Nyheim Hines has been criminally under-utilized this year (merge)

[DougDew]

1 minute ago, jvan1973 said:

He need more opportunities,   which is the point of the thread

 

3 minutes ago, zibby43 said:

 

No, the point of the thread was that Hines has been under-utilized in all phases of the game.

 

And he demonstrated both his speed and elusiveness with the ball in his hand.

 

 

He's had about two seasons, and no he hasn't shown both.  Recent success as a punt returner would be a "hot take".

[zibby43]

4 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

He's had about two seasons, and no he hasn't shown both.  Recent success as a punt returner would be a "hot take".

 

lol apparently you haven't watched Hines the past 2 seasons.  It's easy to see his traits on tape, which is why others (including Stampede Blue) have picked up on the fact that he deserves to be more involved in the offense, and obviously ST.

 

And I made my "hot take" before he exploded today. 

 

Why am I even having a conversation with someone who is trying to tell me what I meant with my own thread?  I need to go into the concussion protocol. 

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[DougDew]

20 minutes ago, zibby43 said:

 

lol apparently you haven't watched Hines the past 2 seasons.  It's easy to see his traits on tape, which is why others (including Stampede Blue) have picked up on the fact that he deserves to be more involved in the offense, and obviously ST.

 

And I made my "hot take" before he exploded today. 

 

Why am I even having a conversation with someone who is trying to tell me what I meant with my own thread?  I need to go into the concussion protocol. 

 

 

He may have found a new role as a punt returner, which is a role that requires more pure speed than an elusive darter.  I acknowledged that when I said I forgot about his recent success as a returner, where @Chloe6124 was the first person to bring it up weeks ago.

 

In the context of how he has been used previously, as an attempted elusive darter near the LOS which is what I remembered, he has not performed well because he is not very good at it.  I don't recall him ever scoring long-ish TDs as a RB, or gaining much YAC on his own. 

 

So was he used more as a RB today or less?   Did he see the field as a RB? Did Wilkins take his snaps?  Did we succeed using him less?

 

If he takes Rogers spot as a PR and the 5th receiver, then it will advance the roster, IMO. 

[zibby43]

10 minutes ago, DougDew said:

In the context of how he has been used previously, as an attempted elusive darter near the LOS which is what I remembered, he has not performed well because he is not very good at it.  I don't recall him ever scoring long-ish TDs as a RB, or gaining much YAC on his own. 

 

 

You must've skipped the past 2 seasons. 

 

The following examples are from this year, alone.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[hoosierhawk]

3 hours ago, DougDew said:

Whenever I've seen him shake a tackle, it seems its by the spin move.  I think Mack has a better ability to cut quickly and keep his balance for making the next move. 

 

But Hines has replaced Rogers in the kicking game recently, and has done well.  I had forgotten about that.

Hines did OK at returning punts today. Does it make you miss Rogers calling for a fair catch? Think Hines sealed a job today. been waiting to see him break a long TD and he broke two!

Broke some tackles also.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

You could see Hines turn up his speed when he made guys miss. He has that extra gear.

[DougDew]

21 minutes ago, zibby43 said:

 

You must've skipped the past 2 seasons. 

 

The following examples are from this year, alone.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you.  5 out of the 6 plays prove my point.  He's fast and gets his yards by using his speed in mostly open space.  A roster spot as a 4th/5th receiver PR, not as the RB getting the second most carries behind Mack, which is substantially how he has been used.

[WoolMagnet]

U need to start a thread like this about JB every week.

We’d be leading the AFC!

[John Hammonds]

...did Nyheim Hines just single handedly save the special team coach's job?

 

After kicking issues all season, blocked kicks, blocked punts, you'd think the guy was guaranteed gone.  And then Hines sets a team record for return yards and scores two TD's.

 

I think the coach owes Hines a very nice Christmas present.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

No I bet he wasn’t going anywhere. We didn’t have these issues last year. And isn’t it crazy with a new FG kicker no blocking errors.

[hoosierhawk]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

No I bet he wasn’t going anywhere. We didn’t have these issues last year. And isn’t it crazy with a new FG kicker no blocking errors.

Not really crazy. What does the FG kicker have to do with missed blocking assignments? 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, hoosierhawk said:

not really funny. what does the FG kicker have to do with missed blocking assignments? 

Well if the kicker is kicking to low even with the missed assignments things might not get blocked. All I am saying is we had no issues last year so I don’t think they will. Especially with the Vinny situation.

[PuntersArePeopleToo]

15 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

No I bet he wasn’t going anywhere. We didn’t have these issues last year. And isn’t it crazy with a new FG kicker no blocking errors.

It was with Vinny the issues plus missed assignments. You saw way more pressure

[EastStreet]

We've been good all year at returns. The STs issue was limited to one person for the most part. 

