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WarGhost21

Jacoby Brissett Impressions (Perma Merge)

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I truly feel bad for JB. He seemed to never get a fair shake to learn. Everyone talks about him having 2 years starting and two years learning under Brady and Luck.
 

It might be just me but that is only have if it. sitting and learning is a lot different than getting out there and actually playing. Also, if you get technical this is his first year as the unquestioned starter. 
 

just seems everyone is taking their Anger for Luck retiring and the Colts not being what they should have been, out on JB. 

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6 minutes ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

I truly feel bad for JB. He seemed to never get a fair shake to learn. Everyone talks about him having 2 years starting and two years learning under Brady and Luck.
 

It might be just me but that is only have if it. sitting and learning is a lot different than getting out there and actually playing. Also, if you get technical this is his first year as the unquestioned starter. 
 

just seems everyone is taking their Anger for Luck retiring and the Colts not being what they should have been, out on JB. 

hes a backup caliber player, we dont want him starting

 

texans would probably win the division every year they have watson and we have jacoby 

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6 minutes ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

I truly feel bad for JB. He seemed to never get a fair shake to learn. Everyone talks about him having 2 years starting and two years learning under Brady and Luck.
 

It might be just me but that is only have if it. sitting and learning is a lot different than getting out there and actually playing. Also, if you get technical this is his first year as the unquestioned starter. 
 

just seems everyone is taking their Anger for Luck retiring and the Colts not being what they should have been, out on JB. 

I'm so tired of hearing how he isnt getting treated fairly. he was given the starting job even after he sucked in 17 they gave him a huge pay raise after doing literally nothing. They are still letting him play now after %ting the bed all year. the guy has got plenty of time to show what he is he IS NOT a rookie he will not be treated as such.

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1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

I agree I just love seeing chloe change her stance after every game lol

Lol I can’t comment on that topic... I’ll get more warning points.

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5 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

I'm so tired of hearing how he isnt getting treated fairly. he was given the starting job even after he sucked in 17 they gave him a huge pay raise after doing literally nothing. They are still letting him play now after %ting the bed all year. the guy has got plenty of time to show what he is he IS NOT a rookie he will not be treated as such.

ice cube yes GIF

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1 minute ago, MPStack said:

2020 Salary

 

21.5 Million

 

Think about it!

I think we keep him either way. Hell I'm almost certain we keep him even if Luck is back. Or they might decide to trade him to a team that needs a bridge QB... 

 

But if we draft a rookie QB IMO there is not an insignificant chance that he starts next year too. Unless the rookie is really good and shows he's ready game 1. 

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Just now, stitches said:

I think we keep him either way. Hell I'm almost certain we keep him even if Luck is back. Or they might decide to trade him to a team that needs a bridge QB... 

 

But if we draft a rookie QB IMO there is not an insignificant chance that he starts next year too. Unless the rookie is really good and shows he's ready game 1. 

Cut JB and roll with Hoyer or Kelly as starter then. 
 

I can’t see JB mentoring a rookie any better than Hoyer. 
 

21.5m would be insane

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20 minutes ago, stitches said:

 

This is why I say that these injuries to the receivers are irrelevant. Guys are still getting open. Jacoby just isn’t hitting them. He’s got all day to throw too.

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Just now, Defjamz26 said:

This is why I say that these injuries to the receivers are irrelevant. Guys are still getting open. Jacoby just isn’t hitting them. He’s got all day to throw too.

I mean... to some extent I understand it - even if the WRs are getting open, QBs still need time with the receivers to know how they run their routes, their tendencies, etc. When Jacoby hasn't thrown much to those reserve receivers, it's only natural that he won't always be on point, but there are just some throws where this should not be part of the equation at all. Also... he was still missing receivers open even when we had most of our receivers healthy. 

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11 minutes ago, stitches said:

Also... he was still missing receivers open even when we had most of our receivers healthy.

Also true. I pointed this out in another topic. With the exception of Campbell, Jacoby had everyone healthy for like 5-6 games. That’s what’s frustrating. There was one throw this game on the drive where he threw the 1st interception. He had Doyle wide open on sideline and took forever to throw it to him. Then when he finally did he just missed him.

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51 minutes ago, MPStack said:

Cut JB and roll with Hoyer or Kelly as starter then. 
 

I can’t see JB mentoring a rookie any better than Hoyer. 
 

