Jump to content
Indianapolis Colts
Indianapolis Colts Fan Forum

Why Former Colt Pierre Garcon Will Not Do Well With The Skins


Andy

Recommended Posts

This is the reason why the Skins would not be a good fit for Garcon.

Number 2 receivers are sometimes meant to be number 2 receivers. They get the #2 cornerbacks and they're not as worrisome as the #1 receiver who teams tend to plan against. Pierre Garcon has played as the #2 WR for the Colts the past 2.5 seasons. He's been a very good deep threat for many, but has been too inconsistent at times. Does this remind you of someone...

...Alvin Harper

Alvin Harper of the Cowboys was one of the best #2 receivers back in the 90's with Michael Irvin being the #1. He was so good because he was the #2 wide receiver and Irvin was a more worrisome threat. Every team defended against Smith, Irvin and Aikman. Nothing about Harper, but Harper ended up having several good seasons getting to 850 yards in one season.

One thing Alvin Harper and Garcon had in common was the fact that they were deep threats. Deep threats are #2 WR, and you'll never find a pure deep threat receiver be a number 1 WR, except Desean Jackson. Mike Wallace, Vincent Jackson and Percy Harvin are reliable receivers too with good hands. Deep threats that are #2 dont transition well to the #1 receiver spot in a new different system.

Now that Garcon is with the Redskins, he must adapt to a new lifestyle. He's in a city where the spotlight is always on that division. They have a new QB, who may not pan out (but he probably will). That team in general looks like it's declining and not getting better, since some of their FAs are not coming back. They play Mike Shannahan's run heavy variation of the West Coast offense. It's going to be tough for a deep threat to become the new #1 reliable guy playing in a new offense, new city, new coach and a QB who's going to be a rookie. These are all signs that he will probably not pan out with the Skins.

I love ya Pierre, but not the best choice to join the Skins.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The guy had 900+ yards with Kerry Collins, Curtis Painter and Dan Orvlosky (granted he played pretty well towards the end). Also dont forget probably one of the most clueless coaching in the NFL. I think he'll be ok with RG3 and shany.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The guy had 900+ yards with Kerry Collins, Curtis Painter and Dan Orvlosky (granted he played pretty well towards the end). I think he'll be ok with RG3.

Keep in mind that he had 150 of those yards on 2 catches, and 275 yards on 7 catches. The season he had this year was very overrated because of how the fans are saying it is. He had a good year without PM, but it wasn't that great of a year. It was average. Just take out those 7 catches and he's average. Proves he's a deep threat only, but his consistency got a bit better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ehh I think he'll be about the same as he was for the Colts...don't think he'll improve any really and don't think he'll get any worse either.

But he has a bigger role. He's setting himself up for failure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I could see him and rg3 being the cam newton/steve smith version of this year, though not as good. Rg3 is known for his great deep balls. And the system they run in washington focuses quite a bit on roll outs and bootlegs, giving pierre more chances to go deep. I bet he'll do ok. Hes only gonna be 26 starting this year. In two or three years, i bet he and rg3 will be pretty dangerous

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Keep in mind that he had 150 of those yards on 2 catches, and 275 yards on 7 catches. The season he had this year was very overrated because of how the fans are saying it is. He had a good year without PM, but it wasn't that great of a year. It was average. Just take out those 7 catches and he's average. Proves he's a deep threat only, but his consistency got a bit better.

Yeah but Garcon has that big play ability. Its partly why he's a good WR. He's also a pretty good route runner. He does have stone hands at times but I thought he was better last year in that regard.

I will agree he's probably not worth as much as he got. But I think he's one of 3 legitimately talented WRs this team has had in the Manning era (atleast since 2002): Reggie, Marvin and Garcon. Im not saying Garcon is as good as Marv and Reggie but he's a good player IMO. Stokley was probably next up but he was a decent slot receiver who greatly benefited from playing inside of Marv and Reggie and having Peyton Manning tossing him passes.

Manning has taken less talented WRs and turned them into halfway productive guys his entire career. Blair White is a prime example. Sorry Im kinda going tangential on this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Andy...

The Skins also signed Eddie Royal so Garcon probably won't have to be the number one over there. That said it is the Redskins and they are Daniel Snyder's team. Nothing they do ever seems to work out well. They definitely overpaid for what they will be getting. Still wish Garcon well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah but Garcon has that big play ability. Its partly why he's a good WR. He's also a pretty good route runner. He does have stone hands at times but I thought he was better last year in that regard.

