Colts passing game is a joke

[stitches]

12 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

The fact he was in more of air it out offense I think is probably the biggest reason. Maybe he would be good down in Tampa where the offense fits him better. I just want  to see more risks like that and not be so scared.  He clearly can anticipate  and throw guys open.

I disagree with passion on the last bit. IMO this has been his biggest weakness for a while. You can find a throw here and there where it seems like he's anticipating, but those are few and far between. 

[Fisticuffs111]

16 minutes ago, stitches said:

I disagree with passion on the last bit. IMO this has been his biggest weakness for a while. You can find a throw here and there where it seems like he's anticipating, but those are few and far between. 

 

Yeah...I’m very much with you in passionately disagreeing with that take.

[coltfaninnewyork]

And when you see those sorry stats you know Ballard ,Reich and the analytic crew all no this .Look for a move in draft or some type of move in offseason.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

6 hours ago, aaron11 said:

jacoby is still a project him self and hes been in the league 4 years.  

that is my point trade for a proven talent

[EastStreet]

6 minutes ago, stitches said:

 

The answer is... not much has changed. Jacoby is largely the same QB with some variance in his downfield success(which is understandable - those are lower probability shots on small sample) + being in Chud's Air Coryell system before and in Reich's system now. 

I think the Chud to Reich change in scheme is huge.

 

1. On top of the scheme but still central, in Chud's O, JB was asked to simply throw more to a "spot" (deep), while in Reich's he's asked to read, process, and throw. JB was good just putting the ball up and letting the WR or TE do the work. 

2. Chud's O made it much easier to read the D, and a lot easier to determine if it was man or zone based on all the pre-snap motion by the WRs/TEs. 

3. Chud's O also stretched the entire field, so WRs/TEs were often more "open", and didn't require as much visual processing to find the mismatch. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

I think the Chud to Reich change in scheme is huge.

 

1. On top of the scheme but still central, in Chud's O, JB was asked to simply throw more to a "spot" (deep), while in Reich's he's asked to read, process, and throw. JB was good just putting the ball up and letting the WR or TE do the work. 

2. Chud's O made it much easier to read the D, and a lot easier to determine if it was man or zone based on all the pre-snap motion by the WRs/TEs. 

3. Chud's O also stretched the entire field, so WRs/TEs were often more "open", and didn't require as much visual processing to find the mismatch. 

Which it might be he is just in the wrong system but could have a ton of success in a system that plays to his strengths.

[MikeCurtis]

5 hours ago, MPStack said:

Maybe someone were offer a 2nd Rd pick for JB. 

The STACK weighs in 

 

[Fisticuffs111]

2 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Which it might be he is just in the wrong system but could have a ton of success in a system that plays to his strengths.

 

A lot of us have said that from the beginning, that JB isn’t a great fit for Reich’s system, at least theoretically.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

Which it might be he is just in the wrong system but could have a ton of success in a system that plays to his strengths.

I don't think the system is the problem, I do think however Reich is running it too much. I love running it but he is the king of running lately  

[NFLfan]

1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

 

Let me be specific. I see a few different types of QB.

1) A QB who uses running as a huge part of their game (Jackson/Newton type)

2) A QB who who uses mobility as a huge part of their passing game (Mahomes/Wilson)

3) A QB who is primarily a pocket guy who is not afraid to run (Luck)

4) A QB who is primarily a pocket guy and tries not to run (Brady/Stafford/Flacco)

 

2018 rushes

Jackson - 147 (16 games)

Newton - 101 (14)

Wilson - 67 (16)

Mahomes - 60 (16)

Luck - 46 (16)

Brady - 23 (16)

 

When an injury happens to type 1 or 2 and the player is hobbled, their game and O scheme built around them is typically severely limited. Let's just say a sprained ankle. A Mahomes or Jackson won't be half of what they typically are. A hobbled type 3 or 4 will be a lot less limited because the offense built around them doesn't have the run reliance.