Not certain, but think we've been pretty decent on KOs and punts too. 

[John Waylon]

He sure helped cost me one fantasy championship, I’ll give him that. 

[GoColts8818]

I don’t know if it was in danger.  Still, you don’t make those kinds of decisions, good or bad, based solely on one game.  You could easily spin this to why didn’t that coach have Hines out there fielding punts sooner?  

 

Overall the special teams unit has been a disaster so I wouldn’t be against a change there but as loyal as Frank is I doubt there is one.

[WoolMagnet]

The little big man set the tone.

He gets my gameball.  

And its not even close.

 

A 40 yard punt return to start our 1st drive.  BIG!  Then the 14 points off the two returns.  3 punt returns for 195 yards and 2 TDs.  Best part was running out the tunnel throwin the peace sign. 
Just exciting as heck.  What a Christmas present for the fans at the game. And the rest of us.
 

Special teams outshined the whole team....... for once.

Was it just Hines or do we give some credit to coaching?  The blocking looked better.  The team seemed livelier.  The team seemed ready to play.

  In hindsight, seemed like we had more yards passing and less running than the stats. Oh, and their QB played like what he is, and that #22 is amazing.

 

Funniest moment was breaking their will and their defender pulling a Myles Garrett on Doyle and an OL and getting himself ejected.  
 

[ColtsAC]

In retrospect, since you opened this thread up before the Carolina game, you kinda look like a genius.

[ColtsAC]

20 hours ago, John Hammonds said:

...did Nyheim Hines just single handedly save the special team coach's job?

 

After kicking issues all season, blocked kicks, blocked punts, you'd think the guy was guaranteed gone.  And then Hines sets a team record for return yards and scores two TD's.

 

I think the coach owes Hines a very nice Christmas present.

The special teams coach had to be just about the most excited guy in the bldg after the 2nd return. He quickly called home and told his wife  "Hon, you can quit working on my resume".

[Dasteez]

On 12/22/2019 at 5:20 PM, DougDew said:

Thank you.  5 out of the 6 plays prove my point.  He's fast and gets his yards by using his speed in mostly open space.  A roster spot as a 4th/5th receiver PR, not as the RB getting the second most carries behind Mack, which is substantially how he has been used.

Bro, Hines is basically a Sproles clone. He is a RB. He is a PR. He can be moved around to get favorable match ups - I.e moving to the slot or Jet sweeps. Dude has got burners as the 2 punt returns for TD put on display.
 

Most if not all would probably agree this guy isn’t a 3 down back. He is fast and elusive enough to garner more playing time and creativity than what we’ve seen over the course of 2019 however. 
 

If anything I think his lack of playing time is more a testament to what the Colts think they have in Mack as an all around back - just think if you put both those guys on the field at the same time, you’re bound to catch the defense out of place.

[Defjamz26]

Hate to Lee piling on the guy but it’s funny how topics like this always lead back to the same source:

-Last year the TEs were a big part of the offense and Ebron was a pro-bowler. This year the TEs were non-existent until injuries and Ebron had career 

 

-Last season we were a top 10 offense, this year were bottom 10

 

-And now as this topic points out, last year a guy like Hines was heavily involved in the passing game, and for some strange reason he’s been underutilized in that regard this season

 

I’ll let you guys figure out what changed from this year to last year lol....

[NewColtsFan]

On 12/22/2019 at 6:43 AM, DougDew said:

Hines is not elusive enough and does not stay on his feet well enough (balance) to be the guy for that role.  And, he doesn't seem to be as fast as advertised.  Its criminal that he is even on the roster.

 

Mack is both more elusive and harder to tackle and should be in the role of Hines, which should be to get the ball in space, and more plays should be called for that role.  A more powerful RB who can also occasionally catch should take over Mack's current role.

 

All JMO.

 

BTW, Hines doesn't stink because of JB.  He's always stunk.

You’re a funny guy.   Often unintentionally so, like this post,  but funny never the less.....

 

 All Just Your Opinion.  
 

Right.   Got it.  

[DougDew]

13 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

 All Just Your Opinion.  
 

 

Of course its my opinion.  Its a discussion forum.

 

If all we did is post stats and links and highlight plays, it would be a collection of spoon-fed narrow facts for nonobservant types.

 

Good punt returner. As a 4th/5th receiver PR/KR on the roster who catches the ball near the LOS, (not a down field receiver) he has value as long as there is some open space in front of him.  He's fast.

 

As a #2 RB who catches passes on routes like a #2RB, he doesn't have a stiff arm, can't make a move and keep his balance for the next move, and tends to be brought down fairly easily.  Listing him as a RB takes up a spot for a real #2 RB, or #3 backup.

 

Not sure if there are any stats or links to quote for those observations.

[LockeDown]

15 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Of course its my opinion.  Its a discussion forum.

