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This defense is legit!!


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it wasnt the players fault for the most of it .   they browns had a better game plan in the first half .  the second half the colts played more man coverage and got more aggressive with blitz and held them to 3 points .  with leonard playing and a better offense to take time off the clock we could of held them under 20.

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I replied in a different topic that the D didn't hold up in the 1st half, but after thinking about it more, I feel like it was scheme.  The adjustments were really good in the 2nd half, which IS very promising.  That starts with the coaches.

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I would say they are a legit top 10 defense.  I do NOT think they are THE top defense in the NFL right now.  But I think this game proves they can limit the damage against a very good offense.  They really already proved that vs. the Vikings IMHO.  But I think they would benefit from a more aggressive scheme (a la Pittsburgh).  I think they now have the horses up front and the athletes to pull it off.  Yet we keep getting turnovers.  Can you imagine if this defense was aggressive?  It would be awesome.  I would not be surprised at all if this defense ends up top 10 in yards, points, and takeaways by the end of the season.  And THAT is all I was asking for.  I think with another player or two, they could easily be top 5 next season.  Easily.

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2 minutes ago, Architects08 said:

They got abused in the first half but looked much better in the passing game in the 2nd half. The run defense is top tier though. 

 

Do the 9 points gifted by Rivers count towards the defense? 

I believe they look at points scored not how.

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2 minutes ago, Robin said:

I believe they look at points scored not how.

That's what I was thinking too. In reality they held a good offense to 23 points and 3.7 ypc. Credit their playmakers for making some really tough catches. 

 

All of that and we were missing our all pro LB. The defense is fine.

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Sometimes all you can do is tip you cap to their receivers in the first half.....they made some insane catches...it was just their day today.

Also it's just a weird day in the nfl today....Raiders smack Chiefs in the mouth in KC, Dolphins smoke the Niners, Vikings on the verge of beating Seattle, in Seattle.

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2 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

This defense with almost no healthy linebackers, gifted Philip rivers his ints back today. 

 

Walker, and Okereke Balled out considering both werent healthy. So all of our linebackers out or injured. 

 

This is the number 1 defense, and they proved it to me against a team considered the top offense in the afc.

 

Everyone needs to calm down. 

 

Leading tackler was Okereke with 11. 

 

Oh brother.  The game was lost in the 1st half. They made Baker look like Unitas in the 1st half. 

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#1 defenses don’t get gashed on the final drive when they need a stop. The 3rd and 9 run with Baker clearly favoring his arm was bad.

 

Okereke was solid...Walker definitely missed some tackles. 

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1 hour ago, shasta519 said:

#1 defenses don’t get gashed on the final drive when they need a stop. The 3rd and 9 run with Baker clearly favoring his arm was bad.

 

Okereke was solid...Walker definitely missed some tackles. 

I think the linebackers played very well in the second half.  
 

my issues were the soft zone defense they keep going back too that gets shredded by any decent QB that they played in the first half and the last drive.  Like you said teams that depend on their defense and have pride in their defense get stops there and at least give their offense a chance.  
 

We can play what if with the offense had they gotten that chance and it’s fair to say hey they would have screwed it up anyone way but we can’t over look the fact we are having to play what if and we didn’t see it because the defense couldn’t stop a run on 3rd and nine when you knew it was coming.  
 

The Colts need to stick with the aggressive defense they played in the second half.  That’s when this defense is at its best.  When they play not to lose by playing the soft zone is when they struggle.  All good defenses have one thing in common, they attack the offense.  We saw that from the Colts in the second half but we saw the exact opposite in the first half and we saw very different results.  

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31 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

I think the linebackers played very well in the second half.  
 

my issues were the soft zone defense they keep going back too that gets shredded by any decent QB that they played in the first half and the last drive.  Like you said teams that depend on their defense and have pride in their defense get stops there and at least give their offense a chance.  
 

We can play what if with the offense had they gotten that chance and it’s fair to say hey they would have screwed it up anyone way but we can’t over look the fact we are having to play what if and we didn’t see it because the defense couldn’t stop a run on 3rd and nine when you knew it was coming.  
 

The Colts need to stick with the aggressive defense they played in the second half.  That’s when this defense is at its best.  When they play not to lose by playing the soft zone is when they struggle.  All good defenses have one thing in common, they attack the offense.  We saw that from the Colts in the second half but we saw the exact opposite in the first half and we saw very different results.  


