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Most over rated Colt is??

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8 minutes ago, Mr.NotSoCreative said:

Im guessing they made him captain to boost his confidence? Really need him to be a beast with the lack of experience behind him but agree he is most over rated. As for Leonard, teams know that they have to get a body on him, every play, its our job to do something about that so he can use his instincts, speed, etc. He is really good.

 

 So they boosted his confidence last season too? Haha!
 
 
 

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I thought it was a pretty common opinion that Geathers was just kinda average (and not even average in coverage). He was hyped early in his career but for the past year or so it seems like people have gotten more realistic with what he is. It only really seems like he's a captain because of his locker room presence/leadership.

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1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

support is one thing being a fool and claiming that he can be the next Aaron Rodgers is dumb and yes that was actually posted here before. so far I've seen different posters compare him to Andrew Luck Aaron Rodgers Ben Roethlisberger Kurt Warner and Tom Brady YES Tom Brady. :facepalm: 

 

hell just the other day had someone say they would rather have JB in certain situations than healthy Luck haha

I would like to see the post where someone supposedly said JB can be the next Aaron Rodgers. I think you are twisting words and don't believe you. 

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1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

well I seen some one specifically say he's the next Tom Brady lol also have seen quite a few say he can be just as good as Luck both are pretty dumb considering he hasn't really done a damn thing. I support him as well cause if hes good we can continue to draft other positions and keep building the roster but some need to slow the hell down they are buying into the media hype too much.

Show us the post where somebody said JB is the next Tom Brady. That never happened. 

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6 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 So they boosted his confidence last season too? Haha!
 
 
 

It was just a guess, hence the ? Thought I had seen where many were hoping or thinking he would be let go, not extended. Dont know every single tid bit about our team and that he is an exceptional leader, hope like heck he stays on the field and plays great! We need him. 

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9 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I thought it was a pretty common opinion that Geathers was just kinda average (and not even average in coverage). He was hyped early in his career but for the past year or so it seems like people have gotten more realistic with what he is. It only really seems like he's a captain because of his locker room presence/leadership.

We will see since he is healthy this year. Everyone missed tackles Sunday so won’t hold the one game against him.  Stephen holder wrote a article of what he went through last year just to play. I am shocked he didn’t retire it was so bad. 

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44 minutes ago, BeanDiasucci said:

I would like to see the post where someone supposedly said JB can be the next Aaron Rodgers. I think you are twisting words and don't believe you. 


I'll vouge for @Colts_Fan12, somebody was comparing him to Rodgers a while back, and I do believe "the next Aaron Rodgers" was said. It was said by someone who has admirably optimistic takes.

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2 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I agree. We have no sample size on Kelly, and a one game sample size with Brissett with this offense. Either could be better than the other. I thought Brissett did a good job last week, but there's no way to judge Kelly yet Vs Brissett as we'd be guessing. Both sides can make a point, but all we can say is Brissett looked good in game 1 and Kelly did solid in the preseason. We have nothing else of evidence at this point.

The evidence is in the depth chart.   Brissett is the starter,  Kelly is third string

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48 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

He had 80 catches with Brissett in 2017 and is very reliable when you need yards.

 

I didn’t literally mean his ability to catch the football....he’s great at that. I am talking about as an threat or integral part of the passing game or in comparison to other pass catching TEs. 

 

2017 was as a great year for him though...but somewhat driven by the circumstances of a terrible offense that checked down at will.

 

Doyle is a solid player...but I have seen Colts fans (especially on SB) act as if he is a vital component to the passing game and one of the better all-around TEs in the league. 

 

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30 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 No doubt it is Kelly.
 Ryan Kelly. Yes it hurts when he is out because of the lack of a quality backup.
 He is an above average player, but NOT a one of the Best in the NFL. 
  And Autry was getting great hype coming into the season.
 He got it handed to him against the Chargers. By mid-season we will see how his production has been. I expect it to be a noticeable drop off from last season.

