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NannyMcafee

Andrew Luck vs Peyton Manning.

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21 hours ago, superrep1967 said:

Yes very well put I was thinking the same thing you just spelled it out better...lol That's also why if everything falls into place we could be in the Super Bowl but like I said everything has to go well with injuries and a little Luck no pun intended.  

yup. if we can keep away from the injury bug, it's simply all about execution and living up to what we did last year.

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1 hour ago, Irish YJ said:

yup. if we can keep away from the injury bug, it's simply all about execution and living up to what we did last year.

 

With more intense practices you'll notice that last year was one of our least injured years in quite a long time!

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1 minute ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

With more intense practices you'll notice that last year was one of our least injured years in quite a long time!

Mack was out more or less the first 3rd of the season. AC was hobbled. Doyle was hobbled. Cain, who I'm sure they expected something out of was out. And the WR was pure mediocre after TY.

 

That's our lead RB. Our LT (arguably the most important OL position), and our TE that was PB the year before. You can call it least injured in several years, but it really sucked for a QB that was just coming back from a severe injury. Add in a new O scheme. Add in that our best (thought to be at the time) FA add (Grant) sucked

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@NewColtsFan

 

is your "sad" "reaction" a disagreement to most of my posts? 

 

if so, feel free to challenge with a reply. you're constant "sad" faces are pretty weak. happy to debate with fact and data.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Irish YJ said:

Mack was out more or less the first 3rd of the season. AC was hobbled. Doyle was hobbled. Cain, who I'm sure they expected something out of was out. And the WR was pure mediocre after TY.

 

That's our lead RB. Our LT (arguably the most important OL position), and our TE that was PB the year before. You can call it least injured in several years, but it really sucked for a QB that was just coming back from a severe injury. Add in a new O scheme. Add in that our best (thought to be at the time) FA add (Grant) sucked

 

I am just happy there seems to be an increase in our teams health. It is something to be happy about.

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20 minutes ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

I am just happy there seems to be an increase in our teams health. It is something to be happy about.

Amen brother.

 

I'm lighting candles nightly too.

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58 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

@NewColtsFan

 

is your "sad" "reaction" a disagreement to most of my posts? 

 

if so, feel free to challenge with a reply. you're constant "sad" faces are pretty weak. happy to debate with fact and data.

 

 

I don’t care if you find my “sad” reactions are weak.    I find your views of the Colts....   unique.    Makes me wonder how many games you were actually able to view last year?

 

As for your claims of using facts and data....  don’t forget opinion.   You live yours (which’s fine),  but sometimes you think your opinion is fact.   Those have drawn some of my sad faces...  and even some laughing faces too. 

 

Camp starts in a week...   plenty for you to opine on.... 

 

 

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It is too early to rank Andrew all-time, his career is only half over. Mt Rushmore is obviously Brady/Montana/Unitas/Peyton based on being a winner, stats, MVP's, etc.. Trying to compare Andrew to Peyton isn't fair as of now. Lets do it 5 years from now. Lets compare Andrew to guys like Watson, Mariota, Winston, Wentz, Wilson, Foles, Goff, RG3, Carr, Cousins, Newton, and now Mahomes = this era. That is fair. Andrew is better than all of them except Mahomes, that is pretty even. He is better than Wilson IMO but Wilson has a SB win so I guess some could debate that. He also had a stacked team when he won his. Foles has a SB win too but anyone with half a brain knows Andrew is better than Foles.

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9 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It is too early to rank Andrew all-time, his career is only half over. Mt Rushmore is obviously Brady/Montana/Unitas/Peyton based on being a winner, stats, MVP's, etc.. Trying to compare Andrew to Peyton isn't fair as of now. Lets do it 5 years from now. Lets compare Andrew to guys like Watson, Mariota, Winston, Wentz, Wilson, Foles, Goff, RG3, Carr, Cousins, Newton, and now Mahomes = this era. That is fair. Andrew is better than all of them except Mahomes, that is pretty even. He is better than Wilson IMO but Wilson has a SB win so I guess some could debate that. He also had a stacked team when he won his. Foles has a SB win too but anyone with half a brain knows Andrew is better than Foles.

 

Why is that Mt. Rushmore of yours so obvious?  Couldn't an obvious group of 4 include Elway?  Or Sammy Baugh or Dan Marino or Roger Staubach or Terry Bradshaw?  