21.5m would be insane

we have to waste the money regardless

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14 minutes ago, MPStack said:

coding stephen colbert GIF

you wernt alone! I find it hilarious that the super fans are even starting to turn. the Colts reddit was full of JB lovers now everyone is giving up on him after seeing what he really is.

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47 minutes ago, stitches said:

I mean... to some extent I understand it - even if the WRs are getting open, QBs still need time with the receivers to know how they run their routes, their tendencies, etc. When Jacoby hasn't thrown much to those reserve receivers, it's only natural that he won't always be on point, but there are just some throws where this should not be part of the equation at all. Also... he was still missing receivers open even when we had most of our receivers healthy. 

I was at the game yesterday and was specifically watching the coverage that is normally out of screen range.  There were two throws I remember where Jacoby was waiting for the throwing window to open up.  It's like when you're behind a car at a stop sign, waiting for a window to make a turn and needing cars to be a half mile away before he's comfortable making the turn.   I kept yelling "Throw the ball already!"  Very frustrating when I know a guys open and Jacoby doesn't think he's open enough.

 

I also noticed a couple of receivers that had positioning on a post route, once with single high safety, and I can't remember the other coverage.  With the single high safety look (we're at about the Titans 45 yard line), the safety's got a little more distance to go.  Marcus Johnson noticed and ran his post a little steeper beating the CB coverage (Marcus had at least a step on him).  Had Jacoby thrown it when he was breaking, the safety would have never gotten there.  What was more telling though was after Marcus had already cut, he played his coverage up and ignored Marcus.  I don't know this to be true but when I had looked back toward Jacoby, he was already sorting out his check down options and staring to hit Jordan Willis (either he or Hines, I forget).  I don't know this to be the case, but I think the safety knew Jacoby had already decided to check down so Marcus was no longer a threat.  The biggest threat to him was a 45 yard TD from a check down play.

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9 hours ago, stitches said:

In NFL this is wide open. You don't get much better windows than this in the league, especially on 3d and long. And 1 second is plenty enough. That's the thing... he needs to anticipate a lot of those things... he needs to be throwing guys open, and he not only isn't... he needs more than 1 second AFTER they are open to make the throw. 

I agree here. The problem is that JB just can’t throw open or anticipate his guys are breaking. You would think by now, film room and the preseason and the regular season time would help him understand, you need to throw.....NOW, not stand there and pat the ball and wait for your first read to do something you wanted. 3 other guys are open somewhere on the field but you have to look around. I think we are at a lost cause to improve here with JB anymore. I had hopes he would develop better. He is just stuck at what he is. Imho 

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17 hours ago, stitches said:

 

 

 

JB isn't showing to be a 'playmaker'. But he also needs teammates help.  Here, you can't see (very well) the blitzing Logan Ryan got by Jordan Wilkins clean and is almost in his face as he was getting ready to sling it.  I'll try to post a better pic (but I don't have All 22 yet :( )

 

KNWkfEg.jpg

 

JB shook Ryan off enough to sling an incomplete downfield.  A good clean block by Jordan Wilkins, at least enough to slow down Ryan, and this may well have been a decent pass play. I'm telling people, you can make anything with one picture.  You need All 22, and slo motion video, to get a real feel on what went on.

 

I feel there is plenty of blame (poor pass blocking by running backs, exceptionally poor special teams; notably FG's, etc...) and Jb is in that mix.  This team can win, but only by playing as a team in all 3 phases.

 

I've got a set of pics where J. Williams totally guesses wrong on who the blitzer is (it was A. Jackson came clean) I may post.  I wish all 22 was available for my laptop, I have much better editing tools than I do on my iPad

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Yesterday showed how much we miss Mack in the passing game. He is a pretty good blocker and picks up the blitz pretty well.

 

It seen this year we just couldn’t put the run and pass game together at the same time. We haven’t been able to be balanced. Its either all run or all pass. Nothing balanced with both doing well. We really didn’t have a identity.

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8 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

JB isn't showing to be a 'playmaker'. But he also needs teammates help.  Here, you can't see (very well) the blitzing Logan Ryan got by Jordan Wilkins clean and is almost in his face as he was getting ready to sling it.  I'll try to post a better pic (but I don't have All 22 yet :( )

 

KNWkfEg.jpg

 

JB shook Ryan off enough to sling an incomplete downfield.  A good clean block by Jordan Wilkins, at least enough to slow down Ryan, and this may well have been a decent pass play. I'm telling people, you can make anything with one picture.  You need All 22, and slo motion video, to get a real feel on what went on.

