Highest % of Missed Tackles Forced - 2020

[Colt.45]

 

 

Presented with no comment.

[csmopar]

Wow

[jbaron04]

19 minutes ago, Colt.45 said:

 

 

Presented with no comment.

I know what you getting at but , Iol

[Colt.45]

The numbers sure always seem to back Wilkins. I know some feel Frank Reich went away from JT too quickly in that Baltimore loss.

Just now, jbaron04 said:

I know what you getting at but , Iol

Like I said.....presented without comment. Make of it what you will.

[aaron11]

i have a comment, hes a fine back up but im not banging the table for him to get more carries.  i do think taylor has the talent to be special 

[jbaron04]

5 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

i have a comment, hes a fine back up but im not banging the table for him to get more carries.  i do think taylor has the talent to be special 

Yea I agree frank has a real short lease on Taylor but rivers have unlimited rope , vet making rookie mistakes is ok but rookie making rookie mistakes they get punished 

[JPFolks]

30 minutes ago, Colt.45 said:

 

 

Presented with no comment.

And yet somehow he's still 3.7 yards per carry.  Small sample size, but does that simply mean he gets the ball 4 yards deep and gets hit twice before the line of scrimmage? Yes, often it does.  

[BProland85]

I’ve always believed in going with the hot hand. I also believe Wilkins is better used in start of games, due to reliability and ball security, with JT brought in to wear down the defense afterwords. 

[Colt.45]

16 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

And yet somehow he's still 3.7 yards per carry.  Small sample size, but does that simply mean he gets the ball 4 yards deep and gets hit twice before the line of scrimmage? Yes, often it does.  

 

Exactly.

[Colt.45]

11 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

I’ve always believed in going with the hot hand. I also believe Wilkins is better used in start of games, due to reliability and ball security, with JT brought in to wear down the defense afterwords. 

I'm not sure JT is a 'spot' guy. He seems to be one of those RBs who need a full workload and who get 2 yards here, 3 there, maybe the odd 4, then breaks out a big run. He'll get 100/120yds but you'll probably be behind the chains on quite a few of his carries. Saquon used to be that way (maybe still is). I don't know if he split carries at Wisconsin.

[EastStreet]

Part of the context that is missing here.... 

 

Wilkins is getting more late carries. If you look at success rates in the first half, JT is more successful, and beats JW in success rate on every down.

 

During the first half (success rate)

On 1st down - JT 39% vs JW 27%

On 2nd down - JT 41% vs JW 36%

 

JW doesn't have any 3rd or 4th down carries in the 1st half.

In the 1H, JT has 56 carries, vs JW 22.

[CurBeatElite]

1 hour ago, BProland85 said:

I’ve always believed in going with the hot hand. I also believe Wilkins is better used in start of games, due to reliability and ball security, with JT brought in to wear down the defense afterwords. 

 

Wilkins was benched his rookie year due to his fumbling issues.  JT has fumbled 1x in 8 games and it was against the D in the NFL who is the best at forcing fumbles.  Really not too worried about JT's ball security.  It does seem at times that he's still learning how to hold onto the ball very tightly and it may effect him for a split second with his vision, etc.. but I'm still not worried about him.  I think our biggest problem in the run game has mainly been predictable play calling in many situations.

[Smoke317]

3 hours ago, BProland85 said:

I’ve always believed in going with the hot hand. I also believe Wilkins is better used in start of games, due to reliability and ball security, with JT brought in to wear down the defense afterwords. 

As East showed in a post below yours, it’s actually Taylor who’s more effective against the defense in the 1st half when they’re fresh. Once Taylor’s pounded on them Wilkins gets the 2nd half carries when they’re more worn out.  Give Taylor the essentially garbage time 10 yard carry that an ineffective Wilkins got late in the 2nd half and his average jumps above 5 yards per carry and Wilkins’ game looks like the ineffective trash that it truly was that day. 
 

But if Frank had done that then everybody would really be grilling him about not going back to the only guy who had it going in the ground game.  Instead he gives Wilkins those “questionable” late carries because he needed to make him look a little more effective & also to make the run pass numbers even less skewed than they really were.

