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Brissett Extension?

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2 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Sounds like a Texans move. 

 

Not to mention that wasn't close to the 13 million dollar raise you're suggesting

Brissett is going to be a starting QB. Not an aging CB. 

 

Like I've said $15m is well under starting QB $.

 

They vert well could do an extension, I just don't think it benefits either side. Straight raise for 1 season make sense for both.

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2 minutes ago, w87r said:

Brissett is going to be a starting QB. Not an aging CB. 

 

Like I've said $15m is well under starting QB $.

 

They vert well could do an extension, I just don't think it benefits either side. Straight raise for 1 season make sense for both.

Okay, you lost me on that last sentence.  How do the Colts benefit by giving a contracted player more money for...well...not exactly sure what for?  Playing in his contract??

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1 minute ago, MB-ColtsFan said:

Okay, you lost me on that last sentence.  How do the Colts benefit by giving a contracted player more money for...well...not exactly sure what for?  Playing in his contract??

Straight raise benefits the Colts, because they don't have to give any future money w/o knowing if he is capable. 

 

He will be getting more money this year 1 way or another. Raise or extension.

 

Suspect that news will be coming within next couple days.

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3 minutes ago, w87r said:

Straight raise benefits the Colts, because they don't have to give any future money w/o knowing if he is capable. 

 

He will be getting more money this year 1 way or another. Raise or extension.

 

Suspect that news will be coming within next couple days.

So you don't think he'll play as well as he could this year because he's still getting his rookie salary?

 

Remember, if he plays extremely well without your raise, he still looks to get a great contract next year, right?

 

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5 minutes ago, w87r said:

Straight raise benefits the Colts, because they don't have to give any future money w/o knowing if he is capable. 

 

He will be getting more money this year 1 way or another. Raise or extension.

 

Suspect that news will be coming within next couple days.

 

He’s still on his rookie deal. Think Brissett is going to hold out after week three if he plays well?? The Colts hold all the cards. They don’t know what they’re getting with Brissett this season, and just signed a backup QB. I doubt their worried about his feelings in regards to Hoyer’s contract or any other starter in the league.  I would be shocked if he gets a new contract before the season is over. He has a lot to prove in 2019.

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9 minutes ago, MB-ColtsFan said:

So you don't think he'll play as well as he could this year because he's still getting his rookie salary?

 

Remember, if he plays extremely well without your raise, he still looks to get a great contract next year, right?

 

Has nothing to do with that. I suspect he will perform the same either way. 

 

Time will tell.

 

I would just rather give him a raise this year and see what it is w/o investing future money into a question mark.

 

 

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1 minute ago, w87r said:

Has nothing to do with that. I suspect he will perform the same either way. 

 

Time will tell.

 

I would just rather give him a raise this year and see what it is w/o investing future money into a question mark.

 

 

:sigh:

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2 minutes ago, w87r said:

Has nothing to do with that. I suspect he will perform the same either way. 

 

Time will tell.

 

I would just rather give him a raise this year and see what it is w/o investing future money into a question mark.

 

 

Why give him anything more than he is getting since he is a question mark? 

 

It's not gonna happen

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Was SF stupid to give Jimmy G all that money. JB was a pretty high draft pick. He looks like a starting QB to me. He has a presence about him. I think he is ready. He is in a great situation.

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3 minutes ago, MB-ColtsFan said:

:sigh:

I don't know what there is to sigh about?

 

I hope he plays out his rookie deal to. Just don't think the Colts are going to do that. Colts take care of their guys, just don't see them letting JB go into the season making less than his backup, that they hope doesn't play.

 

So the best of 2 options, IMO, is a raise this year and no extension.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Also even though JB did not play he has a ring. That experience has to be very valuable to the colts.

 

JB has a SB ring? I thought Broncos won his rookie year..

 

I was wrong!

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10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Was SF stupid to give Jimmy G all that money. JB was a pretty high draft pick. He looks like a starting QB to me. He has a presence about him. I think he is ready. He is in a great situation.

