QB Discussion and Preference Poll - Part 2.5

[csmopar]

13 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think I would take Tannehill for the next 3 years over Ryan.    Matt Ryan has been declining the past couple years.  Some because Atlanta isn't good, but he has had good WR to throw to.  

 

Lawrence will own the division in a year or 2.   

Until it happens, its all speculation.  He's good, but anything can happen plus its the Jags. Their FO is liable to bungle this as they have with others.  They've drafted top 10 like 18 times in the last 20 years.

[Myles]

11 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think it will take Lawrence 3 years before he really unleashes, Jags roster is bad. I like Tannehill, he is above average to good but take away Henry and just put an average back in there, how good is Tannehill really?

I think Tannehill is a very good efficient QB.   I agree that he has benefitted from having Henry as the RB, but Matt Ryan has also had top notch receivers that he has benefitted from.    Either would be good.   I don't think we are getting Ryan.  I give Ballard credit for not giving up the farm for one of the QB's that have been available this offseason.  Slim pickens with allot of risk with allot of these guys.  

 

 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TannRy00.htm

[gnet550]

Just for laughs...you guys that are getting tired of the rumors....this is nothing lol

 

if anyone else is also a St. Louis Cardinals fan like me, I had to endure 3 years of Arenado rumors before that trade happened...I’ll have to admit when I heard they may trade for him this off season I just said, “yeah, sure” and ignored it. Then low and behold they pulled it off lol

 

i hope this saga doesn’t last that long or some of you will be saying some really not nice things

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Until it happens, its all speculation.  He's good, but anything can happen plus its the Jags. Their FO is liable to bungle this as they have with others.  They've drafted top 10 like 18 times in the last 20 years.

Lawrence is the best prospect coming out since Luck but because the Jags are drafting him, who knows? When Burrow went to the Bengals I had a bad feeling that he may get injured or have a bad year. Their roster like the Jags roster is just bad. The Colts were smart when they drafted Luck because as bad as we were in 2011 and turning over the majority of the roster, they kept guys like Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis on the team. That VET leadership was huge for Luck. Wayne really helped Luck out bigtime. The Jags don't have a Reggie Wayne. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think Tannehill is a very good efficient QB.   I agree that he has benefitted from having Henry as the RB, but Matt Ryan has also had top notch receivers that he has benefitted from.    Either would be good.   I don't think we are getting Ryan.  I give Ballard credit for not giving up the farm for one of the QB's that have been available this offseason.  Slim pickens with allot of risk with allot of these guys.  

 

 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TannRy00.htm

Yeah Ballard deserves a lot of credit but at  some point here soon he is going to have to give up picks for a QB. Whether that is a trade or moving up in the draft. This team is too good and we aren’t going to have one just fall in our laps.   

[2006Coltsbestever]

9 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think Tannehill is a very good efficient QB.   I agree that he has benefitted from having Henry as the RB, but Matt Ryan has also had top notch receivers that he has benefitted from.    Either would be good.   I don't think we are getting Ryan.  I give Ballard credit for not giving up the farm for one of the QB's that have been available this offseason.  Slim pickens with allot of risk with allot of these guys.  

 

 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TannRy00.htm

Well we probably won't trade for Ryan, I was just giving my preference. I don't think last seasons play was Matt Ryan's fault, he is the starting QB so I guess he will get blamed for a lot. That roster and coaching was MEH. 

[joecolts]

8 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Lawrence is the best prospect coming out since Luck but because the Jags are drafting him, who knows? When Burrow went to the Bengals I had a bad feeling that he may get injured or have a bad year. Their roster like the Jags roster is just bad. The Colts were smart when they drafted Luck because as bad as we were in 2011 and turning over the majority of the roster, they kept guys like Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis on the team. That VET leadership was huge for Luck. Wayne really helped Luck out bigtime. The Jags don't have a Reggie Wayne. 

This is spot on.  Many do not look at the value of quality, veteran leadership.  If you have solid guys who know the system, know the organization and are invested in the TEAM, it can give a rookie (especially a rookie QB) a solid foundation to build upon.  Good post.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, joecolts said:

This is spot on.  Many do not look at the value of quality, veteran leadership.  If you have solid guys who know the system, know the organization and are invested in the TEAM, it can give a rookie (especially a rookie QB) a solid foundation to build upon.  Good post.