Disagree there on Kelly.  I thought he looked very good against the Chargers.  I was watching highlights of Mack and his plays running the ball and Kelly through some great blocks for him.  It wasn't just Big Q and Costanzo.  I don't think he's overrated at all.  He is one of the best centers in the league IMO and I would guess by many others in the league as well.  Even Autry has a chance to be a key DL.  Only one game played you know.  Even Von Miller had a rough game last week.  Everyone has off days once in awhile.  

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3 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Disagree there on Kelly.  I thought he looked very good against the Chargers.  I was watching highlights of Mack and his plays running the ball and Kelly through some great blocks for him.  It wasn't just Big Q and Costanzo.  I don't think he's overrated at all.  He is one of the best centers in the league IMO and I would guess by many others in the league as well.  Even Autry has a chance to be a key DL.  Only one game played you know.  Even Von Miller had a rough game last week.  Everyone has off days once in awhile.  

If he stays healthy this year he will probably end up being the highest paid center in the league.

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2 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

If he stays healthy this year he will probably end up being the highest paid center in the league.


How Ballard handles his extension will be interesting. He is a great center no question, but IMO health will still be a question going forward even if he stays mostly healthy this season. Besides Geathers, he probably has the most extensive injury history on the team.

I'm thinking he'll work out some sort of front heavy contract for Kelly.

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1 hour ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

These next few games are very important on his outcome then. 

Yes like I said last week it was an over reaction to call for him to be cut last week but it does bare watching.  If this trend continues then the Colts will have to make a move at kicker.

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19 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Disagree there on Kelly.  I thought he looked very good against the Chargers.  I was watching highlights of Mack and his plays running the ball and Kelly through some great blocks for him.  It wasn't just Big Q and Costanzo.  I don't think he's overrated at all.  He is one of the best centers in the league IMO and I would guess by many others in the league as well.  Even Autry has a chance to be a key DL.  Only one game played you know.  Even Von Miller had a rough game last week.  Everyone has off days once in awhile.  

I agree the left side of the line all the way to Kelly plays like the first rounders they are.  They got a steal in Smith at RT.  Yes he was a second rounder but he plays like a mid to high first.  The weak spot is Glow who is serviceable.  He works well in this unit but if there is a problem on the line Glow normally has something to do with it.  

11 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


How Ballard handles his extension will be interesting. He is a great center no question, but IMO health will still be a question going forward even if he stays mostly healthy this season. Besides Geathers, he probably has the most extensive injury history on the team.

I'm thinking he'll work out some sort of front heavy contract for Kelly.

If you listen to him that’s what he has been saving his money for.

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It has to be Geathers. A lot of hype and only a few big plays. The issue with Brissette is that the Colts really thought he was the guy they would have given him a longer deal. This team is in a wait-and-see mode

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2 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

It doesn't mean he's overrated at all, it just means he's an unknown. That could mean he's better or worse than Brissett, but in actuality, there's no proof of either at this point.

 

o·ver·rate

/ˌōvərˈrāt/

 

have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved.

 

It means Kelly's overrated on this forum... We have sample size of Brissett winning games and performing well. We don't have (and highly likely won't have) anything on Kelly, so to say he is better than JB (which a lot on this forum have...including you saying there is strong possibility he would be) is "having a higher opinion of someone than is deserved." Kelly doesn't deserve jack squat. 

 

And to touch on that definition, to say Viniateri is overrated is stupidity. I have been a critic of vinny of late, but to say he is overrated is insane. He's the greatest kicker of alltime, and even if he flames out to end his career, he still will hold that title and be in HOF. 

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1 hour ago, throwing BBZ said:

 No doubt it is Kelly.
 Ryan Kelly. Yes it hurts when he is out because of the lack of a quality backup.
 He is an above average player, but NOT a one of the Best in the NFL. 
  And Autry was getting great hype coming into the season.
 He got it handed to him against the Chargers. By mid-season we will see how his production has been. I expect it to be a noticeable drop off from last season.

From USA Today which ranked him #3 in the league... 

 

"In 885 snaps in the 2018 season, Kelly allowed one sack, three quarterback hits and eight quarterback hurries, and he put up strong performances when asked to turn on the power in the running game."

 

 

Try again bbz... we have one of the best center's in the league. Far from overrated.

