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TimetobringDfence!

Mahomes over anyone.

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22 minutes ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

His career will be short if he doesn't start going out of bounds when he runs.   

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39 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

His career will be short if he doesn't start going out of bounds when he runs.   


Definitely better than Lamar who runs for a living as opposed to Mahomes, who like RW uses his legs first to pass and then get a first down most of the time.

 

All the QB sneaks Brady did never broke him, I’d think he’s done more of that than any other QB in the playoffs.

 

The only time Mahomes did that this playoff game was when only 15 seconds remained on the clock before the half, rest of the game he went down or out of bounds.

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1 hour ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

Mahonnes is great but Hill is the toy that makes it tick. 

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4 hours ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. 

 

Yeah well, his playoff competition - Texans and Titans - not exactly the 2000s Patriots. Steelers or Chargers, or some of the other great teams from the past.

 

Chiefs, Texans, Titans?  Our loser team with no QB beat all three of them.  

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4 hours ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

Mahomes is the best QB today but ever, nah. The 2014 Patriots with Tom, Edelman, Gronk may have something to say about that.

 

I would of loved to see this Chiefs team take on our 2006 team when we had Peyton, Marv, Reggie and our defense with Bob Sanders, Freeney, and Mathis as well. Hey guess what, Chiefs haven't won it yet though, what if the 49ers beat them?

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52 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Mahomes is the best QB today but ever, nah. The 2014 Patriots with Tom, Edelman, Gronk may have something to say about that.

 

I would of loved to see this Chiefs team take on our 2006 team when we had Peyton, Marv, Reggie and our defense with Bob Sanders, Freeney, and Mathis as well. Hey guess what, Chiefs haven't won it yet though, what if the 49ers beat them?

 

Agree. Best QB today is where it stops. He still has to earn his stripes over time. 49ers are like the early Patriots, with all the defensive talent stockpiled, and that is why they will win the SB.

 

Plus, this is definitely not against you but in general, I get the vibe that colored QBs are held to a different standard w.r.t the cerebral aspect of playing QB and their physical talents are somehow dismissed as not something future QBs should embrace completely for playing the QB position, and their faults aren't forgiven as easily as traditional QBs, IMO. I see it when people pounce on Lamar Jackson, Mahomes and Watson, who are being stereotyped as physical freaks for their running and athletic skills but not what they bring new to the table for the QB position. The same thing happened with Russell Wilson too when he played on a real good Seahawks team, till he won the SB and followed up with consistent QB play over these last few years, he still runs to pass but in some people's minds, he is a running QB. I get the same sense while discussing Jordan Love vs other QBs in the draft. It is a sub-conscious thing people aren't aware of or don't wish to acknowledge, IMO. @Jules, when she was still posting here, before the 2012 draft, she was the one I remember pointing out that it was an easier sell for a Midwest crowd to sell Andrew Luck over RG3 even if they had the same pros and cons but thankfully, she said, Luck had more pros and made it an easier choice. 

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7 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Agree. Best QB today is where it stops. He still has to earn his stripes over time. 49ers are like the early Patriots, with all the defensive talent stockpiled, and that is why they will win the SB.

 

Plus, this is definitely not against you but in general, I get the vibe that colored QBs are held to a different standard w.r.t the cerebral aspect of playing QB and their physical talents are somehow dismissed as not something future QBs should embrace completely for playing the QB position, and their faults aren't forgiven as easily as traditional QBs, IMO. I see it when people pounce on Lamar Jackson, Mahomes and Watson for being stereotyped as physical freaks for their running and athletic skills but not what they bring new to the table for the QB position. The same thing happened with Russell Wilson too when he played on a real good Seahawks team, till he won the SB and followed up with consistent QB play over these last few years, he still runs to pass but in some people's minds, he is a running QB. I get the same sense while discussing Jordan Love vs other QBs in the draft. It is a sub-conscious thing people aren't aware of or don't wish to acknowledge, IMO. @Jules, when she was still posting here, before the 2012 draft, she was the one I remember pointing out that it was an easier sell for a Midwest crowd to sell Andrew Luck over RG3 even if they had the same pros and cons but thankfully, she said, Luck had more pros and made it an easier choice. 

Yeah I really don't look at color. If I had to choose the best 4 QB's today I would go with Mahomes 1, Rodgers 2, Wilson 3, and Jackson 4. Luck is in that group too when he decides to quit playing Mr Mom lmao . IMO Mahomes is the best though. Guys like Tom, Peyton, and Montana are the greatest ever. 

