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Imgrandojji

Week 5 impressions: Brissett

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10 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Aspirations yes, expectations however are something different.

 

The team around Jacoby is very talented and well constructed but still really young.  This is a setup year to me.  If we compete this year that's great, but this season isn't an all-or-nothing situation. 

 

I want to make the playoffs because this team would gain a lot from even a bit of playoff experience, but I think we're still a bit too young for Superbowl or bust. 

Well i'ts never an all or nothing situation.  I wasn't suggesting it was.  Make the playoffs and anything can happen.  

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Let it rest, folks. 

 

JB is the QB.  He's playing well AND within himself.

 

He can, and will, get better.  Ceiling?  No one knows.

 

Let it rest.  For now.

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23 hours ago, Imgrandojji said:

I wish youth was an automatic ticket to improvement, but I do expect enough young players to make enough improvements that Ballard will be able to take what we are at the end of the year and build a better team with it than we are right now.

 

The fact that the team we are right now could go toe to toe with a Superbowl contender, rough them up one side and down the other and win a football game in their building, BEFORE that improvement has really happened... should  be a reason for anyone to be optimistic.

 

Exactly, it's not like youth automatically means a guy is gonna get better. This isn't Madden where guys stats just increase exponentially every year. Guys that are talented get better, and have high ceilings. There are variables at play. Brissett has been a QB in the league for years, and has been in this system for years. I'm not gonna say he's at his ceiling, because I don't believe that's true, but he's probably getting close. I'd say he's at 75-80% of what he's gonna be. He's never gonna be a Top 5-10 QB in the NFL imo. I feel like they have to go get their guy in a draft --in 2020-- that lends itself to strong QB play. They, in all likelihood, aren't gonna land Tua, without selling the farm; but guys like Herbert, Burrow, Hurts, and Fromm are all easily attainable. And if you don't think the Colts are thinking QB, guess again, cuz they've been sending lead scouts to see the top quarterbacks play for weeks now. Recently, they had guys at the LSU/Utah St. game to see Love/Burrow. I'd say there's a really good shot that Ballard grabs a top-tier guy in the 2020 draft. 

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6 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

No he doesn't. The "stats" don't create any trends that point to that being consistently true. Again there are just as many guys with pedestrian college stats that have performed very well at the pro level as there are guys who blew it out of the water in college that never could make it as a pro.. 

Yes they do.  His college stats were not huge with yardage.   They are not huge  with yardage in the NFL either.  That is a trend.   He took care of the ball very well in college as well as the NFL.  That is also a trend.   

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10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

The best chance for this team to win a Sb is for JB to improve and be the guy for the the next 5-8 years. If we have to go with a rookie QB this franchise will be set back another 3 to 5 years. Before we know it Nelson and Leonard will be 30 and we won’t have anything to show for. That’s why we are rooting for him. The way we are playing right now is also going to help keep the defense fresh.

where did you buy your crystal ball at? since you seem to be able to tell the future.

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5 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

where did you buy your crystal ball at? since you seem to be able to tell the future.

Mind your manners.

 

It's not an unreasonable speculation.  Brisset skeptics seem to be behaving as if there's a Magic Super Fix Everything Rookie out there just waiting to be drafted if only we give up on Brissett.  That's really, really not how the draft works.  Most likely anyone we draft will have their own flaws and will not know how to do many things Brissett has already learned to do the hard way

 

If you dispense with Brissett in favor of a drafted rookie you're effectively trading predictability for unpredictability in the hopes that the uncertainty works in your favor.  It can work, but it's usually not wise and always sets the team back at least a little until the new guy settles in

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12 minutes ago, Myles said:

Yes they do.  His college stats were not huge with yardage.   They are not huge  with yardage in the NFL either.  That is a trend.   He took care of the ball very well in college as well as the NFL.  That is also a trend.   

 

Wow way to deflect and go the simpleton route because you know what I was referring to, and with the QB's (which there are tons more) I named, because they completely go against this^^^ 

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13 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Mind your manners.

