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Josh Rosen

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2 hours ago, MPStack said:


One trick pony with very limited playoff success. Enough said!

he could throw it.  he was probably one of the better left handed passers 

 

not a hall of fame career but he had a good one on the field 

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8 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

he could throw it.  he was probably one of the better left handed passers 

 

I don’t know what your definition of throw it means? But a 56% career completion rate isn’t impressive. Merry Christmas 

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7 minutes ago, MPStack said:

 

I don’t know what your definition of throw it means? But a 56% career completion rate isn’t impressive. Merry Christmas 

Luck's was 60% for his career.  56 isnt bad for one of the best runners ever

 

 vick didnt hit every throw but he could sling it and made some big plays. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, ar7 said:

There were questions about Rosen's leadership and coachability during the draft process when he came out.

 

I don't know how he has been in those two areas in the NFL. However, the fact that the Cardinals dumped him after just on year, and using a top 10 pick to select him, and the Dolphins don't appear to see him as their QB of the future makes me doubt him.

 

I don't think I'd like to Rosen as the long-term answer at QB for the Colts.

Except for 2 glaring facts.....kingsbury drafted his style of qb as a rookie head coach.

 

Dolphins also have a rookie head coach who has flip flopped between rosen and Kirkpatrick, but mainly has stuck with the veteran. Which sounds like a disciple of belichek

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If we traded one of our 6th Round Picks for him and drafted one with the Redskins 2nd Round Pick and let them battle it out I would not be upset at all.....

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Vick was not a good pocket passer, so he used his legs a lot. He was a wanna be QB.

Jackson is a top shelf pocket passer, he runs for fun. He's a rare double threat.

Wilson is a top shelf pocket passer, and also a scrambler, with decent wheels.

Fran Tarkenton & Archie Manning were top shelf pocket QB's that scrambled.

 

Bottom Line; If you're not a top shelf pocket passer, you're just a poser QB. Bank on it.

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I read an article recently that Rosen isn’t liked in NFL locker rooms either/ I think it said he separates himself . I thought about picking him up too but I’m thinking he won’t make it now.

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59 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

Except for 2 glaring facts.....kingsbury drafted his style of qb as a rookie head coach.

 

Dolphins also have a rookie head coach who has flip flopped between rosen and Kirkpatrick, but mainly has stuck with the veteran. Which sounds like a disciple of belichek

 

It wasn't just Kingsbury drafting Murray. Steve Keim was the GM When they drafted Rosen and Murray.

 

Coaches (good ones) will adapt to their players particularly the starting QB. The Cardinals drafted Murray and traded Rosen because they didn't believe Rosen was the guy to lead them at QB.

 

Even if Kingsbury did demand drafting Murray and trading Rosen as a condition of accepting the job the Cardinals agreed to it. If Keim really believed in Rosen I think he would have hired a different Head Coach if Kingsbury really demanded a QB who fit his system.

 

Same with Dolphins...if Rosen was better than Fitzpatrick he would play over him.

 

If the Colts want to give up a late round pick and see what happens fine. But I think hopes that Rosen could be a team's answer at QB smells of desperation.

 

His first two years in the league have been far from ideal but if he was a franchise caliber QB two NFL teams would not dump him so easily. If he was this type of QB he would rise above this to some degree.

 

 It's not like we are talking about playing vs sitting him...it's whether or not the teams have confidence in him as their guy in the future. The Cardinals said no after just one year and the Dolphins don't appear committed to him and they don't have a long-term alternative.

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Rosen ran the same 40 time at the combine as Drew Brees. 4.85 40. Rosen also threw better than Brees did at the combine. With that being said, I know that means nothing. My biggest fear with Rosen is that he is already damaged psychologically. 2 teams in 2 years. He cant be brimming with confidence. 
Miami gave a 2nd and a 5th for him this year. I don’t see them giving him up for much less. He is on a rookie contract, so he is very affordable. 

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Not this argument again about mobile QBs as if it is something new. I seem to recall 1986 Randall Cunningham on the cover saying "Robo QB".  The future of the NFL.  Then Michael Vick.  They always claim mobile QBs are the way the NFL is, yet every year the guys better at throwing from the pocket always rule.  Andrew Luck was a pocket passer who could run.  I expect Lamar Jackson to last 2 years and defenses will figure him out.  See RGIII.  So predictable.

 

Again, I would rather have Josh Rosen over Jordan Love any day.  how many times do physical, mobile, inaccurate QBs fail in the NFL?

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Josh Rosen has went to 2 organizations just begging for him to be their franchise guy.  He has been traded once and benched in favor Fitzpatrick. That should tell u all you need to know about his ability to lead a team.  If he was truly a franchise guy, he would, to some degree, be able to rise above it all.  He has shown absolutey nothing that tells me he can b that guy. 

