mind being wrong at all if it means the team is doing well. 

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Boondoggle Team Captain

Boondoggle

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I think Wentz would have to be a complete and total bomb to be benched by Reich.   I don't think being even a bit of a disappointment would get Wentz benched.    He'd have to be a complete disaster.   Because benching would break complete trust that the two have.    If Wentz thought Reich was making him the scapegoat,  and was benched unfairly,  that would be Philly revisited.    

 

Reich has two full years to get Wentz right.    It's in everyone's interest to make it happen.   So Wentz is going to get a long leash.   Maybe the longest leash.   He'll get the benefit of the doubt.   No tossing under the bus.   Reich can't be seen as a guy looking to protect a possible upgrade to a first round draft pick at the expense of helping his future QB.    The optics would be disastrous.  

 

We should all hope and expect that the final price of the deal to be a 1 and a 3.   That's what we should all want.  We're all hoping Wentz exceeds the price.    And if he's as good as Reich/Ballard think he can be,  then he'll easily be worth the cost.

This deal doesn't get made without Wentz knowing that there's a round one pick in play that affects his playing time.  It's actually a nice result for the Colts because it puts pressure on Carson which is good for him.  If he's not playing well enough at that 75% point they will bench him I am sure and he'll understand it was his fault.  Also they'll get a look at Eason which isn't the worst thing.

 

Note that I don't think it will come to that.  I think behind this line he will play well.

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luv_pony_express Team Captain

luv_pony_express

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10 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

We're on the same page.  I'm just hoping to have my optimism rewarded.  If the outcome is negative we're both gonna be disappointed.  And if it works out it's a career defining move for Ballard and Reich, and I suspect we'll both be dancing in the aisles.

I think we just have to have faith in Reich’s judgment here.

 

Reich knows Wentz’s strengths and weaknesses, tendencies, capabilities.  I’m sure he’s watched a lot of tape of CW from this past season, with the intent of determining if the player he was a few years ago is still in there somewhere.

 

But it’s worth pointing out that we apparently made an attempt toward getting Stafford first.  If that’s really true, it says something.

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shasta519 Ring of Honor

shasta519

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1 hour ago, luv_pony_express said:


Well, I’m not sure I’d say it’s ever a “great deal” for a GM to be dealing his former #2 overall pick that he traded up to get and who they had recently signed to a 4 year, $130M contract in exchange for a 3rd rounder and a future 2nd/1st rounder.

 

I might say it was the best he could do under the circumstances.


Obviously. But drafting and paying Wentz was already done. And now Wentz wanted to be traded...so there was nothing he could do. So yes under the circumstances...it was a pretty good deal. 

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LJpalmbeacher2

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8 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

This deal doesn't get made without Wentz knowing that there's a round one pick in play that affects his playing time.  It's actually a nice result for the Colts because it puts pressure on Carson which is good for him.  If he's not playing well enough at that 75% point they will bench him I am sure and he'll understand it was his fault.  Also they'll get a look at Eason which isn't the worst thing.

 

Note that I don't think it will come to that.  I think behind this line he will play well.

 

I seriously doubt frank will show anything but complete trust and support of Wentz publicly and privately. 

I think Wentz will play well if not at a very high level but regardless of play Reich will not bench him.

The colts present and foreseeable future are in Wentz's right arm and his mental psyche, and I'm sure frank & Ballard realize that. 

 

 

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shasta519 Ring of Honor

shasta519

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17 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

This deal doesn't get made without Wentz knowing that there's a round one pick in play that affects his playing time.  It's actually a nice result for the Colts because it puts pressure on Carson which is good for him.  If he's not playing well enough at that 75% point they will bench him I am sure and he'll understand it was his fault.  Also they'll get a look at Eason which isn't the worst thing.

 

Note that I don't think it will come to that.  I think behind this line he will play well.


If he gets benched...the Wentz era would effectively be over. But I don’t think it will come to that.

