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28 minutes ago, DougDew said:

That's what I said.  3 and outs are like turnovers.   (In fact, I'm the only one here who says it). We didn't go 3 and out much early in the year.

 

Your claim of upgrades being added is purely judgmental.  You have no basis for it. 

 

In fact, this team looked the same last year against KC, which was a SB contender then, even with Luck at QB.  That says that QB play isn't very important.  

 

lol... 

you think Houston wasn't an upgrade? And Willis and Okereke (in SAM and passing downs) both have strong PFF ratings.

 

QB play isn't important? No wonder folks don't take you seriously.

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1 minute ago, EastStreet said:

 

lol... 

you think Houston wasn't an upgrade? And Willis and Okereke (in SAM and passing downs) both have strong PFF ratings.

 

QB play isn't important? No wonder folks don't take you seriously.

God u missed the point.  This team is struggling  big time.  I am having a real time after week 14 identifying a player who I feel is a keeper.  Sure Nelson.....Leonard (who struggles big time in coverage) and Moore.  After that,  I really don't know.  This loss and down word spiral is very alarming. At this point everything bout this organizations direction needs to be queationed. No one is off the hook.  The coordinators.....the coach and the GM r on notice.

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6 minutes ago, adubb84 said:

Something has to give. No way after viewing game tape this week they go with Jacoby at center to wrap up the year. Especially with is being out of playoff contention. See what you got with kelly, close the book on this murder mystery. 

And Carolina is apparently going to blow everything up and start over. 

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2 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I was one of the posters who said let's hold back the praise on Ballard.  I kept getting beat up by this board.  So after 14 weeks what r peoples thought on the over all talent level on this team???

I still think the talent is much improved. On offense, JB has been so horrific he has the offense all out of whack. He has the defense winded before halftime because it’s 1,2,3 and out too much and quite frankly, I think the team is defeated by the handling of the team dynamics. First with Vinny and crippled leg and over the season with inaccurate JB. His only true asset is he doesn’t throw up INT’s like other poor QB’s do. It’s probably because he is so inaccurate that even the defense is thrown off by how far off the ball is thrown. Of course so many balls travel into the ground, it’s hard to pick ground balls. 

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11 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

lol... 

you think Houston wasn't an upgrade? And Willis and Okereke (in SAM and passing downs) both have strong PFF ratings.

 

QB play isn't important? No wonder folks don't take you seriously.

 

KC was a SB contending team that put us away whenever they thought the game was getting closer.  NO never let off the gas in the middle of the game like KC did probably because they wanted the record for Brees on Monday night.

 

You compared this year's team to last year's.  I didn't say as a generality that QB play din't matter. In the context of your comparison to last year, no,  our QB play didn't matter in either game.  Just like it didn't matter when we lost 45-7 in the AFCCG too. (except for the picks our down field passer threw)

 

It was the defense that mattered more.

 

Okereke and Willis are fine.  I like them as draft picks, but in this game they were no upgrade over whom we had last year, and they don't seem to be helping the overall D very much when the D needs to make a stop...which is the important times.

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8 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

God u missed the point.  This team is struggling  big time.  I am having a real time after week 14 identifying a player who I feel is a keeper.  Sure Nelson.....Leonard (who struggles big time in coverage) and Moore.  After that,  I really don't know.  This loss and down word spiral is very alarming. At this point everything bout this organizations direction needs to be queationed. No one is off the hook.  The coordinators.....the coach and the GM r on notice.

 

Our run D is top 10. Our run O is top 10. Our OL is top 5. 

And that's with a QB who puts stress on the OL, the run O, and D in general. 

The same team faired much better last year with a QB that didn't stress every component of the team.

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Effort like tonight Is what is going to get some of these players looking for different teams next year. We are supposed to have character and they didn’t show it. Reich got mad in the press conference a little to late. He should of been mad weeks ago.

