Week 6 impressions: Brissett

[Fisticuffs111 2,094]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

Everyone should go listen to Reich taking questions from fans on the colts App. Good questions about the passing game and Jacoby. He know we need a few more big plays.

But will we get them? We'll see...

[Stephen 1,855]

3 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

But will we get them? We'll see...

When funchess  and Campbell  return

[Fisticuffs111 2,094]

8 minutes ago, Stephen said:

When funchess  and Campbell  return

Yeah, again, we'll see. Funchess won't be coming back for a few weeks, but I do think he'll be targeted a lot. As for Campbell, as much as I'm a fan, we'll see how he's worked in once he comes back. Which I doubt will be for 2-3 weeks as well after having an abdomen procedure.

[Chloe6124 5,368]

Funchess can return to practice next week. He can return either the Miami or jags game. Reich mentioned yesterday on his Q and A with Matt Taylor that he is looking forward to getting him back. Funchess also posted a IG story saying he is on his way back. Sirriani mentioned he has been in all the meetings and has been working out at the facility. He has such a fun personality I am sure he will bring a lot of juice to the team. 

[Stephen 1,855]

8 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Funchess can return to practice next week. He can return either the Miami or jags game. Reich mentioned yesterday on his Q and A with Matt Taylor that he is looking forward to getting him back. Funchess also posted a IG story saying he is on his way back. Sirriani mentioned he has been in all the meetings and has been working out at the facility. He has such a fun personality I am sure he will bring a lot of juice to the team. 

Now if we only could  get cain or Campbell  to step up along with funchess  return our offense  could become  more dynamic 

[Fisticuffs111 2,094]

1 hour ago, Chloe6124 said:

Funchess can return to practice next week. He can return either the Miami or jags game. Reich mentioned yesterday on his Q and A with Matt Taylor that he is looking forward to getting him back. Funchess also posted a IG story saying he is on his way back. Sirriani mentioned he has been in all the meetings and has been working out at the facility. He has such a fun personality I am sure he will bring a lot of juice to the team. 

Yeah, I said a few but meant week 8. Season's going by fast.

[krunk 11,894]

On 10/15/2019 at 11:41 AM, stitches said:

Can you guys and gals spot a problem in this play from Brissett:

 

 

He looked a lot better in the first several weeks with his pocket presence, but this is something I've noticed get worse lately. He's leaving clean pockets more than is ideal. He had Paschal open on a corner route if he just stayed in his clean pocket and went through his progression. 

I complained about that literally the entire chiefs game.

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

On 10/15/2019 at 12:41 PM, stitches said:

Can you guys and gals spot a problem in this play from Brissett:

 

 

He looked a lot better in the first several weeks with his pocket presence, but this is something I've noticed get worse lately. He's leaving clean pockets more than is ideal. He had Paschal open on a corner route if he just stayed in his clean pocket and went through his progression. 

 

No. Receivers seemed to be covered, defenders ready to make a pick. Maybe has the check down out to the left flat to Mack ( it seemed the corner was where he intended to throw it, but pulled it back in, it wasn't a designed pump fake).

 

https://imgur.com/hugzHE9
 

Nothing opens up waiting in that pocket, that I can see.

 

https://imgur.com/maLD0Ia

 

He leaves the pocket and barely escapes outside the box to unload it out of bounds and avoid a sack or grounding.

 

https://imgur.com/8AaGSif

 

I have the all 22.  (NFL game pass) I had a chance to watch some of it, and this play was in there.

[GoatBeard 673]

5 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

No. Receivers were covered, defenders ready to make a pick. Maybe has the checkdlown at bto the left flat to Mack

 

https://imgur.com/hugzHE9
 

Nothing opens up waiting in that pocket

 

https://imgur.com/maLD0Ia

 

He barely escapes outside the box to unload it out of bounds and avoid a sack or grounding.

 

https://imgur.com/8AaGSif

 

I have the all 22.  (NFL game pass) I had a chance to watch some of it, and this play was in there.

