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Your thought on Ballard sticking with Vinny.

Whats your opinion on Ballard sticking with Vinny?  

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  1. 1. Whats your opinion on Ballard sticking with Vinny?

    • The first Big mistake of his Colts tenure, Vinny showed clear signs of decline at the end of last season. Messed it up badly.
      56
    • Hindsight is 20/20, can't knock him for resigning a HOF kicker, mistakes made now move on.
      50
    • Any GM would have resigned AV he is a clear cut HOF kicker and we should stick with him cause there nobody better.
      16

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  • Poll closed on 11/12/2019 at 06:00 AM

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14 hours ago, twfish said:

Vinny did not lose us this game.

I’ve seen this statement a couple of times over the course of the season when AV has struggled. In the purest form of the definition of loss, I agree it’s a team sport. Hoyer certainly could’ve put up 50 against the dolphins and AV can miss all the PATs all game and it wouldn’t matter. 
 

However 31 out of 32 teams in the NFL can count on their kicker to make a PAT or FG within 30 yds - that’s really just state of place kickers in the NFL. Yes, you miss one from time to time, however with the game on the line with Hoyer under center, you HAVE to make that Pat.
 

I hate to say it but if we have a AV from 3 years ago, were likely 7-2. Instead we continue to lose in close games because of our unreliable kicker. Unfortunately for us there’s no one better out there at this point I think the season, so we’re in for a bumpy ride through the end of the year. 

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1 minute ago, Dasteez said:

I’ve seen this statement a couple of times over the course of the season when AV has struggled. In the purest form of the definition of loss, I agree it’s a team sport. Hoyer certainly could’ve put up 50 against the dolphins and AV can miss all the PATs all game and it wouldn’t matter. 
 

However 31 out of 32 teams in the NFL can count on their kicker to make a PAT or FG within 30 yds - that’s really just state of place kickers in the NFL. Yes, you miss one from time to time, however with the game on the line with Hoyer under center, you HAVE to make that Pat.
 

I hate to say it but if we have a AV from 3 years ago, were likely 7-2. Instead we continue to lose in close games because of our unreliable kicker. Unfortunately for us there’s no one better out there at this point I think the season, so we’re in for a bumpy ride through the end of the year. 

To the portion in bold: I could be wrong, but I read that AV has the worst kicking percentage in the league this year. Again, I could be wrong here. This would tell me that there's plenty of room for improvement.

 

Vinny has missed 6 PATs. Signing another kicker would immediately improve the Colts in this area. PATs are usually automatic. Misses are extremely rare, yet Vinny has missed 6. He's also missed 5 field goals. Adding another kicker may not result in a better field goal percentage (though, I think it would), but it would solve the PAT issues.

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Kickers are a differmt breed they flame out hard was ready to move on in the offseason .

 

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2 hours ago, Flash7 said:

To the portion in bold: I could be wrong, but I read that AV has the worst kicking percentage in the league this year. Again, I could be wrong here. This would tell me that there's plenty of room for improvement.

 

Vinny has missed 6 PATs. Signing another kicker would immediately improve the Colts in this area. PATs are usually automatic. Misses are extremely rare, yet Vinny has missed 6. He's also missed 5 field goals. Adding another kicker may not result in a better field goal percentage (though, I think it would), but it would solve the PAT issues.

 

Agreed 100%

The problem with "nobody's available" is that at least 2 kickers are now on NFL rosters and kicking FG's that weren't 4-5 weeks ago. Of course they're not available now because someone signed them, just like the kickers that will be signed over the next 3-4 weeks wont be available in 5 weeks. 

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3 hours ago, OffensivelyPC said:

So random...lol

What’s random about that? Other than the fact that the trade deadline has passed, it makes sense. The Eagles are basically paying guys off the street to play CB, and Jake Elliott is a young and solid kicker that could do well here.

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3 hours ago, BigQungus said:

 

I was literally thinking the exact same thing yesterday. We should give Vinny 75% of his remaining salary to become a kicking coach. One thing the fans don't see is the locker room. If you watch the videos, Vinny is a locker room leader. I love having him and his experience in there. However, we cannot afford to have him on the field anymore. We just can't. This would be the best thing to do

Exactly! Ballard basically said in the off-season the biggest reason for resigning Vinny is because he’s such a great leader for the team, and he obviously still wants to be part of the team. Therefore, let him help the team in the best way he can. Make Vinny the kicking coach, and let him train up the next kicker and Rigo and Rhoades

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You could tell the difference between Adam Vs kicks versus the kicks from the Dolphins kicker.