 

Sometimes Frank really confuses me.  I think he’s deferring to Rivers too much. Maybe because Rivers, a future hall of famer, is a better QB than he ever was???  Regardless, he’s the coach. He needs to force Rivers to stick with pounding Taylor.  If we start that 2nd half like the first half, pounding the rock with JT, instead of immediately putting our defense back out there with a poor throw 1 play after our defense stuffed them on a long drive that game goes differently. 
 

That’s where Frank has to get better as a coach.  Where’s the situational awareness?  Our defense was spent. But they still bowed up and held the other team out of the end zone. Give them some time to recuperate. Go back to what was working. Pound the rock with Taylor. No Frank chose to bench his young running back for a mistake he made when being aggressive. He didn’t bench Rivers though for his mistakes that cost us games this year or that duck that gave the refs a chance to screw us over. 
 

So Frank needs to stop letting Rivers (who I believe is truly behind it) push him to keep putting Taylor in the doghouse.  Because as a 2nd round pick, Taylor is very likely to be here longer than Rivers and quite likely longer than Frank if he keeps insisting on showing Ballard’s 2nd round pick of a running back isn’t ready; even when he’s showing he’s the most effective back that day.  
 

Wilkins isn’t going to “lead” this team to where we need to get. Frank & Phillip better come to grips with that and start featuring Taylor.  Because he’s one of only a few playmakers we have on offense. And they should be trying to get everything they can out of him.  Going into a Thursday game vs our biggest division rival this season, the Ravens game was the perfect game to feature the run.  Try to make that game go as quickly as possible knowing our guys have to play again Thursday. Instead you throw it 40 plus times and allow the Ravens to seriously deplete our best unit (the defense) going into a short week...  Genius coaching & qb’ing. 
 

IMO Frank and Phillip have a lot to prove vs the Titans this Thursday. I hope they get things tightened up this week. 

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

As East showed in a post below yours, it’s actually Taylor who’s more effective against the defense in the 1st half when they’re fresh. Once Taylor’s pounded on them Wilkins gets the 2nd half carries when they’re more worn out.  Give Taylor the essentially garbage time 10 yard carry that an ineffective Wilkins got late in the 2nd half and his average jumps above 5 yards per carry and Wilkins’ game looks like the ineffective trash that it truly was that day. 
 

But if Frank had done that then everybody would really be grilling him about not going back to the only guy who had it going in the ground game.  Instead he gives Wilkins those “questionable” late carries because he needed to make him look a little more effective & also to make the run pass numbers even less skewed than they really were.

 

Sometimes Frank really confuses me.  I think he’s deferring to Rivers too much. Maybe because Rivers, a future hall of famer, is a better QB than he ever was???  Regardless, he’s the coach. He needs to force Rivers to stick with pounding Taylor.  If we start that 2nd half like the first half, pounding the rock with JT, instead of immediately putting our defense back out there with a poor throw 1 play after our defense stuffed them on a long drive that game goes differently. 
 

That’s where Frank has to get better as a coach.  Where’s the situational awareness?  Our defense was spent. But they still bowed up and held the other team out of the end zone. Give them some time to recuperate. Go back to what was working. Pound the rock with Taylor. No Frank chose to bench his young running back for a mistake he made when being aggressive. He didn’t bench Rivers though for his mistakes that cost us games this year or that duck that gave the refs a chance to screw us over. 
 

So Frank needs to stop letting Rivers (who I believe is truly behind it) push him to keep putting Taylor in the doghouse.  Because as a 2nd round pick, Taylor is very likely to be here longer than Rivers and quite likely longer than Frank if he keeps insisting on showing Ballard’s 2nd round pick of a running back isn’t ready; even when he’s showing he’s the most effective back that day.  
 

Wilkins isn’t going to “lead” this team to where we need to get. Frank & Phillip better come to grips with that and start featuring Taylor.  Because he’s one of only a few playmakers we have on offense. And they should be trying to get everything they can out of him.  Going into a Thursday game vs our biggest division rival this season, the Ravens game was the perfect game to feature the run.  Try to make that game go as quickly as possible knowing our guys have to play again Thursday. Instead you throw it 40 plus times and allow the Ravens to seriously deplete our best unit (the defense) going into a short week...  Genius coaching & qb’ing. 
 