 

In terms injury likeliness. Guys like Newton and Jackson are basically passers and running backs. Guy like Mahomes and Wilson extend plays and use mobility but don't act or run like running backs. Guys like Luck see themselves as passers who "can" run when necessary. Guys like Brady don't want to run....  

 

In short, it's proven that RBs are more injury prone than QBs overall, so type 1 is logically at more risk. While type 2 may not be at more risk than type 3, their game will be more limited if they are hobbled. While there are no studies that take a granular look at different types of QBs, their injury likeliness, the impact of an injury, etc., It's not a huge leap of logic to think QBs that run as running backs put themselves at risk more often than those who don't, and so on as you move down the QB type list. 

 

What you fail to see is that pocket passers miss time too. You will dismiss a QB that runs, for fear of injury, while every QB has a good chance to get injured. Okay, carry on...

 

(Btw, most years Luck ran 60 times or more. Mahomes ran 60 times last year.) 

[coltfaninnewyork]

2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't think the system is the problem, I do think however Reich is running it too much. I love running it but he is the king of running lately  

Tells me not confident in brisett imo

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't think the system is the problem, I do think however Reich is running it too much. I love running it but he is the king of running lately  

The points eastatreet pointed out you can clearly see why he might be having issues with this system.

 

Maybe we can get the jags to give us foles in the off season. Lol. Minshew was doing a lot better then foles. Looks like it was a mistake to bench him.

[2006Coltsbestever]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

The points eastatreet pointed out you can clearly see why he might be having issues with this system.

 

Maybe we can get the jags to give us foles in the off season. Lol. Minshew was doing a lot better then foles. Looks like it was a mistake to bench him.

Foles looks bad right now. Titans are pounding them. We play the Titans next week, that won't be easy.

[MPStack]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Foles looks bad right now. Titans are pounding them. We play the Titans next week, that won't be easy.

 

100% Agree, if the Colts can only muster a buck thirty in the air. 

[coltfaninnewyork]

Dare I say the jags would like to rid themselves of Foles ?Cheaper and younger ,minshaw .Man I know we division rivals but a second round pick for Foles .We also have the space for Foles contract .Reich and Foles reunion in Indy 2020.Make it happen lol 

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 minutes ago, MPStack said:

 

100% Agree, if the Colts can only muster a buck thirty in the air. 

If we get a buck 50 I think we can pull it out  as long as Williams runs for 100.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

9 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Foles looks bad right now. Titans are pounding them. We play the Titans next week, that won't be easy.

Yes but Reich knows who he is and he firs this offense a lot better then maybe the jags.

[EastStreet]

23 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Which it might be he is just in the wrong system but could have a ton of success in a system that plays to his strengths.

Not sure I'd say a ton of success, but definitely more success.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

9 minutes ago, coltfaninnewyork said:

Dare I say the jags would like to rid themselves of Foles ?Cheaper and younger ,minshaw .Man I know we division rivals but a second round pick for Foles .We also have the space for Foles contract .Reich and Foles reunion in Indy 2020.Make it happen lol 

I bet we could get him for less then a 2nd. They would never trade within the division. Especially to the team that had the coach he won the SB with. This should of happened in the spring and Luck should of retired after the season.

[EastStreet]

21 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

What you fail to see is that pocket passers miss time too. You will dismiss a QB that runs, for fear of injury, while every QB has a good chance to get injured. Okay, carry on...

 

(Btw, most years Luck ran 60 times or more. Mahomes ran 60 times last year.) 

I'm not saying pocket passers don't miss time. I'm just saying the more running, the more potential for injury. And the more reliance on running, the less effective a QB will be if he's hobbled and the more limited the scheme will be.

[indyagent17]

Having great field vision is a must for a solid quarterback. Brissett has not mastered this skill and that is his biggest downfall

[coltfaninnewyork]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

I bet we could get him for less then a 2nd. They would never trade within the division. Especially to the team that had the coach he won the SB with. This should of happened in the spring and Luck should of retired after the season.

