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Brissett is last in passes more than 20 yards

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Good luck Coffeedrinker. You may need something stronger than coffee to get thru this charade. Some people just like to :stir: the pot!

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2 minutes ago, hoosierhawk said:

Problem with only the eyeball test 2006 is you would draw only the conclusion that it is strickly play calling for the short passing game. I you look into his stats thru college and pros you find out the reason for the play calling. I know you know this but some other people cannot grasp it.

Stats are important. I know this but I look at stuff like leadership, presence, clutchness that a QB has too. How much he wins obviously too. By the eyeball test one can just tell how a team plays around a QB. For example in 2015, Denver played like a team that knew their leader was back when Peyton who had a noodle arm played. They knew with Brock they weren't winning the SB, when Peyton came back in week 17 that whole team was rejuvenated. I could see it too. Once they got HFA by winning that game vs the Chargers I had little doubt they weren't going to win at all.

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2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

Based upon the JB critic echo chamber process, including the enlightening stats presented in this thread, I have now concluded that Gordon Minshew is the answer to the JAGS QB question.  

 

 

I figured you would respond in this fashion.  You always tell us how smart you are and how you look at all the variables to draw your own conclusion.  All I'm saying is prove it.

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10 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

I figured you would respond in this fashion.  You always tell us how smart you are and how you look at all the variables to draw your own conclusion.  All I'm saying is prove it.

I don't have all of the variables.  But I look at more than one. That's not particularly smart.  Its simply the absence of chosen blindness.

 

Then get accused of bringing up variables out of some sort of MO.  I only bring up multiple variables if there are multiple threads with the same johnny one note criticism.

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23 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I don't have all of the variables.  But I look at more than one. That's not particularly smart.  Its simply the absence of chosen blindness.

You say you look at more than one variable but you have not really proven that you do.

23 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

Then get accused of bringing up variables out of some sort of MO.  I only bring up multiple variables if there are multiple threads with the same johnny one note criticism.

Ok, if you want to believe that about yourself that is fine.

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Ya and last year we were among the top10 teams in the league for plays of 20 yards or more so you can tell just how much Luck retiring damaged this offense.

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11 hours ago, DougDew said:

How in the world did you post get so many likes.  There must be a blind following or something.

 

All of my points are relevant to the stats presented.   

 

Some folks have an opinion of JB, that he is not the answer. They make the same point, over and over, that he misses receivers down field.  And that single point means he is not the answer. 

 

Same point.  Same broad conclusion based upon that singular point.  We get it.

 

I guess the single stats about throwing downfield being linked to being "the answer" means that we know by looking at the first half stats of this season that  Allen, Goff, Ryan, and Rivers, are not "the answer's" for their teams, and that Minshew and Murray are "the answer"'s for their teams. 

 

IMO, If folks have a desire to make a decision about JB, they should probably look at a multitude of things, and use their judgement.  Not just the same thing over and over, then show stats to illustrate what we already know by  watching the games.

 

To the bolded:  I know.  It was my first point.  

 

 

Just speaking for myself, I liked my post, and I didn't like your post, so it's not hard for me to understand.

 

Here's what happened in this thread. OP posted a stat. You derided stats on the basis of "you guys keep using stats to talk about things JB doesn't do well, which means you can't form an opinion for yourself," which is just another way of you trying to show your superior depth or whatever.

 

No one has ever offered any singular stat as definitive proof that JB "isn't the answer." If they have, that's ridiculous. 

 

You say you agree with the first point. The stat in the OP quantifies it. So what's the problem?

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16 hours ago, Superman said:

 

It's actually really simple. JB isn't good at throwing the ball down the field, and he and the staff know it.

 

You keep presenting this argument that throwing downfield isn't valuable, and that's just dead wrong. But that's a discussion for another day.

 

You and others also keep presenting this argument that, because the receivers aren't the guys the team expected to have at the beginning of the year, it's not possible to be productive throwing down the field. But there's a reason players wear the same color uniform in games, and we have ocular proof of receivers open in various spots on the field, including down the field, but not being targeted. The first prerequisite for downfield production is receivers getting open; the second is the QB throwing the ball. The first is happening, the second is not.