Exactly, people rag on him for not looking downfield more, so on a play he passes up that check down to Mack and winds up throwing it out of bounds. Then they say he missed open receivers. There was nothing wrong with what he tried to do, that side of the field had two one on ones and if he can get out of the pocket he forces those DBs to make some really tough decisions. It just didnt work, but there was nothing wrong with it whatsoever. He might have had a TD if he could've got on the edge.

 

And that's really why I just want him to take that check down every single time it's there. Because that is what eventually will open things up down field for him. That is good QB play to me. Not how far he throws it, or how often he chucks it deep. Take what they give you. 

 

I know I come across as a total dick about this stuff and I dont like that I look that way because I'm not that type of person at all. But damn. 

[FanFromtheWasteland 695]

He is a backup. That is what he was originally signed for. He will never be a franchise QB no matter how much wishfull thinking is put out there. We are a mediocre team with a mediocre QB. This is what we have this year. There is no way this team can lean on him to win a game when push comes to shove. Otherwise we would not need threads like this.

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

1 hour ago, krunk said:

I complained about that literally the entire chiefs game.

 

I saw nothing through the first Q and early Q2.  This was the next down (3rd)

 

https://imgur.com/MZCeE8f

 

He bailed the pocket again, threw it out of bounds again, but allowed Vinny a 32 yard FG to tie the game.

 

Going to watch more tomorrow. Done with it for tonight.

[FanFromtheWasteland 695]

8 minutes ago, FanFromtheWasteland said:

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

7 minutes ago, FanFromtheWasteland said:

He is a backup. That is what he was signed for. He will never be a franchise QB no matter how much wishfull thinking is put out there. We are a mediocre team with a mediocre QB. This is what we have this year. There is no way this team can lean on him to win a game when push comes to shove. Otherwise we would not need threads like this.

 

May be true, but if anyone is going to point out deficiencies, give me the full footage or where to look at it/them myself. I prefer the latter. I do have All 22 coaches video, from 2 angles in HD and can run slo-mo / freeze frame.

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

12 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

Funchess can return to practice next week. He can return either the Miami or jags game. Reich mentioned yesterday on his Q and A with Matt Taylor that he is looking forward to getting him back. Funchess also posted a IG story saying he is on his way back. Sirriani mentioned he has been in all the meetings and has been working out at the facility. He has such a fun personality I am sure he will bring a lot of juice to the team. 

 

If he is ready to go, the earliest he could play is the November 10th home game vs. the Dolphins.

[Chloe6124 5,368]

9 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

If he is ready to go, the earliest he could play is the November 10th home game vs. the Dolphins.

It’s actually the jags game because the bye week don’t count. Andrew walker of the colts clarified that on twitter today.

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

33 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

It’s actually the jags game because the bye week don’t count. Andrew walker of the colts clarified that on twitter today.

 

I don't believe that. I know for fact that in 2012, this was the wording-

 

Only players with a “major injury” who are placed on the IR list...

 

A major injury is described as an injury that renders the player unable to practice or play football for at least six weeks — or 42 calendar days — from the date of injury.

 

That designated player is eligible to return to practice if he has been on the IR list for at least six weeks from the date he was placed on Reserve. He is eligible to return to the active list if has been on the IR list for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.

 

The only change to that since is now up to 2 players can return, and I see no bye week exceptions anywhere, either.  I'd like to see that in NFL rules or operations print.

[stitches 5,905]

4 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

No. Receivers seemed to be covered, defenders ready to make a pick. Maybe has the check down out to the left flat to Mack ( it seemed the corner was where he intended to throw it, but pulled it back in, it wasn't a designed pump fake).

 

https://imgur.com/hugzHE9
 

In the NFL you have to make this pass... this corner route to Pascal is open if only he manages to throw it over the DB. You loft it on the outside and let your receiver have a chance. If I sat down and watched every single game, I can probably find 5-10 very similar throws just last week in the NFL. (look at my edit at the end of the post).I'm not entirely sure about the pump fake because they are both in his reasonable line of sight, but IMO when he pulled it down he wasn't going to throw it to Pascal. He was looking at the crossing route to TY when he pump faked(after he gave up on the Pascal route early). Again - hard to tell in this situation because they are both in that general line of sight. 