IMO Frank and Phillip have a lot to prove vs the Titans this Thursday. I hope they get things tightened up this week. 

I agree with some of this, but I don't agree that Rivers has anything to do with when JT or Wilkins plays. I also don't think Reich is impacted by Rivers at all when it comes to game plan or play calling. We're 12th in the league in rushing attempts, and 21st in passing %. I'm sure that's not what Rivers had in mind when he signed up. At least not the not 21st part lol. 

 

And I'm sure everyone is privy to the #s. JT actually looks to be a better ball catcher than Wilkins and Hines. JT has the highest catch % and AVG, so why would Rivers not want that? Rivers is a short timer. He just wants to win. Doubt he has any interest who is playing RB so long as they are successful. Thinking he'd try to sabotage is pretty twilight zone stuff to me.

 

As far as Wilkin's #s, most folks on here aren't willing to peel the onion. If they started using him as an early game bell cow, folks would act surprised at his low #s and would be calling for JT to come back. Wilkins has improved this year though. He's still not the bell cow type though.

[JPFolks]

1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

As East showed in a post below yours, it’s actually Taylor who’s more effective against the defense in the 1st half when they’re fresh. Once Taylor’s pounded on them Wilkins gets the 2nd half carries when they’re more worn out.  Give Taylor the essentially garbage time 10 yard carry that an ineffective Wilkins got late in the 2nd half and his average jumps above 5 yards per carry and Wilkins’ game looks like the ineffective trash that it truly was that day. 
 

But if Frank had done that then everybody would really be grilling him about not going back to the only guy who had it going in the ground game.  Instead he gives Wilkins those “questionable” late carries because he needed to make him look a little more effective & also to make the run pass numbers even less skewed than they really were.

 

Sometimes Frank really confuses me.  I think he’s deferring to Rivers too much. Maybe because Rivers, a future hall of famer, is a better QB than he ever was???  Regardless, he’s the coach. He needs to force Rivers to stick with pounding Taylor.  If we start that 2nd half like the first half, pounding the rock with JT, instead of immediately putting our defense back out there with a poor throw 1 play after our defense stuffed them on a long drive that game goes differently. 
 

That’s where Frank has to get better as a coach.  Where’s the situational awareness?  Our defense was spent. But they still bowed up and held the other team out of the end zone. Give them some time to recuperate. Go back to what was working. Pound the rock with Taylor. No Frank chose to bench his young running back for a mistake he made when being aggressive. He didn’t bench Rivers though for his mistakes that cost us games this year or that duck that gave the refs a chance to screw us over. 
 

So Frank needs to stop letting Rivers (who I believe is truly behind it) push him to keep putting Taylor in the doghouse.  Because as a 2nd round pick, Taylor is very likely to be here longer than Rivers and quite likely longer than Frank if he keeps insisting on showing Ballard’s 2nd round pick of a running back isn’t ready; even when he’s showing he’s the most effective back that day.  
 

Wilkins isn’t going to “lead” this team to where we need to get. Frank & Phillip better come to grips with that and start featuring Taylor.  Because he’s one of only a few playmakers we have on offense. And they should be trying to get everything they can out of him.  Going into a Thursday game vs our biggest division rival this season, the Ravens game was the perfect game to feature the run.  Try to make that game go as quickly as possible knowing our guys have to play again Thursday. Instead you throw it 40 plus times and allow the Ravens to seriously deplete our best unit (the defense) going into a short week...  Genius coaching & qb’ing. 
 

IMO Frank and Phillip have a lot to prove vs the Titans this Thursday. I hope they get things tightened up this week. 

This reminds me of the dirty little open secret about our OC, HC and QB. The stank up the joint the last time they were together in SD and two of them, Rivers and Reich, were eventually "released" I know Sirianni became WR from QB coach there, not exactly upwards but perhaps to get ready to be an OC, but you'd think with those specialties our WRs would be more locked in with our QB. .  

