Malik Hooker

[jvan1973]

Losing one of the best free safeties in the game for any length of time is not fine.     

[PrincetonTiger]

21 hours ago, csmopar said:

I think you merged the wrong ones.  My Brissett thread got merged with the Hooker being out thread, probably meant to merge this thread and the hooker being out thread

 

21 hours ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

Ah, I think you're right.

So that is why I was confused yesterday 

[csmopar]

3 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

 

So that is why I was confused yesterday 

lol, you werent the only one. I know I was

[King Colt]

Definitely a bummer. It was painful to watch Julio Jones catch passes as if it was a scrimmage game.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

lol, you werent the only one. I know I was

 

1 hour ago, PrincetonTiger said:

 

So that is why I was confused yesterday 

 

I went back in & tried to un-merge, I didn't have any luck. 

[Fisticuffs111]

15 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I only hope Hooker needs a small trim (as expected) to the meniscus and not sutured to repair.  The former is 4-6 weeks recovery, the latter 3-6 months.

FWIW Rapoport tweeted today that he was having a meniscus trim. Is that a good sign or are there different types of trims that can be done? I obviously have no knowledge in the medical field hah.

[Colts_Fan12]

1 hour ago, jvan1973 said:

Losing one of the best free safeties in the game for any length of time is not fine.     

he's not any good didn't doug tell you? hell he has told us 1948838383862 times.

[csmopar]

28 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

 

I went back in & tried to un-merge, I didn't have any luck. 

its all good. Its no biggie, I just thought I was going crazy Thanks 

[csmopar]

26 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

FWIW Rapoport tweeted today that he was having a meniscus trim. Is that a good sign or are there different types of trims that can be done? I obviously have no knowledge in the medical field hah.

a trim is better than a replacement. but it'll still be some time out. I chipped mine when my ACL tore and it was all done at the same time so I can't really say how much of my recovery was from that

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Hooker is having the procedure today. He had it on his Instagram story.

[a06cc]

Seems like he is Bob Sanders 2.0. Great on the field but made of glass. Love him a lot, he needs to stay healthy.

[AustexColt]

Hooker is getting hurt often.  Hope he is available against Mahomes. If there is a stage for him to shine for a big contract that is the stage. The entire NFL will be watching.

[indyagent17]

On 9/22/2019 at 5:35 PM, Chloe6124 said:

 

That Quarter was abysmal, Makes a litter more sense that Malik was not out there 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

That Quarter was abysmal, Makes a litter more sense that Malik was not out there 

We also had dline going in and out and then back in several times that third quarter. Kenny Moore also missed several snaps.

[Superman]

19 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I only hope Hooker needs a small trim (as expected) to the meniscus and not sutured to repair.  The former is 4-6 weeks recovery, the latter 3-6 months.

 

The latter also bodes ill for his long term prospects. If I had a seat at the table, I'd be pushing him to seriously consider the repair instead of the meniscectomy, even if it costs him the rest of the season. 

[Lucky Colts Fan]

8 hours ago, DougDew said:

As I always say, Hooker is fine.

 

Oh, wait, you guys were talking about injuries?  I wasn't.  LOL.

 

And I still know that he's just fine.  No better.   LOL.

 

Sooo... you purposefully baited people with "he's fine" in an effort to derail a thread about Malik Hooker being injured...

 

 

Isn't that a form of trolling?  

 

(And for the umpteenth time, if you think he is "just fine" as a FS, you're wrong.  That's a horrible opinion.  - Just a friendly reminder from Lucky Colts Fan )

[jvan1973]

34 minutes ago, Lucky Colts Fan said:

 

Sooo... you purposefully baited people with "he's fine" in an effort to derail a thread about Malik Hooker being injured...

 

 

Isn't that a form of trolling?  

 

(And for the umpteenth time, if you think he is "just fine" as a FS, you're wrong.  That's a horrible opinion.  - Just a friendly reminder from Lucky Colts Fan )

Same ole schtick.   Then try to blame others when he is called out.  

[ColtsBlueFL]

7 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

FWIW Rapoport tweeted today that he was having a meniscus trim. Is that a good sign or are there different types of trims that can be done? I obviously have no knowledge in the medical field hah.

 

Yes.  And yes, but likely has minimal effect on the recovery timeline.

 

7 hours ago, csmopar said:

a trim is better than a replacement. but it'll still be some time out. I chipped mine when my ACL tore and it was all done at the same time so I can't really say how much of my recovery was from that

 

Depending, a month to 1.5 months or so.