 

If all we did is post stats and links and highlight plays, it would be a collection of spoon-fed narrow facts for nonobservant types.

 

Good punt returner. As a 4th/5th receiver PR/KR on the roster who catches the ball near the LOS, (not a down field receiver) he has value as long as there is some open space in front of him.  He's fast.

 

As a #2 RB who catches passes on routes like a #2RB, he doesn't have a stiff arm, can't make a move and keep his balance for the next move, and tends to be brought down fairly easily.  Listing him as a RB takes up a spot for a real #2 RB, or #3 backup.

 

Not sure if there are any stats or links to quote for those observations.

Hilton returned Pints his first year and even he never had a game like this so I think you are probably just thinking Carolina just didn’t care. 

[shasta519]

15 hours ago, Dasteez said:

Bro, Hines is basically a Sproles clone. He is a RB. He is a PR. He can be moved around to get favorable match ups - I.e moving to the slot or Jet sweeps. Dude has got burners as the 2 punt returns for TD put on display.
 

Most if not all would probably agree this guy isn’t a 3 down back. He is fast and elusive enough to garner more playing time and creativity than what we’ve seen over the course of 2019 however. 
 

If anything I think his lack of playing time is more a testament to what the Colts think they have in Mack as an all around back - just think if you put both those guys on the field at the same time, you’re bound to catch the defense out of place.

 

To be fair to the coaching staff....Hines is not even close to the level of a Sproles. Yes...he’s fast...but he doesn’t consistently create big plays (on offense) and isn’t much of a true threat like a Sproles was. A gadget player that gives you sub 4 yds/carry and ~7 yds/catch just isn’t really efficient or effective. And since he offers very little as a RB...it doesn’t help to have him out there very often. 

 

He did have a great game as a PR...I hope he has found his niche.

 

[shasta519]

15 minutes ago, LockeDown said:

Hilton returned Pints his first year and even he never had a game like this so I think you are probably just thinking Carolina just didn’t care. 

 

TY did have a monster game returning against BUF his rookie year...but not quite on this level.

[shasta519]

36 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Of course its my opinion.  Its a discussion forum.

 

If all we did is post stats and links and highlight plays, it would be a collection of spoon-fed narrow facts for nonobservant types.

 

Good punt returner. As a 4th/5th receiver PR/KR on the roster who catches the ball near the LOS, (not a down field receiver) he has value as long as there is some open space in front of him.  He's fast.

 

As a #2 RB who catches passes on routes like a #2RB, he doesn't have a stiff arm, can't make a move and keep his balance for the next move, and tends to be brought down fairly easily.  Listing him as a RB takes up a spot for a real #2 RB, or #3 backup.

 

Not sure if there are any stats or links to quote for those observations.

 

There are stats that back this up.

 

https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/nyheim-hines/

 

- #51 in juke rate (14.3%)

- #42 in big run rate (2.3%)

- #72 in yards created 

- Faces a light front 70.5% of the time (3rd highest % in the NFL)...but only has a 3.6 YPC average.

[LockeDown]

1 hour ago, LockeDown said:

Hilton returned Pints his first year and even he never had a game like this so I think you are probably just thinking Carolina just didn’t care. 

Punts not pints. I don’t want to accuse him of running moonshine or anything.

[Coffeedrinker]

On 12/22/2019 at 12:33 AM, EastStreet said:

He came very close to setting rookie records last year, and then....  Regression....

 

I think part of it is he ran a good amount of seam routes last year, which JB simply is not very good at seeing/hitting.  I think the other challenge may be JB's high time to throw, and the need to use a larger back to stay in and block. What I hated most is that they ran him between the tackles too much. He's ok when they are man blocking, but he's much better IMO on the edge.

 

Whatever the reason, he's capable of a lot more. Reich has several head scratchers this year.

Have you seen Hines in pass protection?  He is the best blocking back on the Colts... by far.

 

But yes, it is a head scratcher... unless, as the conspiracy side of me thinks, after Luck quit (retired, whatever phrase people want to use) Reich/Ballard wanted a middle of the road season to get a higher draft pick.

[EastStreet]

On 12/26/2019 at 1:02 PM, Coffeedrinker said:

Have you seen Hines in pass protection?  He is the best blocking back on the Colts... by far.

 

But yes, it is a head scratcher... unless, as the conspiracy side of me thinks, after Luck quit (retired, whatever phrase people want to use) Reich/Ballard wanted a middle of the road season to get a higher draft pick.

LOL.. I think it's more JB's troubles in the seam (with both Hines and Slots/TEs in general) than conspiracy.

 

His snap count was reduced by 13%, and 190ish snaps (we ran less O snaps for obvious reason). But yes, it's almost not even worth running a seam route, except to clear things out for other WR/TE running crosses, etc..