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chad72

Last night's game where Minkah Fitzpatrick was not a factor says all we need to know about Malik Hooker

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Minkah has legend status for the rest of the year around here...

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17 minutes ago, chad72 said:

When teams avoid you, you have made an impact already, regardless of the impact on the stat sheet.

 

Last night, Baker Mayfield made a conscious effort to avoid Minkah more often knowing his play making ability. I find a lot of folks picking on Malik Hooker here and he has the ability to make the same impact that Minkah does, and is on his way to doing so, IMO. Just like Minkah, he is impacted by QBs not looking his way and I wish people would make their assessment based on much more than the stat sheet for a player's impact.

 

That is all I have to say!!! :hat:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

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8 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

Pittsburgh's D utilizes the safety position more aggressively.

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38 minutes ago, chad72 said:

When teams avoid you, you have made an impact already, regardless of the impact on the stat sheet.

 

Last night, Baker Mayfield made a conscious effort to avoid Minkah more often knowing his play making ability. I find a lot of folks picking on Malik Hooker here and he has the ability to make the same impact that Minkah does, and is on his way to doing so, IMO. Just like Minkah, he is impacted by QBs not looking his way and I wish people would make their assessment based on much more than the stat sheet for a player's impact.

 

That is all I have to say!!! :hat:

this times 10000000000. I'm tired of seeing the disrespect towards Hooker he is a stud and is rightfully being avoided! I still wish we had traded for Fitzpatrick then QBs would have to try to avoid both!! haha

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15 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

the Pitt DLine is 10 times better than ours too.

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11 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

 

I don't think the point is about who is playing better or making more plays, it's about the way a good safety is gameplanned by the opposing offense. If the offense makes a concerted effort to avoid that safety, then even without recording a stat, that safety is having a significant impact on the game. 

 

There's an insistence from some that, because a safety is so far away from the ball and can be avoided, it means his impact on the game is lessened, and ultimately, that makes it a mistake to use a high pick on a safety. The point in the OP is that when a team makes a conscious effort to avoid a safety, the safety's impact on the game is not lessened, it's actually even greater.

 

Where Hooker fits in -- do teams actively avoid him, or is he just taken out of the game by his role? -- is a different part of the conversation. I don't think people appreciate just how impactful he is, even when he's not showing up on the TV feed. 

 

And I agree with you, the weakest part of Hooker's game is his tackling, but he's been tackling well the last few games. 

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Relevant point, the Colts secondary is significantly better when Hooker plays. 

 

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If Mayfield did avoid him, it could simply mean that Minkah could be the best player on a weak secondary, and that the QB naturally avoids the best player to pick on the worst.  Once the other players get better, the QBs could "target" the FS on every play once he becomes the weak link. 

 

Once the other players get better, then we can see how good they are.  Currently, they both may be impactful on their specifec team simply by default, because the other players are so bad.

 

IIRC, PITTS secondary was its weak spot for them.  And ours certainly hasn't been a strong spot for us.

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45 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

this times 10000000000. I'm tired of seeing the disrespect towards Hooker he is a stud and is rightfully being avoided! I still wish we had traded for Fitzpatrick then QBs would have to try to avoid both!! haha


He’s a Stud when he’s healthy and on the field. 

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50 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

Well, let’s put a little context into Minkah’s heroics..... that pick 6 against us was a gift in the form of a ridiculously stupid pass by Brian Hoyer.

 

He stared down his primary target directly in the range of Fitzpatrick and we paid for dearly. (Note Pascal, who was open on the near sideline.)
 

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, pacolts56 said:

Well, let’s put a little context into Minkah’s heroics..... that pick 6 against us was a gift in the form of a ridiculously stupid pass by Brian Hoyer.

 

He stared down his primary target directly in the range of Fitzpatrick and we paid for dearly. (Note Pascal, who was open on the near sideline.)
 

 

 

 

And so did Phillip Rivers, which Hooker intercepted. Does that lessen the impact of the play? How bout his other 4 Ints? They all just bad plays by the QB too?

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The Pascal TD was an example of the Colts scoring while Fitzpatrick was out of position.  I also think one of the other TD’s that were scored had him out of position as well.

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Its pretty simple actually, people think that just because Hooker doesn't lead the league in INT and passes defensed that he isnt't that good.

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15 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

And so did Phillip Rivers, which Hooker intercepted. Does that lessen the impact of the play? How bout his other 4 Ints? They all just bad plays by the QB too?

Did I say that in my post?

 

I merely pointed out that Hoyer made a badly telegraphed stupid throw and that we paid dearly for it.

 

Hooker and Fitzpatrick are both excellent safeties.... and I would contend that schemes and game scripts have resulted in Fitzpatrick’s higher pick totals rather than some large gap in talent.

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hard to make a bunch of interceptions when your'e regularly not thrown at.  That means he's doing his job and doing it very well. 

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On 11/15/2019 at 10:59 AM, DougDew said:

Currently, they both may be impactful on their specifec team simply by default, because the other players are so bad.

 

Isn't Kenny Moore considered a top-2 nickelback in the NFL?

 

What's it say that opposing offenses would still rather throw it at Moore than Hooker?

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I don't think there is any fan watching TV that can honestly say how good Hooker is.  We just can't see him enough except for the odd replay or when he's in the box. 

 

But if you want to use the eye test, he does appear as just another guy IMO, and saying he's lacking in stats because he's being avoided all the time is not really accurate either.  That applies more to dbs.  It would also imply that stat grabbing safeties aren't as good. 

 

But I'll trust the coaches/analytics guys and say he's a very good player and maybe the stats don't matter quite so much in his case.  I remember a couple games he didn't play and that secondary was terrible. 

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On 11/15/2019 at 10:08 AM, Mr.Debonair said:

 

I like Hooker but as someone pointed out here Hooker and Fitzpatrick have just about the same amount in regards to lack or targets their way but yet Fitzpatrick as had a far larger impact on the game in regards to causing turnovers and getting INTs. Hooker has not had a pick since the first game of the season. Fitzpatrick has Forced fumbles, INTs, INT TD, Pass deflections. You need to look at the stat sheet to see Fitzpatrick's impact because there highlight plays that show it. Hooker is making his tackles and that's good.

i agree , hooker is seldom a game changer , fitzpatrick is quite often, big difference there.

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he is not living up to the hype, his play is just average, hope he improves

 

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12 hours ago, cbear said:

I don't think there is any fan watching TV that can honestly say how good Hooker is.  We just can't see him enough except for the odd replay or when he's in the box. 

 

But if you want to use the eye test, he does appear as just another guy IMO, and saying he's lacking in stats because he's being avoided all the time is not really accurate either.  That applies more to dbs.  It would also imply that stat grabbing safeties aren't as good. 

 

 

this is when stuff like pff is handy.  we dont have to take everything they say as gospel of course, but they do watch the things that we cant on tv

 

they like hooker for what its worth 

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Wasn't it Hooker that laid the lumber so that RYS could come up with the INT? Just saying. :) 

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What a game by Hooker. He is improving every day. He might make the pro bowl. If he finishes the season healthy he is going to get paid after this season.

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Phony stats. Its pretty hard to be targeted when you're not actually covering anybody.

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Malik’s transition to being a complete safety isn’t talked about enough here.

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