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Qb for next year/QB class of 2021 (merge)


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I love how good people are at reaching conclusions, based on absolutely no information at all.    First, we were definitely getting Stafford. Now, we're definitely not. (And we will definite

Stafford was always my #1 choice among veteran options. (He was my preferred choice last offseason, someone posted a poll and I picked him.)   I'M ALL IN ON STAFFORD YALL.

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5 hours ago, Smonroe said:

 

They're both QBs with potential that aren't living up to it.  Could a good QB coach and a good O line change that?  

 

It would be fitting to get Darnold for a 3rd round pick though, lol!

Darnold is on a bad team he would be perfect with the Colts

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54 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

 

Yeah he looks like a QB that has the worst offense line and worst WR group in the NFL

 

Oh, I think his problem goes way beyond that.  I've watched a couple Eagles games and I couldn't think of a regular starter (not a backup starting for an injured starter) in the league who looked worse than Wentz.

 

I mean, Andrew Luck had a porous offensive line for a few years there.  He made do -- despite getting banged up pretty hard for it.  And, beyond TY, he didn't always have the best receiving corps.

 

I don't think Carson Wentz c. 2020 would be successful on any team in the NFL.  I do think that Sam Darnold would be much more successful on a different team and with a coach not named Adam Gase.

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11 minutes ago, colts8718 said:

Darnold is on a bad team he would be perfect with the Colts

 

I'm not going to go so far as to say he'd be "perfect".

 

But I do think that the Colts would be a better place for Sam than his current situation, and Sam would be a better QB for the Colts than their current situation.  It seems like a win-win to me.

 

That said, I think our #1 priority this off-season might be LT rather than QB.  It's probably a pipedream that we could get Sewell or Leatherwood.  But there are a host of other highly regarded OTs in the draft:  Darrisaw, Mayfield, Mays, Slater, Cosmi, Labryan Ray.

 

I'd rather we try to get a QB through free agency or trade and use our 1st round pick to replace AC.

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20 minutes ago, Colt.45 said:

 

The offense is averaging more points per game right now than it did in '18 IIRC. 

 

Because of the defense getting us points or giving us short fields on turnovers. You really think 18 tds explains averaging more points?

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16 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

Because of the defense getting us points or giving us short fields on turnovers. You really think 18 tds explains averaging more points?

Average starting position for drives is close. Own 29.8 to own 30.5 (2018 v 2020) so that's a wash.

You're speaking of the TDs as if passing is the only way to score. The team has as many rushing TDs now as it did in the whole 2018...there's still a quarter of the reg. season to go.

I remember games in 18 where it felt like the offense was in a lull and then something would spark them. It happened v Jacksonville, happened v Houston, happened several times in the playoffs. Maybe I am misremembering and maybe we need to clarify what we mean by the offense stalling. By stalling, i mean the offense goes through spurts where it feels like they cannot execute.

 

FYI, the one big thing the stats seem to point to is that the team was better at finishing off chances in 2018. So they were better in the orange/red zone. I think even without looking at stats, we'd lean towards that being true.

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41 minutes ago, luv_pony_express said:

 

Oh, I think his problem goes way beyond that.  I've watched a couple Eagles games and I couldn't think of a regular starter (not a backup starting for an injured starter) in the league who looked worse than Wentz.

 

I mean, Andrew Luck had a porous offensive line for a few years there.  He made do -- despite getting banged up pretty hard for it.  And, beyond TY, he didn't always have the best receiving corps.

 

I don't think Carson Wentz c. 2020 would be successful on any team in the NFL.  I do think that Sam Darnold would be much more successful on a different team and with a coach not named Adam Gase.

