Anthony Gordon-QB- Wazzu- Cheez-It Bowl/ Thoughts

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

Hey guys. This is a QB that I really like. I wanted to jump on the forum and setup the thread for his game tonight.
 

Before it starts, what are some thoughts y’all got on him. 

[Hoose]

Don't know much about him but the last guy out of WSU is doing pretty darn well in the NFL. It will be a reason to tune in, just like the Frisco Bowl. 

[BleedBlu8792]

1 hour ago, Hoose said:

Don't know much about him but the last guy out of WSU is doing pretty darn well in the NFL. It will be a reason to tune in, just like the Frisco Bowl. 

Who would that be?

[MikeCurtis]

3 hours ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

Hey guys. This is a QB that I really like. I wanted to jump on the forum and setup the thread for his game tonight.
 

Before it starts, what are some thoughts y’all got on him. 

He is worth the watch

 

He has a quick release and excellent touch

 

If we pass on an early QB, I would be happy with him in the 3rd

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 hour ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

Who would that be?

Minshew.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 hours ago, Hoose said:

Don't know much about him but the last guy out of WSU is doing pretty darn well in the NFL. It will be a reason to tune in, just like the Frisco Bowl. 

Minshew s stats are about the same as Jacobys.

[Gigc]

The one thing that makes it really hard to evaluate Gordon is that he gets SO MUCH time to throw in WSU's offense. 

I swear I've seen him standing back there 7 to 8 seconds in a bunch of games.

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

51 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

He is worth the watch

 

He has a quick release and excellent touch

 

If we pass on an early QB, I would be happy with him in the 3rd

That is what I would like. I am just very hesitant about the 1st round QBs this year. I love the quick release and touch he has. Also he didn’t spend his entire career at Wazzu in the air raid. Went JUCO, like Aaron Rodgers. He had 3,864 yards 37 TDS and 13 INTS at JUCO and won national title. This was as a freshman. 

[DougDew]

6'3" 210 pounds.  If that's accurate, he should be big enough.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

16 minutes ago, DougDew said:

6'3" 210 pounds.  If that's accurate, he should be big enough.

That is very light for being that tall.

[BleedBlu8792]

1 hour ago, Chloe6124 said:

Minshew.

Guess I was confused by the "pretty darn good" part..

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, BleedBlu8792 said:

Guess I was confused by the "pretty darn good" part..

Yeah. He started hot like Jacoby then fizzled and couldn’t gain his spark back. Everyone forgets they got creamed by the Texans with Minshew which lead to them starting foles the week we played the jags. Minhews stats are about the same as Jacobys. 

[Fisticuffs111]

1 hour ago, Chloe6124 said:

That is very light for being that tall.

My guess was that's Kirk Cousins size and woah, same exact height and weight, according to google at least.

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

I noticed that ball comes out super fast. He has a quick release and knows where he wants to go and get it there fast. Man that release is super quick. 

[MikeCurtis]

32 minutes ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

I noticed that ball comes out super fast. He has a quick release and knows where he wants to go and get it there fast. Man that release is super quick. 

100% Agree

 

I think this kid has more tools than Fromm and Eason

 

He has good movement in the pocket as well

 

If he lights it up at the senior bowl he will go in 2nd or 3rd

 

 

 

I WISH JB had the release, movement, read, and touch this kid does..........

 

If we picked him with our 2nd, 2nd round pick........

 

CUT Hoyer - He brings absolutely NOTHING to this team

 

Let JB, CK, and Gordon (or one of 4-5 OTHER QB)  COMPETE to be on the roster

 

 

At a minimum, we need another actual QB prospect, to compete with what we have today

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MikeCurtis]

9 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

That is very light for being that tall.

Give him a year, the pro trainers can put 10-15 lbs on him

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

Yeah, I will say that what impressed me most was that quick release of the ball. It literally jumps out of his hand. 

