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zibby43

Ballard was at the Utah State game tonight (watching Jordan Love)

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12 hours ago, zibby43 said:

 

It's a virtual certainty (99%) that Ballard was at the Utah State game primarily to evaluate Love.  Sure, maybe he took note of some guys on Boise State's roster while he was there, but the Colts have been scouting Love all season, and Ballard's presence at one of Love's last games of the season is a pretty dead giveaway.

 

A nice highlight compilation:

 

 

 

 

Question on Love. . . he obviously can hit the big time throws.  Can he hit the routine throws?  

 

I know his decision making needs work, or at the very least he needs to return to the form he was last year.  

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22 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Question on Love. . . he obviously can hit the big time throws.  Can he hit the routine throws?  

 

I know his decision making needs work, or at the very least he needs to return to the form he was last year.  

He can... it's hard for me to explain what's happening with him. IMO he's pushing it this year. He's trying to do too much, because he knows that if he doesn't his team will lose. There are WOW throws on both ends of spectrum with him. Along with the amazing ones, there are head scratching ones where I go back and look at it 5-10 times on tape and still have no idea what made him throw that ball or how he didn't see the dropping defender. He needs to be tamed a little and his talent need to be channeled in good direction, but he's showing almost every game that he can do the hard things in the game right. BTW for a player with such a strong arm and playmaking - the thing that goes underrated is the touch he has on some of his passes. He has variety of passes in his arsenal. He has perfectly thrown lobs with touch over defenders, back shoulder throws, he has bullet passes, he has side arm flicks, he has "in the bucket" long throws where the ball will travel 60 yards in the air and drop in the receivers basket on point right next to the sideline. IMO his accuracy is much better than that of Josh Allen for example, and he has much better variety of throws in his arsenal. I also love his pocket presence and nuanced movement in the pocket. 

 

On the flipside - like you said - decisionmaking needs to improve and some of his lower body mechanics need to improve too. His footwork on throws to the left is funky and leaves balls short because of it. He needs work on his fade balls too, but like I said before - he has the touch, so I think it's fixable. He needs to improve his accuracy on slants too. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, stitches said:

He can... it's hard for me to explain what's happening with him. IMO he's pushing it this year. He's trying to do too much, because he knows that if he doesn't his team will lose. There are WOW throws on both ends of spectrum with him. Along with the amazing ones, there are head scratching ones where I go back and look at it 5-10 times on tape and still have no idea what made him throw that ball or how he didn't see the dropping defender. He needs to be tamed a little and his talent need to be channeled in good direction, but he's showing almost every game that he can do the hard things in the game right. BTW for a player with such a strong arm and playmaking - the thing that goes underrated is the touch he has on some of his passes. He has variety of passes in his arsenal. He has perfectly thrown lobs with touch over defenders, back shoulder throws, he has bullet passes, he has side arm flicks, he has "in the bucket" long throws where the ball will travel 60 yards in the air and drop in the receivers basket on point right next to the sideline. IMO his accuracy is much better than that of Josh Allen for example, and he has much better variety of throws in his arsenal. I also love his pocket presence and nuanced movement in the pocket. 

 

On the flipside - like you said - decisionmaking needs to improve and some of his lower body mechanics need to improve too. His footwork on throws to the left is funky and leaves balls short because of it. He needs work on his fade balls too, but like I said before - he has the touch, so I think it's fixable. He needs to improve his accuracy on slants too. 

 

 

 

 

 

I read that he locks onto his first receiver and doesn't come off.  

 

Potential is obviously there but I worry a lot with these project players.  

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20 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

I read that he locks onto his first receiver and doesn't come off.  

 

Potential is obviously there but I worry a lot with these project players.  

 

I haven't noticed that. I will look for it next time I watch and share if I agree or not. 

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On 11/24/2019 at 10:55 PM, zibby43 said:

 

Wasn't his best game, but he still made plenty of incredible throws.

