Still A Chance Freeney Is Traded

[IndyTrav]

Do they even have a 2nd after the swap with the Rams?

Heck if I know. It was just speculation on my part. Just think they are going mini raiders over there in Washington. Raiders a 1. Wash a 2. Everyone else who is reasonable 3/4.

[Restored]

How is the best option to release him? That's the worst option. Even if we only get a 5th for him, why wouldn't we do that? It doesn't change the remaining cap hit in 2012.

If I remember correctly, we only would be forced to pay the base salary and not the 14 million that makes it 19. Not sure though.

[oldunclemark]

I agree that Freeney has no place on this team if we go to a 3-4.

Usually the 3 down lineman are 290 plus in a 3-4

Have you noticed how few tackles Freeney is getting ?

He is still an awesome pass rusher..... But lets be honest....... He couldnt find a RB

If it was tied to his arm.......

Mathis is great in both areas.... Thats why he works as the rush LB in a 3-4

The trade may come on draft day, if an early run occurs on defensive ends.

Usually the draft day trades work out best for the team giving up a player.........

We can always cut Dwight, and get the cap savings after the draft

Sort of high stakes poker.

I am not sure why everyone thinks that he should rush to restructure.

If he gets cut, he gets to negotiate with any team HE chooses...... And get another signing bonus.

Again.... We have to be honest...... We are rebuilding....... We have many holes.....

At best, we probably have 3 years till we have a chance at fielding a SB type team.

Freeney will probably be retired by then

again..the contradiction...we're rebuilding...but we resign Mathis even though he's 31 and changing positions.

Doenst make sense to me.

A lot of Mathis success is because of Freeney..

I'd feel a lot better about 2012 if we had them both..

..and I wish he'd sign a 2 or 3-year extension so we can afford him..

[Restored]

again..the contradiction...we're rebuilding...but we resign Mathis even though he's 31 and changing positions.

Doenst make sense to me.

A lot of Mathis success is because of Freeney..

I'd feel a lot better about 2012 if we had them both..

..and I wish he'd sign a 2 or 3-year extension so we can afford him..

When you are rebuilding, you don't completely start over. I hate that term because people completely mis-interpret what it means. We are really building the core of the team, not the WHOLE team. You have to maintain a veteran presence to a degree to help bring the younger players along in the new era. Which is why you see the likes of Mathis and Reggie staying.

[FireJimCaldwell]

If I remember correctly, we only would be forced to pay the base salary and not the 14 million that makes it 19. Not sure though.

19,035,000 2012 Cap hit if playing

5,000,000 2012 Dead Cap Space if cut/traded

14,035,000 2012 Savings

[Superman]

If I remember correctly, we only would be forced to pay the base salary and not the 14 million that makes it 19. Not sure though.

The base salary in 2012 is $14 million. That's what we have to pay if we keep him and don't reach agreement on an extension. The portion of his signing bonus that's prorated to the 2012 cap is $5 million, and that remains on the cap regardless (cut, extension, trade), but it's already been paid.

So if we trade him, we keep a $5 million cap hit. If we release him, we keep a $5 million cap hit. If we extend him, we carry a $5 million cap hit + a prorated portion of his new signing bonus + his new base salary. If we keep him without an extension, we carry a $19 million cap hit.

Even if we get a conditional 7th rounder in 2014, it's better than releasing him and getting nothing.

[Restored]

19,035,000 2012 Cap hit if playing

5,000,000 2012 Dead Cap Space if cut/traded

14,035,000 2012 Savings

Thank you. I knew that cutting him would have some money benefit this year if we did do it. Would like to have him retained still but my whole thinking is, if we aren't planning to be big F/A players, we might be able to still take his cap hit. Thoughts?

The base salary in 2012 is $14 million. That's what we have to pay if we keep him and don't reach agreement on an extension. The portion of his signing bonus that's prorated to the 2012 cap is $5 million, and that remains on the cap regardless (cut, extension, trade), but it's already been paid.

So if we trade him, we keep a $5 million cap hit. If we release him, we keep a $5 million cap hit. If we extend him, we carry a $5 million cap hit + a prorated portion of his new signing bonus + his new base salary. If we keep him without an extension, we carry a $19 million cap hit.

Even if we get a conditional 7th rounder in 2014, it's better than releasing him and getting nothing.

Refer to above post

[Superman]

Question for the guys who know the CBA:

Is it possible to do the following trade?

