Rivers fate (Merge)

[Thebrashandthebold]

7 hours ago, colts8718 said:

LOL WOW you would rather have Rivers over Luck ask any Colt fan who no's football' who they would rather have. You must be related to Rivers no other rational explanation 

Well, let's think about that. What did Luck ever win? Was he ever an MVP? Will he be a Hall of Fame QB? Does he have outlandish career numbers? Did he walk out on the team? Rivers played very well and stayed within what he can do now. I don't think you could have asked for much more. He showed up for every game even when injured. I do not see the infatuation with Luck. He is gone. Let him go. He walked out on us.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

If Pederson gets fired that might just keep Wentz in Phili. They have options though with Hurts and drafting another QB. But with Wentz contract he might stay if Pederson is fired.

[TimetobringDfence!]

47 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Maybe that is where Jacoby comes in. He won’t cost a ton. To many QB out there.He knows the system. I think having a veteran would be very important if we did decide to go with Eason or a rookie. 

It wouldn't bother me, it would help Ballard keep good cap space to intrigue young guys to earn contracts. Hes the best drafting GM and it helps get those players to play their best when there is incentive to get that contract. 

[TimetobringDfence!]

42 minutes ago, Thebrashandthebold said:

Well, let's think about that. What did Luck ever win? Was he ever an MVP? Will he be a Hall of Fame QB? Does he have outlandish career numbers? Did he walk out on the team? Rivers played very well and stayed within what he can do now. I don't think you could have asked for much more. He showed up for every game even when injured. I do not see the infatuation with Luck. He is gone. Let him go. He walked out on us.

Luck over Reich 10 out 10 times.

[Zoltan]

The one thing I won’t miss if Rivers leaves is the fans that think he walks on water. But all in all he played great for us this season considering he came in and learned the playbook with minimal offseason, I just hope he doesn’t comeback and look like Favre or Peyton there last year. 

[John Waylon]

Well, Frank has been frank about it: 

 

He wants Phil back as the starter next year. 

[Patrick Miller]

2 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

Maybe that is where Jacoby comes in. He won’t cost a ton. To many QB out there.He knows the system. I think having a veteran would be very important if we did decide to go with Eason or a rookie. 

Tbh I really don't want Brissett back next season. I think we've seen his ceiling and I'd rather go with Eason or bring in another qb.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

10 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

Well, Frank has been frank about it: 

 

He wants Phil back as the starter next year. 

Yea  he said that but also said they will make the right business decision.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, Patrick Miller said:

Tbh I really don't want Brissett back next season. I think we've seen his ceiling and I'd rather go with Eason or bring in another qb.

That post was about if we started a rookie or Eason. If we go that route we need a veteran in case things go south. So he could be that veteran backup if we go with a rookie or Eason.

[Patrick Miller]

4 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

That post was about if we started a rookie or Eason. If we go that route we need a veteran in case things go south. So he could be that veteran backup if we go with a rookie or Eason.

Ah. I'd still rather have a better qb than Brissett as a back up.

[StatesmanN]

2 hours ago, Thebrashandthebold said:

Well, let's think about that. What did Luck ever win? Was he ever an MVP? Will he be a Hall of Fame QB? Does he have outlandish career numbers? Did he walk out on the team? Rivers played very well and stayed within what he can do now. I don't think you could have asked for much more. He showed up for every game even when injured. I do not see the infatuation with Luck. He is gone. Let him go. He walked out on us.

I think Luck was very good, but I do think he was somewhat overrated overall.

 

I don't think he ever lived up to the college hype when he was playing like Manning did.

[NewColtsFan]

9 minutes ago, StatesmanN said:

I think Luck was very good, but I do think he was somewhat overrated overall.

 

I don't think he ever lived up to the college hype when he was playing like Manning did.

You might want to consider he never had a very good team around him.   He dragged lesser teams to great success. 
 

Just food for thought. 

[TimetobringDfence!]

16 minutes ago, Patrick Miller said:

Tbh I really don't want Brissett back next season. I think we've seen his ceiling and I'd rather go with Eason or bring in another qb.

We've already paid the man and I dont think anyone wants to trade for him.

[NewColtsFan]

It’s not up on the Colts.com page yet...  but I expect it to be.    It’s over on the Colts page on ESPN.

 

Reich is quoted as saying he thought Rivers had a good year and has more good football in him.   He’d like to have him back.