 

Since you love traditional stats, let's play a game.

 

Hypothetically, a rookie NFL QB posts the following stats for the season: 26 TDs, 28 INTs, 56.7% completion percentage.

 

After that performance, would you start looking for a replacement?

I don't think you can teach this guy anything, but I certainly appreciate all the info!

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38 minutes ago, Kenzicocapontas said:

I don't think you can teach this guy anything, but I certainly appreciate all the info!

 

You are very welcome!  My strategy was to continue providing useful information to others on the board as I attempted fruitlessly to mollify his concerns and answer the same questions over and over again lol.

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My only question is does Ballard have the stones to do it? He really talked up Jacoby, calling him a rare leader and someone you can win with. If you draft Love you’re going to have to draft him in the 1st round. Then you’re going to have to go in front of the media after the pick and explain the decision. Indy media would be abuzz. Not only that but you’d be putting Jacoby on notice. Plus you might have to trade up for him. Is the ultimate hoarder of draft picks ready to pony up and go get a QB? Big decision to make.

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2 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

My only question is does Ballard have the stones to do it? He really talked up Jacoby, calling him a rare leader and someone you can win with. If you draft Love you’re going to have to draft him in the 1st round. Then you’re going to have to go in front of the media after the pick and explain the decision. Indy media would be abuzz. Not only that but you’d be putting Jacoby on notice. Plus you might have to trade up for him. Is the ultimate hoarder of draft picks ready to pony up and go get a QB? Big decision to make.

Yep going to be interesting. I think Ballard kinda prepared for this with JB getting the two year deal. Worse case JB is starting next as we’re grooming his replacement 

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2 hours ago, boo2202 said:

Yep going to be interesting. I think Ballard kinda prepared for this with JB getting the two year deal. Worse case JB is starting next as we’re grooming his replacement 

Listening to the Locked on Colts podcast and that’s exactly what they suggested. A Mahomes situation where you sit Love behind Jacoby for a year while he develops.

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So Stephen Holder said Ballard was not at the Utah state game. He was credentialed but went to a different game.

 

 

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2 hours ago, BleedBlue4Shoe86 said:

So wait. Ballard wasn’t scouting Jordan Love?  

 

He was scheduled to attend, had a credential (which is why the news made it to social media), but ultimately attended a different game.

 

It's unclear as to whether the Colts had any other scouts there in his place.

 

Regardless, the Colts have been following/scouting Love, and other quarterbacks, this entire season.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, zibby43 said:

 

He was scheduled to attend, had a credential (which is why the news made it to social media), but ultimately attended a different game.

 

It's unclear as to whether the Colts had any other scouts there in his place.

 

Regardless, the Colts have been following/scouting Love, and other quarterbacks, this entire season.

Rumors and articles about Ballard's interest specifically in love started immediately when Luck retired. Here's one right after.

 

https://mwwire.com/2019/08/28/coach-gary-andersen-hints-at-difficult-decision-for-jordan-love/

 

Quote

Being named to every preseason awards watch-list a college quarterback could hope for and facing a strong fall schedule — including road trips to LSU, Wake Forest and Fresno — provides ample opportunity for interested parties to see Love in action. Love’s opportunity to make a significant splash in the draft is already rising, as rumors abound concerning Colts’ GM Chris Ballard eyeing Love as a solution to Andrew Luck’s surprise retirement.

 

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Also the quote I heard from the Locked on podcast was that Ballard was asked early on about what QBs he liked in the upcoming class and the two names he dropped were Justin Herbert and Jordan Love.

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11 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Also the quote I heard from the Locked on podcast was that Ballard was asked early on about what QBs he liked in the upcoming class and the two names he dropped were Justin Herbert and Jordan Love.

Those are the Patrick Mahomes types of this draft. I have no idea how much input he had on the Chiefs picking Mahomes before he left and took on the Colts job, it's possible he was one of the people that endorsed Mahomes before moving to Indy. 