[MikeCurtis]

With Gordon (and Tua, Love, Burrows, Herbert)

 

Watch just a quarter of their play

 

Then watch JB to compare

 

You can see quicker reads, release, accuracy etc. ALL the QB BASICS ...........

 

From college kids.

 

Its a VERY SAD comparison

 

 

 

I feel bad bashing JB, but IMHO, its "Nose on face" Obvious

 

He is doing the best he can with limited tools...... but it shows

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

7 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

With Gordon (and Tua, Love, Burrows, Herbert)

 

Watch just a quarter of their play

 

Then watch JB to compare

 

You can see quicker reads, release, accuracy etc. ALL the QB BASICS ...........

 

From college kids.

 

Its a VERY SAD comparison

 

 

 

I feel bad bashing JB, but IMHO, its "Nose on face" Obvious

 

He is doing the best he can with limited tools...... but it shows

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Problem with this is they will make way more mistakes, forcing stuff, etc.. I am not trying to defend JB here as his release isn't real quick.

[MikeCurtis]

30 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Problem with this is they will make way more mistakes, forcing stuff, etc.. I am not trying to defend JB here as his release isn't real quick.

Absolutely

 

You expect it, especially from a rookie

 

When these 4-5 rookies have had a year or two of the pro game, they will have an opportunity to develop to be safer with their throws

 

Some of these may not "make it" in the NFL, because they dont learn when to NOT throw the ball

 

JB is "safe" because he doesnt have the accuracy or release, and knows it so he doesnt even try to fit the ball into a tight space.

 

We are "safe" but will not win against better teams most weeks

 

There were two games that very much turned me against JB as an NFL caliber player.

 

The 2nd, Texans game. They had 2nd and 3rd string DBs........ and we couldnt pass against them.

 

I attended the Colts / TB game......  I came away with a much worse perspective on JB than I could gather from watching on TV.

 

When you see the whole field and people that are open.... and the misses or where the WR have the ball behind them.

 

A QB in the NFL needs to be accurate enough to throw to the WR back shoulder on plays where coverage dictates it

 

JB just doesnt have that accuracy, he doesnt have the touch on the passes, he doesnt have the release, he doesnt read the field very well

 

How any more games do we need to see?

 

We will probably win tomorrow

 

But will probably have just 125-140 yards passing.

 

Ok for Air Force, ground and pound.....  But not for NFL

 

 

Sorry.... last rant on JB from me till draft time 

 

[stitches]

14 hours ago, DougDew said:

6'3" 210 pounds.  If that's accurate, he should be big enough.

 

14 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

That is very light for being that tall.

I don't think it's that light. The new NFL is not the same as NFL of yesteryears. Darius Leonard is about the same size too - he said he expects to play at about 215 this year. And that's a linebacker. Being in good shape, being quick on your feet and elusive is much more important nowadays than being bulky and strong. With the new rules the QBs are protected more than anytime before and thus the necessity to be big has been mitigated lately. 

 

QB's weight is generally not something I worry about unless it's an extreme outlier case. That's why I have no issue with Gordon's weight or Love's weight. They are young players, they will get into an NFL strength and conditioning program and they will get the help they need with their bodies for optimal performance. Nothing in those numbers look to me like some underlying problem. It's just young players being young and not having grown and trained into their bodies yet. 

[Archer]

Yeah, I’m on Gordon and Wake Forest QB Jamie Newman in the late middle rounds, rather than taking an early shot at Love, Eason, or Fromm.  Those guys don’t give me a fuzzy feeling...

[WoolMagnet]

11 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Problem with this is they will make way more mistakes, forcing stuff, etc.. I am not trying to defend JB here as his release isn't real quick.

Everything JB does is deliberate.  There is no “quick” in anything he does.  Movement, thinking, ...everything.  And i’m not saying he’s not football smart.  I think he just processes at a slower pace than some.   I can somewhat relate.  My educational background is in the sciences and engineering.  I HATE to be rushed when thinking things thru.  I like a slower pace to think things thru and analyze all angles.  I was trained this way.  The problem is, i do it when buying socks as well.  And sometimes, like while playing QB, you just dont have the time to be 100% certain.