Have to get after the QB as well. Both INTs were direct results of QB pressure. On the first one, Baker was pressured and made a terrible choice to throw to Hopper who was surrounded by Colts...and he had little on the throw...and Okereke did the rest. And then Houston hit Baker as he was throwing...causing the pass to go to Walker.

 

 

 

 

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Lets play someone like the Hawks or the Chiefs and we can see where this defense is. We are looking good so far and confidence should be high, but Browns aren't exactly contenders. Currently the 29th passing offense in the league.  Week 9 is what I'm waiting for :lecture:

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8 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yeah looking back the browns made some great catches in that first half on pretty tight coverage. Not to bad holding their offense to 23 pts.

There was tight coverage on maybe 3 catches. The rest of the time  it looked like weak 1 against the Jaguars again. 

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Good OL - Titans, Steelers, Packers and then Ravens a little bit though their OL has taken a step back. Those will be the biggest tests for our pass rush. Our run D is definitely legit. Eberflus had a Top 10 RUN D in both 2018 and 2019, seems like we are on our way in 2020 as well. Pass D definitely needs work. However, we saw the vaunted Steelers D give up 29 points playing aggressive as well with Wentz extending the plays and making plays out of pocket.

 

That first TD, Baker Mayfield was the one that created that pass to Hunt for a TD. There is an emphasis on QB extending plays and making plays - RW, Rodgers, Murray, Darnold, Mayfield, Allen, Mayfield, Lamar, Mahomes, Trubisky, Wentz....dang it almost seems like half the league's QBs can do it. That is what we have to plan to play pass D against. All of us should also temper expectations that unless the team talent is outmatched like the Bengals or Jaguars, the other team is going to make plays on offense. I have to remind you all that Peyton and Luck won games with our D underwhelming throughout the game several times, and remember our infamous "Fire Ron Meeks and his cushiony D" threads? That is why we have to assess our expectations to find out if Rivers can play anywhere close to their level at his age to overcome a few lapses on D. I think the clear answer is No at this point. 

 

Buckner is one heck of a disruptor but edge lacks speed and our missed picks on Lewis and Banogu with no contributions is catching up unless we trade for a pass rusher instead of waiting on Turay to come back with the same impact. If we cannot get an alpha WR, at least get an alpha pass rusher via trade and we can give Rivers more margin for error. That is where we are now.

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4 hours ago, rayski said:

Lets play someone like the Hawks or the Chiefs and we can see where this defense is. We are looking good so far and confidence should be high, but Browns aren't exactly contenders. Currently the 29th passing offense in the league.  Week 9 is what I'm waiting for :lecture:

 

I wouldn't rule the Browns out at this point.  They seem to be pretty good and are 4-1.  

 

I wouldn't put them at the top of the mound but they are certainly looking to be contenders at this point.  

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3 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

I wouldn't rule the Browns out at this point.  They seem to be pretty good and are 4-1.  

 

I wouldn't put them at the top of the mound but they are certainly looking to be contenders at this point.  

Come on, the Browns haven't had a winning season since 2007 and they are contenders? 

So far they got blown out by the Ravens, barely won against a 1-2-1 Bengals, beat a 1-3 Washington, beat a 1-3 Cowboys and beat us. I get they are an exciting team but hardly a contender yet. Just my 5 cents. 

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17 minutes ago, rayski said:

Come on, the Browns haven't had a winning season since 2007 and they are contenders? 

So far they got blown out by the Ravens, barely won against a 1-2-1 Bengals, beat a 1-3 Washington, beat a 1-3 Cowboys and beat us. I get they are an exciting team but hardly a contender yet. Just my 5 cents. 

 

What does their lack of winning season's have to do with anything.  Teams change so fast in the NFL that last year's loser can be next year's SB champs.

 

They seem to have a decent enough QB, they have great receivers and a good pass rush.  I wouldn't list them at the top of my list as most likely to win the SB but they have played well enough thus far that they seem likely to make the playoffs.  