Yeah it is huge. Wayne was a beast in 2012 and it helped Luck learn a lot and gave Luck a top WR in the league. Another thing Wayne did, he opened things up for TY Hilton from getting doubled. That gave TY confidence early in his career and he and Luck developed something special. I try and think of everything because it is not all about talent, or who is more mobile, etc.. Football is a mental game just as much as anything.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[csmopar]

40 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Lawrence is the best prospect coming out since Luck but because the Jags are drafting him, who knows? When Burrow went to the Bengals I had a bad feeling that he may get injured or have a bad year. Their roster like the Jags roster is just bad. The Colts were smart when they drafted Luck because as bad as we were in 2011 and turning over the majority of the roster, they kept guys like Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis on the team. That VET leadership was huge for Luck. Wayne really helped Luck out bigtime. The Jags don't have a Reggie Wayne. 

I dont disagree with any of what you said. I would add too, that the Jags typically haven't shown a lot of patience or help in getting a QB to develop. Lawerence is also coming a shoulder surgery, to his non throwing arm, which has me a bit concerned for injury for him. If the Jags can't protect him like we failed with Luck, history doesn't bode well for him

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

 

 

[Myles]

47 minutes ago, gnet550 said:

Just for laughs...you guys that are getting tired of the rumors....this is nothing lol

 

if anyone else is also a St. Louis Cardinals fan like me, I had to endure 3 years of Arenado rumors before that trade happened...I’ll have to admit when I heard they may trade for him this off season I just said, “yeah, sure” and ignored it. Then low and behold they pulled it off lol

 

i hope this saga doesn’t last that long or some of you will be saying some really not nice things

Cardinal fan here.   

I was thrilled with that trade this season.  This should inject some life into that roster.   I don't expect Arenado's number to match what they have been in Colorado, but even at 20% less, it will be huge for the Cardinals.  

[richard pallo]

19 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

 

So it appears they are tweaking it trying to make it happen.  The phone lines are open.  If this is true then I would think they could agree on something very soon.  

[richard pallo]

55 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yeah Ballard deserves a lot of credit but at  some point here soon he is going to have to give up picks for a QB. Whether that is a trade or moving up in the draft. This team is too good and we aren’t going to have one just fall in our laps.   

I think he is trying to give up picks for a QB.  A veteran QB.  He tried for Stafford and now for Wentz.  Darnold and Mariotta are also available and were high draft picks in the past.  It looks like he thinks Reich is capable of helping the ones he's targeting to turn their careers around versus paying a huge price to move up in the draft especially after drafting Eason last year.   To me that certainly looks like the road he has chosen. 

[MarquisJ]

 

[BlackTiger]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Lawrence is the best prospect coming out since Luck but because the Jags are drafting him, who knows? When Burrow went to the Bengals I had a bad feeling that he may get injured or have a bad year. Their roster like the Jags roster is just bad. The Colts were smart when they drafted Luck because as bad as we were in 2011 and turning over the majority of the roster, they kept guys like Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis on the team. That VET leadership was huge for Luck. Wayne really helped Luck out bigtime. The Jags don't have a Reggie Wayne. 

Yeah, recent history does seem to suggest that Trevor might struggle on that team.  

 

The Jaguars need defense, but they might be smart to double down on Oline and receivers anyway to help their franchise guy.  He is used to having a great team around him at Clemson too.

[MarquisJ]

Just now, MarquisJ said:

 

Unless another teams comes with a offer that Eagles can’t refuse looks like Wentz could get what he wants 

[PrincetonTiger]

1 minute ago, MarquisJ said:

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Well. Seems like this might happen soon.

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Woops beat me too it. Sorry for posting again.

[krunk]

9 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I will add to this, if we trade for Wentz and he leads us to at least a Playoff berth I will be the 1st to apologize and say I wrong about him. I am a stand up guy though, a lot aren't. It is too early to make a true prediction though because we haven't had Free Agency or the Draft yet. 

 

Here is a question for you @NewColtsFan, if you took Rivers off our team this past year and replaced him with Wentz, do you think we go 11-5 and make the playoffs?

I have another question. Do you think Wentz plays the way he did behind Indys team? The man was sacked 50 times behind a tradh O line and no talent/or inexperienced receivers. Hes gotten his team to the playoffs once, and was damn sure headed there in 2017 bf injury so id say yes he could have gotten us to a Wildcard at min on a better team.

[onebad150]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Woops beat me too it. Sorry for posting again.