 

I feel there is plenty of blame (poor pass blocking by running backs, exceptionally poor special teams; notably FG's, etc...) and Jb is in that mix.  This team can win, but only by playing as a team in all 3 phases.

 

I've got a set of pics where J. Williams totally guesses wrong on who the blitzer is (it was A. Jackson came clean) I may post.  I wish all 22 was available for my laptop, I have much better editing tools than I do on my iPad

That's the thing... Brissett needs everything around him to be ideal. He needs multiple receivers to get tons of separation, he needs the protection to be perfect... AND LONG. (on the first interception he got 5 seconds to throw the ball and on the 6th he was under pressure. Sure, the protection broke and there was pressure... but he also stayed there for damn long).I thought he was doing well in the 1st half yesterday... but then in the second they were giving him the same looks and he couldn't figure them out. So I don't know what to make of it. IMO there is a real chance he's doing great in scripted plays and once those are gone, you can really see his limitations in processing the game. 

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1 minute ago, stitches said:

That's the thing... Brissett needs everything around him to be ideal. He needs multiple receivers to get tons of separation, he needs the protection to be perfect... AND LONG. (on the first interception he got 5 seconds to throw the ball and on the 6th he was under pressure. Sure, the protection broke and there was pressure... but he also stayed there for damn long).I thought he was doing well in the 1st half yesterday... but then in the second they were giving him the same looks and he couldn't figure them out. So I don't know what to make of it. IMO there is a real chance he's doing great in scripted plays and once those are gone, you can really see his limitations in processing the game. 

That is a really good point about scripted plays. Usually first 15 or so are all scripted. That would explain the good first half.

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7 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yesterday showed how much we miss Mack in the passing game. He is a pretty good blocker and picks up the blitz pretty well.

 

It seen this year we just couldn’t put the run and pass game together at the same time. We haven’t been able to be balanced. Its either all run or all pass. Nothing balanced with both doing well. We really didn’t have a identity.

I have to agree with that one. Mack has been tremendous with his blitz pick ups and yesterday all of our backs had trouble with it. They didn't know when to stay and when to release, they were taking the wrong blitz, Williams got benched IMO more because of protection issues than because of his running. 

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I'm not going to pile in with an "I told you so", because there is still some of the season to go, and barring a major change in the off season I can see Brissett being the opening day starter next season. One thing to note is cutting him next year has no dead cap ramifications as far as I can work out, but would have to be done fairly sharpish because of his roster bonus. 

 

For all that objectively discussing his play gets you labelled as a "hater" or a "basher", I certainly don't hate Brissett. I'd have loved him to succeed, and who knows he may yet surprise us all yet. He's an easy guy to root for and on the one hand you can say it wasn't an ideal way to become the starter.....

 

... on the other, it gave him an opportunity he probably wasn't going to get otherwise. He has a good line in front of him, a good running game and had a chance to show the league he is a legit franchise QB. He hasn't as yet taken it, and the window is shutting rapidly.

 

I know some are still slightly myopic about his shortcomings, but hey at least your consistent. Better than flip flopping to be on the "right" side of the discussion. 

 

My heart wants us to win out and have a shot at the postseason, my head says we need the best draft position possible not that it looks like we're also QB shopping. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, stitches said:

That's the thing... Brissett needs everything around him to be ideal. He needs multiple receivers to get tons of separation, he needs the protection to be perfect... AND LONG. (on the first interception he got 5 seconds to throw the ball and on the 6th he was under pressure. Sure, the protection broke and there was pressure... but he also stayed there for damn long).I thought he was doing well in the 1st half yesterday... but then in the second they were giving him the same looks and he couldn't figure them out. So I don't know what to make of it. IMO there is a real chance he's doing great in scripted plays and once those are gone, you can really see his limitations in processing the game. 

 

I agree. but if other guys 'do their jobs', it makes it easier for JB to do his We all know he's not a dynamic playmaker/hero QB.  But tell me, if Wilkins makes a decent block, isn't this one of those JB situations he often makes?

 

sdyYFKH.jpg

 

Here's the whiff below on the block-

 

EmEGrWp.jpg

 

Now this below, I think a 'Playmaker' QB throws it knowing he is going to get clocked.

QMMB2rm.jpg

 

If Ryan was blocked/disrupted even a little, this may well be a completion, yes?