I will agree he's probably not worth as much as he got. But I think he's one of 3 legitimately talented WRs this team has had in the Manning era (atleast since 2002): Reggie, Marvin and Garcon. Im not saying Garcon is as good as Marv and Reggie but he's a good player IMO. Stokley was probably next up but he was a decent slot receiver who greatly benefited from playing inside of Marv and Reggie and having Peyton Manning tossing him passes.

Manning has taken less talented WRs and turned them into halfway productive guys his entire career. Blair White is a prime example.

Big play ability, but that is not enough to become a #1 WR. He and deep threat only's are #2 guys at best. Although RG3 loves big play guys, like his man Kendall Wright, he will be going up against #1 CBs, which is very tough, especially in the NFC.

Sure he's up there in the top WRs since 2002, but I'd give the nod to Brandon Stokely. Was more consistent over a longer time, and put up great numbers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Skins also signed Eddie Royal so Garcon probably won't have to be the number one over there. That said it is the Redskins and they are Daniel Snyder's team. Nothing they do ever seems to work out well. They definitely overpaid for what they will be getting. Still wish Garcon well.

lol you think Eddie Royal will get the starting job over Pierre Garcon... Garcon is better than Royal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Big play ability, but that is not enough to become a #1 WR. He and deep threat only's are #2 guys at best. Although RG3 loves big play guys, like his man Kendall Wright, he will be going up against #1 CBs, which is very tough, especially in the NFC.

I def. agree he's not a true #1 now but its too early to tell whether he will become one or not IMO. But we'll see.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

lol you think Eddie Royal will get the starting job over Pierre Garcon... Garcon is better than Royal.

LOL you're right. Checked his stats. What was I thinking? Also I don't think it's definite yet that the Skins have actually signed Royal. Hearing that talks broke down somewhat but they are still in negotiations. So looks like I was wrong all the way around.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I def. agree he's not a true #1 now but its too early to tell whether he will become one or not IMO. But we'll see.

Fair enough, but I just see too many negative variables involved with this move.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Even though the 'Skins overpaid for Morgan and Garcon, they are more respectable in that area now.

Not sure if Gafney will be back, but I believe Moss is there to stay, and so is Fred Davis. And Leonard

Hankerson will be in his 2nd year and should be ready to go from his injury. So, all in all, RG3 has some

weapons at least. And Roy Helu can catch it out of the backfield.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Even though the 'Skins overpaid for Morgan and Garcon, they are more respectable in that area now.

Not sure if Gafney will be back, but I believe Moss is there to stay, and so is Fred Davis. And Leonard

Hankerson will be in his 2nd year and should be ready to go from his injury. So, all in all, RG3 has some

weapons at least. And Roy Helu can catch it out of the backfield.

Too bad their defense will be losing some key players. Fletcher is likely gone and Landry is almost definitely gone. Hall is gone soon after this year and if I'm not mistaken, Orapko's still in his rookie deal and will demand a big contract. The Redskins can't kill themselves now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1: He's WAY overpaid, and Dan Snyder is famous for overpaypaying players and price-gouging fans (Google it)

2: He's not proven at catching balls not thrown to by Peyton Manning. A LOT of drops last year. SB loss as well...whatever

3. RG3 is a "late in the season"/"flash in the pan" type of player that is somewhat typical of college football hype from year to year

I'm honestly shocked that Redskins fans haven't had a full-on revolt. A once winnning & proud franchise is willfully sucking year after year due to a TERRIBLE owner. We should all rejoice that we have JIM Irsay running the show!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Too bad their defense will be losing some key players. Fletcher is likely gone and Landry is almost definitely gone. Hall is gone soon after this year and if I'm not mistaken, Orapko's still in his rookie deal and will demand a big contract. The Redskins can't kill themselves now.

Landry isn't much of a loss. Fletcher is a loss, but they still have a good defense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think garcon will hit 1,000 yards in washington. with gaffney,santana moss, hankerson, terrance austin, garcon will fit in just fine and their still not done yet. their talking about signing 3 WR's this off season, so they could sign someone like brandon lloyd, mario manningham etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Landry isn't much of a loss. Fletcher is a loss, but they still have a good defense.