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34 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Also the quote I heard from the Locked on podcast was that Ballard was asked early on about what QBs he liked in the upcoming class and the two names he dropped were Justin Herbert and Jordan Love.

I'm a little surprised Ballard would single out two college players he liked especially Love who hasn't declared for the draft.  He's all about keeping things like that in house.  He's paranoid about it.  That's why we never hear reports like that from the front office.  

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31 minutes ago, stitches said:

Those are the Patrick Mahomes types of this draft. I have no idea how much input he had on the Chiefs picking Mahomes before he left and took on the Colts job, it's possible he was one of the people that endorsed Mahomes before moving to Indy. 

You nailed it. Patrick Mahomes is exactly the type of vibes I get from those two. Especially with Love. Makes you wonder. Mahomes was drafted in 2017, which is the same year Ballard became our GM. Considering how he was the Director of football operations for them, I’m willing to bet he scouted him. If nothing else it seems like Ballard has an archetype he likes at the position.

5 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I'm a little surprised Ballard would single out two college players he liked especially Love who hasn't declared for the draft.  He's all about keeping things like that in house.  He's paranoid about it.  That's why we never hear reports like that from the front office.  

I figured that the connections would have been drawn eventually with scouting so maybe that’s why. I mean if you send scouts to Utah State or Oregon, who else are you there to watch? Love will definitely declare after this new coaching staff helped lower his draft stock.

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One fact that I can't get out of mind is that he has one year of eligibility left.  He is not having a great year stat. wise and this years QB class is really good.  Why would he come out now and probably fall in the draft order while if he stays and has a better year he would probably go much higher and might even be the No.1 QB choice the following year?  I think there is probably a decent chance he doesn't come out.  

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Haven't read all of this thread, so apologies if its been covered.

 

But it sounds like folks are putting Love into the same comparison as Mahomes or Josh Allen.  Physically talented but a bit raw.

 

Considering those two were taken pick 7 and pick 16?, what makes anybody think we won't have to trade up to take Love?

 

I've been reading many comments that solve our QB issues by devoting only one pick.  I don't see that.  

 

If Love has that much potential, I'd think we'd have to use all three picks to move up to get him, leaving our next pick at mid round three.

 

Recently, teams traded up to take Mayfield, Darnold, Rosen, and Allen; and into the first to take a high ceiling guy at 32 (Lamar).  I don't see how we'd take the next high ceiling guy at 15, and we wouldn't be even close with just the Redskins 2nd.

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46 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

One fact that I can't get out of mind is that he has one year of eligibility left.  He is not having a great year stat. wise and this years QB class is really good.  Why would he come out now and probably fall in the draft order while if he stays and has a better year he would probably go much higher and might even be the No.1 QB choice the following year?  I think there is probably a decent chance he doesn't come out.  

Understand your thinking but if you saw his surrounding cast you could understand why he might get out this year. They appear to be really bad.

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21 hours ago, DougDew said:

Haven't read all of this thread, so apologies if its been covered.

 

But it sounds like folks are putting Love into the same comparison as Mahomes or Josh Allen.  Physically talented but a bit raw.

 

Considering those two were taken pick 7 and pick 16?, what makes anybody think we won't have to trade up to take Love?

 

I've been reading many comments that solve our QB issues by devoting only one pick.  I don't see that.  

 

If Love has that much potential, I'd think we'd have to use all three picks to move up to get him, leaving our next pick at mid round three.

 

Recently, teams traded up to take Mayfield, Darnold, Rosen, and Allen; and into the first to take a high ceiling guy at 32 (Lamar).  I don't see how we'd take the next high ceiling guy at 15, and we wouldn't be even close with just the Redskins 2nd.

First off , great post.

 

Allowed to add to that. So the reason that Love gets the Allen, Mahomes, And even Lamar hype is that he’s that new style of QB. He’s athletic, has a big arm, but maybe isn’t the pure west-coast pocket passer. We’ve seen each of these guys have success by being able to operate off-script. That’s what Love gives you.