 

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54 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


I'll vouge for @Colts_Fan12, somebody was comparing him to Rodgers a while back, and I do believe "the next Aaron Rodgers" was said. It was said by someone who has admirably optimistic takes.

I said he could make plays similiar to Aaron Rodgers because they can both extend plays and throw on the run, but to become the next rodgers he'd have to throw the football down the field more. 

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15 minutes ago, Stephen said:

I said he could make plays similiar to Aaron Rodgers because they can both extend plays and throw on the run, but to become the next rodgers he'd have to throw the football down the field more. 


Which is fine. But to be fair, you did technically start off those posts by saying "He's the next Aaron Rodgers", so I was just vouching for @Colts_Fan12 because he got called out on it.

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At the moment Chad Kelly is most overrated by far. As noted ad nauseum in this thread he played well against 2s and 3s in a preseason game. BFD. My money has him going to the PS as soon as his suspension ends, after which his rating should come back to something reasonable.

 

Also, consensus outside of this board (media/analysts, extended contract, team captain) says Geathers plays very good when he's on the field. His only knock has been injuries.

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3 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


Which is fine. But to be fair, you did technically start off those posts by saying "He's the next Aaron Rodgers", so I was just vouging for @Colts_Fan12 because he got called out on it.

He might be. td to int wise he is already throwing less ints to tds when compared to rodgers, brady, and wilson. Now he needs to increase yardage per game and tds thrown per game while keeping his ints low like he is currently doing.

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5 hours ago, Pacergeek said:

Easily Clayton Geathers. For five seasons, I've had to read how terrific he is, and how he leads the defense. During games, I only see him routinely getting beat.

We need an upgrade at SS.

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1 hour ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


I'll vouge for @Colts_Fan12, somebody was comparing him to Rodgers a while back, and I do believe "the next Aaron Rodgers" was said. It was said by someone who has admirably optimistic takes.


Oof...or "vouche" ...that's the kind of misspelling that haunts me.

But back to the thread question. I actually don't think we have anybody that's particularly overrated. Although I will say I think some fans have too high of expectations for some of our rookies in their rookie year (Ya-Sin in particular, Banogu to some extent).

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4 minutes ago, jameszeigler834 said:

We need an upgrade at SS.

Imagine if we could of got Landon Collins. We need a stud there. A high draft pick. Not sold Willis is going to be that guy. Collins would of made a huge difference on this team.

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36 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


Oof...or "vouche" ...that's the kind of misspelling that haunts me.

But back to the thread question. I actually don't think we have anybody that's particularly overrated. Although I will say I think some fans have too high of expectations for some of our rookies in their rookie year (Ya-Sin in particular, Banogu to some extent).


Oh my god I did it again..."vouch" ...Alright, sorry to derail the thread with some OCD esque corrections.

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37 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Imagine if we could of got Landon Collins. We need a stud there. A high draft pick. Not sold Willis is going to be that guy. Collins would of made a huge difference on this team.


I'm not super high on Willis either (at least not yet) but I think Ballard's going to give him every chance to prove his worth after trading up for him.

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2 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:


I'll vouge for @Colts_Fan12, somebody was comparing him to Rodgers a while back, and I do believe "the next Aaron Rodgers" was said. It was said by someone who has admirably optimistic takes.

Ok not the same spelling, but still had to do it....

 

o6cZX_.gif

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7 minutes ago, HOZER said:

Ok not the same spelling, but still had to do it....

 

o6cZX_.gif


Hah yeah, I went on a spell correct (and recorrecting) spree.

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1 hour ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

o·ver·rate

/ˌōvərˈrāt/

 

have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved.

 

It means Kelly's overrated on this forum... We have sample size of Brissett winning games and performing well. We don't have (and highly likely won't have) anything on Kelly, so to say he is better than JB (which a lot on this forum have...including you saying there is strong possibility he would be) is "having a higher opinion of someone than is deserved." Kelly doesn't deserve jack squat. 

 

And to touch on that definition, to say Viniateri is overrated is stupidity. I have been a critic of vinny of late, but to say he is overrated is insane. He's the greatest kicker of alltime, and even if he flames out to end his career, he still will hold that title and be in HOF. 