My hope not many teams can take that cap hit and we do have the space 

[esmort]

No thanks ... Pass on Foles

[Sumo63]

I know we're all living in the now, seeing what we believe to be an average QB regressing week to week.

 

But it is possible that Reich and company know what their doing and are breaking Jacoby's game down so the can build it back up into something that fits this scheme.  

 

That said Jacoby might just be out over his skis on this offense.  Truth is we wont know til they make a move or dont.

 

Ballard and Reich didnt come here to make this a mediocre club.  If Jacobys not the guy they'll let us know sooner rather than later I think.

 

I've been a big supporter of Brissett and I'd like to believe we'll see some improvement and maybe a little more risk now that the playoffs are unlikely.  Imo he needs a 4 int game to get over some of the hesitation/fear he seems to be gripped by.  A 4 td 0 int game would also be acceptable.......

 

Come out throwing one more time this year, and let him sink or swim.  Either way it'll be good for him.

[coltsfanatic24]

This is a great draft for QB’s. The best draft since 1983 imo. Justin Herbert, Joe Burrow, and Jake Fromm are franchise caliber QB’s. We have to get one of those three for this franchise to move in the right direction.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

43 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

I know we're all living in the now, seeing what we believe to be an average QB regressing week to week.

 

But it is possible that Reich and company know what their doing and are breaking Jacoby's game down so the can build it back up into something that fits this scheme.  

 

That said Jacoby might just be out over his skis on this offense.  Truth is we wont know til they make a move or dont.

 

Ballard and Reich didnt come here to make this a mediocre club.  If Jacobys not the guy they'll let us know sooner rather than later I think.

 

I've been a big supporter of Brissett and I'd like to believe we'll see some improvement and maybe a little more risk now that the playoffs are unlikely.  Imo he needs a 4 int game to get over some of the hesitation/fear he seems to be gripped by.  A 4 td 0 int game would also be acceptable.......

 

Come out throwing one more time this year, and let him sink or swim.  Either way it'll be good for him.

He will probably come out and have a career game against the titans. Lol. That always happens when you think things are so bad. I think it was Dungy that said your never as bad as your last game or as good as your last game. I bet this is all a over reaction to last week. After Sunday we will be sayin dang he was good lol. He did have 3 TD against the titans last time I believe. 

[Sumo63]

13 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

He will probably come out and have a career game against the titans. Lol. That always happens when you think things are so bad. I think it was Dungy that said your never as bad as your last game or as good as your last game. I bet this is all a over reaction to last week. After Sunday we will be sayin dang he was good lol. He did have 3 TD against the titans last time I believe. 

Had plenty against Houston last time too.  I just don't know what to expect anymore.  Except: O line good, reich is better than hes looked this month, and defense not too shabby.  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

9 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

Had plenty against Houston last time too.  I just don't know what to expect anymore.  Except: O line good, reich is better than hes looked this month, and defense not too shabby.  

If titans play the same defense they did the first time I will be curious if he learned from it and has a easier time. Titans have got Simmons in the lineup now and he is killing people. They also have Lewan back. Neither of them played the first matchup. 

 

This team is very strange and inconsistent. We can lose to anyone but beat almost anyone. The saints did not look good on defense today. That will also be a interesting game to watch. Their oline is struggling also.

 

Hopefully we get DF and Campbell back Sunday and TY is back to his usual self.

[hoosierhawk]

50 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

He will probably come out and have a career game against the titans. Lol. That always happens when you think things are so bad. I think it was Dungy that said your never as bad as your last game or as good as your last game. I bet this is all a over reaction to last week. After Sunday we will be sayin dang he was good lol. He did have 3 TD against the titans last time I believe. 

Chloe, I give you credit for being an eternal optimist but if things don't go well you have the most excuses of anyone I know. I have to give you a gold star for being so optimistic. Can not take that away from you and am proud of you but won't hire you as my bookie.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

13 minutes ago, hoosierhawk said:

Chloe, I give you credit for being an eternal optimist but if things don't go well you have the most excuses of anyone I know. I have to give you a gold star for being so optimistic. Can not take that away from you and am proud of you but won't hire you as my bookie.