 

When It came down to Luck and RG3, to me Luck was just the better all-around QB.

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Mahomes is the best QB in the league today no doubt.

But as far as ever that will be told in time. There are way too many variables that have to be taken into consideration.

The team the QB plays on is the main factor. 

Is there any QB in history that was better than Dan Marino? Joe Montana? Steve Young?  

It's all in the eyes of the beholder as they say. 

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12 hours ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

I don’t think they win the SB this year.  He is a great QB but if we are being honest O’Brien had to gift wrap that divisional game for them, and well SF the better team this year. (Their D stop them and KC D won’t stop the 49ers)

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3 hours ago, JimJaime said:

I don’t think they win the SB this year.  He is a great QB but if we are being honest O’Brien had to gift wrap that divisional game for them, and well SF the better team this year. (Their D stop them and KC D won’t stop the 49ers)

 

That is what I feel too.

 

It seems like the early Pats years with the 49ers defensive talent going against an offensive minded Colts team. We know how it went, I am leaning towards the 49ers too unless Andy Reid surprises me and pulls a Sean Payton and gains a possession with an onside kick or something, unlikely. :) 

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Anybody remember the conditions under which we played KC?  Mahomes couldn't scramble and Hill was out. 

 

As a pocket passer with only one of his weapons gone, he looked below average.

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3 hours ago, JimJaime said:

I don’t think they win the SB this year.  He is a great QB but if we are being honest O’Brien had to gift wrap that divisional game for them, and well SF the better team this year. (Their D stop them and KC D won’t stop the 49ers)

I know the 49ers D is way better. But I still dont think they can stop mahomes. If KC acn slow down the run somehow they will win.

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1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Anybody remember the conditions under which we played KC?  Mahomes couldn't scramble and Hill was out. 

 

As a pocket passer with only one of his weapons gone, he looked below average.

 

Moving out of his pocket is his strength, which is why Belichick brought the pressure in the A-gaps last year with a DB spy to keep him contained. So, he was shut down in the first half of the 2018 season AFCCG. His OL was manhandled the first half. The second half, Mahomes' agility was still there but he realized all the extra resources Belichick devoted led to his RBs left wide open in the flat constantly and he started hitting his RBs in stride for checkdowns and wheel routes instead of looking down field and the comeback happened to force OT.

 

In our Colts game, Mahomes' ankle was rolled upon by his OL and took away his biggest strengths. So, no, he cannot beat you consistently without his ability to move outside the pocket. It is like asking Peyton or Brady to make plays outside the pocket to beat you. A bad ankle would not affect Peyton or Brady's ability to beat you but for Mahomes, he needs his full mobility to win because that is his game. I expect the 49ers to do the same, bring pressure down the middle and not lose containment for most of the game.

 

The unsung heroes for the Chiefs, much like Brady's SB runs, are the OL guys, IMO, that have kept him upright. That is the #1 match up the 49ers have to win, their DL vs the Chiefs OL, and I think they will, over 60 minutes.

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16 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

His career will be short if he doesn't start going out of bounds when he runs.   

That goes double for Lamar Jackson.  I like Lamar, but everyone is talking about how amazing he is and how he's changing the game with his running, but they're ignoring all the hits he takes.  If Lamar doesn't change his style and continues running the way he does, I think his career will be very short.  Mahomes seems to run more out of necessity whereas Jackson runs as a primary weapon.

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1 minute ago, chad72 said:

 

Moving out of his pocket is his strength, which is why Belichick brought the pressure in the A-gaps last year with a DB spy to keep him contained. So, he was shut down in the first half of the 2018 season AFCCG. His OL was manhandled the first half. The second half, Mahomes' agility was still there but he realized all the extra resources Belichick devoted led to his RBs left wide open in the flat constantly and he started hitting his RBs in stride for checkdowns and wheel routes instead of looking down field and the comeback happened to force OT.

 

In our Colts game, Mahomes' ankle was shot and took away his biggest strengths. So, no, he cannot beat you consistently without his ability to move outside the pocket. It is like asking Peyton or Brady to make plays outside the pocket to beat you. A bad ankle would not affect Peyton or Brady's ability to beat you but for Mahomes, he needs his full mobility to win because that is his game. I expect the 49ers to do the same, bring pressure down the middle and not lose containment for most of the game.