Sure he was injured quite a bit in the last 2 years, but when healthy he was "a Pro Bowl safety" according to many like his coach Mike Shannahan. Fletcher is a huge loss. He's the captain and best player of that defense. He is a tacking machine who's great in coverage. The ageless. Landry and Fletcher are two great losses, and two good acquisitions for other teams.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1: He's WAY overpaid, and Dan Snyder is famous for overpaypaying players and price-gouging fans (Google it)

2: He's not proven at catching balls not thrown to by Peyton Manning. A LOT of drops last year. SB loss as well...whatever

3. RG3 is a "late in the season"/"flash in the pan" type of player that is somewhat typical of college football hype from year to year

I'm honestly shocked that Redskins fans haven't had a full-on revolt. A once winnning & proud franchise is willfully sucking year after year due to a TERRIBLE owner. We should all rejoice that we have JIM Irsay running the show!

i dont know what garcon your watching, but the garcon who was wearing an indy uniform was pretty decent given the situation last year. still caught for 940 yards and a team leading 6 TD's. i mean if thats not good then heck you have to high of standards for everyone on the colts team and you must be miserable every year when those expectations are not met. with Collins, painter and orlovsky throwing to him he did pretty good, pretty well matched his numbers when manning was throwing to him. he will be fine in washington.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i dont know what garcon your watching, but the garcon who was wearing an indy uniform was pretty decent given the situation last year. still caught for 940 yards and a team leading 6 TD's. i mean if thats not good then heck you have to high of standards for everyone on the colts team and you must be miserable every year when those expectations are not met. with Collins, painter and orlovsky throwing to him he did pretty good, pretty well matched his numbers when manning was throwing to him. he will be fine in washington.

Again 275 yards of those catches came on 7 catches, and 150 of them came on two. Stop using the stats as points, because it's not that impressive when you really look into them. Without those 7 catches, it's just an average year for Garcon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

...So he should play it safe for the rest of his career and try not to be all he thinks he can be?

Or he could do something he hasn't done. Work his butt off in the offseason and get all his weaknesses off his back. He needs to have better hands and better route running skills. If he can fix all his weaknesses, he can become a very good receiver in this league. Problem is, I don't think he does that. I don't know what you mean by play it safe? Do you mean, staying low, not opening your mouth, working hard and trying on the field?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1: He's WAY overpaid, and Dan Snyder is famous for overpaypaying players and price-gouging fans (Google it)

2: He's not proven at catching balls not thrown to by Peyton Manning. A LOT of drops last year. SB loss as well...whatever

3. RG3 is a "late in the season"/"flash in the pan" type of player that is somewhat typical of college football hype from year to year

I'm honestly shocked that Redskins fans haven't had a full-on revolt. A once winnning & proud franchise is willfully sucking year after year due to a TERRIBLE owner. We should all rejoice that we have JIM Irsay running the show!

He had more drops in 2010.

I dont get the hate for Garcon, he had a really good year and was the #1 target for the majority of the season until Reggie picked it up in the end. Garcon nd RG3 have the potential to be a very good combination. Who knows, with his speed, their playbook also has alot of potential

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Or he could do something he hasn't done. Work his butt off in the offseason and get all his weaknesses off his back. He needs to have better hands and better route running skills. If he can fix all his weaknesses, he can become a very good receiver in this league. Problem is, I don't think he does that. I don't know what you mean by play it safe? Do you mean, staying low, not opening your mouth, working hard and trying on the field?

I mean play safe by not trying to take a bigger role as a WR, teamate etc. He's taking a shot at a bigger role that isn't with us. There's one thing to resign on a team and overall keep your same role, there's a completely different thing in signing with another team expecting you to step up to a higher role. He's taking a chance for a bigger role in WAS.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I mean play safe by not trying to take a bigger role as a WR, teamate etc. He's taking a shot at a bigger role that isn't with us. There's one thing to resign on a team and overall keep your same role, there's a completely different thing in signing with another team expecting you to step up to a higher role. He's taking a chance for a bigger role in WAS.

I completely agree with you. It's going to be too overwhelming for Pierre.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So the skins now have Anthony Armstrong, Jabar Gaffney, Santana Moss, Josh Morgan, Pierre Garcon, Eddie Royal & Leonard Hankerson. That is a loaded bunch but is anyone other than Moss a #1?