 

That said....   Frank adds it's NOT his call, and that other considerations will be factored, such as money and who else might be available. 
 

EDIT:    Here's the link....

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/30687157/frank-reich-says-wants-philip-rivers-indianapolis-colts-qb-2021

[Patrick Miller]

3 minutes ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

We've already paid the man and I dont think anyone wants to trade for him.

He's a UFA isn't he?

[TimetobringDfence!]

5 minutes ago, Patrick Miller said:

He's a UFA isn't he?

Yes my bad I had to look it up. He signed for two years not three.

[TimetobringDfence!]

1 minute ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

Yes my bad I had to look it up. He signed for two years not three.

As much as we paid the man he owes us a season lol...for real tho...

[King Colt]

I agree. 

[StatesmanN]

21 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

You might want to consider he never had a very good team around him.   He dragged lesser teams to great success. 
 

Just food for thought. 

Agree.  I think his first 3 years were awesome, especially when he ran more.

 

But injuries took their toll and especially towards the end of his last season and in the playoff game against the Chiefs his arm velocity went down to nothing.  He was guiding the ball and he knew it and I think that played a part in his retirement. He was a shell of his old self.  Not that Manning had great velocity either but his football smarts and devotion to the game were much higher than Luck's.  I had heard stories how some coaches thought that Luck did not put in the time and effort into the film room like he should have for example. 

1 minute ago, StatesmanN said:

 

 

[coltfaninnewyork]

IMO he will not be the quarterback next season ,just a gut feeling .

[StatesmanN]

Would be another wasted year of some fine Colt talent on the team.

 

You are not going to win a SB with Rivers and nor will you be getting experience for the QB of the future.

 

So why?  It's pointless.

 

But Frank will be Frank.

[TimetobringDfence!]

Merge this with Rivers Fate please.

[w87r]

Imo, only way Rivers wont be back, is if he elects to retire.

 

 

Merging to Rivers fate thread though

[EastStreet]

9 hours ago, Fluke_33 said:

It doesn’t need to be opinion on reich.  I just heard his press conference when asked if he wants pr back he did not hesitate and responded positively 3 times. Yeah, yes and yes.  And then said we will see how it plays out. 
 

I haven’t seen a press conference from Ballard yet but as you said after his performance yesterday I don’t see how he won’t be back. 
 

I think rivers  is back in Indy next year. 

Folks keep forgetting about PR being new, not having a preseason, needing to develop chemistry with pass catchers through the season..... Given all that he played well, and would likely play better in year 2. I'm fine with them going a different direction, I just don't see any clearly better directions right now. We did very well yell yesterday despite a lot of dumb....... and none of the dumb came from Rivers. Even Leonard said he prays Rivers comes back. 

[MCurtis32]

Why ,Why,Why,  Why did the Colts give Brissett a whole year to get better? Why did the colts keep Brissett around to run short yardage plays with Eason not even suiting up? Are they waiting for Eason to grow up? Why did they draft him? Kelly most likely could have done as well as Rivers. Whats next, Rivers retires, the colts, not knowing what Eason can do, calls kelly to come to camp.

Kelly reply's " you guys would not know a good qb if it bit you", and hangs up. Irsay sighns Brissett two another rediculous deal to do absolutely nothing. This all could have been solved three years ago.

[EastStreet]

7 hours ago, The Fish said:

As of today and going forward and given all of the roster disparity between the Colts offense and the Lions?

At least for me, it kind of is, though I might be a little more diplomatic if I was wording that sentiment. 

 

And a minor side rant... The QB's job- the thing he needs to be the best at, is throwing the ball. This is why Rivers can be 40 and immobile and play in the NFL. Mobility is cool, but it's not the thing and guys like Kevin Bowen making it almost paramount isn't correct imo. 

Running is part of it. There are lots of good running QBs that can throw. I'll take the smart, good passer, every day over the all the mobile guys who aren't great passing, or aren't smart about reading Ds, going through progressions, etc.

[StatesmanN]

23 minutes ago, MCurtis32 said:

Why ,Why,Why,  Why did the Colts give Brissett a whole year to get better? Why did the colts keep Brissett around to run short yardage plays with Eason not even suiting up? Are they waiting for Eason to grow up? Why did they draft him? Kelly most likely could have done as well as Rivers. Whats next, Rivers retires, the colts, not knowing what Eason can do, calls kelly to come to camp.