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3 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

Why is that Mt. Rushmore of yours so obvious?  Couldn't an obvious group of 4 include Elway?  Or Sammy Baugh or Dan Marino or Roger Staubach or Terry Bradshaw?  

I guess it could be different, which yours? What I listed is what a lot of people think. I love Elway to be honest. 

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9 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I guess it could be different, which yours? What I listed is what a lot of people think. I love Elway to be honest. 

 

I think such rankings are a complete waste of time.  They are all great.

 

The only clearly obvious one to me who belongs on Mt. Rushmore is Brady.  You can have a legitimate debate on about 10 more QB's and none of them would be wrong.  Any list that leaves off Brady is simply wrong to me.

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10 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

I think such rankings are a complete waste of time.  They are all great.

 

The only clearly obvious one to me who belongs on Mt. Rushmore is Brady.  You can have a legitimate debate on about 10 more QB's and none of them would be wrong.  Any list that leaves off Brady is simply wrong to me.

Brady belongs easily IMO,

 

I think Montana belongs too because he won 4 SB's with no INT's in any of those SB's. He was so much better than Bradshaw IMO. Peyton belongs because he won 5 MVP's, nobody will ever do that again in NFL history IMO. He also won 2 SB's with 2 different teams - he was a history maker, nobody has done that either as a starter. That 4th spot is debatable but to leave off someone like Unitas seems crazy to me. I do like Elway a lot though from my eye test.

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12 hours ago, jskinnz said:

 

I think such rankings are a complete waste of time.  They are all great.

 

The only clearly obvious one to me who belongs on Mt. Rushmore is Brady.  You can have a legitimate debate on about 10 more QB's and none of them would be wrong.  Any list that leaves off Brady is simply wrong to me.

 

I believe I am biased against Brady simply be ause everyone touts him as the GOAT. Not saying ita right, but the overall love he gets just annoys me. In all hes a pretty good guy based on what I have seen. For me it's like justin bieber. Hated him because no one would shut up. Its probably not fair of me. 

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This to me is a complete start over for his career. He didn’t have the supporting cast Manning had at the beginning. Also I have to say this about Luck. I have no clue why people are saying he doesn’t have a good touch on his throws. He has excellent touch. Remember the throw he made against the Texans to TY Hilton into triple coverage? He is finally in a offensive scheme the suits him best. He can finally throw them open in Reich offense. 

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21 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

yup. if we can keep away from the injury bug, it's simply all about execution and living up to what we did last year.

Our GM finally realized we need depth. Chris went out and got it. 

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Here's my opinion of what Peyton & Manning have in common:

 

They both play the QB position.

 

They both were drafted first overall.

 

They both were drafted by the Colts.

 

That's it.

 

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On 7/15/2019 at 4:20 AM, Jared Cisneros said:

I actually threw up in my mouth after reading this at 4 in the morning. They are nowhere near equal. Peyton Manning made 4 SB's and won 2, Luck hasn't even won a SB. Peyton won 5 MVP's, Luck hasn't won any. Peyton is literally a top 3 QB of all time, and a lot of his playing time was before the extreme passing era of today. Luck "might" be a top 3 QB today if he's lucky. 

 

You are lessening and insulting Peyton by saying Luck is equal to him in your eyes. Luck is clearly not equal yet, and you know it.

No arguing Peyton is  one if not the greatest regular season qbs thia of all time. When u compare his regular season performances to his play off performances, he under whelms.  He is a 9.5 to a  10 in the regular season and mayb a 5 in the playoffs and that maybe being generous.

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3 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

No arguing Peyton is  one if not the greatest regular season qbs thia of all time. When u compare his regular season performances to his play off performances, he under whelms.  He is a 9.5 to a  10 in the regular season and mayb a 5 in the playoffs and that maybe being generous.

I would give him a 10 for the regular season and a 6 for the post season. He has had 9 one and done's but also has been to 4 SB's, winning 2 of them. His record is 14-13 in the playoffs so he is even above .500. A 6 is fair IMO. 5 is too low.

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2 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would give him a 10 for the regular season and a 6 for the post season. He has had 9 one and done's but also has been to 4 SB's, winning 2 of them. His record is 14-13 in the playoffs so he is even above .500. A 6 is fair IMO. 5 is too low.

