Are The Broncos Your Second Team Now?

[Fx Stryker]

Fact: Jim Irsay said that the Colts will use its #1 overall draft pick in 2012 to draft either Luck of RG3.

Fact: Jim Irsay said that the Colts are rebuilding.

Fact: Jim Irsay fired the Polians and replaced them with Grigson.

Fact: The Colts fired Caldwell and most of the old coaching staff and replaced them with Pagano, and the new coaching staff.

Fact: PM said, "Jim and I have spoken extensively about where we are today, and our conversations have led both of us to recognize that our circumstances make it best for us to take this next step." (see post #188, this thread. I posted the video)

Fact: The Colts released PM after this press conference.

So Jim see it he no longer WANT/NEEDS Peyton. So I don't see how any of you can argue this is on Peyton. Right from the get go there is no longer a desire for Peyton. He was simply unwanted. You guys honestly think he wanted to be unwanted?

[jjcolts]

Colts also won a SB with hard nosed defensive football in 2006 for 4 games.

It's okay to credit QBs not named Peyton once in a while.

Brady is an all time great whether we like it or not.

WOW Jules...sure have changed your tune regarding Manning

I am sure you have your valid facts and reasons and I respect that.

But as an all around sports fan, I will always appreciate an athlete like Manning. My father in law who is a die hard 49ers fans...states that at one point "fans" were upset at Montanta and 49ers, he laughs about how silly it was now. I suppose we will all get there one day.

[Jules]

So Jim see it he no longer WANT/NEEDS Peyton. So I don't see how any of you can argue this is on Peyton. Right from the get go there is no longer a desire for Peyton. He was simply unwanted. You guys honestly think he wanted to be unwanted?

It's a business.

It really and truly is.

In the end that sounds cliche but it's the truth.

A business owner has to make tough choices for his current and future business as well. And Peyton also had to make a choice for his future here too after talking it out with the owner.

Edited April 1, 2012 by 21isSuperman

[Fx Stryker]

You can't prove it though can you. No.

It's a waste of time. The more time passes by the more I realize the man deserves credit for helping the Pats go to 5 SBs and winning 3.

'01 Patriots top ten offense and defense. '02 Patriots still top ten offense, the only difference? They have a bottom half defense. They miss the playoffs. I wonder what the deciding factor was.

Also to add to this. 03' Patriots top ten defense. 12th ranked offense. Still win the Super Bowl.

'04 Patriots top defense and offense. Win Super Bowl.

05' top ten offense. Bottom half defense. Lose divisional round.

'06 top ten defense and offense. Lose to Colts with a sub par defensive second half.

See a pattern The Patriots defense are not credited enough for what they did.

[UndecidedFrog]

Didnt more potentially see it coming? All last season it seemed like "Suck for Luck" was more a reality as the weeks went by then a joke to me. ;)

And besides, both Peyton AND Irsay sometimes say things that are not 100% truthful. It's the game. I don't expect anyone in sports to be 100% honest all the time......

I would be more shocked if they were all honest all the time.....

Yes, many saw this coming.

Yes, sometimes, people are not truthful.

However, I believe PM was being truthful at the March 7 press conference. I believe him when he said it was a mutual decision for him and the Colts to separate. I think he understood the following:

1) The Colts will be drafting a new highly rated QB prospect with the #1 overall pick

2) The Colts will be completely rebuilding, not a retooling, or a small adjustment.

3) He cannot play forever and will most likely retire in the next few years

4) He wants to win SB championships

5) The likelihood of winning SB championships with the Colts given 1 , 2 and 3 above, is not very good.

[Jules]

WOW Jules...sure have changed your tune regarding Manning

I am sure you have your valid facts and reasons and I respect that.

But as an all around sports fan, I will always appreciate an athlete like Manning. My father in law who is a die hard 49ers fans...states that at one point "fans" were upset at Montanta and 49ers, he laughs about how silly it was now. I suppose we will all get there one day.

On another forum I was full on board with starting with Luck since like last fall after getting into Stanford.

Loved what Peyton did but can't hold onto things forever.

I don't hate Peyton at all. But, I am ready to move on too and honestly I don't really care if the Broncos have success, he is not my QB anymore.

Luck is gonna be a stud......I truly believe this. I feel this was the right move too.

Now RG3.....I don't even want to hear about it.

[John Dee]

Didnt more potentially see it coming? All last season it seemed like "Suck for Luck" was more a reality as the weeks went by then a joke to me. ;)

And besides, both Peyton AND Irsay sometimes say things that are not 100% truthful. It's the game. I don't expect anyone in sports to be 100% honest all the time......