 

We do? He's 5-13 as a starter....and his career passer rating enter last Sunday's game was like 82. Plenty of bad QBs throughout the years have managed to have that "sample size." And it wouldn't take much to be better than that.

 

That said...we haven't seen and maybe never will (to your point). I am indifferent really when it comes to the JB vs. Kelly debate (I just assume the future franchise QB for the Colts is playing today somewhere)...but I do think there is bit of a difference between being high on someone for their potential (when they haven't played)...like rookies for example. 

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2 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

 

All fair commentary in my book, I like Enron a lot, and I’m really glad he’s got a home here after the crap he got in Detroit. But... he’s doesn’t have the consistency of a true great IMO. Good player, great guy but doubt replicates last year.

 

However as we are talking overating, doubt many had him down as doing this anyway. 

 

I think his numbers could go way, way down. Like to the point where he is a big disappointment and reverts to the unfocused, overly emotional player he was in Detroit, and is looking for a new home next year. I'm not sure hes found a home yet. He jokingly made a comment a few weeks back that he thinks him and Jack were both just buying the Colts time until Mo Alie Cox get a little more experience. But I sensed a little jealousy and insincerity in his tone. Just a feeling I have with him.

 

I always felt Lions fans were more than justified in their disappointment of his play. I dont feel like he got a bad rap necessarily. He consistently let them down in big moments, and he is too talented to do that. And we have seen a little of that here as well. Hes just made more plays than he did there, and that's cures all ills.

 

Is that because he has improved? Or was it more due to the presence of Andrew Luck? 

 

And this year, he has a new set of challenges beyond losing his best friend.

 

1. He wont get as many opportunities because of his poor blocking. Alie Cox is someone the Colts see as a long term solution at the TE position and is absolutely ascending, perhaps already surpassing Ebron. I believe they see him as having the potential to be a top TE in the league. And Jack Doyle is just solid and is such a good blocker its gonna be tough for Ebron to get any snaps on early downs.

 

2. There are just more weapons now, even with the loss of Funchess, and outside of the talented TE group. You got two young receivers in Cain and Campbell, who both have a lot to offer. And then you have two young RBs, both looking to increase their roles in Mack and Hines. It becomes a snap count issue. If we go more 4 receiver sets, it really puts a dent in TE snaps. I could see a lot of 3rd and long sets with Mack in the backfield, Hilton, Cain, Campbell and Hines as receivers, which is a lot of speed on the field. So, where does he fit in now?

 

3. Hes a bit of a DIVA. I am 100% anti DIVA. I think they rarely pay off to the point where they are worth it, and I dont think you need them. We have a great group of young guys, from a character standpoint. And humble guys usually dont like DIVAs. That's why they must produce, or they almost always become a locker room problem. If there's no pay off, it usually becomes an issue. It doesnt make him a bad guy, but I think some of the comraderie you see is because he has produced so far. What happens if he has a disappointing year? Is referring to himself in the third person as cute? No.

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And on Geathers, I think hes a good guy and is someone you would love to have around...the problem is I dont see him as a good special teamer. He could be a descent backup for us at SS and maybe someone you who gets snaps on 3rd and long as a cover LB, but he isn't a great cover guy and he needs to play special teams if hes gonna be on the bench. Remember to play that dime backer role you got to beat out Darius Leonard lol. Not gonna happen.

 

I just think you could find a more skilled, versatile player to fill whatever role you try to put him in, and be a better football team for it.

 

I hope he proves me wrong because hes obviously well liked within the organization for a reason.

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15 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

 

I think his numbers could go way, way down. Like to the point where he is a big disappointment and reverts to the unfocused, overly emotional player he was in Detroit, and is looking for a new home next year. I'm not sure hes found a home yet. He jokingly made a comment a few weeks back that he thinks him and Jack were both just buying the Colts time until Mo Alie Cox get a little more experience. But I sensed a little jealousy and insincerity in his tone. Just a feeling I have with him.