 

We were spoiled with two of the best QB minds in history. The first had a stellar line and weapons most of his career. The second had no support. One solid tiny receiver and not much else on offense. His defense was a little better but the rushers were old and the rest were a hodge podge of rejects and aging FAs.  Yet in the regular season he was always in the game, elevated everyone (Ebron?) and he finished .500 in the playoffs losing twice to the eventual Super Bowl champs of the year. 

 

I honestly think when Luck realized who they had brought in to coach/coordinate he realized it was just not worth it anymore.  And he may well be right.  These may be really nice guys loved by media and players, but maybe just over their skis. 

 

Let's hope they rock and roll Thursday and get us back into the playoff discussion. Winning the division might be our best way in so it is all right in front of us. 

[Smoke317]

12 hours ago, EastStreet said:

I agree with some of this, but I don't agree that Rivers has anything to do with when JT or Wilkins plays. I also don't think Reich is impacted by Rivers at all when it comes to game plan or play calling. We're 12th in the league in rushing attempts, and 21st in passing %. I'm sure that's not what Rivers had in mind when he signed up. At least not the not 21st part lol. 

 

And I'm sure everyone is privy to the #s. JT actually looks to be a better ball catcher than Wilkins and Hines. JT has the highest catch % and AVG, so why would Rivers not want that? Rivers is a short timer. He just wants to win. Doubt he has any interest who is playing RB so long as they are successful. Thinking he'd try to sabotage is pretty twilight zone stuff to me.

 

As far as Wilkin's #s, most folks on here aren't willing to peel the onion. If they started using him as an early game bell cow, folks would act surprised at his low #s and would be calling for JT to come back. Wilkins has improved this year though. He's still not the bell cow type though.

I don’t think Rivers is intentionally sabotaging the team. I just don’t think he believes in the rookie. And your points are just the reason. Rivers is a short timer who just wants to win.  Unfortunately, maybe he feels that JT isn’t ready and he doesn’t have the time to wait on him to get up to speed?   That’s where Frank has to see the bigger picture and force Rivers to give the ball to Taylor until we know for certain he doesn’t haven’t it.
 

Because Frank and Phillip have to see that we’re not getting where we want to go with Wilkins getting the lion’s share of the carries.  Frank did say that he only chooses the running backs for his first scripted plays and then lets  Rathman choose the snap counts the rest of the game. So maybe it’s Rivers & Rathman that need to lean on Taylor more? Or Frank needs to lean on them to lean on Taylor more instead of putting him in the doghouse?

[crazycolt1]

20 hours ago, BProland85 said:

I’ve always believed in going with the hot hand. I also believe Wilkins is better used in start of games, due to reliability and ball security, with JT brought in to wear down the defense afterwords. 

Ball security? JT has one fumble in 8 games. I wouldn't be too worried about ball security. 

Besides, JTs fumble was a result of a very good defensive play. 

[EastStreet]

7 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

I don’t think Rivers is intentionally sabotaging the team. I just don’t think he believes in the rookie. And your points are just the reason. Rivers is a short timer who just wants to win.  Unfortunately, maybe he feels that JT isn’t ready and he doesn’t have the time to wait on him to get up to speed?   That’s where Frank has to see the bigger picture and force Rivers to give the ball to Taylor until we know for certain he doesn’t haven’t it.
 

Because Frank and Phillip have to see that we’re not getting where we want to go with Wilkins getting the lion’s share of the carries.  Frank did say that he only chooses the running backs for his first scripted plays and then lets  Rathman choose the snap counts the rest of the game. So maybe it’s Rivers & Rathman that need to lean on Taylor more? Or Frank needs to lean on them to lean on Taylor more instead of putting him in the doghouse?

I'm sure they're all privy to the stats. The stats say JT is more successful in 1H carries, and better catching balls. So why would Rivers campaign against that? Doesn't make sense. And I doubt Rivers is impacting Reich's personnel choice at all. If anything, it's probably frustrating Rivers. Rivers likes big bodies. And he obviously likes, and has chemistry with MAC. Yet Reich has been pushing Burton snaps over MAC snaps. I just doesn't make a lot of sense that Rivers wouldn't want to try and replicate the sail routes that were so successful to MAC a few games ago.