 

Quote

 

Nothing opens up waiting in that pocket, that I can see.

 

https://imgur.com/maLD0Ia

 

He leaves the pocket and barely escapes outside the box to unload it out of bounds and avoid a sack or grounding.

 

https://imgur.com/8AaGSif

 

I have the all 22.  (NFL game pass) I had a chance to watch some of it, and this play was in there.

 

He barely escapes because he leaves the pocket. The pocket was about as good as you can imagine it after several seconds of protection and the chance of a sack or grounding probably increased when he left it.  

 

edit: Just watched it again and on a second watch... maybe that throw to Pascal is indeed too risky because the DB is already drifting backwards. He missed a dropping defender in a similar situation later when he threw the pick to Ebron. But still the point about him leaving a clean pocket stands. The more clean pockets he leaves the more throws he will miss. 

[NannyMcafee 1,375]

You guys gotta give Brissett time to develop. His ceiling doesn't need to be incredibly high, but just high enough. He needs to make some longer throws, and I know this not happening has fans on edge, but I was talking to a Bill's fan who has watched Brissett and he told me that he has improved tremendously in accuracy. 

 

He deserves the year and if he finishes how he started I would be fine with him finishing out his contract. Hes got the character. Hes got the work ethic. Give him some time. Brady wasnt Brady in his first starting season. 

 

Like I said. Brissett needs to be just a tiny bit better than he is for this team to not need to worry about the QB position, imo. 

 

This next draft needs to be oline and dline heavy.. Invest more in the lines and take both sides to the next level. 

 

 

[Chloe6124 5,368]

1 hour ago, NannyMcafee said:

You guys gotta give Brissett time to develop. His ceiling doesn't need to be incredibly high, but just high enough. He needs to make some longer throws, and I know this not happening has fans on edge, but I was talking to a Bill's fan who has watched Brissett and he told me that he has improved tremendously in accuracy. 

 

He deserves the year and if he finishes how he started I would be fine with him finishing out his contract. Hes got the character. Hes got the work ethic. Give him some time. Brady wasnt Brady in his first starting season. 

 

Like I said. Brissett needs to be just a tiny bit better than he is for this team to not need to worry about the QB position, imo. 

 

This next draft needs to be oline and dline heavy.. Invest more in the lines and take both sides to the next level. 

 

 

I was listening to a stampede blue podcast today. The guy went on like a 2 min long rant about fans need to give him time. He mentioned everything that has been said by some of us about how he lost his number 2 WR and has two young guys who he barely had snaps with. Campbell had one day of TC. Cain and Campbell took all preseason game. snaps from walker and Kelly. It’s going to take a little time.  I am actually terry impressed with what he has done with basically just TY. Had 1 1/2 games without TY. You wouldn’t put this kind of pressure on a guy we drafted after 20 games. That’s JB starting experience. Give him time. I don’t think it will take long. 

[Chloe6124 5,368]

4 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

I don't believe that. I know for fact that in 2012, this was the wording-

 

Only players with a “major injury” who are placed on the IR list...

 

A major injury is described as an injury that renders the player unable to practice or play football for at least six weeks — or 42 calendar days — from the date of injury.

 

That designated player is eligible to return to practice if he has been on the IR list for at least six weeks from the date he was placed on Reserve. He is eligible to return to the active list if has been on the IR list for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.

 

The only change to that since is now up to 2 players can return, and I see no bye week exceptions anywhere, either.  I'd like to see that in NFL rules or operations print.

Well he works for the colts so we will see. 

[SteelCityColt 7,981]

6 hours ago, GoatBeard said:

Exactly, people rag on him for not looking downfield more, so on a play he passes up that check down to Mack and winds up throwing it out of bounds. Then they say he missed open receivers. There was nothing wrong with what he tried to do, that side of the field had two one on ones and if he can get out of the pocket he forces those DBs to make some really tough decisions. It just didnt work, but there was nothing wrong with it whatsoever. He might have had a TD if he could've got on the edge.