Yes, the 9ers were extremely stupid giving that money to Jimmy G...

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8 minutes ago, MPStack said:

 

JB has a SB ring? I thought Broncos won his rookie year..

 

I was wrong!

Pretty sure I have seen a picture of him and jimmy G with a ring in a picture with Tom Brady.

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Yes I just looked it up. JB was inactive for the patriots SB in 2016. But he still was around it and was on the roster and got a ring.

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JB also has two really good games with NE when Brady was suspended and Jimmy G got hurt. That right there should tell you what he can do with a good team around him. The game he did lose was because he had a injured thumb that later required surgery.

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I think you have to give Brissett an extension if you can

 

The odds of Chad Kelly actually maturing into the starting QB his superfans are telling us he will be are actually moderately low. and the odds of us holding onto control of him long enough for him to finish developing here are even lower. 

 

We're already on the cusp of having to do some roster math just to keep Kelly and still have a starting QB and decent backup, neither of which Kelly is right now. 

 

If we "play stupid games" with Brissett's contract one of the "stupid prizes" we win is a distinct possibility of losing Brissett with no viable replacement and having to go onto the market from a position of desperation, which is far worse and more expensive, believe me, than securing the bird in the hand first and paying the one guy we do have who's an actual starting quarterback.

 

This is not an environment where we need to be out there being "clever."  Rule 1 of roster management: secure your foundation, then build on it.  We need Brissett for at least the next 2 years which means a contract for 3 years is a minimum for the Colts, and it's probably going to be 3 years at a higher dollar value than you guys are hoping.

 

I think we do sign Brissett, and I think we sign him for 3 years at around 65-70M, or a little over $20M/year.  Given what good quarterbacks are getting in free agency that's a pretty fair valuation level for the contract of a guy like Brissett who, while unproven, is widely considered a very solid bet to start successfully in the NFL

 

If instead we try to play games, lose Brissett, and have the choice of the free agency roulette or he complete lottery ticket that is Chad Kelly, I think this franchise is much worse off than it will be by paying Brissett a fair wage, and THEN machinating about how to make him expendable.  you can do both at the same time you know.

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That is a great point. If he balls out and don’t extend him we take a chance of losing him and then having no QB. It doesn’t have to be a ton of years. A 2 to 3 year extension won’t cause any long term cap problems.

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Bottom line people who think the Colts are in a position of power here are kidding themselves.  Chad Kelly mania notwithstanding Brissett is the only show in town right now and he has the ability to simply sit on his hands, play out the season, sign nothing, and test the waters of FA with at least half a dozen teams being interested in what he has to offer. 

 

What's more, Brissett has had a front row seat to how it ended with the last quarterback.  We may be behind a bigger 8 ball than we think.

 

Bottom line we're going to have to make it worthwhile to Brissett to hitch his wagon to the Colts organization and forgo the potential bounty in FA.  If we fail, our playoff window, which reduced when Luck retired but is still open a crack, instantly snaps closed for at least the next 2-3 years unless we hit a home run in FA or Kelly is much closer to NFL readiness than I think he is.  Both are quite unlikely.

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It's definitely a conundrum.

 

Extend him for $20-$25m and he balls out. Will be a great deal.

 

Extend him for $20-$25m and he doesn't live up to expectations and you are spending 8% of cap space on a QB who isn't the future.

 

Not sure what will happen. I'm sure he will be getting more money for sure. Pay raise or extension? Idk? Rooting for raise at this point.

 

I'm sure if JB sees that in good faith we gave him more money(this year), when we didn't HAVE to. If he plays good and we want to extend him, he will feel good about it. Push comes to shove we could Transition tag him if need be.

 

Better than being on the hook for $30-$40m over next couple years without knowing how he is going to play.

 

I think that is probably what works best for JB as well. He could agree to a 3yr $60m deal and if he balls out he will be making less than he should.

 

Makes sense to use this season as a measuring stick for a contract.