 

It's not an unreasonable speculation.  Brisset skeptics seem to be behaving as if there's a Magic Super Fix Everything Rookie out there just waiting to be drafted if only we give up on Brissett.  That's really, really not how the draft works.  Most likely anyone we draft will have their own flaws and will not know how to do many things Brissett has already learned to do the hard way

 

If you dispense with Brissett in favor of a drafted rookie you're effectively trading predictability for unpredictability in the hopes that the uncertainty works in your favor.  It can work, but it's usually not wise and always sets the team back at least a little until the new guy settles in

You are making it sound like the extremes are the only option.  You build through the draft, and if the new guy beats out the old guy, whether in his rookie year or in year 3, you start him, otherwise, Jacoby is still there to run things. 

 

There are other options than going all in on only Jacoby or on a rookie/free agent, which no one has even discussed yet.  I mean, what if things go sour in GB and all the sudden, Aaron Rodgers hits the market?  Can anyone make the argument that we'd rather have Brissett?  Because that would be insane.

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8 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Mind your manners.

 

It's not an unreasonable speculation.  Brisset skeptics seem to be behaving as if there's a Magic Super Fix Everything Rookie out there just waiting to be drafted if only we give up on Brissett.  That's really, really not how the draft works.  Most likely anyone we draft will have their own flaws and will not know how to do many things Brissett has already learned to do the hard way

 

If you dispense with Brissett in favor of a drafted rookie you're effectively trading predictability for unpredictability in the hopes that the uncertainty works in your favor.  It can work, but it's usually not wise and always sets the team back at least a little until the new guy settles in

The way JB handled himself in arrowhead was so impressive. No false starts making sure everyone knew the snap count and the play was very good. No rookie is going to come in and do that right away. You also have to think about a locker room if you sit a drafted guy for a year and how the team plays when there is a lame duck QB. The players love him and his leadership skills are very good. If you seen his post game locker room speech to the players is what is impressive. I think Reich will have him playing better by the end of the season. We need him to be the guy if we want a SB the next two or three years. 

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1 minute ago, OffensivelyPC said:

You are making it sound like the extremes are the only option.  You build through the draft, and if the new guy beats out the old guy, whether in his rookie year or in year 3, you start him, otherwise, Jacoby is still there to run things.  There are other options than going all in on only Jacoby or on a rookie/free agent, which no one has even discussed yet.  I mean, what if things go sour in GB and all the sudden, Aaron Rodgers hits the market?  Can anyone make the argument that we'd rather have Brissett?  Because that would be insane.

At Rogers age no you would not bring him in. Now foles in Jax might be a guy you could think about with the way minshew is playing.

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18 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Mind your manners.

 

It's not an unreasonable speculation.  Brisset skeptics seem to be behaving as if there's a Magic Super Fix Everything Rookie out there just waiting to be drafted if only we give up on Brissett.  That's really, really not how the draft works.  Most likely anyone we draft will have their own flaws and will not know how to do many things Brissett has already learned to do the hard way

 

If you dispense with Brissett in favor of a drafted rookie you're effectively trading predictability for unpredictability in the hopes that the uncertainty works in your favor.  It can work, but it's usually not wise and always sets the team back at least a little until the new guy settles in

dear god you two try way to hard to go out of your way to make up these excuses.

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The colts have a huge opportunity to be 4–0 the second quarter of the season if we can beat the Texans. Imagine beating the Texans and winning the next 3 games and being 7-2 after nine games.  That might even put us in the running for a bye week.  This team is actually set up better to beat a team like Jax then we were last year. 

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Just now, Chloe6124 said:

At Rogers age no you would not bring him in. Now foles in Jax might be a guy you could think about with the way minshew is playing.

He's still got 2 years remaining so I don't see it happening as we should either know what Jacoby is  or have begun trying to improve the QB position by that point in time.  

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35 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

Let it rest, folks. 

 

JB is the QB.  He's playing well AND within himself.

 

He can, and will, get better.  Ceiling?  No one knows.

 

Let it rest.  For now.

Naah.  I'd rather continue to talk ball.  That is why I chat about ball.  

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35 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

Let it rest, folks. 

 

JB is the QB.  He's playing well AND within himself.

 

He can, and will, get better.  Ceiling?  No one knows.

 

Let it rest.  For now.

 

:agree:

We just beat KC on the road.