  
  I want a QB that reads quickly and is accurate.  That seems to be trending with successful QBs as well.

[NewColtsFan]

13 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

Absolutely

 

You expect it, especially from a rookie

 

When these 4-5 rookies have had a year or two of the pro game, they will have an opportunity to develop to be safer with their throws

 

Some of these may not "make it" in the NFL, because they dont learn when to NOT throw the ball

 

JB is "safe" because he doesnt have the accuracy or release, and knows it so he doesnt even try to fit the ball into a tight space.

 

We are "safe" but will not win against better teams most weeks

 

There were two games that very much turned me against JB as an NFL caliber player.

 

The 2nd, Texans game. They had 2nd and 3rd string DBs........ and we couldnt pass against them.

 

I attended the Colts / TB game......  I came away with a much worse perspective on JB than I could gather from watching on TV.

 

When you see the whole field and people that are open.... and the misses or where the WR have the ball behind them.

 

A QB in the NFL needs to be accurate enough to throw to the WR back shoulder on plays where coverage dictates it

 

JB just doesnt have that accuracy, he doesnt have the touch on the passes, he doesnt have the release, he doesnt read the field very well

 

How any more games do we need to see?

 

We will probably win tomorrow

 

But will probably have just 125-140 yards passing.

 

Ok for Air Force, ground and pound.....  But not for NFL

 

 

Sorry.... last rant on JB from me till draft time 

 

How many games do you need to see?

 

Do you decide on a rookie quarterback after his first year?   Because that’s what you’re doing.   2017 means almost nothing.   Bad team, weak talent, poor coaching.   Arrived late and had no time to learn a QB unfriendly system.

 

This is as close as JB had to a rookie season.   I don’t pretend to know how good he can be,  but I’d expect him to improve next season.   I just don’t know how much better.... 
 

Im not arguing for JB long term.  I favor drafting a QB with a first or second round pick.  I just think judgements are being made on Brissett as if it’s impossible for him to be better.   I would strongly caution against that.   
 

Unless we acquire someone like Foles,  or Carr, then JB is highly likely to be the guy next year.  The rookie we draft will need a redshirt year.   He’ll get the keys to the car in 2021.   I’m hoping JB does well and makes the decision hard.  

[esmort]

5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

How many games do you need to see?

 

Do you decide on a rookie quarterback after his first year?   Because that’s what you’re doing.   2017 means almost nothing.   Bad team, weak talent, poor coaching.   Arrived late and had no time to learn a QB unfriendly system.

 

This is as close as JB had to a rookie season.   I don’t pretend to know how good he can be,  but I’d expect him to improve next season.   I just don’t know how much better.... 
 

Im not arguing for JB long term.  I favor drafting a QB with a first or second round pick.  I just think judgements are being made on Brissett as if it’s impossible for him to be better.   I would strongly caution against that.   
 

Unless we acquire someone like Foles,  or Carr, then JB is highly likely to be the guy next year.  The rookie we draft will need a redshirt year.   He’ll get the keys to the car in 2021.   I’m hoping JB does well and makes the decision hard.  

 

Not the "hes essentially a rookie" excuse.  He's so far removed from a rookie.  The fact that 2017 was a bad year doesn't mean you get to dismiss it, plenty of rookie QBs come into bad situations and that was his second year. What about his real rookie year he got to spend with the Patriots learning and getting playing time. Three years in, he has had plenty of time to develop and learn.  I will be very surprised if he makes any significant improvement. 

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

Hey guys. Can we please stick to the discussion about Anthony Gordon. I’m sick and tired of every thread turning into a Jacoby Bashfest or a Jacoby Argument thread. 
 

I am genuinely interested in what everyone thinks about this guy as a round 2 or 3 guy. 

[MikeCurtis]

9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

How many games do you need to see?

 

Do you decide on a rookie quarterback after his first year?   Because that’s what you’re doing.   2017 means almost nothing.   Bad team, weak talent, poor coaching.   Arrived late and had no time to learn a QB unfriendly system.