I am not sure I believe all these unverified reports, BUT if there is any truth in these reports it bothers me that we are bidding against ourselves for a QB that was benched last year because of his performance or lack of

[csmopar]

10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Well. Seems like this might happen soon.

 

 

well I'll be taking up drinking again if that happens lol

[MarquisJ]

1 minute ago, onebad150 said:

I am not sure I believe all these unverified reports, BUT if there is any truth in these reports it bothers me that we are bidding against ourselves for a QB that was benched last year because of his performance or lack of

Twitter allows credible people with a verification check by their name so when you see that 9/10 that person is legit. In some cases you have people who are verified and just like to tweet; I don’t see that here. All of them have been pretty much the same in regards to Colts and Wentz. Also remember you can be very credible and still be wrong when it comes to what will happen.

[Myles]

1 minute ago, MarquisJ said:

Twitter allows credible people with a verification check by their name so when you see that 9/10 that person is legit. In some cases you have people who are verified and just like to tweet; I don’t see that here. All of them have been pretty much the same in regards to Colts and Wentz. Also remember you can be very credible and still be wrong when it comes to what will happen.

Only to a point.   The more wrongs you are the less credible you are.  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

If we get him it will be fun to have a QB that can make plays when things break down. He should be fun to watch.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

People have to remember things change quick in the NFL. A source can be right at the time but it still not happen. Zak doesn’t give to much insider stuff so when he posts it is real. Doesn’t mean it can’t change.

[richard pallo]

23 minutes ago, onebad150 said:

I am not sure I believe all these unverified reports, BUT if there is any truth in these reports it bothers me that we are bidding against ourselves for a QB that was benched last year because of his performance or lack of

Ballard has said in the past that a trade has to be a win win for both teams.  They are trying to get there.  His performance last year is not a roadblock for Ballard.  He has confidence in Reich.  If Reich can resurrect his career than the cost will look like a bargain.  

[groundnpound]

I was all for Rivers coming in, the guy is a mental giant compared to wentz. I wasn't his biggest fan, but i learned to love his attitude and accuracy and the move was a no-brainer for Ballard. I'll be the first to admit and apologize if Wentz comes here and balls out, I just don't see the latter happening.

[groundnpound]

3 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Ballard has said in the past that a trade has to be a win win for both teams.  They are trying to get there.  His performance last year is not a roadblock for Ballard.  He has confidence in Reich.  If Reich can resurrect his career than the cost will look like a bargain.  

 

I think the deal would be done if last years performance wasn't a bit of a roadblock.

[csmopar]

8 minutes ago, groundnpound said:

 

I think the deal would be done if last years performance wasn't a bit of a roadblock.

im not so sure.  Its still in the Eagles court at this point.  I can't imagine this dragging on much more before Ballard just walks away.  

[PRnum1]

10 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think the people that were calling him noodle arm and saying we wouldn't even make the playoffs with Rivers should apologize. I for one loved the signing when we got Rivers and predicted a 10-6 record + a playoff berth. He even played better than I thought but I wasn't surprised. I thought he would be good. I just seen several in here bashing Rivers but yet they want Wentz here. I am a little confused with that is all.

I think there has been one poster who admitted they were wrong but there weren't many.

 

What's really sad is we were in a position to go into Buffalo and win the game.  We would have won if not for Frank Reich's head scratching game calls.

 

One thing not discussed much here with Wentz is his selfish prima donna attitude.  I've been reading that he's difficult to work with and not a good team mate.  In fact many of his Philly team mates called him a locker room cancer.

 

The real danger is what if he comes to the Colts and completely destroys the comradery with his me first attitude ?  One thing I always liked about the Colts is how the players play for each other, not for themselves.

 

That could completely change in one season with Wentz and the damage could take years to repair.

[Colts1324]

I have been saying every day for the last 2 weeks, "Today is going to be the day."

 

Will today actually be the day?? 

[richard pallo]

1 minute ago, groundnpound said:

 

I think the deal would be done if last years performance wasn't a bit of a roadblock.

It's a roadblock for the Eagles.  They are trying to get more than market value.  Ballard won't over pay.  Once the Eagles realize it, and it appears they are finally getting it,  he will be traded. 

[richard pallo]

6 minutes ago, Colts1324 said:

I have been saying every day for the last 2 weeks, "Today is going to be the day."

 

Will today actually be the day?? 

Yes please.  If it is inevitable let it be today!

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, PRnum1 said:

I think there has been one poster who admitted they were wrong but there weren't many.