 

I disagree, I have watched almost every eagles game because my brother is an Eagles fan and Wentz is the only good thing about their offense, and its Howie Roseman and Pederson's fault for not protecting him and for the 2nd year in a row have him throwing to practice squad receivers. He is trying to hard and forcing passes but the fact that Pederson's ego is so large that he  decided to not have an Offensive Coordinator this season is a large reason the offense has failed. I would love to have Wentz because he and Frank work well together but his contract makes him unmovable right now

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i would want rivers back but on a discount .  The cap is going down 20 million if he stays at 25 million the team will be worse then this year and then there would be no point .    Only if the colts can keep this same team together i would be for it , if they have to cut key players to do it then no.

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5 hours ago, DownHillRunner said:

Wentz's contract makes it nearly impossible to deal him. That is why I don't see it happening. Plus, the cost will be too high. 

Wentz is no good. His derp passes have been falling  short, he walks into sacks, fails to see whole field and is injury prone

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1 hour ago, bestQBever said:

If I had to choose between Wentz and Darnold, Give me Wentz. I think a good O line and Frank Reich could fix some of the stuff Wentz is doing right now. He has shown he has MVP level talent.

Negative.  Wentz is terrible.  Darnold is to. I'd pick Darnold between the two because  of cost of wentz and have him compete  against  Eason for the starting  job.

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7 hours ago, colts8718 said:

Darnold is on a bad team he would be perfect with the Colts

Idk he has some things to work on mechanic  wise. Throws too many ints. His throw on the run and rushing ability  is nice. I've noticed  some of his throws don't  ways hit the receiver  in stride. 

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10 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

So once again Darnold gets excuses for his poor play.  Jacoby played similarly poorly (new team no offseason thrown to the wolves & 5-2 start before injury and going 7-8) but you know he's not great but Darnold is a lot better...  Why?  Because you want him to be?  Stats haven't shown him to be better.  They've shown him to be just as below average as Jacoby.  But it must be the Jets and Gase right? Sure they suck but Tannehill put up better numbers despite having Gase in Miami.  Why can't Darnold put up average QB numbers? 

 

Just like with Rosen (and even Gase), certain guys keep getting chance after chance and excuses made for them.  Is Darnold better than Bortles?  Bortles was a couple plays from going to a Super Bowl.  Even Mitch Trubisky's resume looks better than Darnold.  So again why do some QB's like Brissett, Trubisky, & Bortles get blamed for their performances while others like Darnold & Rosen get excuses made for them?  Look at how the excuses for Wentz have helped him regress to the bench,

 

If you want to say that Darnold may still reach his potential?  Fine.  Maybe.  Or maybe this is as good as he's ever gonna be? But to say you can't fault him for his poor play is making excuses for a guy who has so far been a below average QB.  That blame falls on him.  Poor organizations and coaching and bad line play haven't stopped Herbert or Burrow from balling out.  Even Mayfield in Cleveland, who I'm not the biggest fan of, has put up above average numbers.  Darnold is looking closer to being a bust than a star QB in this league.  I still say give Eason a shot.  I like his upside and potential better than Sam's.


They aren’t really that similar.

 

Last season...JB was 27...in his 4th year in the league...playing behind a very good OL. It was also his 2nd season in the system...with a solid head coach. And he took all of the offseason snaps that year...so he wasn’t thrown to the wolves.

 

Last season...Darnold was 22...in his 2nd pro season...playing behind a terrible OL that allowed him to be pressured at a league-leading rate. It was also his 1st season in a system with a historically bad HC. He also had mono...and still went 7-6 as a starter.

 

There has definitely been more flashes with Darnold. This past season has been terrible no doubt...but it’s also a lost season...and I would be willing to throw it out if I believed he wasn’t broken...because the talent is there. 

 

That said...I don’t think Ballard goes this route.

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I just want us to have a piece for moving forward, someone who can prove and develop into a winner, we have a young team who is really melding together, especially on offense, I don't want to "waste" it on another Rivers situation. 

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18 hours ago, DownHillRunner said:

Wentz's contract makes it nearly impossible to deal him. That is why I don't see it happening. Plus, the cost will be too high. 

 

They could get a little cap savings from trading him next year.  