 

0U0cI3C.jpg

 

JB's hesitation tendencies he pulls it back to shake off Ryan, then misfires downfield on reload.

 

I've only analyzed this play, and one in 1st quarter where Williams doesn't slide over to the left to pick up a blitzing A. Jackson: instead helping (not really much either) B. Smith with his assignment.  It's a 'team' game. JB is a 'team' QB.  Maybe around top 20. He is not a top 10 playmaker. The other guys get paid, they have to perform too. I don't care who is at QB. Luck, or Hoyer.

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2 minutes ago, SteelCityColt said:

I'm not going to pile in with an "I told you so", because there is still some of the season to go, and barring a major change in the off season I can see Brissett being the opening day starter next season. One thing to note is cutting him next year has no dead cap ramifications as far as I can work out, but would have to be done fairly sharpish because of his roster bonus. 

 

For all that objectively discussing his play gets you labelled as a "hater" or a "basher", I certainly don't hate Brissett. I'd have loved him to succeed, and who knows he may yet surprise us all yet. He's an easy guy to root for and on the one hand you can say it wasn't an ideal way to become the starter.....

 

... on the other, it gave him an opportunity he probably wasn't going to get otherwise. He has a good line in front of him, a good running game and had a chance to show the league he is a legit franchise QB. He hasn't as yet taken it, and the window is shutting rapidly.

 

I know some are still slightly myopic about his shortcomings, but hey at least your consistent. Better than flip flopping to be on the "right" side of the discussion. 

 

My heart wants us to win out and have a shot at the postseason, my head says we need the best draft position possible not that it looks like we're also QB shopping. 

 

 

I still think giving him the full year was/is the right thing to do. He deserved a chance, his teammates love him and he has their respect. It would have been great for this team if he could be our QB of the future. Wouldn't need to waste picks trying to chase the elusive franchise QB in the draft, wouldn't need to skip a beat in our contention ambitions and we could have made reinforcements of the roster elsewhere instead of now looking at having to give up multiple high picks to get a QB. Unfortunately, right now it doesn't look like he will be the answer long term. 

 

With that said, I still think keeping him for next year is probably a smart thing to do, even if we draft a rookie QB. If injuries hit some team, we could probably still trade him and extract some value from him if our rookie is ready to play. 

 

I don't mind us pushing to win out. I just don't think we are good enough for it at some key positions(QB and kicker being the main two). From the very beginning my thought about this season has been that this for me would be a season to evaluate Brissett first and foremost, so I didn't really have some grand expectations for deep playoff run once Luck retired. So my point is - I wouldn't mind it going either way - best possible draft position or winning out and playoff berth. I guess the worst kind of finish is the one that's most likely - 8-8 and none of the above achieved. 

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Here's another pass blocking RB 'not' helping the QB-

 

OK, pre snap.  6 defenders on DL. Who's coming, who's dropping? {You make the call, anybody remember those?} 

 

5at68om.jpg

 

1 drops, 5 come.  Guess who? The guy the opposite side of where the RB lined up?  Yup-

 

o9Jzde3.jpg

 

Does RB anticipate that happening, look and slide over?  Nope, helps Glow and Smith instead-

 

ntSbq39.jpg

 

By now, JB sees it and tries turn and hit his hot receiver, Doyle but too late-

 

x8uvTLi.jpg

 

The pass bounces just 3 feet in front of JB.  But J. Williams helped Braden keep that DE off JB.

 

I listened (no TV broadcast here in FL) to the game. I think I'm going to find more of these throughout. :(

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

I agree. but if other guys 'do their jobs', it makes it eaqsier for JB to do his We all know he's not a dynamic playmaker/hero QB.  But tell me, if Wilkins makes a decent block, isn't thhis one of those JB situations he makes?

 

sdyYFKH.jpg

 

Here's the whiff below on the block-

 

EmEGrWp.jpg

 

Now this below, I think a 'Playmaker' throws it knowing he is going to get clocked.

QMMB2rm.jpg

 

If Ryan was blocked even a little, this is going to be a completion, yes?

 

0U0cI3C.jpg

 

JB's hesitation tendencies he pulls it back to shake off Ryan, then misfires downfield on reload.