 

I always felt Lions fans were more than justified in their disappointment of his play. I dont feel like he got a bad rap necessarily. He consistently let them down in big moments, and he is too talented to do that. And we have seen a little of that here as well. Hes just made more plays than he did there, and that's cures all ills.

 

Is that because he has improved? Or was it more due to the presence of Andrew Luck? 

 

And this year, he has a new set of challenges beyond losing his best friend.

 

1. He wont get as many opportunities because of his poor blocking. Alie Cox is someone the Colts see as a long term solution at the TE position and is absolutely ascending, perhaps already surpassing Ebron. I believe they see him as having the potential to be a top TE in the league. And Jack Doyle is just solid and is such a good blocker its gonna be tough for Ebron to get any snaps on early downs.

 

2. There are just more weapons now, even with the loss of Funchess, and outside of the talented TE group. You got two young receivers in Cain and Campbell, who both have a lot to offer. And then you have two young RBs, both looking to increase their roles in Mack and Hines. It becomes a snap count issue. If we go more 4 receiver sets, it really puts a dent in TE snaps. I could see a lot of 3rd and long sets with Mack in the backfield, Hilton, Cain, Campbell and Hines as receivers, which is a lot of speed on the field. So, where does he fit in now?

 

3. Hes a bit of a DIVA. I am 100% anti DIVA. I think they rarely pay off to the point where they are worth it, and I dont think you need them. We have a great group of young guys, from a character standpoint. And humble guys usually dont like DIVAs. That's why they must produce, or they almost always become a locker room problem. If there's no pay off, it usually becomes an issue. It doesnt make him a bad guy, but I think some of the comraderie you see is because he has produced so far. What happens if he has a disappointing year? Is referring to himself in the third person as cute? No.

With DF out I think we are going to see Ebron on the field more as a WR with Doyle. I do agree with a lot of your  points. I can see a little bit of him reverting if he has a bad year. Teammates seem to love him and he has said the right things so we will see. I see this year now being a little like last year again with DF hurt. He didn’t have many snaps when Doyle was healthy but he did step up when he got hurt.

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6 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

With DF out I think we are going to see Ebron on the field more as a WR with Doyle. I do agree with a lot of hot points. I can see a little bit of him reverting if he has a bad year. Teammates seem to love him and he has said the right things so we will see. I see this year now being a little like last year again with DF hurt. He didn’t have many snaps when Doyle was healthy.  

And that's a possibility. I hope so because hes got that size/athleticism combo that can be deadly.

 

I just dont trust DIVAs. Ever. 

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9 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

I just dont trust DIVAs. Ever. 

di·va /ˈdēvə/ noun

a self-important person who is temperamental and difficult to please.

"she is much more the dedicated maverick than the petulant diva"

 

EE certainly displays a big personality, but I haven't seen anything from him since he joined the Colts to indicate he's been temperamental, difficult to please, or petulant. Please share your data on this.

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17 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

And on Geathers, I think hes a good guy and is someone you would love to have around...the problem is I dont see him as a good special teamer. He could be a descent backup for us at SS and maybe someone you who gets snaps on 3rd and long as a cover LB, but he isn't a great cover guy and he needs to play special teams if hes gonna be on the bench. Remember to play that dime backer role you got to beat out Darius Leonard lol. Not gonna happen.

 

I just think you could find a more skilled, versatile player to fill whatever role you try to put him in, and be a better football team for it.

 

I hope he proves me wrong because hes obviously well liked within the organization for a reason.

 

 Yes i noticed they put Wilson in at dime linebacker last game.
 Guess what, he was in for... wait wait wait... uh... Walker. Our weak link LB last  season on passing downs, when Geathers replaced him there in the playoffs.
 Nice try though. 
 It didn't appear our D co-ordinator had a good game plan last week.
Geathers and our LB's just were not where they needed to be.

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49 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

We do? He's 5-13 as a starter....and his career passer rating enter last Sunday's game was like 82. Plenty of bad QBs throughout the years have managed to have that "sample size." And it wouldn't take much to be better than that.