 

And that's really why I just want him to take that check down every single time it's there. Because that is what eventually will open things up down field for him. That is good QB play to me. Not how far he throws it, or how often he chucks it deep. Take what they give you. 

 

I know I come across as a total dick about this stuff and I dont like that I look that way because I'm not that type of person at all. But damn. 

So when @ColtsBlueFL posts his analysis where’s the “your no expert” rant. Is it because it suits your own opinion? 
 

@stitches at least attempted to show why he has that opinion. More than most do on here. 

[SteelCityColt 7,981]

55 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I was listening to a stampede blue podcast today. The guy went on like a 2 min long rant about fans need to give him time. He mentioned everything that has been said by some of us about how he lost his number 2 WR and has two young guys who he barely had snaps with. Campbell had one day of TC. Cain and Campbell took all preseason game. snaps from walker and Kelly. It’s going to take a little time.  I am actually terry impressed with what he has done with basically just TY. Had 1 1/2 games without TY. You wouldn’t put this kind of pressure on a guy we drafted after 20 games. That’s JB starting experience. Give him time. I don’t think it will take long. 

for the love of....

 

Most people aren’t saying don’t give him time, it’s been clearly stated by many on here they are happy to wait and see. 
 

But that doesn’t mean ignoring some aspects of his play so far. Your misrepresentation continues.

[EastStreet 1,905]

3 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

I was listening to a stampede blue podcast today. The guy went on like a 2 min long rant about fans need to give him time. He mentioned everything that has been said by some of us about how he lost his number 2 WR and has two young guys who he barely had snaps with. Campbell had one day of TC. Cain and Campbell took all preseason game. snaps from walker and Kelly. It’s going to take a little time.  I am actually terry impressed with what he has done with basically just TY. Had 1 1/2 games without TY. You wouldn’t put this kind of pressure on a guy we drafted after 20 games. That’s JB starting experience. Give him time. I don’t think it will take long. 

 

JB basically has what Luck had last year, plus more. In training camp, he had everyone but PC and Cain was on a pitch count. In preseason snaps, he had pretty much the same WRs and TEs that Luck had last year (except for Inman) in Rogers, Pascal, TY, Ebron, MAC, and also got Doyle back. Rogers was basically Luck's most consistent #2 last year... 

 

Sure he needs time to develop chemistry with Cain and PC, but he's had plenty of time with the other guys. Like I've said several times, JB's issues is getting beyond the 1st and second read. Based on what we've seen, the majority of fist and second reads have been TY plus Doyle/Ebron. 

 

And I'm happy giving him time. I do want to see sustained and consistent improvement over the next 4 games though. That's a total of 9 games and 10 weeks of practice to get "up to speed".

[Nickster 232]

9 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

No. Receivers seemed to be covered, defenders ready to make a pick. Maybe has the check down out to the left flat to Mack ( it seemed the corner was where he intended to throw it, but pulled it back in, it wasn't a designed pump fake).

 

https://imgur.com/hugzHE9
 

Nothing opens up waiting in that pocket, that I can see.

 

https://imgur.com/maLD0Ia

 

He leaves the pocket and barely escapes outside the box to unload it out of bounds and avoid a sack or grounding.

 

https://imgur.com/8AaGSif

 

I have the all 22.  (NFL game pass) I had a chance to watch some of it, and this play was in there.

All three of those guys on the left are open.  At the least dump it to Mack.  Pascal is open if he Makes a good throw to he boundary.  It’s safe too.  The flat guy ain’t making up 6 yds on a throw to the corner. That play worked as designed for the receivers.

 

Secondly,  There is no way that LB is going to make a play on a well thrown crosser to TY.

 

Check to Mack then if you don’t want to throw it.  He has a chance to score with just a flip out to him.p and a block or two.

 

i can’t see what you see in those pics.  Full on panic job by JB.  Poor vision. Inadequate in the long run.