 

This is as close as JB had to a rookie season.   I don’t pretend to know how good he can be,  but I’d expect him to improve next season.   I just don’t know how much better.... 
 

Im not arguing for JB long term.  I favor drafting a QB with a first or second round pick.  I just think judgements are being made on Brissett as if it’s impossible for him to be better.   I would strongly caution against that.   
 

Unless we acquire someone like Foles,  or Carr, then JB is highly likely to be the guy next year.  The rookie we draft will need a redshirt year.   He’ll get the keys to the car in 2021.   I’m hoping JB does well and makes the decision hard.  

I guess, what ARE you arguing for?

 

I like JB

 

I like him better as a backup, vs a starter.

 

If you see my posts, I have taken an amount of ribbing because I was higher than most others on JB. 

 

We are in JBs 4th year.  He has 31 starts. 

 

After 31 starts, we should see someone who sees the field, develops some consistent touch, and is developing into a better QB.

 

I dont see this needed development from JB. 

 

Think about ANY of the top QBs over the past 5 years. After 31 games, you just KNOW

(JW of TB may be an exception) 

 

To me, I have seen enough......  In my NON-EXPERT eyes.....  JB is NOT the guy.

 

We agree that we need to draft a QB. (Or..... bring in someone like Carr) Draft is better, but I would be happy with either

 

We do disagree on the redshirt of a QB, especially if we draft a QB early.

 

We have a unique situation where we have an awesome OL, where a young QB wont get himself beat to a pulp, and can learn the spot.

 

I say put him in early vs later...... which may equate to starting snaps from the start, or mid year.

 

Either way........   with a rookie QB, we all need to be prepared for a 2020 season that may not reach .500

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MikeCurtis]

2 hours ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

Hey guys. Can we please stick to the discussion about Anthony Gordon. I’m sick and tired of every thread turning into a Jacoby Bashfest or a Jacoby Argument thread. 
 

I am genuinely interested in what everyone thinks about this guy as a round 2 or 3 guy. 

Sorry......  I will limit my JB bashing 

 

Mark me down for 100% in the Gordon camp, as one of the possible choices

 

 

 

[NannyMcafee]

 

 

If this guy is right I want no part of it. 

[NewColtsFan]

6 hours ago, esmort said:

 

Not the "hes essentially a rookie" excuse.  He's so far removed from a rookie.  The fact that 2017 was a bad year doesn't mean you get to dismiss it, plenty of rookie QBs come into bad situations and that was his second year. What about his real rookie year he got to spend with the Patriots learning and getting playing time. Three years in, he has had plenty of time to develop and learn.  I will be very surprised if he makes any significant improvement. 

And he did well on his time with the Pats.   That’s not in dispute.

 

I’m only saying those holding 2017 against the guy are wrong.   That’s not how he’s measured, especially since the NFL community thought JB did well under terrible circumstances not of his making. 
 

Judge him all you want by 2019, but people who are holding ‘17 against him are making a mistake. 

[Hoose]

5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

And he did well on his time with the Pats.   That’s not in dispute.

 

I’m only saying those holding 2017 against the guy are wrong.   That’s not how he’s measured, especially since the NFL community thought JB did well under terrible circumstances not of his making. 
 

Judge him all you want by 2019, but people who are holding ‘17 against him are making a mistake. 

I'm not a big JB fan, but I do agree with this comment. 2017 was as tough a situation for a young QB to step into as any I could imagine. Hardly a week under his belt and now he's the starter with a brand new system, a brand new team, and no time to work with the offense? JB did well just to stay alive. In fact, he had some very good moments. 

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

I guess, what ARE you arguing for?

 

I like JB

 

I like him better as a backup, vs a starter.

 

If you see my posts, I have taken an amount of ribbing because I was higher than most others on JB. 

 

We are in JBs 4th year.  He has 31 starts. 