Trade Freeney to Team X, who agrees to send us a 4th round pick in the 2013 draft if they fail to either reach a long-term deal with Freeney before the 2013 draft, or don't tag him. However, if they do reach a long-term deal with him, they send us 2nd round pick in the 2013 draft. If they tag him, they send us a 3rd round pick.

[Superman]

Thank you. I knew that cutting him would have some money benefit this year if we did do it. Would like to have him retained still but my whole thinking is, if we aren't planning to be big F/A players, we might be able to still take his cap hit. Thoughts?

To me, it's not about whether we have the cap space or not. It's about how ridiculous it is to carry him with a $14 million salary in 2012, given the state of the franchise. Chances are we'd have to tag him in 2013 when he's 33 years old, which would cost us $23 million (120% of his 2012 cap hit), or we'd just be letting him walk. Not worth the $14 million salary he's due in 2012. It's bad business, both now and in the future.

[oldunclemark]

When you are rebuilding, you don't completely start over. I hate that term because people completely mis-interpret what it means. We are really building the core of the team, not the WHOLE team. You have to maintain a veteran presence to a degree to help bring the younger players along in the new era. Which is why you see the likes of Mathis and Reggie staying.

and I hope its Reggie, Mathis and Dwight staying..but.as FJC points out....we cannot keep him on his present deal...

I think Freeney could be a situational DE for three of four more years...and..with so much passing in the NFL..he'd be worth it.

I want to rebuild in the sense that YOU define the term...

but not in the 'start over' sense

[Boneman2]

Teams are always looking for pass rushers, especially a team like New England. Any 4-3 team capable of scoring a lot of points could use Freeney, and so there will be a market for him.

With such a thin market Freeney has value. Maybe the Jets or Patriots want to keep up in their division. There are a number of teams that will call, and so it is possible to trade him. Otherwise he'd be gone by now, like everybody else. I'd hold onto him as long as possible hoping somebody will eventually give. The Bengals made a similar decision with Carson Palmer and look how that turned out.

[Restored]

and I hope its Reggie, Mathis and Dwight staying..but.as FJC points out....we cannot keep him on his present deal...

I think Freeney could be a situational DE for three of four more years...and..with so much passing in the NFL..he'd be worth it.

I want to rebuild in the sense that YOU define the term...

but not in the 'start over' sense

I believe Freeney will be a Colt this year and beyond.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Question for the guys who know the CBA:

Is it possible to do the following trade?

Trade Freeney to Team X, who agrees to send us a 4th round pick in the 2013 draft if they fail to either reach a long-term deal with Freeney before the 2013 draft, or don't tag him. However, if they do reach a long-term deal with him, they send us 2nd round pick in the 2013 draft. If they tag him, they send us a 3rd round pick.

I've never seen one structured quite like that, but I won't say it would be impossible.

Generally a team will give the player/agent the opportunity to see a trading partner, by discussing a contract and coming to terms, and then teams agree on compensation.

Using the Carson Palmer/Raiders as an example, they gave Palmer the ability to restructure his deal with the Raiders to make it more attractive for Oakland, and the trade agreement did have a addendum attached that if they reached the playoffs the Bengals compensation would increase.

Freeney's base salary is so high that few teams would be able to facilitate the trade exactly as you mentioned, and even the ones with the space would prefer to have some form of extension worked out to get more value out of the compensation they are giving up.

[Smitto]

Freeney never said he didn't want to be in the 3-4.... there was rumor of him going to the jets. Why would he do that if he doesn't want to play in the 3-4..... chances are he's gonna reconstruct his contract.

[Deano1818]

again..the contradiction...we're rebuilding...but we resign Mathis even though he's 31 and changing positions.

Doenst make sense to me.

A lot of Mathis success is because of Freeney..

I'd feel a lot better about 2012 if we had them both..

..and I wish he'd sign a 2 or 3-year extension so we can afford him..

In a 3-4 you really only have 1 rush linebacker

Between the 2, mathis is the one.

Freeney isnt that big, run stopping DE that a 3-4 needs.

He could be a situational player..... But..... Thats a ton of jack to spend

Mathis is still playing both the run and the pass at an extremely high level

And is 2 years younger

I also believe that new england is a good destination for Freeney.

They have little pass rush, and now that Mario is signed, it wouldnt suprise me to see the Pats make the trade

[Deano1818]

I really think we will get a second round pick for Freeney, on draft day

[chad72]

I would like a conditional pick, a 3rd round for starters, a 2nd round pick if he makes the Pro Bowl. Then, I will be voting like American Idol for the fan portion of the Pro Bowl votes .