 

And yes, you’re right that you’re not going to get Love in the 2nd. You’ll have to get him in the 1st and probably get ahead of Carolina and maybe even Tampa Bay. 

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34 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

First off , great post.

 

Allowed to add to that. So the reason that Love gets the Allen, Mahomes, And even Lamar hype is that he’s that new style of QB. He’s athletic, has a big arm, but maybe isn’t the pure west-coast pocket passer. We’ve seen each of these guys have success by being able to operate off-script. That’s what Love gives you.

 

And yes, you’re right that you’re not going to get Love in the 2nd. You’ll have to get him in the 1st and probably get ahead of Carolina and maybe even Tampa Bay. 

I wouldn't put it past BB and the Patriots to try and move up as well to get him.

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21 hours ago, DougDew said:

Haven't read all of this thread, so apologies if its been covered.

 

But it sounds like folks are putting Love into the same comparison as Mahomes or Josh Allen.  Physically talented but a bit raw.

 

Considering those two were taken pick 7 and pick 16?, what makes anybody think we won't have to trade up to take Love?

 

I've been reading many comments that solve our QB issues by devoting only one pick.  I don't see that.  

 

If Love has that much potential, I'd think we'd have to use all three picks to move up to get him, leaving our next pick at mid round three.

 

Recently, teams traded up to take Mayfield, Darnold, Rosen, and Allen; and into the first to take a high ceiling guy at 32 (Lamar).  I don't see how we'd take the next high ceiling guy at 15, and we wouldn't be even close with just the Redskins 2nd.

It's possible. What helps things is that in addition to being raw, Love is not having the best season so far. It's possible we could have him with our mid-round pick, wherever that one ends up. But yeah... it's also possible teams fall in love with him in the pre-draft process - from what I've heard he's got exemplary character and has good leadership qualities. If he does well on the whiteboard with coaches, you might indeed have to trade up to get him. The point I've been making is - if you believe he's the guy for you for the next 10-15 years... there really is no price high enough you can pay to get him. If you have a true high end franchise QB in Love in 2 years who cares if you lost 2 2nd round picks or even a future 1st to get him? 

 

That doesn't mean you should go spewing draft assets that you might not need to use to get up in the draft. Identify soft spots in the draft, identify QB hungry teams and try to trade up before their picks with the minimum possible loss of assets. Kind of how the Eagles knew the Texans wanted an OT and traded up right before them and took the last R1 level LT in the last draft. 

 

 

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I love watching this kid... no pun intended. He’s got all the throws and the mindset of getting downfield. If he’s got the intangibles I think it’s a no-brainer for fair value. To reiterate.. he’s always looking downfield, and that’s something we’re sorely missing right now.

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Just now, Vexed said:

I love watching this kid... no pun intended. He’s got all the throws and the mindset of getting downfield. If he’s got the intangibles I think it’s a no-brainer for fair value. To reiterate.. he’s always looking downfield, and that’s something we’re sorely missing right now. I think Frank can work wonders with this guy.

 

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3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Instead of suck for Luck, it should be suck for Love :funny:. It still sorta rhymes haha 

Just don't google it! :peek:

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4 minutes ago, pacolts56 said:

Just don't google it! :peek:

That is hilarious :funny:. I am sure I would see some stuff, if I googled that I may end up with a virus on my computer ray liotta laughing GIF

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I just saw this in twitter. Love is expected to declare for the draft but there is still a possibility he could transfer to a bigger school as a graduate transfer. 

 

 

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9 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I wouldn't put it past BB and the Patriots to try and move up as well to get him.

I think they will  be moving up for a QB.

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There are a few QBs besides Love in this upcoming draft the Colts could be interested in.

Justin Herbert, Jalen Hurts, Kelly Bryant and Joe Burrow. 