You never know. This always happens when you think things are so bad. Somehow they will prove us wrong. 

 

Thought this was funny. Brady better be thankful for his defense.

 

 

[hoosierhawk]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

You never know. This always happens when you think things are so bad. Somehow they will prove us wrong. 

 

Thought this was funny. Brady better be thankful for his defense.

 

 

Agree Chloe, he is on the downside of his career! But seriously Chloe, I admire you for your optimism! 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Here is a great one for some that thinks stats are everything,

 

College career averages:

QB A = 2,794 yards per year, 20 TD's, 8 INT's, here is the kicker 8.4 Y/A

 

QB B = 2,800 yards per year, 22 TD's, 8 INT's, 8.1 Y/A, (same as above basically overall)

 

Can you name the 2 QB's who were identical coming out of college statistically? 

[hoosierhawk]

6 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Here is a great one for some that thinks stats are everything,

 

College career averages:

QB A = 2,794 yards per year, 20 TD's, 8 INT's, here is the kicker 8.4 Y/A

 

QB B = 2,800 yards per year, 22 TD's, 8 INT's, 8.1 Y/A, (same as above basically overall)

 

Can you name the 2 QB's who were identical coming out of college statistically? 

A. Jacoby

B. Mahomes

Do I win the prize?

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, hoosierhawk said:

A. Jacoby

B. Mahomes

Do I win the prize?

Nope, Leaf was A and Peyton was B. That is why stats aren't everything. Leadership means a ton.

[NDcolt]

Any arm chair GM can see JB is not the answer, stop pretending.  He lacks the confidence it takes to play the position and more importantly doesn’t have the anticipation factor to throw a receiver open.  

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, NDcolt said:

Any arm chair GM can see JB is not the answer, stop pretending.  He lacks the confidence it takes to play the position and more importantly doesn’t have the anticipation factor to throw a receiver open.  

Trent Dilfer wasn't the answer in 2000, Brad Johnson wasn't in 2002, Foles wasn't 2017. Everyone said Philly was toast when Wentz went out in 2017 and he beat Tom Brady in a shootout  . Is Jordan Love the answer? Who knows, I don't.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

30 minutes ago, hoosierhawk said:

Agree Chloe, he is on the downside of his career! But seriously Chloe, I admire you for your optimism! 

Remember how down this board was after the Miami loss.  What happened against the jags.

[hoosierhawk]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Nope, Leaf was A and Peyton was B. That is why stats aren't everything. Leadership means a ton.

Darn, so I don't win the prize? Seriously 2006, this whole conversation has got soo out of hand. We have guys that think JB is the guy and we have some who are critiquing his performance and all of the sudden we have a divided fan base. Kind of remind you of the state of our country as divided as it is now? We all should have a pow wow at the corner bar and I think we would all get along and have a great time. Since I may be in the minority it's probably not a good idea so HAPPY TURKEY DAY!! 

[hoosierhawk]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

Remember how down this board was after the Miami loss.  What happened against the jags.

I'm complimenting you Chloe!

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 hours ago, hoosierhawk said:

Darn, so I don't win the prize? Seriously 2006, this whole conversation has got soo out of hand. We have guys that think JB is the guy and we have some who are critiquing his performance and all of the sudden we have a divided fan base. Kind of remind you of the state of our country as divided as it is now? We all should have a pow wow at the corner bar and I think we would all get along and have a great time. Since I may be in the minority it's probably not a good idea so HAPPY TURKEY DAY!! 

I hear ya, I am not sold on JB being the answer, he may not be as he looked bad on Thursday. That was his chance to shut his critics up and he played like Mike Pagel I admit  . I just to try to make points that things could be worse. I have seen far worse than JB in my time and so have you my friend.