 

4 wins on a really bad roster... so yes, we do have sample of him winning games. Also, last weeks loss was on anybody but him. The passer rating also goes to that god awful roster that led him to be sacked 53 times. His one game behind a great o-line led to a no interception, high percentage passing, 120 rated game in which he could have thrown for 300 plus had we not run the ball for 200 yards. We can have this conversation at the end of the season and compare the "plenty of bad qb's"... my guess is he stands out from the long list of those quarterbacks. Like a sore thumb

 

We'll see. 

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5 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

4 wins on a really bad roster... so yes, we do have sample of him winning games. Also, last weeks loss was on anybody but him. The passer rating also goes to that god awful roster that led him to be sacked 53 times.

Not to mention he is still standing after that beating he took in '17. No injuries of note. He's a tough SOB. And very good.

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32 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 Yes i noticed they put Wilson in at dime linebacker last game.
 Guess what, he was in for... wait wait wait... uh... Walker. Our weak link LB last  season on passing downs, when Geathers replaced him there in the playoffs.
 Nice try though. 
 It didn't appear our D co-ordinator had a good game plan last week.
Geathers and our LB's just were not where they needed to be.

I thought the defensive game plan was a mess. I don’t know if he was just trying to find something that would work or what. Just weird. Also why was rock on Allen instead of Desir on that TD. It’s one thing to get rookies playing time but Desir has proven he can lock down top receivers. It seems Eberflus was just throwing darts trying to find something that worked. I also think he messed around with walker way to much. We didn’t stick to what worked last year. Instead did a little to much experimenting with young guys.

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7 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I said Chad Kelly and I think that because many think he should be our starter after he looked good against backups in pre-season. I like Kelly but until he looks good against starters lets not say he is better than JB. 

Most QBs in the league are better than JB.

And yes, Kelly should be our starter, but not yet...he needs more practice with the 1s and 2s...maybe after the bye week if our record is in the toilet.

And yes, JB is now our most overrated player...way too much hype without any reason.

 

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    • He tried to rip off Garrett's helmet when they were on the ground and then kept coming toward him as well after that but Garrett deserves 6 games = the brunt of the punishment.
    • I didn't blame Mack for the run game...I am talking about the talent level. For this season, I think it's the lack of light front carries moreso than stacked boxes. The average defenders in the box is about the same as last year...and he is on pace to only see 4-5 more stacked box carries vs. last year. But the light front carries are down and that's where his production came from last year.   A big part of the decrease is on the QB...and I am sure the last two games with Hoyer has only increased the base front and stacked front carries. But Mack is also part of it. He's not a pass-catching threat...and he's running the ball on half the plays he's in...so it makes the offense a bit more predictable.    So I don't want a RB2...I want a more well-rounded RB1a. Give me a Nick Chubb or an Aaron Jones type.   And Hines is alright...but he's not really an APB...because he can't run the ball. They just do that to keep the defense honest and it's typically a wasted play. But even if we call him an APB...he's fairly average. He has gotten better at making plays after the catch for sure...but still not that dynamic.   If I can't have that well-rounded RB1a...then I want a dynamite APB...ala James White or Duke Johnson...or Miles Sanders.   Ideally, I can have both...but it's rare to have that setup...like NO the past couple of years. Right now, I just feel like the Colts are missing parts to the RB game...and I think some investment could be made.
    • People keep saying that about Rudolph but I'm just not seeing it from the videos I've seen
    • Yes...I agree JB is the big reason the offensive numbers are down. I think you are confusing my post as an excuse for JB. I am just looking at the skill position talent objectively...and it's not overwhelming.   Doyle's best year was with JB...so I don't really get this argument about JB holding him back. But that Pro Bowl year (two years ago) was a byproduct of volume as the checkdown option in a bad offense (his yards/catch was <9). Now those checkdowns get spread round (Campbell, Pascal, Hines). I like Doyle just fine though...but he's a solid complimentary piece...and he's also going to turn 30.    I liked Ebron as well when they signed him. But he's a pass-catching TE...who drops passes...he's not some special talent. The Colts need long-term improvements at TE...they can't just keep re-investing more money in the same two guys. So I hope they explore the trade market...or maybe one of these free agent-to-be TEs becomes available.        
    • No butthurt here. Just trying to shine a light in the fog you live in. 
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