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1 hour ago, lennymoore24 said:

Not this argument again about mobile QBs as if it is something new. I seem to recall 1986 Randall Cunningham on the cover saying "Robo QB".  The future of the NFL.  Then Michael Vick.  They always claim mobile QBs are the way the NFL is, yet every year the guys better at throwing from the pocket always rule.  Andrew Luck was a pocket passer who could run.  I expect Lamar Jackson to last 2 years and defenses will figure him out.  See RGIII.  So predictable.

 

Again, I would rather have Josh Rosen over Jordan Love any day.  how many times do physical, mobile, inaccurate QBs fail in the NFL?

 

The irony... 

 

Josh Rosen - physical, mobile, inaccurate QB

 

Much like Manziel, he's an entitled *, who was born with a silver spoon in his mouth, who thought he would come in with some status and be given a job. That's working out fantastic for him, just like it did for Manziel.  I think I'd rather see the Colts pay JB 18M/yr than get Rosen for free. 

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You're talking about a guy who's already been run out of 2 towns with teams far worse than ours.

 

No thank you.  I would 10,000 times rather have Brissett than Rosen.   Moving for Rosen would be basically trading 1 flawed QB for an even more flawed one.  I don't like that math.

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8 hours ago, Shadow_Creek said:

umm besides brady and manning name me a good decent pocket passer? cause if you say brees or rogers both are included in the mobile type

Brees is mobile?  That's a new one on me LOL?

 

Rivers?  Goff? Garoppolo?  Cousins has his moments.  There's a few really good pocket guys out there.  

 

Pocket passers aren't as sexy as dynamic multi threat QB, but they're a lot more predictable and stable. 

 

Rosen's issue isn't that he's a pocket passer, it's that he's a terrible one who doesn't have the hand speed to get the ball out of his hand quickly, and doesn't have the mental acuity to step up or step back when he needs to, leading to rushed awful throws time and again.  Even Brissett has more escapability, and Brissett himself is mostly a pocket guy.

 

Sometimes a guy just doesn't have what it actually takes to survive in the NFL despite Godgiven physical gifts.  Rosen is gonna be one of those guys.

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I agree that Rosen hasn't gotten a fair shake.  Thrown into the fire with a bad Arizona team as a rook, team gets impatient and falls in love with Murray.  Samething in Miami.  If Miami would take a 6 or 7, I'd look into it.  

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8 hours ago, aaron11 said:

i like mobile QBs, if the ravens get 4 or 5 good years out of lamar playing at this level its probably worth it. 

Interesting way to look at it.  
If you got him in the 1st, you've got 5 years.  So basically you let him walk and get big payday somewhere else.  Or tou trade in year 4. 
  The problem is, even if he’s been beat around,  you’re gonna want to keep him if he’s produced at that level.

  Its also going to be more costly (draft or FA) for these giys as they are the current trend.

  But treat his as many do RBs.  
It does seem costly tho.  Tou really like to keep the guys tou develop.  Tou would really have to invest in scouting in the QB area too. 
 

Edit:  i’m not sure why i dislike “Y”s so much.  Sorry.

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Appears that according to these posts, Josh Rosen is a bust being in two teams already.  Yeah, there must be more to it than meets the eye....They had to see something in him to draft him in the first round....Maybe the scheme on the team didn't fit the bill.....If they want to sell, we maybe interested in buying.  But not before we explore what's available in the draft that's worth going after to replace JB....

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12 hours ago, Shadow_Creek said:

umm besides brady and manning name me a good decent pocket passer? cause if you say brees or rogers both are included in the mobile type

I wouldn’t necessarily say they are “mobile” but more so have the ability to improvise and extend plays. 

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16 hours ago, lennymoore24 said:

Some of you might think I am crazy, but if the Dolphins pick a QB like Tua early in the draft and we could get Rosen for like a 5, I would love that. I know Rosen has not played great his first two years.  But do keep in mind he is 22 years old, was on two of the worst teams of the last two years, and has been through coaching hell.  He also has attributes that Reich likes.  He is definitely a pocket passer who is very accurate. I remember him coming out of college, hew as called the most pro ready QB since Andrew Luck.  I expect some team like New England will make a move to get him because he is loaded with potential.  I am not saying he is anything like Steve Young, but sometimes being drafted by a bad team and then going to a system that fits you better can turn a career around.

 

So my hope is the Colts can either have a guy like Tua fall into their lap, draft Fromm in 2nd, trade for Rosen, or sign Foles (assuming Jacksonville lets him go) as a bridge QB.  Just don't start Brissett another game please!

I'd take Rosen all day long for a third rounder or less...absolutely worth that risk.