No one saw that coming. 

 

Who knows what the future holds, but I'm optimistic!  Go Colts! :1colts:

 

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1 minute ago, OffensivelyPC said:

He's still got 2 years remaining so I don't see it happening as we should either know what Jacoby is  or have begun trying to improve the QB position by that point in time.  

It’s possible the jags could trade foles. You could probably get him for a pretty good draft pick also. I am riding the JB train until this team fails and shows me they can’t win. I am actually loving watching team football. This is how you win in Jan.

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28 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Wow way to deflect and go the simpleton route because you know what I was referring to, and with the QB's (which there are tons more) I named, because they completely go against this^^^ 

Nope.   Once again, you are wrong.   That is also becoming a trend.

 

Brissett could end up being a different QB than what we have seen.   However, all we have to go off of is his college stats and his NFL stats.  They all tell us he is a good leader who takes care of the football but will rarely throw for high yardage.   He is capable of throwing for 300+ yards, but it isn't going to happen much.   Perhaps Reich know his limitations.  

 

I can live with that.  With the current Colts team, that could work fine.    

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10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

It’s possible the jags could trade foles. You could probably get him for a pretty good draft pick also. I am riding the JB train until this team fails and shows me they can’t win. I am actually loving watching team football. This is how you win in Jan.

Sorry, I can see how I was unclear.  I was talking about Rodgers.  I can't figure  Foles out.  One day he's an elite QB, the next he's backup caliber.

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Ok here goes...

JB (friends call him that)

Can be slow on reads. And Reich doesn't know this? So expect the dink and dunks with the occasional long ball (to stretch the defense). Reich's (Please don't EVER suggest the offense's nick name should be called "The 3rd Reich") philosophy is MOVE THE CHAINS. And this is exactly what you're going to get (at this time) with JB.

So, yes! He is Reich's man to execute Reich's game plan week in week out and lm ok with that.

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With the way this team is set up all we really need is a deep pass or two a game. That’s it. Cain drew another PI Sunday.  Why do we care about 50 and 60 yard bombs. If your getting 6 or seven yards a play and running the ball your in the red zone quick. He hit a few ten yard passes Sunday. That gives you a first down and that’s all you need to get into scoring position. 

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we should just have a season long Jacoby thread, most of this isnt even about the last game

 

25 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

It’s possible the jags could trade foles. You could probably get him for a pretty good draft pick also. 

 

i doubt they would trade him here, at least not for a reasonable price.  

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3 hours ago, Rebel said:

His college stats weren't very good either.

 

Let's visit this.  JB7 was actually fortunate (after Charlie Weis left there) to get beat out for QB1at the University of Florida by (Maxwell Football Club National High School Player of the Year and the Gatorade Florida Player of the Year) Jeff Driskel.  Jeff had mediocre career as a Gator, and had to go to Louisiana Tech in Conference USA to even get looked at in the draft.  In fact, there are a plethora of Gator QB's that have underachieved in the NFL- Steve Spurrier, Rex Grossman, Tim Tebow, Danny Wuerfel, Chris Leak, etc...

 

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/jeff-driskel-1.html

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/jacoby-brissett-2.html

 

Now Driskel is QB3 with Lions, Brissett QB1 with Colts.

 

2 hours ago, Myles said:

Yes they do.  His college stats were not huge with yardage.   They are not huge  with yardage in the NFL either.  That is a trend.   He took care of the ball very well in college as well as the NFL.  That is also a trend.   

 

But there are plenty of guys with great college stats that could not achieve the same in the NFL. Here's a short sampling over the last decade or two-

Gino Toretta

Andre Ware
Graham Harrell
Johnny Manzeil
Kellen Moore
Colt Brennan
Colt McCoy
Matt Barkley
Major Harris

 

And those that hardly ever even started a college game get drafted and even had some success in the NFL:

 

Brad Johnson (many good seasons and Super Bowl winner)  (9th round, 227 overall))

Matt Cassel.  (7th round, 230 overall)

 

College stats alone say neither should have ever been drafted.

 

Interesting case for Cassel. Cassel had a 10-5 record for the Patriots in 2008, with Josh McDaniels as OC using his version of the Erhardt-Perkins system Charlie Weis installed back in the early 2000's for Brady.