I would be more shocked if they were all honest all the time.....

I agree... and that leads to the situation Indy confronted,,

Irsay... bad team, with the No. 1 pick in the NFL draft

Manning coming off "another surgery" looking at a 2 - 14 team.

Do all of you really think Manning and Irsay would not get together and take realistic look at the state of this team?

[Jules]

'01 Patriots top ten offense and defense. '02 Patriots still top ten offense, the only difference? They have a bottom half defense. They miss the playoffs. I wonder what the deciding factor was.

Also to add to this. 03' Patriots top ten defense. 12th ranked offense. Still win the Super Bowl.

I forgot.

Brady is a non factor for the Pats according to some of you. He did not put points up in playoff games, get first downs, throw TD passes or drive into FG range.

Heck but TBH since 2010 I feel the best QB in the league is Aaron Rodgers anyway. And at 28 and in his prime it should continue for a few more seasons I would think....barring major injury.

Man have I become less of a homer the last few seasons. It feels great. I can finally enjoy all the great QBs out there and not have to worry as much about silly GOAT arguments.

There are some studs out there in this league to watch and enjoy as a fan of the game.

[John Dee]

On another forum I was full on board with starting with Luck since like last fall after getting into Stanford.

Loved what Peyton did but can't hold onto things forever.

I don't hate Peyton at all. But, I am ready to move on too and honestly I don't really care if the Broncos have success, he is not my QB anymore.

Luck is gonna be a stud......I truly believe this. I feel this was the right move too.

Now RG3.....I don't even want to hear about it.

Right On....

[jjcolts]

Nobody is "anti" Manning... you threw out the business scenario...

RISK is always at the front of any business conversation.

Manning, like it or not has a LOT of risk right now. That is why Denver WONT GUARANTEE THE LENGTH OF HIS CONTRACT. Yet Peyton wanted Indy to. ??

It's all business, and I love the choice. Maybe Indy will get LUCKY

So we agree that Irsay did want to terminate the contract? Great.

Of course it is all business, that is why I am not a least bit upset about any of it, sad yes, upset no. I am a fan first and always wants to be competitive. Though we deal with it, no one likes to be in rebuilding mode.

[John Dee]

So Jim see it he no longer WANT/NEEDS Peyton. So I don't see how any of you can argue this is on Peyton. Right from the get go there is no longer a desire for Peyton. He was simply unwanted. You guys honestly think he wanted to be unwanted?

The decision to part is NOT ON ANYONE..

Do you understand the meaning of "mutual?"

[Jules]

Rebuilding mode is an interesting term. It sounds so ugly but in some ways they could suprise you in terms of competitiveness next season.....

I felt last years Broncos were lucky. Lucky they even won the games they did. Lucky they got the breaks. Lucky all around.

Now if you want to point to a lucky team it was last years Broncos. That thing was nuts.

In many ways last years Broncos kept reminding me of the 1995 Colts.

[Fx Stryker]

The decision to part is NOT ON ANYONE..

Do you understand the meaning of "mutual?"

I don't think you do.

One wanted to play for the Colts. The other wanting to move on. Unless they changed mutual to meaning opposite feelings I don't think those are.

Man have I become less of a homer the last few seasons. It feels great. I can finally enjoy all the great QBs out there and not have to worry as much about silly GOAT arguments.

There are some studs out there in this league to watch and enjoy as a fan of the game.

If you are such less of a homer now. Then why are you googly eyed over a possible homer QB?

[Jules]

Getting a headache now......

I don't think anyone here can truly change the minds of others on what may or may not have happened.

[jjcolts]

On another forum I was full on board with starting with Luck since like last fall after getting into Stanford. Loved what Peyton did but can't hold onto things forever. I don't hate Peyton at all. But, I am ready to move on too and honestly I don't really care if the Broncos have success, he is not my QB anymore. Luck is gonna be a stud......I truly believe this. I feel this was the right move too. Now RG3.....I don't even want to hear about it.

I will follow Peyton wherever he goes, as I follow other Super Star Athletes, it is a little different with Manning because he was with the Colts. Heck, a few years ago I started to watch Hockey because of Sid the Kid and Geno.

I am excited about the future but will make no bold predictions, I was the same when Manning came on board (I am a little superstitious )

In regards to your Brady quote - Peyton or no Peyton to argue with or debate against - we all have seen that defense wins Championship and not just a QB.