The Dolphins kicker had a whole lot more control over his kicks.  His kicks has really good pop to them. 

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3 hours ago, Nesjan3 said:

Just trying to keep my post on a linear conversation about Ballards decision to re-sign vinny and not get into the game but it doesn't really matter. No i am not a mod no need to get hostile lol relax

Sorry if that was too hostile, just don’t like shutting down discussion. No harm intended

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6 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

Vinny indicated last night again he is injured. That makes it even worse. Ballard could of put him on IR instead of cutting him so he didn’t take so much heat. 

Of course he will say he’s injured after missing another kick. Just another excuse.

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Definitely an all time Colt great, but he scares the hell out of me kicking anything nowadays.

 

Hopefully there's a plan B in the works.

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Just now, Blueblood23 said:

Of course he will say he’s injured after missing another kick. Just another excuse.

They keep Brissett out when he could play and put the injured Vinatieri in to kick. What a bunch of horse crap.

 

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3 hours ago, 1959Colts said:

I also did not want him back. Yet the vast majority said the most obvious decision Ballard had to make was to resign AV. The decision to sign him was often referred to as a "no-brainer"

To be fair, Vinny was obviously not retiring and most people didn’t want him to retire anywhere but here and were hoping he’d retire after one more good year. Also, even though he regressed towards the end of the year, it did not at all look like he would regress this much. A lot of people also gave him a pass because that KC game was garbage for everyone on the team, and it was snowing.

Not making excuses, just providing reasoning

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17 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

On the last drive a field goal would have tied the game if our kicker kicks a freaking extra point. This loss is squarely on him

 

You could also say if our receiver held on to the TD pass in the endzone we would have won.

 

That said, I think it could be argued that Vinitieri is the least reliable kicker in the NFL today.

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10 minutes ago, LuckyHorseShoe§ said:

What’s random about that? Other than the fact that the trade deadline has passed, it makes sense. The Eagles are basically paying guys off the street to play CB, and Jake Elliott is a young and solid kicker that could do well here.

I must have been thinking of someone else, cuz I thought Jake Elliott was a lineman.  lol.   I was like, we're talking about kickers and you're talking about trading a CB for an OL?  Woops!

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Wow what a bunch of crybabies .  AV  went from G.O.A.T  to   Scape Goat thanks now get lost & on most teams that might be the case .

 

Irsay Ballard Reich & the Indianapolis Colts seem to have more CLASS that & its there opinions that matter thankfully .

 

Coming from a fan base that BOOED Andrew Luck  after all he went thru & AV struggles & no he is not the reason our COLTS are losing ?  He is but 1 of many reasons we have lost . 

 

Christmas Wish list  New QB & Kicker 

 

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4 hours ago, LuckyHorseShoe§ said:

FB7BD070-8169-4DD7-8BFE-FCE7CC0AF738.jpeg

 

There are people here who were clamoring to replace AV before he started losing games for us.

 

There are obviously a lot more doing it now, of course.  I don’t know if the OP was saying this before or not.  But we can’t lump everybody in as a Monday morning quarterback.

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24 minutes ago, ÅÐØNϧ 1 said:

Wow what a bunch of crybabies .  AV  went from G.O.A.T  to   Scape Goat thanks now get lost & on most teams that might be the case .

 

Irsay Ballard Reich & the Indianapolis Colts seem to have more CLASS that & its there opinions that matter thankfully .

 

Coming from a fan base that BOOED Andrew Luck  after all he went thru & AV struggles & no he is not the reason our COLTS are losing ?  He is but 1 of many reasons we have lost . 

 

Christmas Wish list  New QB & Kicker 

 

 

This is mostly nonsense.  About the only thing you said that is correct is that AV is one of the reasons we’re losing games we should be winning.

 

What you’re calling “class” only goes so far in any business — and professional football is a business.

 

Case in point, Irsay handled letting our franchise’s all-time best player go with a lot of class.  Held a joint press conference, flew him on the team jet, built him a statue, retired his jersey...all class.

 

But let him go, he did.  And it was almost universally seen as the best decision for the team.

 

It’s Irsay’s job to do what’s best for the team - same with the GM and coaching staff.  And sometimes that requires tough things — like letting your icons go...which can be done in a classy and respectful way.

 

It was a mistake to retain Vinatieri going into last season...compounded by doing so this season.