Kelly reply's " you guys would not know a good qb if it bit you", and hangs up. Irsay sighns Brissett two another rediculous deal to do absolutely nothing. This all could have been solved three years ago.

I think it has been 2 years wasted I agree.  People can talk all they want about Ballard, but he has now had 2 years to find a Luck replacement and all he has done is overpaid a backup by a factor or 5 and brought in a great guy in Rivers, but who is someone who will never get you a SB.

 

Total waste of some fine Colts players on both sides of the ball.

[StatesmanN]

11 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Running is part of it. There are lots of good running QBs that can throw. I'll take the smart, good passer, every day over the all the mobile guys who aren't great passing, or aren't smart about reading Ds, going through progressions, etc.

In today's NFL almost any young Qb is athletic enough to run.

 

Look at Luck.   He isn't the most athletic but he could run well enough to save a broken play or score at the goal line.

 

Rivers is perhaps the ONLY qb in the league who cannot run....at all.  Even Brady can somewhat.

 

Name me another qb in the league who can't run at all.  Big Ben?  And his arm strength is faltering and look how much Pittsburgh is faltering as a result.

 

Combine Rivers lack of mobility with no arm strength/spin and that is a huge liability. 

[EastStreet]

4 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I think he is a no brainer over Rivers.  Those stats do nothing to dissuade me considering the state of the two defenses each was going up against.  He is certainly mobile enough to get the job done and probably be extremely productive for a long time with us.  I would much rather have a pocket QB that is not only protected by a good OL but also all the new rules protecting the QB.  QB's that have to break out and run, whether designed or not, will have a shorter career IMO.  The more you risk yourself the worse your odds.  

I'm not against Stafford. I like him. He's just not near a no brainer to me. My neighbor, a big UGA fan, loves him. I've even seen him play several times in college between the hedges and in Knox. He's got upside, but he's got a lot of flaws too. And if you take Stafford, you're basically telegraphing that you're not interested in drafting and developing a young QB. I'm OK with that to be honest. And keep in mind he's got a potential out (contract) right now, and would be looking for at least a 4 year deal for 35 or more per year. I'm not totally against that either, but it's a lot to think about in terms of commitment. I think Carr is the only no brainer to me right now.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, StatesmanN said:

Agree.  I think his first 3 years were awesome, especially when he ran more.

 

But injuries took their toll and especially towards the end of his last season and in the playoff game against the Chiefs his arm velocity went down to nothing.  He was guiding the ball and he knew it and I think that played a part in his retirement. He was a shell of his old self.  Not that Manning had great velocity either but his football smarts and devotion to the game were much higher than Luck's.  I had heard stories how some coaches thought that Luck did not put in the time and effort into the film room like he should have for example. 

 

I’ve only seen those stories, about Luck not putting in enough time, from disgruntled Luck fans.

Otherwise, I’ve never seen those stories coming from coaches or anyone else inside the organization.   As someone who admired Luck, I’ve tried to read as much as I could about him.   I’ve never read anything negative about him from either the Ballard-Reich group or the Grigson-Pagano team.   Just unhappy fans. 

[StatesmanN]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I’ve only seen those stories, about Luck not putting in enough time, from disgruntled Luck fans.

Otherwise, I’ve never seen those stories coming from coaches or anyone else inside the organization.   As someone who admired Luck, I’ve tried to read as much as I could about him.   I’ve never read anything negative about him from either the Ballard-Reich group or the Grigson-Pagano team.   Just unhappy fans. 

I think any person that would quit like Luck did?  That is a pretty big red flag about Luck's devotion to the game and is a sign that his heart wasn't in it....and hence signals a strong possibility that he wasn't putting in the time in the film room.

 

People in love with something spend all of their time practicing and doing it. 

 

People in love with the game don't quit. 

[NewColtsFan]

19 minutes ago, StatesmanN said:

I think any person that would quit like Luck did?  That is a pretty big red flag about Luck's devotion to the game and is a sign that his heart wasn't in it....and hence signals a strong possibility that he wasn't putting in the time in the film room.

 

People in love with something spend all of their time practicing and doing it. 

 

People in love with the game don't quit. 

Oh, Dear God!      

 

Just when I thought things couldn’t get any crazier......

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, StatesmanN said:

In today's NFL almost any young Qb is athletic enough to run.