 

What's really sad is we were in a position to go into Buffalo and win the game.  We would have won if not for Frank Reich's head scratching game calls.

 

One thing not discussed much here with Wentz is his selfish prima donna attitude.  I've been reading that he's difficult to work with and not a good team mate.  In fact many of his Philly team mates called him a locker room cancer.

 

The real danger is what if he comes to the Colts and completely destroys the comradery with his me first attitude ?  One thing I always liked about the Colts is how the players play for each other, not for themselves.

 

That could completely change in one season with Wentz and the damage could take years to repair.

I don’t worry about this for a couple of reasons. Reich knows him very well. If they were worried about this they wouldn’t even think about trading for him. Second we have a great culture in the locker room.

[Smoke317]

21 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Ballard has said in the past that a trade has to be a win win for both teams.  They are trying to get there.  His performance last year is not a roadblock for Ballard.  He has confidence in Reich.  If Reich can resurrect his career than the cost will look like a bargain.  

Let's play the devil's advocate. If we get Wentz and Reich can't resurrect his career & he struggles and his selfishness starts to create problems in our locker room should Ballard still have faith in Reich???  Could Reich pushing for Wentz and things falling apart because of it actually cost Reich his job?  Or is Reich untouchable regardless of how it plays out?  

[BlackTiger]

Just now, Smoke317 said:

Let's play the devil's advocate. If we get Wentz and Reich can't resurrect his career & he struggles and his selfishness starts to create problems in our locker room should Ballard still have faith in Reich???  Could Reich pushing for Wentz and things falling apart because of it actually cost Reich his job?  Or is Reich untouchable regardless of how it plays out?  

I do think there is some risk for Reich here.  It may not get him fired but it will certainly be a strike or two against him if it goes really badly with Wentz

[richard pallo]

9 minutes ago, PRnum1 said:

I think there has been one poster who admitted they were wrong but there weren't many.

 

What's really sad is we were in a position to go into Buffalo and win the game.  We would have won if not for Frank Reich's head scratching game calls.

 

One thing not discussed much here with Wentz is his selfish prima donna attitude.  I've been reading that he's difficult to work with and not a good team mate.  In fact many of his Philly team mates called him a locker room cancer.

 

The real danger is what if he comes to the Colts and completely destroys the comradery with his me first attitude ?  One thing I always liked about the Colts is how the players play for each other, not for themselves.

 

That could completely change in one season with Wentz and the damage could take years to repair.

You would think a smart GM such as Ballard would have checked into all of those allegations.  And he has Reich as his coach and he wants him.  Apparently he's not worried. 

[Smoke317]

1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

You would think a smart GM such as Ballard would have checked into all of those allegations.  And he has Reich as his coach and he wants him.  Apparently he's not worried. 

I see it like Kevin Bowen sees it.  If Ballard really had ultimate faith and belief that Frank could resurrect Wentz to MVP level, what's an extra 3rd or 4th round pick to get a franchise QB?  Or who wouldn't trade the 21st pick for an MVP caliber QB?  The fact that he's being firm in his positioning tells me that he doesn't have supreme confidence in a Wentz career resurrection.  He may ultimately do the deal but he's not in any sort of a hurry to do so.  At any given moment another team could have swooped in and grabbed Wentz.  Ballard doesn't seem too concerned at the moment.

[John Waylon]

6 minutes ago, Smoke317 said:

Let's play the devil's advocate. If we get Wentz and Reich can't resurrect his career & he struggles and his selfishness starts to create problems in our locker room should Ballard still have faith in Reich???  Could Reich pushing for Wentz and things falling apart because of it actually cost Reich his job?  Or is Reich untouchable regardless of how it plays out?  

Reich getting Wentz is us going all in on Reich. They will be tied together at the hip. The success and/or failure will be shared. Frank isn’t looking at this deal going “it’s whatever. If we get him we get him if we don’t we don’t. No big deal.” Otherwise Ballard’s offer not being considered would be the end of the deal. He’s not going to stay on the hook for a player that he values as little as he seems to value Wentz. We just traded a (very nice) first round pick for a stud in Buckner last year, so if Ballard values a player he’s willing to pay. 
 

He’s not as willing to pay this time around. Most of the push for this deal has to be coming from Reich thinking that he can be the one to fix or unlock Wentz. If we make a deal and that doesn’t happen Reich needs to own it shoulder most of the responsibility.