[ColtsBlueFL]

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The latter also bodes ill for his long term prospects. If I had a seat at the table, I'd be pushing him to seriously consider the repair instead of the meniscectomy, even if it costs him the rest of the season. 

 

Interesting.

 

I always consider going the path of the least amount of mucking around; if it can be a viable long term fix...

[jameszeigler834]

On 9/23/2019 at 6:22 PM, Rubles said:

Hooker is starting to scare me with his Bob Sanders like injury history

He is so injury prone it sucks but it is what it is.

[DerekDiggler]

Not gonna read all this dribble. 

 

Just know I'm buying my wife a #29 jersey!

[DerekDiggler]

44 minutes ago, DerekDiggler said:

Not gonna read all this dribble. 

 

Just know I'm buying my wife a #29 jersey!

Seriously nobody????  Bueller?  Bueller?

 

[Superman]

3 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Interesting.

 

I always consider going the path of the least amount of mucking around; if it can be a viable long term fix...

 

I'm sure you saw or are aware of this. Myles Jack had his stitched rather than trimmed, to improve his long term prospects. But the Giants team doctor spoke about this kind of operation, and mentioned that not every patient is a candidate for repair, so Hooker may not have had another reasonable option.

 

http://www.insidesocal.com/ucla/2015/09/26/examining-myles-jacks-recovery-timetable-after-his-meniscus-tear/

[ColtsBlueFL]

6 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I'm sure you saw or are aware of this. Myles Jack had his stitched rather than trimmed, to improve his long term prospects. But the Giants team doctor spoke about this kind of operation, and mentioned that not every patient is a candidate for repair, so Hooker may not have had another reasonable option.

 

http://www.insidesocal.com/ucla/2015/09/26/examining-myles-jacks-recovery-timetable-after-his-meniscus-tear/

 

I think I remember discussions here about his draft stock because of his injury/repair.  And what the doctor you quoted is right.  A main reason some can be repaired and others not relates to blood supply, which is essential in healing. Approximately the outer 1/3 of the meniscus has enough blood supply to support repair and proper healing. Damage to other areas of the meniscus that just do not have adequate blood supply for proper healing needs to be removed (trimmed/meniscectomy).

 

We do not know the extent and area of the meniscus tear Hooker has suffered. Thus repair may not be an option.  However, even if it is, the recovery/rehab is much longer and more intense.  It may even take up to 10 full months to be restored 100%, even though athlete returns sooner. But preservation of the meniscus (if possible) is better, especially long term, no question.

 

Meniscectomy recovery is much, much quicker. However, pressure on the articular cartilage of the knee is increased, which leads to degenerative changes. Therefore, arthritic conditions can appear a decade or two down the road that a successful repair essentially mitigates.

 

Sometimes, there are few/no options. When there are, deciding on a path isn't necessarily easy. Especially for an athlete.

 

 

[Superman]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

Meniscectomy recovery is much, much quicker. However, pressure on the articular cartilage of the knee is increased, which leads to degenerative changes. Therefore, arthritic conditions can appear a decade or two down the road that a successful repair essentially mitigates.

 

I had partial meniscectomy a few years ago. Since then, I've done a ton of research -- backward, right? I wish I had known about the repair option before I had the operation. I don't know if it would have been a viable option, but I wish I had known to ask. I already have problems with the knee again, and I know once I have them take a look at it I'm going to get bad news...

 

So I think anyone should consider the repair, and not just opt for the trim simply because the recovery time is faster. But I assume he was advised accordingly, depending on what his options were. 

 

I haven't read/heard which knee he injured. He tore the ACL/MCL in his right knee two years ago. I wonder if it's the same knee. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I had partial meniscectomy a few years ago. Since then, I've done a ton of research -- backward, right?

 

Ah... we all do it at times.

 

Quote

I wish I had known about the repair option before I had the operation. I don't know if it would have been a viable option, but I wish I had known to ask.

 

Did they tell you if it was a small or large tear?  Was it in the inner portions, or outer area?  Was the any ligament damage (and correction) along with the tear? 

 

Picture for other members curious to what it looks like. (medial is the inside of the knee, lateral the outside)-

 

Quote

I already have problems with the knee again, and I know once I have them take a look at it I'm going to get bad news...

 

How long ago was it performed?  Eventually, there is a good ( 65% - 90%) chance of osteoarthritis.  (degenerative articular cartilage joint disease characterized by articular cartilage maturation and hypertrophy, cartilage matrix degeneration and erosion, and bone spur [osteophyte] formation).

 

Quote

So I think anyone should consider the repair, and not just opt for the trim simply because the recovery time is faster.