In KC the next year 2009 was difficult, but in 2010 Charlie Weis was named as Chiefs OC and Cassel had another 10-5 record, with Weis' Erhardt-Perkins system and play calling. Weis left the next year and Cassel fell once more.

 

I think these stats say more for scouts recognizing skills that transfer to the NFL and coaches that can scheme and coach the most out of a guy.

 

JB7 will develop as he is coached and can execute.  Nobody knows how much that will be. Stats may prove right, or... misleading.  There are cases for every scenario, if one wants to search.

 

I know he has perfoormed well enough to have this team at a 4 - 1 record, and are currently 3 - 2.  I'm hoping for more W's, whether by air, or ground.

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5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

With the way this team is set up all we really need is a deep pass or two a game. That’s it. Cain drew another PI Sunday.  Why do we care about 50 and 60 yard bombs. If your getting 6 or seven yards a play and running the ball your in the red zone quick. He hit a few ten yard passes Sunday. That gives you a first down and that’s all you need to get into scoring position. 

Because you don't want teams thinking that you can't threaten them deep with your passing game.  We've only needed a pass or two a game because the run has been working.  When it's not working then you get the Raiders game where a team is sitting on your short throws and stuffing your run game. Or you get what we got years ago when Hasslebeck was here and teams figured out he couldn't hurt them deep.  People should be concerned that we are not getting many chunks.  I said concerned(not panicked) because I think the time is inching closer where we'll start getting solid contributions from Cain and Campbell.  I think by the end of November we should be approaching full swing with the return of Funchess.  Also whenever Ebron decides to get his head out of his behind.

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29 minutes ago, Myles said:

Nope.   Once again, you are wrong.   That is also becoming a trend.

 

Brissett could end up being a different QB than what we have seen.   However, all we have to go off of is his college stats and his NFL stats.  They all tell us he is a good leader who takes care of the football but will rarely throw for high yardage.   He is capable of throwing for 300+ yards, but it isn't going to happen much.   Perhaps Reich know his limitations.  

 

I can live with that.  With the current Colts team, that could work fine.    

 

I remember Reich wanting a top 5 rusing offense, even with Luck as QB1-

 

https://fox59.com/2019/05/28/frank-reichs-objective-take-a-good-colts-run-game-and-make-it-great-or-at-least-top-5/

 

“We have to run the football,’’ Reich said. “Our goal is going to be a top-5 rushing football team.’’

 

His aim isn’t to disarm Andrew Luck and hike the offense onto the collective shoulders (legs?) of Marlon Mack, Nyheim Hines, Jordan Wilkins, Spencer Ware and Jonathan Williams.

It’s to maximize Luck’s efficiency and even increase his productivity with a more consistent and proficient ground game.

 

“I mean, I know everybody is going to talk about Andrew and the pass game, and we are going to throw it and hopefully throw a lot of touchdowns,’’ Reich said. “But really what is going to set the tone for us is going to be how we run the football."

 

“That is not going to change. We have to run the football.’’

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:scratch:. We are coming off of a good Win.  I was pretty excited about it, and still am.

 

Yet....... arguments abound. :dunno:

 

Can't y'all be happy for a short bit?   

 

 

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32 minutes ago, Myles said:

Nope.   Once again, you are wrong.   That is also becoming a trend.

 

Brissett could end up being a different QB than what we have seen.   However, all we have to go off of is his college stats and his NFL stats.  They all tell us he is a good leader who takes care of the football but will rarely throw for high yardage.   He is capable of throwing for 300+ yards, but it isn't going to happen much.   Perhaps Reich know his limitations.  

 

I can live with that.  With the current Colts team, that could work fine.    

Yards per game mean nothing. You can lose a game throwing for 400 yards just as easy as you can win a game throwing for 150. I will say Reich did say in a phone conference he thinks a perfect game is to have balance and a QB to throw around 250 yards. I am sure they will work towards that.

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1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yards per game mean nothing. You can lose a game throwing for 400 yards just as easy as you can win a game throwing for 150. I will say Reich did say in a phone conference he thinks a perfect game is to have balance and a QB to throw around 250 yards. I am sure they will work towards that.