That is why the Patriots are a dynasty and the Colts were not.

[John Dee]

So we agree that Irsay did want to terminate the contract? Great.

Of course it is all business, that is why I am not a least bit upset about any of it, sad yes, upset no. I am a fan first and always wants to be competitive. Though we deal with it, no one likes to be in rebuilding mode.

huhhhh? No we don't agree.

Irsay wanted Manning back with "less risk and commitment" do you blame him? He did just dish out 26m for the 11 season for .... nothing.

Risk... vs Reward

Denver took a low risk contract with Manning.

What I want to know is why didn't Manning give Indy the same deal?

Honest question.

[John Dee]

Rebuilding mode is an interesting term. It sounds so ugly but in some ways they could suprise you in terms of competitiveness next season.....

I felt last years Broncos were lucky. Lucky they even won the games they did. Lucky they got the breaks. Lucky all around.

Now if you want to point to a lucky team it was last years Broncos. That thing was nuts.

In many ways last years Broncos kept reminding me of the 1995 Colts.

The 95 Colts had a way better QB....

[UndecidedFrog]

I don't think you do.

One wanted to play for the Colts. The other wanting to move on. Unless they changed mutual to meaning opposite feelings I don't think those are.

If you are such less of a homer now. Then why are you googly eyed over a possible homer QB?

I disagree. PM does not want to play for the Colts if the Colts:

1) are going to draft a highly rated QB prospect as their QB of the future.

2) are going to be seriously rebuilding, which may take some years to do so.

I think PM knows he cannot play forever, and will most likely be retiring in a few years, but he still wants to win SB championships.

I think PM does not want to be a Colt under these circumstances, and mutually agreed with Jim Irsay that it was best for both the Colts and for him to separate.

[Jules]

If you are such less of a homer now. Then why are you googly eyed over a possible homer QB?

I think this new "homer QB" is my QB for many years to come now........

I kinda meant that at this time I can actually appreciate more what other elite QBs bring to the table for the game and not put them down as much as I used to.

[John Dee]

Getting a headache now......

I don't think anyone here can truly change the minds of others on what may or may not have happened.

I bet minds will change when they finally see what "will happen"...

[Jules]

The 95 Colts had a way better QB....

Of course.

But, the way sometimes it went about for them was cool last season......comeback kids and all.

[UndecidedFrog]

I bet minds will change when they finally see what "will happen"...

Since PM won one, it will probably take at least 2 SB championships to change minds.

[jjcolts]

I forgot. Brady is a non factor for the Pats according to some of you. He did not put points up in playoff games, get first downs, throw TD passes or drive into FG range. Heck but TBH since 2010 I feel the best QB in the league is Aaron Rodgers anyway. And at 28 and in his prime it should continue for a few more seasons I would think....barring major injury. Man have I become less of a homer the last few seasons. It feels great. I can finally enjoy all the great QBs out there and not have to worry as much about silly GOAT arguments. There are some studs out there in this league to watch and enjoy as a fan of the game.

Well, Welcome Having watched the games this way. I have always appreciated what Manning has done with the Colts. But have always enjoyed watching other QB's. I was thrilled to see Rodgers win, and not happy when Big Ben won against the Cardz.

I think Rivers is great as well. Guy has grown up a lot and is the only one ever competing in his team.

In a few years, even as Andrew Luck is suceeding, people of Indiana will look back and appreciate Manning more, because we would have been removed from all of the emotions.

[Fx Stryker]

I think this new "homer QB" is my QB for many years to come now........

I kinda meant that at this time I can actually appreciate more what other elite QBs bring to the table for the game and not put them down as much as I used to.

So what you meant is you grew to not care for Peyton over the years.

I disagree. PM does not want to play for the Colts if the Colts:

1) are going to draft a highly rated QB prospect as their QB of the future.

2) are going to be seriously rebuilding, which may take some years to do so.

I think PM knows he cannot play forever, and will most likely be retiring in a few years, but he still wants to win SB championships.

I think PM does not want to be a Colt under these circumstances, and mutually agreed with Jim Irsay that it was best for both the Colts and for him to separate.

Peyton is happy with what he has achieved in the NFL. Other posters had the article about if he feels he needs to win more Super Bowls because Eli has. He said no. I cannot provide this. Someone else will have to. So is he a liar now to you because it fits your argument? The only goal he had left was to finish his career with one team.

[John Dee]

I think this new "homer QB" is my QB for many years to come now........

I kinda meant that at this time I can actually appreciate more what other elite QBs bring to the table for the game and not put them down as much as I used to.

very nice Jules... knowledge comes with experience...