 

I favor Wentz. . . Guy used to play well and he played well when our current head coach was his offensive coordinator.   In fact up until this year his stats are pretty good. 

 

Would not be overly risky from our end because the Eagles would be forced to pay off his signing bonus.

 

 

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2 hours ago, rayski said:

I just want us to have a piece for moving forward, someone who can prove and develop into a winner, we have a young team who is really melding together, especially on offense, I don't want to "waste" it on another Rivers situation. 

Kudos for using the word “develop”..... we’re so used to turn-key, pro-ready QBs that we let impatience get the best of us.

 

Hopefully Eason IS the guy! :dunno:


I certainly hope so.... it would save us a hell of a lot of cap space to round out the rest of the roster with.

 

Assuming we make the playoffs and acquit ourselves well.... then next year I’m good with....

 

1 - Rivers (final season @18m)

2 - Eason (Rookie contract)

3 - Brissett (@3 yrs/4m per year .... not a penny more or we let him walk)

 

This is an orderly progression..... assuming Eason  does in fact earn his way towards the starting role.... and Jacoby, a solid backup.... lands where he should have been all along had Luck not bailed.

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2 hours ago, pacolts56 said:

Kudos for using the word “develop”..... we’re so used to turn-key, pro-ready QBs that we let impatience get the best of us.

 

Hopefully Eason IS the guy! :dunno:


I certainly hope so.... it would save us a hell of a lot of cap space to round out the rest of the roster with.

 

Assuming we make the playoffs and acquit ourselves well.... then next year I’m good with....

 

1 - Rivers (final season @18m)

2 - Eason (Rookie contract)

3 - Brissett (@3 yrs/4m per year .... not a penny more or we let him walk)

 

This is an orderly progression..... assuming Eason  does in fact earn his way towards the starting role.... and Jacoby, a solid backup.... lands where he should have been all along had Luck not bailed.

Yeah, the only thing I'd disagree with is another year of Rivers, if he wins it all, okay, fair, but to me he isn't the guy to take this team to the next level, Checkdown Rivers makes our offense way to predictable and we'll struggle to compete with guys like Wilson and Mahomes in the playoffs.  We'll see soon enough I guess.

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9 minutes ago, rayski said:

Yeah, the only thing I'd disagree with is another year of Rivers, if he wins it all, okay, fair, but to me he isn't the guy to take this team to the next level, Checkdown Rivers makes our offense way to predictable and we'll struggle to compete with guys like Wilson and Mahomes in the playoffs.  We'll see soon enough I guess.

Well Checkdown Rivers is 10th in the league in yardage. So he is checking down field with the best of them. 

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9 minutes ago, rayski said:

Yeah, the only thing I'd disagree with is another year of Rivers, if he wins it all, okay, fair, but to me he isn't the guy to take this team to the next level, Checkdown Rivers makes our offense way to predictable and we'll struggle to compete with guys like Wilson and Mahomes in the playoffs.  We'll see soon enough I guess.

I think if he wins it all he will retire on top.  No reason to stick around.  We can win it all with Rivers.  All Qb's check down when the 1st target is not there.  Rivers doesn't have top tier guys to throw to so they are not open as often.  A little better use of our run game wouldn't hurt either.  Big Ben threw 50 times the other day.  Dumb.  And most were all short. 

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1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

Well Checkdown Rivers is 10th in the league in yardage. So he is checking down field with the best of them. 

 

1 hour ago, richard pallo said:

I think if he wins it all he will retire on top.  No reason to stick around.  We can win it all with Rivers.  All Qb's check down when the 1st target is not there.  Rivers doesn't have top tier guys to throw to so they are not open as often.  A little better use of our run game wouldn't hurt either.  Big Ben threw 50 times the other day.  Dumb.  And most were all short. 

I'm aware I'm a Rivers hater and to be fair I enjoyed our games and his play a lot more than I thought I would. I just don't see enough to make me believe he'll suddenly become an all out winner for us at age 39. I won't be sad if he proves me wrong tho :strong:

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