[BProland85]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/16/john-abraham-stays-in-atlanta-on-three-year-agreement/

John Abraham is now off the market as well. More and more DEs are becoming unavailable, and Freeney is the only quality star left at DE that teams can go after. Hopefully this drives up the price on Freeney. As I repeatedly stated, Freeney and his agent both simply need to talk out a potential new contract with the trading team, and we dont assume any extra cap hit, and we get more in compensation since the trading team wont be forced to eat 15 million or so of cap space.

[oldunclemark]

In a 3-4 you really only have 1 rush linebacker

Between the 2, mathis is the one.

Freeney isnt that big, run stopping DE that a 3-4 needs.

He could be a situational player..... But..... Thats a ton of jack to spend

Mathis is still playing both the run and the pass at an extremely high level

And is 2 years younger

I also believe that new england is a good destination for Freeney.

They have little pass rush, and now that Mario is signed, it wouldnt suprise me to see the Pats make the trade

...I think if you restructure his deal....he could play DE on 2nd and 3rd downs in a 3-4..

You dont need a runstopper on passing downs...

But its up to him...if he wont structure his deal..we cant keep him and he knows that..

[BOTT]

trade deadline isn't unti october...plenty of time to work a trade

[Deano1818]

...I think if you restructure his deal....he could play DE on 2nd and 3rd downs in a 3-4..

You dont need a runstopper on passing downs...

But its up to him...if he wont structure his deal..we cant keep him and he knows that..

Mark, i dont think that you would want to tie up that much money for a situational player.

Freeney has been awesome........ But i will be very suprised if he is on this team at the start of the season

[Bill from Schoolhouse Rock]

Hi everybody...a newbie here. I haven't seen any references to these links. It actually looks like the national talking heads are thinking Freeney stays. Thoughts?

http://twitter.com/#!/espn_afcsouth/status/180018193383960576

@ClaytonESPN doesn't see Colts trading or cutting Freeney. Thinks with all the low cost players, they can handle $19 M cap number

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2012/3/14/2871879/dwight-freeney-might-not-get-traded-or-released-colts-free-agency-nfl

Dwight Freeney Might Not Get Traded Or Released

by Brad Wells on Mar 14, 2012 5:08 PM EDT in Colts News

For weeks, everyone has been under the assumption that the Colts will trade or release All Pro defensive end Dwight Freeney. The reasons are the Colts are shifting to a 3-4 base defense, and Dwight is owed way too much money in 2012 for what he is currently worth. Freeney carries a staggering $19 million dollar cap hit for the Colts in 2012, and for a guy who is provided just 8.5 sacks last year and is on the wrong side of 30, that's too much.

Again, as I always say to crazy fans who think that sports is about "loyalty," the bottom line is this league is a bottom line business. Your play must validate your pay. When it doesn't, you are hurting the club.

Also, when asked directly last week about whether or not the Colts are attempting to trade Freeney, news that was first reported by ESPN's Adam Schefter, Colts G.M. Ryan Grigson gave a complete non-answer that, for me, translated, "We're trading Freeney." Add to this that the Colts just inked DE Cory Redding, and the writing on the wall suggested a Freeney-Colts divorce.

However, today we get two reports, one from NFL.com's Jason La Canfora and the other from ESPN's John Clayton, informing us that the Colts might not trade Freeney. They might not cut him either. He might actually remain a Colt in 2012.

La Canfora:

There was never a strong possibility that Freeney would be traded in the first place, but it is clear the Colts are making the defensive line a priority under new head coach Chuck Pagano

Chuck Pagano

The Colts have already reached an agreement with DE Cory Redding, a versatile lineman who Pagano coached in Baltimore and can play the end in a 3-4 scheme. The Colts also invested heavily in <a class="sbn-auto-link" href="

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/2808/robert-mathis">Robert

Mathis, who will now be an OLB as they switch to the new scheme.

The last piece is Freeney, who would also fit in as an outside linebacker under Pagano.

John Clayton simply stated, via ESPN's Paul Kuharsky, that he doesn't see Colts trading or cutting Freeney. With all the low cost players the Colts have either brought in or retained, they can handle Freeney's $19 mill cap number this season.

Back to La Canfora, he also reported several days ago that the Colts are looking into restructuring Freeney's final year (2012) so that the cap hit isn't $19 mill. Freeney recently hired CAA to represent him after his longtime agent, Gary Wichard, died last year. Having CAA rep him either means Freeney has them working to trade him out of Indy, or he needs them to re-work his contract.

So, it's still entirely possible that Freeney will be traded, but La Confora and Clayton just tossed a bucket of ice water on it.