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NewColtsFan Ring of Honor

NewColtsFan

Posted
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9 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

This deal doesn't get made without Wentz knowing that there's a round one pick in play that affects his playing time.  It's actually a nice result for the Colts because it puts pressure on Carson which is good for him.  If he's not playing well enough at that 75% point they will bench him I am sure and he'll understand it was his fault.  Also they'll get a look at Eason which isn't the worst thing.

 

Note that I don't think it will come to that.  I think behind this line he will play well.

If I understand you correctly...    Wentz had three months to prove himself...  Sept/Oct/Nov to prove himself, otherwise he’ll be benched in December to protect our ‘22 first round pick.   That’s how I read you.

 

That’s how I read you.   I think Wentz would have to be the NFL’s biggest disappointment for him to be benched.    Otherwise I think we’re giving Wentz a two year trial, not a three month audition.  I think we’re willing to lose the one instead of the second as we try to rehab Wentz.  
 

The key is trust.  It was lost in Philly.   Our trade should tell Wentz that we believe in him.  We shouldn’t throw that away in three months unless Wentz completely flames out spectacularly.   

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NewColtsFan Ring of Honor

NewColtsFan

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19 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

So you think the idea is preposterous then I take it.  Curious why that is.

We didn’t make this thread for Wentz to compete with Eason.  Wentz has the starting job until he loses it.

 

Per Ballard,  Eason is trying to earn the backup job.   There isn’t a competition that anyone knows of. 

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Sumo63 Practice Squad

Sumo63

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11 minutes ago, luv_pony_express said:

I think we just have to have faith in Reich’s judgment here.

 

Reich knows Wentz’s strengths and weaknesses, tendencies, capabilities.  I’m sure he’s watched a lot of tape of CW from this past season, with the intent of determining if the player he was a few years ago is still in there somewhere.

 

But it’s worth pointing out that we apparently made an attempt toward getting Stafford first.  If that’s really true, it says something.

Very well said.  Stafford was the best option IMO, I was disappointed when he went elsewhere.

 

What's telling in both potential trades is that Ballard sets his value and doesnt budge.  I personally find that impressive. In Wentz he got the guy he wanted AT the price he wanted.  The two go hand in hand. 

 

I agree tho neither Chris nor Frank went into this deal blindly or timidly.  I think we got a good deal now it's up to the parties involved to maximize that value.

 

They're all "hanging onions" on this one.  3 careers will be defined by a 3rd rounder and a conditional second.  It's the bold move I've been waiting for.  I'm stoked to see how it plays out.

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Boondoggle Team Captain

Boondoggle

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I don't know that giving Wentz the job should be a foregone conclusion is all.  He's not swooping in here as some guy you gave up a ton for.  He's coming in as a guy who cost a 3rd and next year's 2nd until proven otherwise.

 

Obviously we know the guy will end up starting and I expect good things.  But from how things went down in Philly I'd like to see him earn that job in front of the roster and not necessarily for my edification.

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Boondoggle Team Captain

Boondoggle

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

If I understand you correctly...    Wentz had three months to prove himself...  Sept/Oct/Nov to prove himself, otherwise he’ll be benched in December to protect our ‘22 first round pick.   That’s how I read you.

 

That’s how I read you.   I think Wentz would have to be the NFL’s biggest disappointment for him to be benched.    Otherwise I think we’re giving Wentz a two year trial, not a three month audition.  I think we’re willing to lose the one instead of the second as we try to rehab Wentz.  
 

The key is trust.  It was lost in Philly.   Our trade should tell Wentz that we believe in him.  We shouldn’t throw that away in three months unless Wentz completely flames out spectacularly.   

The key is not trust.  The key is good QB play.

 

If Wentz does not provide good QB play you actually think they will eat a first round pick in order to not rock the boat with a QB who is struggling.  No way.  Again I don't think that's going to happen but to rule it out.  Can't get behind that.