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7 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Bottom line people who think the Colts are in a position of power here are kidding themselves.  Chad Kelly mania notwithstanding Brissett is the only show in town right now and he has the ability to simply sit on his hands, play out the season, sign nothing, and test the waters of FA with at least half a dozen teams being interested in what he has to offer. 

 

What's more, Brissett has had a front row seat to how it ended with the last quarterback.  We may be behind a bigger 8 ball than we think.

 

Bottom line we're going to have to make it worthwhile to Brissett to hitch his wagon to the Colts organization and forgo the potential bounty in FA.  If we fail, our playoff window, which reduced when Luck retired but is still open a crack, instantly snaps closed for at least the next 2-3 years unless we hit a home run in FA or Kelly is much closer to NFL readiness than I think he is.  Both are quite unlikely.

If he did that he also takes a huge risk in losing  ton of money if it doesn’t work out. I don’t see him doing that. He knows he has a great situation here with a team that can be SB contenders.There are not going to be teams that are as loaded as we are need a QB.  Where else is he going to have as good of a situation that he is on now. This is a team that he can succeed with.

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Whatever happens, long-term, I'm not worried about losing Brissett.  Maybe in 2019 he changes my mind, but until he proves otherwise, he's a replaceable backup.

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2 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

Was SF stupid to give Jimmy G all that money. JB was a pretty high draft pick. He looks like a starting QB to me. He has a presence about him. I think he is ready. He is in a great situation.

 

SF had to sign Jimmy G because he was an impending FA that they traded for halfway through the year...and he looked amazing in his brief stint as a starter that year.

 

Brissett has yet to look nearly as good as Jimmy G did when started. Giving him an extension now has little value to the Colts.

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38 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

I think you have to give Brissett an extension if you can

 

The odds of Chad Kelly actually maturing into the starting QB his superfans are telling us he will be are actually moderately low. and the odds of us holding onto control of him long enough for him to finish developing here are even lower. 

 

We're already on the cusp of having to do some roster math just to keep Kelly and still have a starting QB and decent backup, neither of which Kelly is right now. 

 

If we "play stupid games" with Brissett's contract one of the "stupid prizes" we win is a distinct possibility of losing Brissett with no viable replacement and having to go onto the market from a position of desperation, which is far worse and more expensive, believe me, than securing the bird in the hand first and paying the one guy we do have who's an actual starting quarterback.

 

This is not an environment where we need to be out there being "clever."  Rule 1 of roster management: secure your foundation, then build on it.  We need Brissett for at least the next 2 years which means a contract for 3 years is a minimum for the Colts, and it's probably going to be 3 years at a higher dollar value than you guys are hoping.

 

I think we do sign Brissett, and I think we sign him for 3 years at around 65-70M, or a little over $20M/year.  Given what good quarterbacks are getting in free agency that's a pretty fair valuation level for the contract of a guy like Brissett who, while unproven, is widely considered a very solid bet to start successfully in the NFL

 

If instead we try to play games, lose Brissett, and have the choice of the free agency roulette or he complete lottery ticket that is Chad Kelly, I think this franchise is much worse off than it will be by paying Brissett a fair wage, and THEN machinating about how to make him expendable.  you can do both at the same time you know.

 

That is pure madness...giving Brissett $22-23M/year. That is not far from what Luck was getting. 

 

The Colts can always tag him...so there's no losing Brissett after this season and being stuck without a viable replacement. But for that to even happen...he has to prove he is foundational piece.

 

The Colts have Hoyer locked up for a few year...so they now they can play it out and see what happens this season. There is little upsidie to giving Brissett an big extension right now.

 

 

 

 

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Every QB In the league even the elite ones start out as unproven. Being a top pick doesn’t mean your going to be great.  This organization is ready to win now. They  aren’t going to start over with a unknown QB right now. JB has been in this system going on two years. He has already built chemistry with TY and Doyle. He is going to do just fine. Reich and Ballard see him everyday. I trust them if they think he is the future.

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46 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

 

That is pure madness...giving Brissett $22-23M/year. That is not far from what Luck was getting. 