 

Look at Luck. 

 

Rivers is perhaps the ONLY qb in the league who cannot run....at all.  Even Brady can somewhat.

 

Combine that with no arm strength/spin and that is a huge liability. 

Dude, you don't need to run when you have a top 5 line. And Brady isn't mobile. I'm not opposed to mobile QBs, and it's great to have a guy that's both mobile, and a good passer, but they are rare. And we're not drafting high enough to get one. 

 

The arm strength/spin argument is just silly. Rivers was top 10 this year. He had a better QBR than Mr. Mobile Allen did yesterday. 

[PaulSTL]

I guess y’all know more about football than Leonard, TY, Q and Kelly.  They all want him back.  

[Zoltan]

After Frank talked about the business side makes me think that Rivers won't be back, Bringing Rivers back would be 20+ Million off the cap, and Ballard doesn't have the same relationship ties to Rivers. I think after we go through resigns and free agency they will decide to move on, unless Rivers plays with a big discount.

[Stephen]

14 hours ago, Zoltan said:

After Frank talked about the business side makes me think that Rivers won't be back, Bringing Rivers back would be 20+ Million off the cap, and Ballard doesn't have the same relationship ties to Rivers. I think after we go through resigns and free agency they will decide to move on, unless Rivers plays with a big discount.

I think we should draft a rookie to compete  with eason for the job

[eaglerockdude]

I know Rivers probably will retire if he does not return to the Colts, but I saw a team yesterday that could use him.  They are called the Tennessee titans.

 

[chad72]

19 hours ago, Zoltan said:

The one thing I won’t miss if Rivers leaves is the fans that think he walks on water. But all in all he played great for us this season considering he came in and learned the playbook with minimal offseason, I just hope he doesn’t comeback and look like Favre or Peyton there last year. 

 

THAT is my #1 concern. When hand offs become pitches and you have to start working around his limitations more and more, you have to examine other options. He is the best option amongst all the QBs on the roster right now and will still be the case if we cannot land Stafford or Carr but it doesn't mean that we have to deal with his limitations and not improve the QB position.

 

If Peyton was not carried by that Broncos defense, we'd be talking about a difficult ending to his career because Elway was ready to let him go if he wouldn't take a salary cut.

[chad72]

4 minutes ago, eaglerockdude said:

I know Rivers probably will retire if he does not return to the Colts, but I saw a team yesterday that could use him.  They are called the Tennessee titans.

 

 

Nah, Rivers cannot do the roll outs that Tannehill can and Frank is a better play caller than Arthur Smith who has no creative bullets left once a team manages to limit Henry. Tannehill could benefit from a better play caller because the Titans are even more predictable on offense than the Colts, except that their execution is better with Henry more hit than miss. Sooner than later, Henry will slow down and the shine on Arthur Smith will wear out and they will be looking for a new OC.

 

The problem you saw yesterday was Arthur Smith underachieving against a team like the Ravens by not utilizing Tannehill's rollouts. Go check the Titans boards, they are mad with Arthur Smith about not utilizing Tannehill's legs like they normally do at the biggest moment of a playoff game.

[Smoke317]

5 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Nah, Rivers cannot do the roll outs that Tannehill can and Frank is a better play caller than Arthur Smith who has no creative bullets left once a team manages to limit Henry. Tannehill could benefit from a better play caller because the Titans are even more predictable on offense than the Colts, except that their execution is better with Henry more hit than miss. Sooner than later, Henry will slow down and the shine on Arthur Smith will wear out and they will be looking for a new OC.

 

The problem you saw yesterday was Arthur Smith underachieving against a team like the Ravens by not utilizing Tannehill's rollouts. Go check the Titans boards, they are mad with Arthur Smith about not utilizing Tannehill's legs like they normally do at the biggest moment of a playoff game.

3 of Tannehill’s last 4 playoff games have been hideous. 2 games last year under 100 yards passing. We’d have run Jacoby out of town for 2 performances like that regardless of if we won or not (they did).  Then barely over 200 yards in the AFC championship game last year (the one I’m counting as good) & back to under 200 yards this year.  Dude is looking quite pedestrian when it matters most.  If he can’t hit the big strike plays, it’s like he can’t hit anything. Still feels like they pull off miracles with timely big plays or opponent turnovers. Don’t know how long Vraebel can sustain that level of good fortune.