 

I think any decent orthopod would explain both, if it were feasible (because not all injuries are). Still, when one hears 'trim through tiny incision the scope goes in and back to activity in 4-6 weeks' versus the doctor 'stiching it together' and likely being on crutches for 4-6 weeks (and no driving if gas/brake leg!), going through PT, and back to activity in 3 months, and heavy activity/sports in 6, the first option sounds better.  But the long term, down the road issue are different too.

 

If you remove the hydraulic fluid from a cars shock absorbers (or they are completely worn out), down the road things on the vehicle are going to suffer from the extra jiggling and jarring that fully functioning shock absorbers typically would reduce. Same with a knee.

 

Quote

But I assume he was advised accordingly, depending on what his options were. 

 

No question.  How do athletes react when they hear

 

"trim and be back in a month or so but. you might get osteoarthritis 10-20 or so years down the road"

compared to-

"We can stitch it up, but then your season is done.  You should be good to go by OTA's next year though."     No need to mention osteoarthritis though.

 

{again, with his injury, it may not have even been an option though}

 

Quote

I haven't read/heard which knee he injured. He tore the ACL/MCL in his right knee two years ago. I wonder if it's the same knee. 

 

I thought I heard the radio announcers mention he was having his left leg looked at during the game. So I can't promise this is factual, but my guess is the left knee.

[Superman]

41 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

Did they tell you if it was a small or large tear?  Was it in the inner portions, or outer area?  Was the any ligament damage (and correction) along with the tear? 

 

How long ago was it performed?  Eventually, there is a good ( 65% - 90%) chance of osteoarthritis.  (degenerative articular cartilage joint disease characterized by articular cartilage maturation and hypertrophy, cartilage matrix degeneration and erosion, and bone spur [osteophyte] formation).

 

I think it was medial, left leg, but I don't remember off the top of my head. About eight years ago, maybe a little more. It's time. No ligament damage, but there was a chondral defect as well, which likely means more cartilage damage. It swells up every few weeks, but that's from sports, biking, etc. 

 

Quote

Still, when one hears 'trim through tiny incision the scope goes in and back to activity in 4-6 weeks' versus the doctor 'stiching it together' and likely being on crutches for 4-6 weeks (and no driving if gas/brake leg!), going through PT, and back to activity in 3 months, and heavy activity/sports in 6, the first option sounds better.  But the long term, down the road issue are different too.

 

Yeah, looking back on it with the benefit of hindsight is one thing. I don't know what I would have opted for if presented both options, but to me, the repair seems like the best option, long term. 

 

[fahlman]

On 9/22/2019 at 5:35 PM, Chloe6124 said:

 

So Coach Reich intentionally misinformed the fans and the media. In my world that's called a lie. Something a good Christian man like Coach Reich shouldn't do.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, fahlman said:

So Coach Reich intentionally misinformed the fans and the media. In my world that's called a lie. Something a good Christian man like Coach Reich shouldn't do.

He clarified yesterday he wasn’t aware of hookers injury until after the game.

[ColtsBlueFL]

43 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I think it was medial, left leg, but I don't remember off the top of my head. About eight years ago, maybe a little more. It's time. No ligament damage, but there was a chondral defect as well, which likely means more cartilage damage. It swells up every few weeks, but that's from sports, biking, etc. 

 

Ahhh, about a decade, and there was already articular cartilage damage prior to the meniscectomy (which places even more stress on the articular cartilage...).   And you continued to be active in sporting activities.  Your hunch may prove right when you go in for a checkup, unfortunately.

 

43 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah, looking back on it with the benefit of hindsight is one thing. I don't know what I would have opted for if presented both options, but to me, the repair seems like the best option, long term. 

 

 

If it was on the outer 1/3 section and if you can be out of work a month or more, and have limited but progressive activity (with Physical Therapy) for the next few months to follow.  I would hazard a guess your tear was more on the inside and not a candidate for repair.

[Superman]

1 hour ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Ahhh, about a decade, and there was already articular cartilage damage prior to the meniscectomy (which places even more stress on the articular cartilage...).   And you continued to be active in sporting activities.  Your hunch may prove right when you go in for a checkup, unfortunately.

 

 

It's a no doubter in my mind. I'll be okay.

 

Quote

If it was on the outer 1/3 section and if you can be out of work a month or more, and have limited but progressive activity (with Physical Therapy) for the next few months to follow.  I would hazard a guess your tear was more on the inside and not a candidate for repair.

 

I sit at a desk, I could have set up a station in a way that allowed me to work. And it was the left leg and I wasn't driving a stick at the time, so I would have made it happen.