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I don't think predicting a 50 yr old kicker would 'fall off' at some point makes anyone a football savant.. Lol

 

It sucks, but it is what it is. 

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Something that hasn't been mentioned here is that Reich was very much in Vinnie's corner and said so in his pressers. Sounds like the only option here for Ballard was to override the coach and not give him the benefit of the doubt. I was all for giving him another chance unless we had a slam dunk replacement. I now think it is time that we do something different. 

I wasn't aware till I read this thread that there were so many that wanted him gone before the season. I wasn't one of them but I guess I'm a poor prognosticator.

 

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7 minutes ago, IinD said:

I don't think predicting a 50 yr old kicker would 'fall off' at some point makes anyone a football savant.. Lol

 

It sucks, but it is what it is. 

 

Heh...true.

 

But it does, at least, put that person one up on our front office and coaching staff in this instance.

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The problem right now is, there is nobody else good out there we can get. We will have someone different next season that is almost certain.

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1 hour ago, LuckyHorseShoe§ said:

To be fair, Vinny was obviously not retiring and most people didn’t want him to retire anywhere but here and were hoping he’d retire after one more good year. Also, even though he regressed towards the end of the year, it did not at all look like he would regress this much. A lot of people also gave him a pass because that KC game was garbage for everyone on the team, and it was snowing.

Not making excuses, just providing reasoning

 

It wouldn’t have bothered me a bit if he had retired somewhere else.

 

a) Some of our best players have (Manning, Saturday, Freeney, Harbaugh, Edgerrin, Hinton, Dickerson, Brooks, Wayne, Faulk...all of whom are in the Ring of Honor).

 

b) He’d be yanking PATs and short FGs for some poor occasional opponent rather than us.  Maybe the Texans could’ve signed him?  That would’ve been fantastic for us.

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19 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

On the last drive a field goal would have tied the game if our kicker kicks a freaking extra point. This loss is squarely on him

Yea a field goal WOULD have tied the game, the only thing people seem to forget is that the same guy who missed that PAT would have had to make the supposed FG to get to overtime. 
 

Furthermore, you can’t say that we would have won in overtime so no you really can’t pin this loss on vinny. Did he contribute to the loss? Yes absolutely, was it all his fault? No! 
 

The Steelers game, Vinny cost us the game, the Chargers game, vinny cost us the game, the dolphins game, Vinny did not cost us the game.

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did anyone notice the near miss on his first kick? He missed to the right earlier in the year and has been compensating left (and missing often) ever since.

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Reich said today he would be sitting down with Ballard after his phone conference to discuss the roster.

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32 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

The problem right now is, there is nobody else good out there we can get. We will have someone different next season that is almost certain.

True, but any kicker who has kicked in college should be able to kick extra points better than Vinny.  Even if it's Sanchez doing everything I like our chances better than watching Vinny give it a try. 

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It has been a mistake to keep looking the other way.  Vinny is done and Ballard should be smart enough to see it and make the tough call.  

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I think that there is a lot of us here who were beyond ecstatic really that Vinny signed another one year deal with us to kick for us this year. I still am happy that he did.


Aside from that where we are now 9 games into the season vinny is as unreliable today as he was in his debacle of his game 1 performance. By all accounts and measures almost any player in any other position with as bad a track record would have in all probabilities been benched already. However, you’ve got to have someone who you feel has more potential to do better for this to happen. Which by all accounts is reasonable and what many have stated on here. Who is to say that management hasn’t looked around or discussed making a change at least once this year? They very well could have, certainly we don’t know.

 

What we do know is “it is what it is”. Given Andrew Luck retired, Hilton out multiple games, 2 other WR’s out, starters on defense out multiple games, I’d say 5-4 is pretty dang good for all that. However, a reliable kicker on the roster and for sure we are in all likelihood at worst 7-2 (because the kicker did not cost us the game yesterday despite some people suggesting it did). At best we could have been 8-1 with a reliable kicker. 
 

Let the disagreements continue.... haha

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19 minutes ago, Happy2BeHere said:

However, you’ve got to have someone who you feel has more potential to do better for this to happen. Which by all accounts is reasonable and what many have stated on here. Who is to say that management hasn’t looked around or discussed making a change at least once this year? They very well could have, certainly we don’t know.

 

I don’t know who they looked at this year.  But last year we had Money Badger on our preseason roster and cut him to keep AV.  He had kicked well for us and he’s gone on to be a solid (though injured) kicker for the Chargers.