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

7 hours ago, stitches said:

In the NFL you have to make this pass... this corner route to Pascal is open if only he manages to throw it over the DB. You loft it on the outside and let your receiver have a chance. If I sat down and watched every single game, I can probably find 5-10 very similar throws just last week in the NFL. (look at my edit at the end of the post).I'm not entirely sure about the pump fake because they are both in his reasonable line of sight, but IMO when he pulled it down he wasn't going to throw it to Pascal. He was looking at the crossing route to TY when he pump faked(after he gave up on the Pascal route early). Again - hard to tell in this situation because they are both in that general line of sight. 

 

That was my thoughts.  If he was looking to Pascal first (and I'm sure he was), they had high / low bracket coverage, with low guy moving to Pascal but ready to reverse and cover Mack in the flat if he checks down. Big Q has his guy locked up right in the throwing lane to T.Y. but in position to bat down a pass. JB7 pulls it back here. He looks right (that extra 1/2 second) and both receivers are locked up (and actually one falling down in the end zone).

 

https://imgur.com/AYob5ov

 

Then decides to escape.

 

Quote

He barely escapes because he leaves the pocket. The pocket was about as good as you can imagine it after several seconds of protection and the chance of a sack or grounding probably increased when he left it.

 

I think he waited a 1/2 second too long to leave.  He would have caused major issues to the defender covering the under receiver had JB7 escaped first and looked at the his options down field second.  Ryan Kelly just couldn't keep Chris Jones engaged long enough and thus he was on JB7 quickly forcing the throwaway once JB7 escaped the tackle box.

 

https://imgur.com/eXTWsJG

 

Maybe Glow was also inhibiting JB7's escape route too.

 

https://imgur.com/5Zk7Ttw

 

Quote

edit: Just watched it again and on a second watch... maybe that throw to Pascal is indeed too risky because the DB is already drifting backwards. He missed a dropping defender in a similar situation later when he threw the pick to Ebron. But still the point about him leaving a clean pocket stands. The more clean pockets he leaves the more throws he will miss. 

 

That was my feeling. I'd rather try again on 3rd down, or end up with 3 points (the end result), rather than turn over the ball and momentum by forcing it to Pascal there and getting a pick.  I'm not debating other times or other items he has to improve (but I'd like to see them on video before I join the criticism), just saw this one differently is all.

 

I think Reich has to devise and disguise the plays downfield better. And the young WR guys have to learn the plays and improve running the route tree.

[GoatBeard 673]

3 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

So when @ColtsBlueFL posts his analysis where’s the “your no expert” rant. Is it because it suits your own opinion? 
 

@stitches at least attempted to show why he has that opinion. More than most do on here. 

Or maybe it's because he didnt claim Brissett "panicked" or act like he knows how good his vision is, and he isnt commenting on his read progressions.....you know things he couldnt possibly know anything about and dont show up on the film anyways.

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

12 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

Or maybe it's because he didnt claim Brissett "panicked" or act like he knows how good his vision is, and he isnt commenting on his read progressions.....you know things he couldnt possibly know anything about and dont show up on the film anyways.

 

 

 

Maybe at first, but in the spirit of cordial dialog/rebuttal here, we both do expand on our opinions and maybe even come closer to the center in so doing.

[SteelCityColt 7,981]

20 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Maybe at first, but in the spirit of cordial dialog/rebuttal here, we both do expand on our opinions and maybe even come closer to the center in so doing.

Thank you for expressing this in much finer words than me. I’m grumpier than usual with posters.
 

It’s interesting seeing how different people interpret the same images/gif/film. At least you have a common starting point about which to form your opinion rather then anecdotal (often wrong) assertions. 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

2 hours ago, Nickster said:

All three of those guys on the left are open.  

 

I don't agree!

 

https://imgur.com/EmlPtbu

 

JB in throwing motion, arrows indicate movement.

 

Quote

At the least dump it to Mack.  