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Just now, EastStreet said:

 

Our run D is top 10. Our run O is top 10. Our OL is top 5. 

And that's with a QB who puts stress on the OL, the run O, and D in general. 

The same team faired much better last year with a QB that didn't stress every component of the team.

Of course our run D is top 10 because qbs are over 70% on our pass D.  Don't always look at stats.  Watch the game and come to your own conclusions.

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9 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

KC was a SB contending team that put us away whenever they thought the game was getting closer.  NO never let off the gas in the middle of the game like KC did probably because they wanted the record for Brees on Monday night.

 

You compared this year's team to last year's.  I didn't say as a generality that QB play din't matter. In the context of your comparison to last year, no,  our QB play didn't matter in either game.  Just like it didn't matter when we lost 45-7 in the AFCCG too. (except for the picks our down field passer threw)

 

It was the defense that mattered more.

 

Okereke and Willis are fine.  I like them as draft picks, but in this game they were no upgrade over whom we had last year, and they don't seem to be helping the overall D very much when the D needs to make a stop...which is the important times.

You're the one that said we had no upgrades. Houston is an obvious upgrade, and you're good with Willis and Oke... You make zero sense, and as usual you pivot to hundred different places. 

 

We're far from a shut down D, but we improved from last year. The difference is this year, our O lacks any semblance of balance and can't sustain drives. That stresses every element of the team, especially the D. I don't like the soft zone crap either, but it's designed to not give up big/chunk plays. That strategy fails every time when your O can't do a thing.

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1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

He has a contract so that’s not happening.

 

Also Frank has been part of the problem.

I’m sorry I disagree.  Frank is limited by his players skill set.  JB is not the answer,  we all can see that.  Do you think FR and CB don’t see that too?  This team was built around Luck and his skill set.  We need to move in a different direction,  it’s difficult to do that two weeks before season starts.  We had a decent run.  Teams have figured our rudimentary offense out.  Time to circle the wagons and regroup.  Come on offseason!

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10 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Of course our run D is top 10 because qbs are over 70% on our pass D.  Don't always look at stats.  Watch the game and come to your own conclusions.

Bend but don't break soft zone Ds are designed to push teams into passing short. So yes they give up higher completion %, but less big/chunk plays. They can work well with a team that has a decent O. Not so much when the O can't sustain drives.

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Just now, Chloe6124 said:

Secondary will look bad when you have no pass rush. Turay injury was big. We have no interior pass rush. Autry has been a disapointment. Ballard has as much to fix on defense as he does on offense.

It was interesting to hear Booger say that Ballard realizes we need a big DT and is the big missing piece on defense.

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13 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

You're the one that said we had no upgrades. Houston is an obvious upgrade, and you're good with Willis and Oke... You make zero sense, and as usual you pivot to hundred different places. 

 

We're far from a shut down D, but we improved from last year. The difference is this year, our O lacks any semblance of balance and can't sustain drives. That stresses every element of the team, especially the D. I don't like the soft zone crap either, but it's designed to not give up big/chunk plays. That strategy fails every time when your O can't do a thing.

I responded to your post that said we made upgrades to the D.  I said that your statement was simply judgmental and had no basis. 

 

Having said that, yes, Houston is an upgrade.  But its minor.  He makes some plays, but it doesn't move the needle in terms of making the defense a whole lot better.  Okerke and Willis are nice picks, but they don't move the needle yet either.

 

There is no argument that the O is worse with JB than with Luck.  Duh.  Who says it isn't?  Why keep beating the horse?

 

Its not the reason we suck.  You can't expect a team to win a division only because they have the number one pick top talent at QB.  (Brees was a second rounder, but it was because of a question of height, not talent, skill, or solid college production).  A team needs other things, things we haven't had since Luck's first two years under Grigson and at NO TIME under Ballard. 