It is really a tossup after Tagovailoa if someone gambles on him. 

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23 hours ago, stitches said:

It's possible. What helps things is that in addition to being raw, Love is not having the best season so far. It's possible we could have him with our mid-round pick, wherever that one ends up. But yeah... it's also possible teams fall in love with him in the pre-draft process - from what I've heard he's got exemplary character and has good leadership qualities. If he does well on the whiteboard with coaches, you might indeed have to trade up to get him. The point I've been making is - if you believe he's the guy for you for the next 10-15 years... there really is no price high enough you can pay to get him. If you have a true high end franchise QB in Love in 2 years who cares if you lost 2 2nd round picks or even a future 1st to get him? 

 

That doesn't mean you should go spewing draft assets that you might not need to use to get up in the draft. Identify soft spots in the draft, identify QB hungry teams and try to trade up before their picks with the minimum possible loss of assets. Kind of how the Eagles knew the Texans wanted an OT and traded up right before them and took the last R1 level LT in the last draft. 

 

 

I'm only saying that if Ballard is smart enough to see Love or any QB as being the elixir to an offense's problems, its likely that at least one, or five, other GMs see that too, and make the same calculation.  I think if GMs see a player as being a cornerstone of a franchise, they don't save draft picks hoping their guy falls.  They go up and get him then worry about the rest of the team with the ensuing drafts.  And any GM will have to compete with the notion that other GMs will do the same thing.  JMO of how they look at QBs.

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On 11/26/2019 at 10:19 AM, richard pallo said:

I think Irsay, Ballard and Reich are going to go all in and try to get Luck to return to the team.  Irsay hasn't asked for a penny back on his contract and if he requests a sit down with Andrew I think Andrew will give it to him.  By the time the season is over a lot of time will have gone by and Andrew would have had a lot of time to heal and to think about a possible return or to stick with his original decision to retire.  I think Love and the rest are back up plans in the event he decides to stay retired.  I think plan A is to get Luck back and plan B is to draft a QB who can play behind JB for a year and see where we are at the end of next year.  JMO

IMO plan A is not going to happen. Luck said there was no more fun in playing football. Once the fun and the desire is gone it don't all of a sudden return. 

Plan B is the more likely. 

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I have a feeling that they won't go after a qb.  I bet they take most of their resources and spend them on offence.  Give Brissett one more year.  I am not sure the Colts can use all of their draft capital on a qb next year. They need play makers on offence.  Stock the offense next year and   see if Brissett can make it work.  If he doesn't then go after a qb in 2021 when u have built talent around him.

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8 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I have a feeling that they won't go after a qb.  I bet they take most of their resources and spend them on offence.  Give Brissett one more year.  I am not sure the Colts can use all of their draft capital on a qb next year. They need play makers on offence.  Stock the offense next year and   see if Brissett can make it work.  If he doesn't then go after a qb in 2021 when u have built talent around him.

That’s not Ballard’s MO. He’s not going to dedicate a draft to Jacoby. Especially when he already has an elite OL and running game. He had T.Y., Ebron, and Doyle most of the year. That’s the same cast Luck had last year.

 

I have no doubt by Jacoby will be the starter in 2020. But I’d bet money that there will be a young QB behind him.

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Thanks for the review.  Podcaster mentions a poor-man's Carson Wentz (which I was thinking in the other thread) or an Alex Smith who is willing to take more shots down field.  Not a bad fit for Reich's offense.

 

But its not going to look like PM or Luck with darts thrown on deep outs, curls, or come backs, to multiple down field receivers, IMO.  More dink and dunk to the correct hip and shoulder with occasional intermediate crossers or posts, IMO.  A better, more athletic version of JB.   Some of those down field throws have too much air, IMO, which might have a different result against NFL DBs. The podcaster mentions a casual throwing style that might be hard to change.  Probably wouldn't have to trade up to take him with our 1st.

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