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8 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

Interesting way to look at it.  
If you got him in the 1st, you've got 5 years.  So basically you let him walk and get big payday somewhere else.  Or tou trade in year 4. 
  The problem is, even if he’s been beat around,  you’re gonna want to keep him if he’s produced at that level.

  Its also going to be more costly (draft or FA) for these giys as they are the current trend.

  But treat his as many do RBs.  
It does seem costly tho.  Tou really like to keep the guys tou develop.  Tou would really have to invest in scouting in the QB area too. 
 

Edit:  i’m not sure why i dislike “Y”s so much.  Sorry.

 

Lamar is playing at an mvp level, i would take a few years of that.  he may or may not get hurt, it doesnt always happen to runners.  luck played 6 years and never won mvp

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14 hours ago, Douzer said:

Vick was not a good pocket passer, so he used his legs a lot

i didnt say pocket passer, i said he could throw

 

he had a lot of arm strength and could sling it 60+ yards with a quick flick of the risk while on the run. wasnt the most accurate but he made a lot of big throws in his career

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11 hours ago, cbear said:

I agree that Rosen hasn't gotten a fair shake.  Thrown into the fire with a bad Arizona team as a rook, team gets impatient and falls in love with Murray.  Samething in Miami.  If Miami would take a 6 or 7, I'd look into it.  

This guy blows he is worst than Brissett and that is saying a lot.

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19 hours ago, MPStack said:


I agree Lamar should win. And I doubt he plays like this season very long. Exciting guy, but he’s going to get hurt eventually. 

 

Maybe...but I watched almost all of his college career at U of L...the dude just doesn’t get hit. Pretty incredible that he has been able to keep that up against bigger, faster players. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, shastamasta said:

 

Maybe...but I watched almost all of his college career at U of L...the dude just doesn’t get hit. Pretty incredible that he has been able to keep that up against bigger, faster players. 

Their all fast in the NFL though! Matter of time, but I wish the Colts had Lamar time now. 

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16 hours ago, LockeDown said:

I read an article recently that Rosen isn’t liked in NFL locker rooms either/ I think it said he separates himself . I thought about picking him up too but I’m thinking he won’t make it now.

 

Sounds like Bo Callahan. We all know how that worked out.

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14 hours ago, ar1888 said:

Rosen ran the same 40 time at the combine as Drew Brees. 4.85 40. Rosen also threw better than Brees did at the combine. With that being said, I know that means nothing. My biggest fear with Rosen is that he is already damaged psychologically. 2 teams in 2 years. He cant be brimming with confidence. 
Miami gave a 2nd and a 5th for him this year. I don’t see them giving him up for much less. He is on a rookie contract, so he is very affordable. 

He was brimming with errogance coming into the league. Probably didnt sit well with the vets. Maybe he has been humbled. Dont know, dont care, dont want him. 

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9 hours ago, Thunderbolt said:

Appears that according to these posts, Josh Rosen is a bust being in two teams already.  Yeah, there must be more to it than meets the eye....They had to see something in him to draft him in the first round....Maybe the scheme on the team didn't fit the bill.....If they want to sell, we maybe interested in buying.  But not before we explore what's available in the draft that's worth going after to replace JB....

Rosen was drafted in the 1st round and many here think Love will go in the 2nd round.  Rosens situation is an example of why Love won't last til the 2nd round.  Teams are desperate for QBs. with upside. 

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On 12/24/2019 at 3:10 PM, MPStack said:


I like Jackson, but he’s no R. Wilson. Once Lamar can no longer run, it will be oh oh! 
 

@Shadow_Creek probably doesn’t know this, but R. Wilson rush yards have declined the past two plus seasons. Meaning he’s become more of a pocket passer. :rock:

I doubt that, Jackson had back to back 3,000 yard passing before he came to the pros by throwing the ball....  

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7 hours ago, richard pallo said:

Rosen was drafted in the 1st round and many here think Love will go in the 2nd round.  Rosens situation is an example of why Love won't last til the 2nd round.  Teams are desperate for QBs. with upside. 

 

pretty sure love will be a first rounder, maybe top 10

 

 

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Imagine this scenario.

QB's Burrow, Herbert, and Tagovailoa are all taken before we pick at 16.  We don't grade any of the rest of the QB's high enough to take them at 16, but there's an impact player there, and we take them.  For now, let's say it's Javon Kinlaw.

Then, at the end of the 1st round, someone trades up into the 1st round and drafts Love out from under us, before we could pick him at 34.

Bottom line - By the end of the draft, we take good players, but no QB's.  At all.