 

I've only analyzed this play, and one in 1st quarter where Williams doesn't slide over to the left to pick up a blitzing A. Jackson: instead helping (not really much either) B. Smith with his assignment.  It's a 'team' game. JB is a 'team' QB.  maybe around top 20. He is not a top 10 playmaker. The other guys get paid, they have to perform too. I don't care who is at QB. Luck, or Hoyer.

 

Yeah, there were multiple issues with blitz pickups by the RBs yesterday and Brissett had trouble identifying those too and seeking his outlet pass. 

 

I don't think Brissett is top 20. I've been pretty firm on that even from the time we were still winning. IMO the defense did well enough to win yesterday and they've been doing really well for the last 2 months or thereabout. Ultimately the offense and especially the special teams made too many mistakes to hope to win any game really. 

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2 minutes ago, stitches said:

Yeah, there were multiple issues with blitz pickups by the RBs yesterday and Brissett had trouble identifying those too and seeking his outlet pass. 

 

Indeed-

 

 

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It's hard to pin the blame on just one player for failing to pick up a blitz as we can never be sure who has responsibility for what once the play is live. But pre-play I feel it's on Kelly/Brissett to identify and adjust the line/playcall. There is something to be said for Reich not calling plays to slow them down (can we get a screen?!). 
 

Good O's eat blitzes for breakfast. 

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3 minutes ago, SteelCityColt said:

It's hard to pin the blame on just one player for failing to pick up a blitz as we can never be sure who has responsibility for what once the play is live. But pre-play I feel it's on Kelly/Brissett to identify and adjust the line/playcall. There is something to be said for Reich not calling plays to slow them down (can we get a screen?!). 
 

Good O's eat blitzes for breakfast. 

 

 

I've been avoiding being nostalgic about Luck, especially in this thread, because I don't want to make this a Brissett vs Luck comparison, but yeah... the really good QBs dismantle blitzes. 

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This has been just a weird year that I think we are all ready to end and get to the draft.

 

I will say if Luck was throwing to pascal as his number one WR pascal would probably have 1k yards this season. He has been that good. 

 

Reichs play calling has to get better next year.  We need WR to stay healthy. QB can make WR better bye WR can also help the QB. Get more playnakers and stay healthy and hopefully whoever is the QB will play better.

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After watching Brady and how he struggled without play makers on his offense, I think laying too much blame on Brissett is a cop out.

I understand the frustration but when any QB don't have the talent needed to make plays they are going to look pretty bad. 

 

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I realize I've said this a few times over the last few games, but....

 

I'm beyond tired of Jacoby looking directly at the RB for the dump off pass, then scanning the field then coming back to the RB for a pass (only after holding the ball entirely waaaaay too long) only for the defense to figure it out and tackle the RB for a 1 yard gain. 

 

Also, if Wilkins (and/or Hines) is that bad at picking up blitzes, why was Williams on the freakin bench the entire 2nd half?? 

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Just now, lollygagger8 said:

I realize I've said this a few times over the last few games, but....

 

I'm beyond tired of Jacoby looking directly at the RB for the dump off pass, then scanning the field then coming back to the RB for a pass (only after holding the ball entirely waaaaay too long) only for the defense to figure it out and tackle the RB for a 1 yard gain. 

 

Also, if Wilkins is that bad at picking up blitzes, why was Williams on the freakin bench the entire 2nd half?? 

Because Williams is even worse that's why. 

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3 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Wilkins had a quicker step. Williams was getting stuffed and wasn’t looking great. 

 

I think it was also about Wilkins having better vision/patience. Williams’ angry running style wasn’t working, not waiting for blocks to develop, etc.

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10 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

After watching Brady and how he struggled without play makers on his offense, I think laying too much blame on Brissett is a cop out.

I understand the frustration but when any QB don't have the talent needed to make plays they are going to look pretty bad. 

 


If your benchmark is a 42 year old who is on the decline... 

 

Besides, some of the issues of Brissett are playmaker agnostic. A open receiver is an open receiver. A line that can give you 6 seconds of protection is a dream for most QBs etc etc. 
 

We got more production out the same group last year pretty much. 

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15 hours ago, The Fish said:

Colts fans wouldn't be salty that Luck isn't playing right now if he was a bust. Disappointment that's hard to categorize, sure. Bust? Not even kind of. Bust implies you thought the guy could play and he can't. Luck was/is an awesome QB. Maybe not generational, but even that's kind of grey to me, because I'm 100% sure there's 20 teams or more that'd be happy to have him right now. 

I'd say there are about 30 teams that would want him and 2 others that should.

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