 

After 31 starts, we should see someone who sees the field, develops some consistent touch, and is developing into a better QB.

 

I dont see this needed development from JB. 

 

Think about ANY of the top QBs over the past 5 years. After 31 games, you just KNOW

(JW of TB may be an exception) 

 

To me, I have seen enough......  In my NON-EXPERT eyes.....  JB is NOT the guy.

 

We agree that we need to draft a QB. (Or..... bring in someone like Carr) Draft is better, but I would be happy with either

 

We do disagree on the redshirt of a QB, especially if we draft a QB early.

 

We have a unique situation where we have an awesome OL, where a young QB wont get himself beat to a pulp, and can learn the spot.

 

I say put him in early vs later...... which may equate to starting snaps from the start, or mid year.

 

Either way........   with a rookie QB, we all need to be prepared for a 2020 season that may not reach .500

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Im arguing the Big Picture.  That if free agency and the draft come and we DON’T  trade for a veteran, then JB is highly likely to be our starter next year.   If we draft someone, I think that player needs a year to sit and learn.

 

I see a lot of people fearful of another year of starting JB.   All I’m saying is he might be more improved than you think.   Give him a chance.  
 

I don’t buy the 31 game argument because I don’t think any QB should be judged for those terrible circumstances.  I don’t blame JB for ‘17. 
 

So, to me, he had a very disappointing ‘19.  I expect the team to acquire another quality QB.  If it’s a draft pick, odds are JB is our starter in ‘20.   If it’s a veteran, then JB either gets cut, traded or demoted. 
 

But if he starts next year, I expect JB to be better.   Hopefully much better. 

[MikeCurtis]

23 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

But if he starts next year, I expect JB to be better.   Hopefully much better. 

I am a natural optimist

 

IF he starts the season, I hope he is much better as well.

 

I havent observed the basic skillset with JB, nor the expected development, to this point, that would make that happen, but my HOPE is there.... 

 

It will all play out one way or another

[NannyMcafee]

1 hour ago, MikeCurtis said:

I am a natural optimist

 

IF he starts the season, I hope he is much better as well.

 

I havent observed the basic skillset with JB, nor the expected development, to this point, that would make that happen, but my HOPE is there.... 

 

It will all play out one way or another

 

I see JB improving in small ways, we just have no idea what his ceiling truly is and how fast he can improve. He could become elite, the question is will it take another 6 years. He has shown improvement since his days in NE. It just might be taking too long. 

[MikeCurtis]

8 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

 

If this guy is right I want no part of it. 

He starts the dialog with how wrong he has been in the past........

 

So NOW.... he wants to take shots

 

He seems to think that what everyone likes about this QB is his stats

 

When I see him play, I see quick release, strong arm, good mobility, and good touch

 

I have no idea if this kid will be great in the NFL...........  there are a few questions

 

But dang... if we havent picked a QB before the 3rd round..... you would have to consider him

 

 

2 cents......

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NannyMcafee]

2 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

He starts the dialog with how wrong he has been in the past........

 

So NOW.... he wants to take shots

 

He seems to think that what everyone likes about this QB is his stats

 

When I see him play, I see quick release, strong arm, good mobility, and good touch

 

I have no idea if this kid will be great in the NFL...........  there are a few questions

 

But dang... if we havent picked a QB before the 3rd round..... you would have to consider him

 

 

2 cents......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Im always down for something like this to be wrong. 

[MikeCurtis]

1 minute ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

Im always down for something like this to be wrong. 

What do you mean?

 

 

 

[NannyMcafee]

1 hour ago, MikeCurtis said:

What do you mean?

 

 

 

 

He says that he doesn't read the middle of the field very well, and doesn't see lbers and safeties, which I'm down for being wrong. But that just seems like a big deal if hes not. Maybe something he can get past with practice? 

[BleedBlue4Shoe86]

Just some highlights for him.  Love the quick release.

 

 

[Colt Overseas]

The big question I have with Gordon is whether he would still be allowed to wear 18 if we draft him