 

That's the play, but only gets back to original line of scrimmage, unless Mack makes the defender coming up miss.  And he might have.

 

Quote

Pascal is open if he Makes a good throw to he boundary.  It’s safe too.  The flat guy ain’t making up 6 yds on a throw to the corner. That play worked as designed for the receivers.

 

The defender was moving back well as underneath blanket, but slowed up once JB7 looked off Pascal and toward T.Y.   Which is understandable because he either has to help tackle T.Y. , or tackle Mack at that point.

 

I'd like to be in the meeting room when coaches went over these with players.

 

Quote

Secondly,  There is no way that LB is going to make a play on a well thrown crosser to TY.

 

Correct, but the D lineman is in the pass lane. He can bat the ball up for grabs.  If T.Y. catches it, he's tackled just beyond the original LOS for a gain of 2. (it was 2nd and 12 from the 14, so true gain of 4)

 

https://imgur.com/RC0pGqi

 

Quote

Check to Mack then if you don’t want to throw it.  He has a chance to score with just a flip out to him.p and a block or two.

 

I agree.  Pascal, no. T.Y., dangerous maybe.

 

Quote

i can’t see what you see in those pics.  Full on panic job by JB.  Poor vision. Inadequate in the long run.

 

I illustrated what I see for you.  I can run the video in real time, and slo-mo.  My thoughts are based on more than just these freeze frames.  I feel you're grasping at straws.

[EastStreet 1,905]

@ColtsBlueFL and @SteelCityColt

 

Three questions for both of you. Not looking really for debate, just your thoughts.

 

1. What do you believe JB's biggest weakness is, and how do you improve it. Is it progressions, touch, vision, etc..

 

2. While JB's downfield attempts have been few (this year and in 2017), he did have a pretty darn good success rate in 2017. Do you think his lack of attempts downfield this year are more due to Reich's play calling, or JB's inability to get beyond the second read and/or let the play develop.

 

3. What changes would you make to the O right now (play calling or existing personnel) if you could. 

[GoatBeard 673]

1 hour ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Maybe at first, but in the spirit of cordial dialog/rebuttal here, we both do expand on our opinions and maybe even come closer to the center in so doing.

I dont really agree with that. 

 

If you're objective is to learn more about Jacoby Brissett, the best thing you can do is go watch as much film as you can on every single QB in the league, and create perspective. Not debate with another fan of a differing opinion and use film to justify your opinion. That's not conducive to learning, IMO.

 

We are gonna sit at home and find out if Jacoby is good enough by watching the games, just like we would have without all of that. That is how we will learn. And all that's gonna matter is whether or not the Colts win. There is no moving closer to the center because the center is the game on Sunday, and it comes on it's own time. All we are is the background noise. The only thing that will change minds is Jacoby Brissetts performance over an extended period of time, and that goes for both sides of the debate.

 

I'm all for cordial conversation, but I'm also for proper perspective. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

19 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

There is no moving closer to the center because the center is the game on Sunday, and it comes on it's own time.

 

This only refers to the distance between our opinions during the course of dialog on that play, nothing more.

 

Long ago, a Latin teacher taught me-

 

Tempus narrat veritas

[SteelCityColt 7,981]

9 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

This only refers to the distance between our opinions during the course of dialog on that play, nothing more.

 

Long ago, a Latin teacher taught me-

 

Tempus narrat veritas

 

As we're talking Classics... I think this pearl is very relative to the modern world:

 

"Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something."

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

25 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

@ColtsBlueFL and @SteelCityColt

 

Three questions for both of you. Not looking really for debate, just your thoughts.

 

1. What do you believe JB's biggest weakness is, and how do you improve it. Is it progressions, touch, vision, etc..

 

2. While JB's downfield attempts have been few (this year and in 2017), he did have a pretty darn good success rate in 2017. Do you think his lack of attempts downfield this year are more due to Reich's play calling, or JB's inability to get beyond the second read and/or let the play develop.