Moss has been the downfield threat for a while now so with the addition of Pierre it might make Moss' days numbered and if that happens they are back to square one and no real standout (on paper) as a #1 threat. It appears that they are looking at the Al Davis school of WR's.... get em fast so you can overthrow them.

Redskins have made many mistakes in the past and I feel that this is not an off year for them. Good luck PG! You are going to need it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So the skins now have Anthony Armstrong, Jabar Gaffney, Santana Moss, Josh Morgan, Pierre Garcon, Eddie Royal & Leonard Hankerson. That is a loaded bunch but is anyone other than Moss a #1?

Moss has been the downfield threat for a while now so with the addition of Pierre it might make Moss' days numbered and if that happens they are back to square one and no real standout (on paper) as a #1 threat. It appears that they are looking at the Al Davis school of WR's.... get em fast so you can overthrow them.

Redskins have made many mistakes in the past and I feel that this is not an off year for them. Good luck PG! You are going to need it!

Exactly. It is almost like people forgot about Santana Moss suddenly. I think Garcon will open things up for others, if not produce himself, IMO. Now, teams will have to decide whether safety has to roll towards Santana Moss or Garcon. The question is, does Santana Moss still have gas in the tank. If no is the answer, Garcon's production will be hit and miss.

Garcon has never played with a scrambling QB, like Hines Ward has with Big Ben. We will find out if Garcon, if he cannot get open immediately, can manage to get open with a scrambling QB.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Again 275 yards of those catches came on 7 catches, and 150 of them came on two. Stop using the stats as points, because it's not that impressive when you really look into them. Without those 7 catches, it's just an average year for Garcon.

ummm with out anyones catches their not that impressive. i dont know how you think yardage is obtained, but you actually have to catch the ball to get those yards whether its 1 catch for 100 yards or 10 catches for 200 yards, there is alot more to playing WR then catching. maybe you never played football before other then backyard football, but in football you have to try to beat the corner back off the line and out work him physically just to get open to catch the ball.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ummm with out anyones catches their not that impressive. i dont know how you think yardage is obtained, but you actually have to catch the ball to get those yards whether its 1 catch for 100 yards or 10 catches for 200 yards, there is alot more to playing WR then catching. maybe you never played football before other then backyard football, but in football you have to try to beat the corner back off the line and out work him physically just to get open to catch the ball.

haha, thanks I know how to play receiver. I've said this before many times, I played wide receiver in University for the McGill Redman and was top 6 in YAC and TDs in CIS history and top 4 in yards. I was then offered a practice squad contract with the Omaha Nighthawks, and I played there for 3 weeks before getting cut. I know how to play receiver. I'll tell you what receiver is about: catching, route running, speed, physicality, explosition and smarts. Those are the very important traits of a great wide receiver. Now about Garcon...

He still got to 950 yards which is very impressive, but you have to look at the fact that he got 275 of those yards on 7 catches. I'm saying he's a deep threat receiver, and deep threat receiver don't work well as #1. What's more impressive to you, 8 catches for 150 yards or 2 catches for 150 yards. 8 catches cause he says more about the receiver.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

haha, thanks I know how to play receiver. I've said this before many times, I played wide receiver in University for the McGill Redman and was top 6 in YAC and TDs in CIS history and top 4 in yards. I was then offered a practice squad contract with the Omaha Nighthawks, and I played there for 3 weeks before getting cut. I know how to play receiver. I'll tell you what receiver is about: catching, route running, speed, physicality, explosition and smarts. Those are the very important traits of a great wide receiver. Now about Garcon...

He still got to 950 yards which is very impressive, but you have to look at the fact that he got 275 of those yards on 7 catches. I'm saying he's a deep threat receiver, and deep threat receiver don't work well as #1. What's more impressive to you, 8 catches for 150 yards or 2 catches for 150 yards. 8 catches cause he says more about the receiver.

ok i just looked at garcons career game by game stats including playoffs, he has never broke 200 yards in a game. so where is it your seeing he had 7 catches for 275 yards? because i dont see it and i have looked 4 times since his rookie year

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ok i just looked at garcons career game by game stats including playoffs, he has never broke 200 yards in a game. so where is it your seeing he had 7 catches for 275 yards? because i dont see it and i have looked 4 times since his rookie year

In Week 4 and Week 5 this year, he combined for that total.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...