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Lancer1

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1 hour ago, Zoltan said:

That’s why I said most not all

That you did, and if you were suggesting that GMs should not survive circumstances like that, I would tend to agree. In the example you provided, this GM has fired 1 coach (Andy Reid) who led the Eagles to a Superbowl, losing to the Tom Brady led Patriots. He guided his next team to back to back Superbowls, winning the 1st one before losing to the Brady led Buccaneers. Reid could conceivably coach for & win several more championships, especially with a QB like Mahomes. This GM also hired a coach in Doug Pederson that won a Superbowl with the Eagles, but then he dispatched the Superbowl MVP QB from that team, (Nick Foles) and eventually fired Pederson as well. I think it’s safe to say that he’s definitely risking his job with this move, and if it goes south for Philly, (and/or Wentz lights up the League as a Colt) then he’s probably blamed, and gone!

 

As for my example, (Tom Telesco) both of his Head Coaching hires have been duds that he needed to fire after 4 seasons apiece and he’s fortunate to have been allowed to hire a 3rd one for the Chargers, after botching the prior 2. He once again selected a Coordinator and gave him his 1st Head Coaching job, and if this doesn’t work out for the Bolts, Telesco may be fired along with his latest hire.

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Blackfish Walk On

Blackfish

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Posted

 Eagles fan, Carson is not a bad football player that played bad, he’s a good football player that had a bad year. He gets a large contract extension and not even a year later they draft a QB in the 2nd round?  It was stupid and it’s viewed that way in Philly, all I can say is our GM has kept his job through Reid getting fired, then Chip, and then Pederson.  He for whatever reason has a job for life. He and the owner wanted to fire Reich in 2016, thankfully Pederson defended him and they won the SB in ‘17.  
 2020 was a bad year all around, Wentz gets some of the blame, but not even close to the most, and for his throwing mechanics, it’s all tied to his footwork, it’s on film and it’s obvious, but easily fixed.   He’s a top 10-12 QB and with a good O line with actual NFL receivers to throw too, he may get back to his 2017 form.   No hate from me just being honest and I hope he plays well, especially to make that 2nd a 1st.

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krunk Ring of Honor

krunk

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48 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

 

Im sure a few of the Colts defenders remember Colts vs Eagles from 2018 when we played against Wentz in Philly. What i remember about that game was how hard Wentz was to sack. Every time we had him he kept escaping and then throwing a completion on the run.

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Sumo63 Practice Squad

Sumo63

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1 hour ago, King Colt said:

This thread will make excellent toilet paper next January.

If that's how you choose to treat your electronics that's your business.  I'll keep mine far away from my b-hole regardless of how the Wentz trade works out.

Just now, PrincetonTiger said:

Just call me the GIFMaster 

boo yah s galore GIF

Your gif game is on point.

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NewColtsFan Ring of Honor

NewColtsFan

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29 minutes ago, Boondoggle said:

The key is not trust.  The key is good QB play.

 

If Wentz does not provide good QB play you actually think they will eat a first round pick in order to not rock the boat with a QB who is struggling.  No way.  Again I don't think that's going to happen but to rule it out.  Can't get behind that.


It all depends on how badly he’s struggling?   I’m not trying to be clever.   We will have played 12 games when it’s time to decide.  If we’re 7-5 or 6-6, we will be viewed as a somewhat disappointing team.  Is Wentz to blame?  Are there other factors?

 

But if we’re 5-7 or 4-8, then that’s another story,

 

The bottom line is, if we bench Wentz after three months we’ve made 2022 much more difficult.  We will have already benched Wentz, basically publicly accusing him of the reason we’re having a disappointing season, but we’re still on the hook for CW’s 2022 salary.   We’re going to have to turn around and try to build him back up for the following season after we’ve blamed him for ‘21.   We will have made an already hard job that much harder. 
 

I don’t view this as a 3-month audition.  I view it as a two year project.  I think we’re invested enough to be all in.  

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