 

3. What changes would you make to the O right now (play calling or existing personnel) if you could. 

 

I'm not qualified to answer that from my firsthand knowledge.  I do not have Sunday ticket (which isn't All 22 anyway), and game pass only allows review 'after' the game has completed. I've not watched a single one.  I just started with this Chiefs game, and only got through one half of Q2, so far.

 

Maybe I'll get a chance to watch a lot more of the previous games and form my perspective.  For now I go by those I deem credible via past experiences. But if specifics are given ( game, quarter, time, on a play)  I may look it up and try to see if I agree.

[stitches 5,905]

1 hour ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

 

 

I think he waited a 1/2 second too long to leave.  He would have caused major issues to the defender covering the under receiver had JB7 escaped first and looked at the his options down field second.  Ryan Kelly just couldn't keep Chris Jones engaged long enough and thus he was on JB7 quickly forcing the throwaway once JB7 escaped the tackle box.

 

https://imgur.com/eXTWsJG

 

This is the thing I disagree about. This is result-oriented rationalization. He didn't wait for half a second too long. The whole point of pass protection is to allow the QB to go through his progressions and have good platform to throw from. Once he leaves he has no protection and he has no good platform to throw off of. This is why off-platform and off-script throws are so impressive and why most of the premier QBs are able to make plays off-script and off-platform. In singular situations you can find instances when the guy would be better off leaving too early rather than waiting until the pocket breaks once you look at the result of the play, but in huge majority of cases and without knowing the end result, it's better for the QB to stay in the pocket and prolong the play and allow his receivers to get open, simply because the off-script plays are much harder to pull off. The base of Brissett's game should be his pocket throwing game and IMO leaving the pocket too early leaves throws on the field for him, especially having in mind that he hasn't shown ability to consistently make plays off-script. 

 

Quote

 

Maybe Glow is also inhibiting JB7's escape route too.

 

https://imgur.com/5Zk7Ttw

 

 

That was my feeling. I'd rather try again on 3rd down, or end up with 3 points (the end result), rather than turn over the ball and momentum by forcing it to Pascal there and getting a pick.  I'm not debating other times or other items he has to improve (but I'd like to see them on video before I join the criticism), just saw this one differently is all.

 

I think Reich has to devise and disguise the plays downfield better. And the young WR guys have to learn the plays and improve running the route tree.

 

 

I can agree with most of this. Brissett's receivers are young and inexperienced right now and they are not doing him any favors with their ball-catching(I was reading some stat where he was top 5 QB with most dropped balls by pass-catchers). I still contend that even with all those issues we should still be able to isolate his play away from his receivers play and his playcallers playcalls and evaluate the quality of his decisions and throws on its own merits.

[aaron11 2,315]

48 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

@ColtsBlueFL and @SteelCityColt

 

Three questions for both of you. Not looking really for debate, just your thoughts.

 

1. What do you believe JB's biggest weakness is, and how do you improve it. Is it progressions, touch, vision, etc..

 

2. While JB's downfield attempts have been few (this year and in 2017), he did have a pretty darn good success rate in 2017. Do you think his lack of attempts downfield this year are more due to Reich's play calling, or JB's inability to get beyond the second read and/or let the play develop.

 

3. What changes would you make to the O right now (play calling or existing personnel) if you could. 

 

2017 was still the old coaching staff, and they threw it down the field more.  i dont remember if Chud himself was still the OC but he ran air coryell  

[GoatBeard 673]

24 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

This only refers to the distance between our opinions during the course of dialog on that play, nothing more.

 

Long ago, a Latin teacher taught me-

 

Tempus narrat veritas

 

I guess I just have a different objective. I dont want other peoples opinions bleeding into my own, especially anonymous people on the internet.

 

To each his own.