He probably has in mind clock control where we spend most our time grinding the defense down with the run game.  I can't say I disagree with that approach.  You know that Irsay agrees with it given some of the remarks he's made inthe past about throwing for a billion yards and losing in the playoffs.

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9 minutes ago, krunk said:

Because you don't want teams thinking that you can't threaten them deep with your passing game.  We've only needed a pass or two a game because the run has been working.  When it's not working then you get the Raiders game where a team is sitting on your short throws and stuffing your run game. Or you get what we got years ago when Hasslebeck was here and teams figured out he couldn't hurt them deep.  People should be concerned that we are not getting many chunks.  I said concerned(not panicked) because I think the time is inching closer where we'll start getting solid contributions from Cain and Campbell.  I think by the end of November we should be approaching full swing with the return of Funchess.  Also whenever Ebron decides to get his head out of his behind.

The raiders game and not being able to run had a lot to do with dropped passes and missing TY. What if those passes weren’t dropped. They wouldn’t of been able to stack the box. Same if TY was in the game because they would of tried to double team him.

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3 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

He probably has in mind clock control where we spend most our time grinding the defense down with the run game.  I can't say I disagree with that approach.  You know that Irsay agrees with it given some of the remarks he's made inthe past about throwing for a billion yards and losing in the playoffs.

If KC doesn’t improve their defense and run game even with that offense they will have a hard time making a SB. Some team will figure out how to shut them down. It’s fun to watch in the regular season but doesn’t win you many playoff games. 

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46 minutes ago, Myles said:

Nope.   Once again, you are wrong.   That is also becoming a trend.

 

Brissett could end up being a different QB than what we have seen.   However, all we have to go off of is his college stats and his NFL stats.  They all tell us he is a good leader who takes care of the football but will rarely throw for high yardage.   He is capable of throwing for 300+ yards, but it isn't going to happen much.   Perhaps Reich know his limitations.  

 

I can live with that.  With the current Colts team, that could work fine.    

 

Those QB's/stats I handed you, to which you still don't seem to comprehend the point of, weren't "made up" by me, so I'm not sure where I'm wrong. It's historical data that you can look up for yourself, but you keep wanting to throw absolutes around as if because a guy performed a certain way in college that's how he'll be in the NFL, which is completely FALSE. 

 

"Brissett could end up being a different QB than what we have seen."

 

You even contradict yourself in your own post. haha 

 

Is he going to be what he was in college or not? You're speaking out of both side of your mouth.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yards per game mean nothing. You can lose a game throwing for 400 yards just as easy as you can win a game throwing for 150. I will say Reich did say in a phone conference he thinks a perfect game is to have balance and a QB to throw around 250 yards. I am sure they will work towards that.

 

I agree that yds per game is pretty much irrelevant.  Put yds per attempt is usually pretty relevant.

 

KC is probably the bottom 2 or 3 possibly the worst D in football.  

 

Running game was awesome.  O line looked like the an 82 high school state champion.  That will not play often in the NFL.  Certainly won't against the Texans and down the line.  

 

Must have the threat in the passing game.  I can' t imagine that the team will continue to have success without figuring a way to get the ball over the LBs and under the Secondary.  So far we haven't done that.

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7 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

If KC doesn’t improve their defense and run game even with that offense they will have a hard time making a SB. Some team will figure out how to shut them down. It’s fun to watch in the regular season but doesn’t win you many playoff games. 

 

Agree about the D.  That D is bad.  It's just that there really aren't any really good teams this year.  NE might win by default.  They are vulnerable too.

 

However, Hill and Watkins' return will open up everything for them.  They make it pert near impossible to keep a lid on the D with their weapons full force.  

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I feel like these "Impressions" threads need a reminder/sticky for each one...

I've seen the word "whining" and phrases like "can't we just be happy with a win?" countless times in these threads. It's completely possible to be happy with a win and still point out where JB struggled (and obviously there were positives too). And I don't see much of what I'd consider whining in this thread, not in the least.