In comparison I would give Luck an 8 in the regular season which is very good. He has 4 seasons where he has led his teams to 10 wins or better and has made the playoffs 4 times. He gets a 5 for the post season so far which isn't bad. On a scale of 0-10, a 5 would be slightly above average. He is only 4-4 in the playoffs (but with a Title Game app) and everytime the Colts have lost, we have been the underdog. 2 of those losses are to stacked Pats teams.

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6 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

No arguing Peyton is  one if not the greatest regular season qbs thia of all time. When u compare his regular season performances to his play off performances, he under whelms.  He is a 9.5 to a  10 in the regular season and mayb a 5 in the playoffs and that maybe being generous.

Peyton was handicapped by Polian's poor drafting on defense and inability to build depth and a complete team. If we could match up with the Pats talent-wise in the 2000s, Dungy and Manning would of won us at least one more SB. Manning's success in Denver in his later years is proof in how talent-deficient this team was with Polian as GM compared to Denver when he had the same success there in 4 years as he had here in 14 years.

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3 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Peyton was handicapped by Polian's poor drafting on defense and inability to build depth and a complete team. If we could match up with the Pats talent-wise in the 2000s, Dungy and Manning would of won us at least one more SB. Manning's success in Denver in his later years is proof in how talent-deficient this team was with Polian as GM compared to Denver when he had the same success there in 4 years as he had here in 14 years.

I totally disagree.  U say that that Polian is to blame for not drafting a defense.  That basically supports my  assessment of Peyton in the playoffs. We drafted numerous high picks on the offensive side of the ball. The defense really didn't play all thay bad in the play offs if u consider the money and draft capital spent on that side of the baĺll. Now the offense on the other hand. They and Peyton put up star war numbers in the regular season only to fall on their faces in the playoffs. U cannot argue that and  u  cannot put the blame on Polian or the defense.

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5 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

In comparison I would give Luck an 8 in the regular season which is very good. He has 4 seasons where he has led his teams to 10 wins or better and has made the playoffs 4 times. He gets a 5 for the post season so far which isn't bad. On a scale of 0-10, a 5 would be slightly above average. He is only 4-4 in the playoffs (but with a Title Game app) and everytime the Colts have lost, we have been the underdog. 2 of those losses are to stacked Pats teams.

I rated him a 5 because in those 2 super bowl victories, Peyton was not a key contributor.

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40 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I rated him a 5 because in those 2 super bowl victories, Peyton was not a key contributor.

That is why I went a 6 because he won 2 SB's and went to 4. I would've went 7 but the 9 one and done's were glaring. I thought Peyton played a great 2nd half vs the Pats in 2006 and was good in the SB vs Chicago. In 2015 he played good vs the Pats again. Denver doesn't win that SB if Brock plays because I don't think he gets by the Pats, JMO.

 

6 to me just seems reasonable because at times in the playoffs he was good and his presence alone helped Denver in 2015. His comeback win vs the Pats in 2006 was just flat out great. His teams are also 3-1 vs Brady and BB in Title games. Peyton is without a doubt a 10 in the regular season. He is the best regular season QB ever IMO.

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11 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Here's my opinion of what Peyton & Manning have in common:

 

They both play the QB position.

 

They both were drafted first overall.

 

They both were drafted by the Colts.

 

That's it.

 

 

Maybe you should figure out that Peyton and Manning are the same person. Otherwise I dont think you know what they have in common besides everything. 

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On 7/19/2019 at 3:14 AM, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t care if you find my “sad” reactions are weak.    I find your views of the Colts....   unique.    Makes me wonder how many games you were actually able to view last year?

 

As for your claims of using facts and data....  don’t forget opinion.   You live yours (which’s fine),  but sometimes you think your opinion is fact.   Those have drawn some of my sad faces...  and even some laughing faces too. 

 

Camp starts in a week...   plenty for you to opine on.... 

 

Everyone has an opinion. I use facts/data/stats, to support the large majority of my opinions. If you disagree, I'd welcome facts/data/stats that support your disagreement. 

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3 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

 

Everyone has an opinion. I use facts/data/stats, to support the large majority of my opinions. If you disagree, I'd welcome facts/data/stats that support your disagreement. 

 

OK.....    if you insist.

 

I'll give you my favorite of yours.    And my post here will be long because there's so many facts on the other side of your argument.    But I'll list it all.