[stitches 5,905]

4 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

 

2017 was still the old coaching staff, and they threw it down the field more.  i dont remember if Chud himself was still the OC but he ran air coryell  

You are correct. Previous coaching staff ran Air Coryell that relied on a ton of deep field plays(usually, Brissett actually didn't throw that much downfield despite the system). I'm not sure it's very fair to draw too many conclusions from that season though, since Brissett was thrown into that thing with very little preparation and with horrible OLine and coaching staff. Some trends are worth noting, though. For example, not many big time throws, not many turnover worthy plays either... this is something that continues as a trend even this season with Reich as a coach and playcaller and with a pretty good OLine. I'm not quite ready to chalk it up as "it's just who Brissett is" but I'm almost getting there. Still want to see how he develops his game until the end of the season. It's possible he's just a conservative thrower who takes care of the ball to the extreme, but also doesn't take risks with aggressive throws. 

[NannyMcafee 1,375]

7 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

I was listening to a stampede blue podcast today. The guy went on like a 2 min long rant about fans need to give him time. He mentioned everything that has been said by some of us about how he lost his number 2 WR and has two young guys who he barely had snaps with. Campbell had one day of TC. Cain and Campbell took all preseason game. snaps from walker and Kelly. It’s going to take a little time.  I am actually terry impressed with what he has done with basically just TY. Had 1 1/2 games without TY. You wouldn’t put this kind of pressure on a guy we drafted after 20 games. That’s JB starting experience. Give him time. I don’t think it will take long. 

 

JB has made a few mistakes and the colts are doing the right thing letting the run game been the focal point of this offense this season. The guy is working on his craft and has already improved. 

[ColtsBlueFL 5,904]

48 minutes ago, stitches said:

This is the thing I disagree about. This is result-oriented rationalization. He didn't wait for half a second too long. The whole point of pass protection is to allow the QB to go through his progressions and have good platform to throw from.

 

OK, you're the QB.  You have moved off Pascal, pulled it back from T.Y. , ignored the checkdown to Mack.  You're in a clean pocket and this is what you see as you continue to go through the progressions-

 

https://imgur.com/tqrxRkp

 

Where are you going with the ball? 

 

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Once he leaves he has no protection and he has no good platform to throw off of. This is why off-platform and off-script throws are so impressive and why most of the premier QBs are able to make plays off-script and off-platform.

 

The play broke down, it was defended. Like most QB's, time to make a play with his feet.  I feel he wanted to sprint to the sideline and buy time for a receiver to get open. But Glowinski was in his way making him take a path closer to Chris Jones (who quickly disengaged from Kelly to pursue).

 

Quote

In singular situations you can find instances when the guy would be better off leaving too early rather than waiting until the pocket breaks once you look at the result of the play, but in huge majority of cases and without knowing the end result, it's better for the QB to stay in the pocket and prolong the play and allow his receivers to get open, simply because the off-script plays are much harder to pull off.

 

 

Castonzo  lost his man shortly after JB7 tucked and started to bail.  I don't think it would be long enough for these receivers to break away from their defenders- T.Y., Cain, or especially Ebron, on his butt in the end zone.  Kelly wasn't in great position on Jones, as witnessed how fast he got to JB once he broke out.

 

Quote

The base of Brissett's game should be his pocket throwing game and IMO leaving the pocket too early leaves throws on the field for him, especially having in mind that he hasn't shown ability to consistently make plays off-script. 

 

Strip sack from the blind side would have been bad. Besides, nobody got open, even with more time!!

 

https://imgur.com/XCETn05

 

This was as JB7 threw it out of bounds.

 

Quote

 

I can agree with most of this. Brissett's receivers are young and inexperienced right now and they are not doing him any favors with their ball-catching(I was reading some stat where he was top 5 QB with most dropped balls by pass-catchers). I still contend that even with all those issues we should still be able to isolate his play away from his receivers play and his playcallers playcalls and evaluate the quality of his decisions and throws on its own merits.

 

If I was talented enough to be in his shoes, I would have taken the safety valve to Mack and let him try to make a play.  But I feel JB7 is every bit as talented as Big Ben to extend a play moving out of the pocket when necessary. So we don't see it the same.  The WR are blanketed. I'm not sitting there forever in that case hoping a defender eventually falls down, instead of one of your targets.

 

I've made my case.  (I think the check down to Mack). I'm moving on.