 

We didn’t need to put ourselves in a situation to have to find somebody else mid-season, and shouldn’t have.  Water under the bridge now, I know.

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2 hours ago, luv_pony_express said:

 

I don’t know who they looked at this year.  But last year we had Money Badger on our preseason roster and cut him to keep AV.  He had kicked well for us and he’s gone on to be a solid (though injured) kicker for the Chargers.

 

We didn’t need to put ourselves in a situation to have to find somebody else mid-season, and shouldn’t have.  Water under the bridge now, I know.

 

I get what you are saying....BUT...the Colts (any MANY in the league I would argue) felt that Vinny (as proven as he was despite his last year end struggles) was the better option at the time. Hindsight is what I think you are referring to here. My point only was that they obviously felt Vinny was indeed the best choice, and I bet had we not re-signed him Vinny would have easily made another teams roster quickly. The decision came before the start of the season and felt through pre-season that it was the right way to go...but NOW they don't have the choices they had before the season started. So they just have to roll with it.

 

No doubt in my mind that Vinny retires after this year...just absolutely no doubt.

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2 hours ago, luv_pony_express said:

 

I don’t know who they looked at this year.  But last year we had Money Badger on our preseason roster and cut him to keep AV.  He had kicked well for us and he’s gone on to be a solid (though injured) kicker for the Chargers.

 

We didn’t need to put ourselves in a situation to have to find somebody else mid-season, and shouldn’t have.  Water under the bridge now, I know.

We looked at Younghoe Koo, but didn't sign him. The Falcons released Matt Bryant (also arguably a HOF kicker) after having similar struggles as Vinny and brought him in to start against the Saints... he went 4/4 in FGs with 48 Long and 2/2 extra points

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13 hours ago, luv_pony_express said:

 

I don’t see how anybody can say “I don't blame them for bringing him back this year” and then, a few sentences later, say “it shows they're too sentimental.”

 

If the latter is true (and it obviously is), then how do Ballard & Co. escape blame?  Fans are supposed to be the sentimental ones.  A GM can’t afford to be - and this situation is one of the best examples why that is.

 

We had a golden opportunity going into last season to sign a solid young kicker in Badgley.  And it apparently wasn’t even considered.  When the idea was broached on this board, the overwhelming opinion was that it was unthinkable to replace AV.

 

I could at least understand that sentiment at the time.  But, in retrospect, I can’t see how anybody would think it was the right decision.

 

In fact, I bet even Ballard himself realizes he goofed.  And now we’re stuck with the dilemma of either keeping our fingers crossed every time AV lines up or trying to scramble mid-season to get a kicker who heretofore couldn’t make anybody else’s roster.

 

This was a self-inflicted unforced error.

 I don't blame them for bringing him back, because there simply wasn't enough bad last year to think he couldn't clean things up at that point (over an off season). And we don't know how he looked in practice leading up to this year and throughout. 

 

But I agree, if there were obvious signs the entire time after last season, then shame on them. Given his career, he has earned more trust and confidence, and it just sounds like CB/FR failed to draw a line in the sand in terms of "how much"..

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I'm watching this kid Chase McLaughlin kicking for the 49ers tonight very closely.  He's a rookie out of Illinois who filled in for the Chargers while Badgely was hurt.  He's 7-10 on the year (including 1-1 tonight) & hasn't missed an extra point.  His misses have come in the 40-49 range where he's 2-5 including the kick tonight a 43 yarder.  He's a late replacement for an injured  Gould who they expect back next week.  I hope Ballard is watching this game as well because Vinny needs to hang up the cleats. 

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holder/Snapper/Kicker fire em all bc literally each one has messed up when one of them have done good

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Us sticking with Vinny too long is ironically the Patriots sticking it too us again.  Here we are with a former Patriot (I know he's been with us longer) & he's already played a huge role in costing us 3 games.  You think Belichick would stick with Vinny after costing them 3 games???  CB this is your moment. 

 

We don't have to do everything the Patriots do but moving on from Vinny is the right thing to do.  Do it with dignity by I.R.ing him but get it done.  If we could let Edge, Peyton, Marv, Reggie, Freeney, & Saturday walk then we can move on from Vinny.  Step up CB. 

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6 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

The problem right now is, there is nobody else good out there we can get. We will have someone different next season that is almost certain.


How did the 49ers and Falcons manage the short term production from their kickers so far? I do not believe in the fact that there aren’t decent options out there, the coaches and GM aren’t willing to make the move, and are too afraid to take chances.

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