 

The Colts can always tag him...so there's no losing Brissett after this season and being stuck without a viable replacement. But for that to even happen...he has to prove he is foundational piece.

 

The Colts have Hoyer locked up for a few year...so they now they can play it out and see what happens this season. There is little upsidie to giving Brissett an big extension right now.

 

 

 

 

While I am not a fan of signing JB to an extension at that price right now, the Franchise Tag would be 30,600,000.  Quite the conundrum indeed my friend!  I am hopeful he either balls out and earns it or fails and doesn't. lol!

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Hopefully the Colts came at him with an team friendly extension(3yr $30-$36m) and he turned it down?

 

I would love for him to playout the final year and earn the money. Hopefully thats what ends up happening, but as I've mentioned all day, I would much rather give him a raise this year than gamble future dollars on an unknown. Still feel like he will be getting a raise either way.

 

I don't think we will have a problem signing him to a new deal if he performs well.

 

 

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20 minutes ago, Coltsfan66 said:

While I am not a fan of signing JB to an extension at that price right now, the Franchise Tag would be 30,600,000.  Quite the conundrum indeed my friend!  I am hopeful he either balls out and earns it or fails and doesn't. lol!

 

A Transition Tag for a QB cost $22.8M this year. I can't imagine it will be much more than that next year...maybe $1M more. If some team wants to give Brissett more than that...so be it.

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1 hour ago, shastamasta said:

 

That is pure madness...giving Brissett $22-23M/year. That is not far from what Luck was getting. \

 

 

Then Luck was underpaid.

 

Look around the league at what top QBs are earning these days.  22M isn't what you pay for elite quarterbacks anymore, it's what you pay for quarterbacks.  Period. The Stafford and Garoppolo contract blew the floodgates open in the last couple years,  everyone's in a rush to cash in.

 

Considering there's almost never 1 starting caliber quarterback per team, quarterback contracts are always going to be a seller's market.  Accept that or get out of the business.

 

And hey, we can go ahead and refuse to meet the market for UFA talent and them go ahead and reap the consequences when no one will re-sign with us for a price we're willing to pay.  That's a thing that can happen.

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5 minutes ago, Imgrandojji said:

Then Luck was underpaid.

 

Look around the league at what top QBs are earning these days.  22M isn't what you pay for elite quarterbacks anymore, it's what you pay for quarterbacks.  Period. The Stafford and Garoppolo contract blew the floodgates open in the last couple years, not everyone's in a rush to cash in.

 

Considering there's almost never 1 starting caliber quarterback per team, quarterback contracts are always going to be a seller's market.  Accept that or get out of the business.

 

And hey, we can go ahead and refuse to meet the market for UFA talent and them go ahead and reap the consequences when no one will re-sign with us for a price we're willing to pay.  That's a thing that can happen.

 

$22M is what you pay for proven starting QBs. Brissett is not proven...and the Colts don't have any reason or need to act out of desperation. They have a tryout year for Brissett to prove he can be that guy (he's not as of now IMO...but I haven't seen him enough).

 

There is little upside to giving him big money right now...mostly risk. In the very best scenario, you are saving a couple million dollars per year on him...vs what he might get on the FA market.

 

Reap the consequences of not overpaying for players? That doesn't even make sense. As we have learned...Ballard sets a price...and that is typically that. And all you hear about is how Ballard takes care of his guys...so I highly doubt that any dealings with Brissett (short of cutting him tomorrow)...is going to have any effect on future dealings  with current Colts (Leonard, Nelson, Hooker, etc.).

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1 hour ago, shastamasta said:

 

A Transition Tag for a QB cost $22.8M this year. I can't imagine it will be much more than that next year...maybe $1M more. If some team wants to give Brissett more than that...so be it.

I gave the quote for this year as a Franchise tag, which you spoke about.  

 

EDIT:  You said "Tag"...very vague indeed, though I assumed and shouldn't have.

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What do you guys think these extension numbers will look like?

 

Anything less than 3yr $45m I will be ok. Anything more is major gamble.

 

Unless it was 2yr $40m or something?

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