 

Getting a new franchise QB without addressing the other aspects of the team is just the same old 10-6, 11-5 crap; winning close games because the QB makes a heroic play, but still getting blown out by real contenders each year like NE, KC, and now NO. Getting the new franchise Qb may, in fact, be a complete waste of time if the rest of the team continues to look the way it has under most of Grigson's and ALL of Ballard's tenure.

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3 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Secondary will look bad when you have no pass rush. Turay injury was big. We have no interior pass rush. Autry has been a disapointment. Ballard has as much to fix on defense as he does on offense.

Pass rush doesn't mean diddley when you're playing the QB with the best/lowest time to throw in the league. Brees eats soft zones for every meal of the day. You're way off the mark as it relates to this game.

 

But yes, we need interior pass rush, but Turay would have added nothing tonight.

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5 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Pass rush doesn't mean diddley when you're playing the QB with the best/lowest time to throw in the league. Brees eats soft zones for every meal of the day. You're way off the mark as it relates to this game.

 

But yes, we need interior pass rush, but Turay would have added nothing tonight.

Not disagreeing with that and Brees. He gets the ball out quick. But we need some guys that can disrupt the interior and collapse the pocket. That is how you give yourself a chance with elite QB.

 

We have a lot of issues we know need fixed. I am disappointed the most however with the lack of effort and it seems they give up and didn’t play hard for Reich.  Eberflus is Aldo up and down with his defensive schemes.

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5 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I responded to your post that said we made upgrades to the D.  I said that your statement was simply judgmental and had no basis. 

 

Having said that, yes, Houston is an upgrade.  But its minor.  He makes some plays, but it doesn't move the needle in terms of making the defense a whole lot better.  Okerke and Willis are nice picks, but they don't move the needle yet either.

 

There is no argument that the O is worse with JB than with Luck.  Duh.  Who says it isn't?  Why keep beating the horse?

 

Its not the reason we suck.  You can't expect a team to win a division only because they have the number one pick top talent at QB.  (Brees was a second rounder, but it was because of a question of height, not talent, skill, or solid college production).  A team needs other things, things we haven't had since Luck's first two years under Grigson and at NO TIME under Ballard. 

 

Getting a new franchise QB without addressing the other aspects of the team is just the same old 10-6, 11-5 crap; winning close games because the QB makes a heroic play, but still getting blown out by real contenders each year like NE, KC, and now NO. Getting the new franchise Qb may, in fact, be a complete waste of time if the rest of the team continues to look the way it has under most of Grigson's and ALL of Ballard's tenure.

We need a QB and interior rush. Both those things could change the entire complexion of the team. Had Luck not retired, this team would have built on last year, and the upgrades of Houston and others would have taken us farther this year. It would have been a step forward. The loss of Luck now puts stress on all 5 phases of the team and was like several steps back.

 

And Huston isn't a minor upgrade.  9 sacks and 14 TFLs...  If we had any kind of interior rush, Houston's impact would have been multiplied.

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9 hours ago, DougDew said:

Getting a new franchise QB without addressing the other aspects of the team is just the same old 10-6, 11-5 crap

 

we need more than one thing, QB is just the most important

 

be lucky to go better than 8-8 with any team around jacoby 

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10 hours ago, EastStreet said:

Bend but don't break soft zone Ds are designed to push teams into passing short. So yes they give up higher completion %, but less big/chunk plays. They can work well with a team that has a decent O. Not so much when the O can't sustain drives.

Bend but don't break!!! The only problem is that they are breaking a lot more than they r bending

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1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Bend but don't break!!! The only problem is that they are breaking a lot more than they r bending

IMO, they Eberflus should have played a lot tighter, and more man. Brees is the king of short and quick passes. He'll eat you up underneath all day. 

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3 hours ago, Gramz said:

Pitiful that we couldn't even score one point last night.  :facepalm:

 

Not to mention, Drew breaking Peyton's record, against us of all teams.  

 

Ooops...

 

My bad.  We had 7.  

Whoop de doo.  I  obviously turned it off before we scored.

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