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18 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Yards per game mean nothing. You can lose a game throwing for 400 yards just as easy as you can win a game throwing for 150. I will say Reich did say in a phone conference he thinks a perfect game is to have balance and a QB to throw around 250 yards. I am sure they will work towards that.

adding the WR/RB/TE have to make plays I think its great to start throwing passes to Marlin so that it doesnt look so predictable when he's in the game. They went zero blitz several times JB had a good game was he great now. But why are we expecting great QB play from him so quickly. He's got the tools give him time. If you draft someone they will have to have some time in the system before they start to be good. why are these threads coming up every week now it makes no sense just lump them all into one thread. Give JB a break look at how Mayfield is looking out there.

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I think we could beat KC again even with Hill and Watkins if we had our full compliment of receivers back and healthy. I think by that time Cain and Campbell would have a different level of experience.  Add Funchess, Ebron and TY to that mix along with Rogers and Pascal and I really believe we could pull it off.  Who knows?  We might even get to play that game in front of our home crowd in Lucas Oil.

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This next four game stretch is going to be big. Beat the Texans and we are sitting really good. Steelers are beatable. The other three games are at home. One team that is terrible and the other we will see if they start to improve. If we are 7-2 that will be incredible. We are going to show who we are this next stretch because 3 of them we should win and the other is at home against a pretty good team.  We have a lot of division games the second half of the season. If we want to be good we need to win these next four. We should not lose any of them if we are a good team. This is about the time last year where we got hot. Win the road game against the Steelers  and our home games next five games and we are 8-2. Think about that after losing luck.

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10 minutes ago, waka waka said:

adding the WR/RB/TE have to make plays I think its great to start throwing passes to Marlin so that it doesnt look so predictable when he's in the game. They went zero blitz several times JB had a good game was he great now. But why are we expecting great QB play from him so quickly. He's got the tools give him time. If you draft someone they will have to have some time in the system before they start to be good. why are these threads coming up every week now it makes no sense just lump them all into one thread. Give JB a break look at how Mayfield is looking out there.

 

But but... Mayfield was great and had "stats" in college.. 

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1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

LOL This is funny

 

 

:hat::heart:

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44 minutes ago, krunk said:

Because you don't want teams thinking that you can't threaten them deep with your passing game.  We've only needed a pass or two a game because the run has been working.  When it's not working then you get the Raiders game where a team is sitting on your short throws and stuffing your run game. Or you get what we got years ago when Hasslebeck was here and teams figured out he couldn't hurt them deep.  People should be concerned that we are not getting many chunks.  I said concerned(not panicked) because I think the time is inching closer where we'll start getting solid contributions from Cain and Campbell.  I think by the end of November we should be approaching full swing with the return of Funchess.  Also whenever Ebron decides to get his head out of his behind.

Exactly he is one demensuinal smart and good decision making game manager. If we are down and in a shoot out he is a liability it just how it is. Good run Ds will force us to play deep and he will be exposed. 

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    • There could be some parallels between SF and IND...and perhaps some lessons. (Look at who started that following season for SF).   SF needed a franchise QB back in 2017. But even though SF ultimately had the #3 pick...they passed on drafting a QB like Mahomes or Watson. Instead, they grabbed a developmental QB prospect in the 3rd round. They then used that pick on a "blue chip" DL player.    Fortunately...they were able to trade for Jimmy G that following season. Maybe they knew they would eventually land Jimmy G...or could get Cousins the following year in FA...but it was risky to pass on drafting a QB.   The Colts need a franchise QB. They don't have the #3 pick...but they are in a position to realistically to get one of the top 3-4 guys. And this is where the Colts are faced with a similar choice. Do they grab their guy at #13 (or perhaps move up a few spots)...or do they pass on drafting a QB early like SF did...and grab a developmental QB in rounds 2-3...while working toward a more proven option...perhaps a Derek Carr trade.    IMO...they are drafting somebody...either as the long-term franchise QB, the developmental backup for the foreseeable future (even if they do manage to get a proven upgrade prior to the draft) OR as a hedge for a future move.   It worked out for SF in the end...but Beathard got beat out by an UDFA and Thomas has been a disappointment.    Going to be very interesting to see how Ballard plays this. I know what I would do...but that's about it.    
    • Panthers select Isaiah simmons
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