What do you want to do?  Just JB and Swag entering 2020?  Can you, would you, go after someone like Derek Carr?  Or Andy Dalton?  If not them, what about bringing in Rosen for next to nothing?  Go into training camp with JB, Swag, and Rosen?  It wasn't your Plan A thing to do.  It's further down the list.  More like Plan J or Plan M.  Is there value in Rosen, if you needed a QB for next to nothing?

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On 12/24/2019 at 8:28 PM, ar7 said:

 

It wasn't just Kingsbury drafting Murray. Steve Keim was the GM When they drafted Rosen and Murray.

 

Coaches (good ones) will adapt to their players particularly the starting QB. The Cardinals drafted Murray and traded Rosen because they didn't believe Rosen was the guy to lead them at QB.

 

Even if Kingsbury did demand drafting Murray and trading Rosen as a condition of accepting the job the Cardinals agreed to it. If Keim really believed in Rosen I think he would have hired a different Head Coach if Kingsbury really demanded a QB who fit his system.

 

Same with Dolphins...if Rosen was better than Fitzpatrick he would play over him.

 

If the Colts want to give up a late round pick and see what happens fine. But I think hopes that Rosen could be a team's answer at QB smells of desperation.

 

His first two years in the league have been far from ideal but if he was a franchise caliber QB two NFL teams would not dump him so easily. If he was this type of QB he would rise above this to some degree.

 

 It's not like we are talking about playing vs sitting him...it's whether or not the teams have confidence in him as their guy in the future. The Cardinals said no after just one year and the Dolphins don't appear committed to him and they don't have a long-term alternative.

we are desperate at qb, luck quit us

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20 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Is there value in Rosen, if you needed a QB for next to nothing?

red flag that two different sets of coaches and locker rooms dont really like him, and they said similar things about him in college 

 

doesnt sound like ballards type to me

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Why does everybody mention Andy Dalton. He is 32 and being paid $16M per. I've watched him and have seen nothing that makes me think he is an improvement over what we've got. Cincinnati is the worst team in the league. I think he has to take some responsible for that. If we were that bad there'd be torches and pitchforks heading to the Colts complex to get JB and run him out of town.

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23 hours ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

The irony... 

 

Josh Rosen - physical, mobile, inaccurate QB

 

Much like Manziel, he's an entitled *, who was born with a silver spoon in his mouth, who thought he would come in with some status and be given a job. That's working out fantastic for him, just like it did for Manziel.  I think I'd rather see the Colts pay JB 18M/yr than get Rosen for free. 

 

If you feel Josh Rosen is a physical, inaccurate QB, you are  watching different film than I am.  The fear for him in Arizona is that he wasn't mobile enough to run Kingsbury's offense.  Coming out of UCLA, he was considered a pure pocket passer who is very accurate.

 

At this point, I would rather bring Chandler Harnish back then endure another year of Brissett.  I would rather see a QB wing and and try to do something rather than checkdown and do nothing.

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I think some of your are missing the point of my post.  Josh Rosen was considered a very good passer coming out of college.  My second favorite team is the Cardinals so I watch them almost every week too.  The coaching staff they had last year is one of the worst coaching staffs I have ever seen point together..  Their OC got fired halfway through his FIRST season with the team.  The entire staff was cleared out after one year.  I can't speak for the Dolphins as to why they trade a #2 for him and then hardly play him.


But the point is, if we aren't going to get one of the top QBs in the draft, I would rather see the Colts trade a 4 or 5 for Josh Rosen knowing there is a CHANCE he could develop rather than going another year with Jacoby Brissett who we know after two years won't get any better.   It's not a lot to give up for a heady guy who was very highly rated.

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On 12/24/2019 at 4:01 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

but look at guys like Cam and RG3.

 

Cam is not a good example. This is the only year in which he has missed significant time. Pocket QBs like Brees and Luck missed time.

 

When Brees and Luck missed time, no one said they won't draft similar type quarterbacks because of how they play football. But when someone like Cam misses time, it is blamed on running. Many thought Russell Wilson would miss time because he ran a lot early in his career. He has yet to miss a game.

 

Just because RG3 got hurt does not mean that all QBs that run will also get hurt. 

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51 minutes ago, FRW said:

Why does everybody mention Andy Dalton. He is 32 and being paid $16M per. I've watched him and have seen nothing that makes me think he is an improvement over what we've got. Cincinnati is the worst team in the league. I think he has to take some responsible for that. If we were that bad there'd be torches and pitchforks heading to the Colts complex to get JB and run him out of town.

I don't want Dalton but he plays on a very bad team and has had some pretty decent years when the OL was half way decent. 

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6 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

I don't want Dalton but he plays on a very bad team and has had some pretty decent years when the OL was half way decent. 

I would take Dalton from Roadhouse but from the Bengals, no thanks :funny:

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