Agreed.  That's basically what I said.  

 

TEN rushed 3, and kept a LB free to rush Mahomes as left the pocket.  He was still making down field plays and not checking down despite TEN only devoting 4 players to the rush.  The offense looked average until late in the game when he hit Watkins on a deep play after the DB fell down.  IOW, backyard ball.

 

His scramble was the result of him beating that LB spy rusher around the edge, and another who took a bad angle.

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2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Agreed.  That's basically what I said.  

 

TEN rushed 3, and kept a LB free to rush Mahomes as left the pocket.  He was still making down field plays and not checking down despite TEN only devoting 4 players to the rush.  The offense looked average until late in the game when he hit Watkins on a deep play after the DB fell down.  IOW, backyard ball.

 

His scramble was the result of him beating that LB spy rusher around the edge, and another who took a bad angle.

 

Belichick used a coverage LB or safety as a spy, can't use a regular thumper LB as spy, Mahomes is too quick for that. He will have to take check downs vs the 49ers DL speed, and if he doesn't do that quick enough, the Chiefs will be behind on the scoreboard against a D that can tee off vs the pass.

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22 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

Belichick used a coverage LB or safety as a spy, can't use a regular thumper LB as spy, Mahomes is too quick for that. He will have to take check downs vs the 49ers DL speed, and if he doesn't do that quick enough, the Chiefs will be behind on the scoreboard against a D that can tee off vs the pass.

Andy Reid will make some adjustments to attack the 49ers since he has 2 weeks for preparation. He’s 18-3 after the bye 

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1 minute ago, runthepost said:

Andy Reid will make some adjustments to attack the 49ers since he has 2 weeks for preparation. He’s 18-3 after the bye 

The two weeks during the super bowl week is nothing like a bye week in regular season. 

 Kyle Shanahan has just as much time to prepare his team so there is no advantage one way or another. 

 

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On 1/19/2020 at 6:05 PM, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

Give many QBs that O-line and weapons, and they would succeed.  

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He hasn’t even won the game yet guys. Atleast some of the other multiple SB winner predictions won 1 first before that talk started, but many of them (all of them besides Brady except for Peyton at the end?) didn’t win another and some of them didn’t even remain elite. And you better believe the 49ers aren’t sitting around expecting to lose the game just like the Titans weren’t against the Pats and Ravens, or the Vikings against the Saints. 

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On 1/21/2020 at 2:34 PM, BloodyChamp said:

He hasn’t even won the game yet guys. Atleast some of the other multiple SB winner predictions won 1 first before that talk started, but many of them (all of them besides Brady except for Peyton at the end?) didn’t win another and some of them didn’t even remain elite. And you better believe the 49ers aren’t sitting around expecting to lose the game just like the Titans weren’t against the Pats and Ravens, or the Vikings against the Saints. 

One down dont think he wont get anymore. lmao

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I'd put money on he's going to be an all timer, multiple SB winner (he's going to get another one in the next 10 years). It'll be on par with Brees, Manning, Farve, Elway ect barring unforeseen injury/early retirement when he's done. He's easily that prolific. It's not impossible to imagine him getting to the Brady/Montana conversation, but that's too much to predict.

This isn't good news for the rest of the AFC, including the Colts.

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After 3 years in the NFL and only 2 as the full time starter Mahomes looks pretty darn impressive, but it seems a little premature to say you would take him all time over anyone. I know in this day and age everyone wants to throw out a hot take and to me that's what this is. Patrick Mahomes has 1 Super Bowl win, to say that you would want him all time over anyone to me says one of 4 things (1) you are a prisoner of the moment, (2) you don't really know the history of the game, (3) you want to be able to pull your hot take up in a few years if he continues his success, or (4) you are trolling trying to get a reaction. I'll admit that the kid is tough and has the potential to go down as an all time great player in the NFL, but winning multiple Super Bowls or even one is no easy task. Just ask Dan Fouts, Dan Marino, Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees. To me your take just seems a little premature.

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I thought KC got lucky on a couple of backyard chuck-it plays, primarily because of the play of the WRs, not because of Mahomes.  He looked terrible throwing from the pocket, with the exception of a couple of good throws. 

 

Good runner though, but that's not that important.