 

We don't need to muddy the waters on this, even though that's your MO. It's clear cut, plain and obvious. JB has bad downfield numbers because he's not good at that part of the game.

The other thing we are beginning to learn as fans is Jacoby seems to struggle with his pre-snap reads.  We're seeing more and more teams blitz us with free runs.  Point of that is, a lot of big plays come against the blitz since there's risk both ways.  Currently it doesn't seem to me (I don't have stats) that we don't generate big plays against the blitz either, so a bit of a big play double whammie.  We don't go down field much and we don't punish the blitz.  If you recall, teams were loathe to blitz Manning and to some extent Luck because of the pre-snap read and subsequent audible. One of the biggest things a QB does is get into the right play or at least out of a bad one, this jumped out at me during the Titan game and I worry about the trend we're starting to see, tendencies are being discovered and we'd better adjust or it's blitzkrieg Indy.

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14 hours ago, DougDew said:

Calm down.

 

JB does not throw the ball down field.  He hasn't done it all season.

 

We were 6 and 2 when he wasn't throwing the ball down field.

 

We are now 6-6 when he still isn't throwing the ball down field.

 

I never said it wasn't important.

 

What I say is that it is not the singular basis for determining that he is not "the answer"

 

What about his short game accuracy?  Does that matter? What was it the first half of the season, and what has it been the last three games?

 

Does anybody know by watching the games?  Or do they have to go mine some data before they know?

 

Why do you think this is the single thing that people don't like about Brissett? I've been following most of the threads about evaluating Brissett and there are plenty of other things he's not doing well enough right now to be considered the answer going forward and a lot of people are talking about those things. Just it happens that IN THIS THREAD people are discussing mainly his inability to throw downfield because... you know why, right? Because this is literally what the thread is about. 

 

Also, you asked about Frank Reich's philosophy in a following post. Here's Frank Reich's philosophy from his own mouth(27:00):

 

Do you think this resembles how we are playing now? Or do you think he's trying to hide his QBs deficiencies? In this introductory press-conference and in other media appearances he's laid out his philosophy pretty clearly, he said he wants us to play multiple, attack, uptempo offense, he's said he values chunk plays, he's said that yards per attempt are very important. So here's the question for you ... do you think Frank Reich's idea of his offensive philosophy coincides with what we are watching now? 

 

- 29th in pace in game neutral situations!

- 31st in pass% in game neutral situations

- 31st in air yards per catch

 

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22 hours ago, Superman said:

 

It's actually really simple. JB isn't good at throwing the ball down the field, and he and the staff know it.

 

You keep presenting this argument that throwing downfield isn't valuable, and that's just dead wrong. But that's a discussion for another day.

 

You and others also keep presenting this argument that, because the receivers aren't the guys the team expected to have at the beginning of the year, it's not possible to be productive throwing down the field. But there's a reason players wear the same color uniform in games, and we have ocular proof of receivers open in various spots on the field, including down the field, but not being targeted. The first prerequisite for downfield production is receivers getting open; the second is the QB throwing the ball. The first is happening, the second is not.

 

We don't need to muddy the waters on this, even though that's your MO. It's clear cut, plain and obvious. JB has bad downfield numbers because he's not good at that part of the game.

 

 See the receiver that is one on one, throw ball to where your player has best chance to catch it. Test the D.
 Jacoby never seems to spot this situation, and has shown no proclivity to being able to place the ball downfield.
 Poor anticipation x trying to make up for it with a hard throw = all kinds of problems.
 Maybe with a couple more years of practice practice practice he gets considerably better at what bothers so many of us. Good luck to the powers that be on whether they choose to ride That Horse.

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On 12/6/2019 at 12:59 PM, crazycolt1 said:

Another bash Brissett thread? Like 5 isn't enough?:facepalm:

yea they should give it a rest, who would they start in place of jb? would they like him if we were winning?

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