I totally respect all great teams and players anymore. I never use to tho.

Once Luck strolls down field 40 yards for a score Manning fans will soon see what dimension of the QB position Indy has been lacking.

Manning was GREAT

LUCK.???? I can't wait to get the future going

[MEAT]

Since PM won one, it will probably take at least 2 SB championships to change minds.

The MHS out seeking membership tonight.That would be up there with the ignorance of the Dilfer > Marino theory.

[jjcolts]

huhhhh? No we don't agree. Irsay wanted Manning back with "less risk and commitment" do you blame him? He did just dish out 26m for the 11 season for .... nothing. Risk... vs Reward Denver took a low risk contract with Manning. What I want to know is why didn't Manning give Indy the same deal? Honest question.

You said this was all business, so why doesn't Irsay stand by the contract? A contract is a contract and is a contract.

Now having said that...I think the right decisions were made AND I still will root for Manning while he plays. ..OMGZZZ I must not be a "true Colts fan" so dramatic.

[Jules]

So what you meant is you grew to not care for Peyton over the years.

*sigh*

No.

I think Peyton is an all time great. End of story. I loved his time here.

I gotta run though.

Nice conversation all......

[jjcolts]

very nice Jules... knowledge comes with experience... I totally respect all great teams and players anymore. I never use to tho. Once Luck strolls down field 40 yards for a score Manning fans will soon see what dimension of the QB position Indy has been lacking. Manning was GREAT LUCK.???? I can't wait to get the future going

WOW. So Manning was the reason Colts did not succeed?

13 straight years in the playoffs and Indy was lacking in the QB position??????????

Thank goodness for the "ignore" function

[FireJimCaldwell]

This thread was embarrassing when it was posted and it is even more embarrassing now...

[John Dee]

You said this was all business, so why doesn't Irsay stand by the contract? A contract is a contract and is a contract.

Now having said that...I think the right decisions were made AND I still will root for Manning while he plays. ..OMGZZZ I must not be a "true Colts fan" so dramatic.

where do I begin? I'll just say that I guess you are new to the "market"... ??

It's a dog eat dog world out there.

[jjcolts]

where do I begin? I'll just say that I guess you are new to the "market"... ??

It's a dog eat dog world out there.

[John Dee]

WOW. So Manning was the reason Colts did not succeed?

13 straight years in the playoffs and Indy was lacking in the QB position??????????

Thank goodness for the "ignore" function

please do,,

[UndecidedFrog]

Peyton is happy with what he has achieved in the NFL. Other posters had the article about if he feels he needs to win more Super Bowls because Eli has. He said no. I cannot provide this. Someone else will have to. So is he a liar now to you because it fits your argument? The only goal he had left was to finish his career with one team.

Peyton has always said, and recently said again (after signing with the Broncos) that his objective is to always compete for the SB championship. Are you claiming Peyton lied here too? Note what Peyton said at the 6:23 mark of this video of his press conference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlLa5v0oHto

[Susie Q]

This thread was embarrassing when it was posted and it is even more embarrassing now...

Thanks Firejim for my laugh for the day. Your reply is so true. :shh:

[Fx Stryker]

Peyton has always said, and recently said again (after signing with the Broncos) that his objective is to always compete for the SB championship. Are you claiming Peyton lied here too? Note what Peyton said at the 6:23 mark of this video of his press conference:

Different context. You are saying winning Super Bowls is a deciding factor for him leaving. When it's not. He would say the same thing if he was still a Colt. It's not why he is no longer a Colt though.

[John Dee]

Thanks Firejim for my laugh for the day. Your reply is so true. :shh:

Watch Manning's farewell presser..

It will ease the pain,.

[John Dee]

Thanks Firejim for my laugh for the day. Your reply is so true. :shh:

Peyton say's "it's a mutual decision" and YOU still can't deal with it?

C'mon now.

[Fx Stryker]

Peyton say's "it's a mutual decision" and YOU still can't deal with it?

C'mon now.

never said "it's a mutual decision."

He also said it really wasn't his decision.

[UndecidedFrog]

never said "it's a mutual decision."

He also said it really wasn't his decision.

When PM said "Jim and I have spoken extensively about where we are today, and our conversations have led both of us to recognize that our circumstances make it best for us to take this next step." (see post #188, this thread. I posted the video), I think most readers will conclude that he and Jim Irsay have come to a mutual decision to separate.

I fully understand that you apparently do not conclude similarly.