 

Only made a play when his receivers found the open spot.  The opponent DBs seem to lose the receivers, allowing Mahomes to chuck the ball to them.

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Let us talk in 2-3 years after Mahomes' big contract comes into play and he is forced to carry the team a bit more than now. Just keeping it real here.

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On 1/20/2020 at 10:58 AM, 21isSuperman said:

That goes double for Lamar Jackson.  I like Lamar, but everyone is talking about how amazing he is and how he's changing the game with his running, but they're ignoring all the hits he takes.  If Lamar doesn't change his style and continues running the way he does, I think his career will be very short.  Mahomes seems to run more out of necessity whereas Jackson runs as a primary weapon.

 

That's what happened to RG3.  

 

Recent experience should show us that QB's who take an extraordinary amount of pounding no matter if it's from running on their own or getting beat up in the pocket just don't have long careers.  

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So the OP's original statement is a bit hyperbole.  Seems that is the norm we live in these days.

 

But if I could pick a QB for the Colts today from any guy available today it would be hard not to pick Mahomes.  He would be on my short list for sure.

 

We've all seen QBs have days that weren't their best performance.  And when Mahomes was struggling a bit in the passing game he didn't - and the team didn't - choke.  He used his legs when he needed to and ended up leading his team back into the game and ultimately the win.

 

So while it's easy to say "he ain't that good" who today would you rather have leading your team?  

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11 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

That's what happened to RG3.  

 

Recent experience should show us that QB's who take an extraordinary amount of pounding no matter if it's from running on their own or getting beat up in the pocket just don't have long careers.  

Jackson will have a good career, but it will most likely be similar in length to that of a running back, not a quarterback, 

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11 minutes ago, gspdx said:

So the OP's original statement is a bit hyperbole.  Seems that is the norm we live in these days.

 

But if I could pick a QB for the Colts today from any guy available today it would be hard not to pick Mahomes.  He would be on my short list for sure.

 

We've all seen QBs have days that weren't their best performance.  And when Mahomes was struggling a bit in the passing game he didn't - and the team didn't - choke.  He used his legs when he needed to and ended up leading his team back into the game and ultimately the win.

 

So while it's easy to say "he ain't that good" who today would you rather have leading your team?  


I don't think many where in opposition to the statement that Pat Mahomes would be the guy you would pick right now.  In fact most said he's the best QB in the league right now and he's young as well.  

 

 I think it was the presumption that he will be the SB MVP for years to come.  And it is a worthwhile point that when his top receiver was out of the game Mahomes lost a couple games in a row to both us and the Texans.  

 

If the Chief's SB hopes ride on getting lucky with injuries, they likely arn't going to be a dynasty.  That to be fair was one thing that separated the Pats from other teams.  They won even with star players out.  

 

KC could be a dynasty but if so Mahomes is going to have to find a way to win when his star receivers get hurt.  Not to take away from Mahomes who I agree is the best QB in the league right now, but he's throwing to a pretty good receiver in Hill and one of the league's best TE's in Kelce.  

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He didn’t exactly light it up last night and the 49ers blew it more than he won it. But he’s holding the trophy. Can’t take that away from him. He’s probably the best guy right now like many have said, but alltime is a stretch even though he does have that potential. 

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31 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:


I don't think many where in opposition to the statement that Pat Mahomes would be the guy you would pick right now.  In fact most said he's the best QB in the league right now and he's young as well.  

 

 I think it was the presumption that he will be the SB MVP for years to come.  And it is a worthwhile point that when his top receiver was out of the game Mahomes lost a couple games in a row to both us and the Texans.  

 

If the Chief's SB hopes ride on getting lucky with injuries, they likely arn't going to be a dynasty.  That to be fair was one thing that separated the Pats from other teams.  They won even with star players out.  

 

KC could be a dynasty but if so Mahomes is going to have to find a way to win when his star receivers get hurt.  Not to take away from Mahomes who I agree is the best QB in the league right now, but he's throwing to a pretty good receiver in Hill and one of the league's best TE's in Kelce.  

Just wait until all these young guys want new contracts.  Same thing happened to the Colts...good players left for $$$ and never did much else.

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On 1/19/2020 at 5:05 PM, TimetobringDfence! said:

I would take Mahomes over any QB ever if I had the choice. He's light years ahead of anyone ever at their 2yr marker. Superbowl MVP for yrs to come!

Sure if he comes with Kelsey, Hill and Reid.  

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