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8 hours ago, shasta519 said:


Have to get after the QB as well. Both INTs were direct results of QB pressure. On the first one, Baker was pressured and made a terrible choice to throw to Hopper who was surrounded by Colts...and he had little on the throw...and Okereke did the rest. And then Houston hit Baker as he was throwing...causing the pass to go to Walker.

 

 

 

 

That goes hand and hand with the soft zone.  When they play the soft zone they drop everyone out and only send the front four.  In the second half we saw more blitzes and we started to see the payoff.

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I went back and looked at the play, Walker should have run with Higgins farther making it a difficult pass and Tavon Wilson made a terrible read (#31 in our defense is never good - Quincy Wilson, Tavon Wilson etc. :) ), instead he goes to an area where there was help already thus making it an easy throw for Baker. I am beginning to think more than the scheme itself, the ability of these guys to communicate well inside a zone scheme has long ways to go:

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Bolts2Colts said:

Very impressed with D in second half. But how did that unknown RB manage to pick up 28 yards on the 3rd and 9 to seal the game?  Were we expecting a pass when Mayfield was clearly hurting? 
 

 

Khari Willis lost outside contain, Rhodes came crashing inside and lost outside contain too allowing himself to be blocked by No.82 Higgins, that is what gave them the edge. Folks have to remember Landry is the most important WR for the Browns, not OBJ. Landry was lined more in an inline fashion, it was a run all the way. Khari Willis took one bad step inside, Landry almost had a bad block in the back thinking it was a run between the tackles. In fact, a run between the tackles would have come up short if we had not panicked, IMO, could have maintained outside contain all along to force things inside. For a moment, it felt like a Pagano defense during the Colts days with inability to contain the edge. We did not have to crash inside that bad, it was not a 3rd and 1 or 2.

 

They avoided 3rd and long as much as they could.  Here is an article that described Kevin Stefanski's approach:

 

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/10/kevin-stefanski-once-again-smoothly-operated-the-browns-to-victory-film-review.html

 

Here is that run:

 

 

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I do love how quickly everyone is to denounce the browns offense. They have leaps and bounds better receiving core than the colts have had since Marvin and Reggie. Jarvis Landry and Beckham JR are top WR's. An incredible TE group and a really good stable of backs. Pair that with a former #1 overall QB who prides himself on his accuracy. Yea we gave up some plays but they had a hell of a day. Not nearly as upset about this loss vs the Jags and neither should the rest of you. They are a good team with a lot of playmakers.

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14 minutes ago, twfish said:

I do love how quickly everyone is to denounce the browns offense. They have leaps and bounds better receiving core than the colts have had since Marvin and Reggie. Jarvis Landry and Beckham JR are top WR's. An incredible TE group and a really good stable of backs. Pair that with a former #1 overall QB who prides himself on his accuracy. Yea we gave up some plays but they had a hell of a day. Not nearly as upset about this loss vs the Jags and neither should the rest of you. They are a good team with a lot of playmakers.

 

I am more upset with the fact that we haven't shown the ability to win except by being a front runner. One comeback from 7 points down would be good enough for me at this point. :) 

 

Both the Jags and Browns games, we came up short, and this was the recurring theme with Rivers in 2019, coming up short and 4th qtr. INTs. I am not as upset with going toe-to-toe on D with the best OL we faced so far albeit disappointed we didn't exploit their safeties on offense.

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the 49ers had the best defense in the league last year averaging 14 points a game . Did they not give up 45 against the saints and the rams last year .  its a offensive league now defense is gonna have a bad game here and there but when it came time in the second half for a comeback the defense showed up.

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2 hours ago, coming on strong said:

the 49ers had the best defense in the league last year averaging 14 points a game . Did they not give up 45 against the saints and the rams last year .  its a offensive league now defense is gonna have a bad game here and there but when it came time in the second half for a comeback the defense showed up.

Until the game deciding drive when they gave up a 28 yard run on 3rd and 9 when everyone knew a run was coming.  
 

I agree that they played great in the second half until that point and I also agree that the offense is a bigger concern and I agree that I don’t think the offense would have done anything with it had they gotten that chance but we can’t over look why they didn’t get that chance.  If you are going to depend on your defense to be what carries you then they have to get that stop.  People can make all the excuses they want to for it but I’d be willing to bet the Colts defensive players would tell you that they have to make that play and that they didn’t is as much as why they lost as anything else.  

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