 

But if my memory is right, it was the medial, and that means the repair likely wasn't a viable option.

[ColtsBlueFL]

4 hours ago, fahlman said:

So Coach Reich intentionally misinformed the fans and the media. In my world that's called a lie. Something a good Christian man like Coach Reich shouldn't do.

 

What did Reich say?  This is what happened according to SI-

 

"Hooker left Sunday's game for 18 snaps in the second half despite no injury being announced during his absence. The 2017 first-round pick returned to finish the game in the fourth quarter."

 

He likely played in pain on his return, and maybe is lucky it didn't 'lock up' on him.  On the radio, it was casually mentioned Hooker was having his (I believe left) leg 'looked at'.  There was no announcement of injury during the game, but to me, anyone getting 'looked at' is an injury. Only questions are, where at, and how minor/severe?

 

And I still can't believe people get their medical info from the HC, GM, or owner. They are not experts in the medical field. Their expertise and attention lies elsewhere (football and duties of their positions).  They get their info from the teams medical staff. The medical staff won't have full info (just a preliminary diagnosis) until their physical tests/exam plus imaging tests (X-Rays and MRI, etc.) are complete, which is often a day or two later.

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

3 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

He clarified yesterday he wasn’t aware of hookers injury until after the game.

 

I can see this.  He's got all sorts of things going on during a game. Hooker was held out a bit in the 3rd quarter and examined. Then he went back in and finished the game. Easy to see how Frank didn't know until after. Medical team probably told him after they feel there's an issue with Hookers knee (maybe even hinted meniscus) and they'll schedule an MRI.

[Coffeedrinker]

4 hours ago, fahlman said:

So Coach Reich intentionally misinformed the fans and the media. In my world that's called a lie. Something a good Christian man like Coach Reich shouldn't do.

Reich probably is not the one to make the decision on who is in and not in on every play, that falls to the DC.  Reich may not have known why Hooker was not playing, but a rotation has been standard so far for the Colts safeties.

[PrincetonTiger]

22 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Reich probably is not the one to make the decision on who is in and not in on every play, that falls to the DC.  Reich may not have known why Hooker was not playing, but a rotation has been standard so far for the Colts safeties.

Not always the DC 

   The Position coach and Medical staff are often involved 

[fahlman]

4 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

I can see this.  He's got all sorts of things going on during a game. Hooker was held out a bit in the 3rd quarter and examined. Then he went back in and finished the game. Easy to see how Frank didn't know until after. Medical team probably told him after they feel there's an issue with Hookers knee (maybe even hinted meniscus) and they'll schedule an MRI.

 

4 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Reich probably is not the one to make the decision on who is in and not in on every play, that falls to the DC.  Reich may not have known why Hooker was not playing, but a rotation has been standard so far for the Colts safeties.

 

3 hours ago, PrincetonTiger said:

Not always the DC 

   The Position coach and Medical staff are often involved 

So we're all watching the game and notice that Hooker is not playing, but the Head Coach is oblivious to his starting safety not being on the field?

[jvan1973]

7 minutes ago, fahlman said:

 

 

So we're all watching the game and notice that Hooker is not playing, but the Head Coach is oblivious to his starting safety not being on the field?

Players check themselves out all the time for various reasons.   The head coach isn't looking for individual players on defense every snap.  Good lord.   Did you play high school ball?  Lots of players come in and out for a variety of reasons.   The coordinators and position coaches handle that

[fahlman]

1 hour ago, jvan1973 said:

Players check themselves out all the time for various reasons.   The head coach isn't looking for individual players on defense every snap.  Good lord.   Did you play high school ball?  Lots of players come in and out for a variety of reasons.   The coordinators and position coaches handle that

So when I'm watching the game and Coach Reich is clearly on the sidelines also watching the game you mean to tell me he's not really watching the game too? What's he doing? He can't keep track of 11 players with big numbers on the back of their jerseys? He doesn't notice #29, his starting safety, is missing for a series or two?

 

I've never coached football, but I did play and coach baseball and I was aware of which 9 players were on the field. Maybe 11 players, an extra 2, is just too many to keep track of? Not enough fingers?

[Blueblood23]

On 9/24/2019 at 10:02 PM, DerekDiggler said:

Not gonna read all this dribble. 

 

Just know I'm buying my wife a #29 jersey!

Are they on the discount rack?

[Fluke_33]

18 hours ago, fahlman said:

So Coach Reich intentionally misinformed the fans and the media. In my world that's called a lie. Something a good Christian man like Coach Reich shouldn't do.