 

You have, in at least two threads that I'm aware of,  and two posts in one of those threads,  claimed that in your view,  Frank Reich was a poor play caller last year.     I confess I found that jaw dropping.  Simply astonishing.    You also said you hoped he'd be better this year.    I don't recall any argument you made for that.    And I found the view so stunning,  that this is why I wonder how many Colts games you actually watched last year?   Perhaps you didn't see most games and are relying on the box score and the play by play sheet?     But here would be my response....   again,  it's going to be long.

 

FACT:   Andrew Luck couldn't even practice with the team until camp opened in late July, and even then was on a limited pitch count.   He had to play his way into shape which didn't come until sometime in mid-late October.    Luck couldn't even throw a Hail Mary in September,  that's how poor his arm was.

 

FACT:   The team's offensive line,  now widely viewed as a strength,  had tough times for the first third of the season.   AC was out with his hammy,  and various players tried to hold down the RT spot until the Rookie, Smith,  finally did a solid job in October.

 

FACT:    We had a virtual unknown at running back.   Marlon Mack missed 4 games and surprised us all with what he delivered in the 12 games he played.

 

FACT:    Our WR core, was so poor,  that we used a TE, Eric Ebron,  to mostly play WR so there was a quality player opposite TYH.    It wasn't until the half-way point of the season,  that we plucked Darnelle Inman off the street and he immediately became our 2nd best true WR.   That's how poor out WR group was.

 

FACT:   Luck didn't have one of his favorite targets for most of the season.   Jack Doyle was hurt in September and we lost our best true tight end.    We used guys like Hewitt and Alie-Cox to fill-in.

 

And with all that working against us,  this is what Reich's offense did with what you believe was poor play calling......    Ready?

 

Scoring Offense:   5th in the NFL,  27 points per game.

 

3rd Down Offense:     1st in the NFL

 

Red Zone Offense:    5th in the NFL.

 

Passing Offense:      6th in the NFL.

 

Offensive Line:      1st in fewest sacks allowed.

 

I won't even go into individual achievements.    I think the facts speak for themselves.    I can't imagine what in the world your comeback argument is going to be.    But I'm quite sure you will have one.    Be my guest.    Make the case that Frank Reich had a poor year calling plays.

 

I think you've got your work cut out for you....

 

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On 7/19/2019 at 9:04 PM, a06cc said:

This to me is a complete start over for his career. He didn’t have the supporting cast Manning had at the beginning. Also I have to say this about Luck. I have no clue why people are saying he doesn’t have a good touch on his throws. He has excellent touch. Remember the throw he made against the Texans to TY Hilton into triple coverage? He is finally in a offensive scheme the suits him best. He can finally throw them open in Reich offense. 

 

No one is saying he doesn't hit his windows. And no one is saying he doesn't have good touch. The comparison was Peyton vs Andrew nothing bad was said about him. 

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19 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

OK.....    if you insist.

 

I'll give you my favorite of yours.    And my post here will be long because there's so many facts on the other side of your argument.    But I'll list it all.

 

You have, in at least two threads that I'm aware of,  and two posts in one of those threads,  claimed that in your view,  Frank Reich was a poor play caller last year.     I confess I found that jaw dropping.  Simply astonishing.    You also said you hoped he'd be better this year.    I don't recall any argument you made for that.    And I found the view so stunning,  that this is why I wonder how many Colts games you actually watched last year?   Perhaps you didn't see most games and are relying on the box score and the play by play sheet?     But here would be my response....   again,  it's going to be long.

 

FACT:   Andrew Luck couldn't even practice with the team until camp opened in late July, and even then was on a limited pitch count.   He had to play his way into shape which didn't come until sometime in mid-late October.    Luck couldn't even throw a Hail Mary in September,  that's how poor his arm was.

 

FACT:   The team's offensive line,  now widely viewed as a strength,  had tough times for the first third of the season.   AC was out with his hammy,  and various players tried to hold down the RT spot until the Rookie, Smith,  finally did a solid job in October.

 

FACT:    We had a virtual unknown at running back.   Marlon Mack missed 4 games and surprised us all with what he delivered in the 12 games he played.

 

FACT:    Our WR core, was so poor,  that we used a TE, Eric Ebron,  to mostly play WR so there was a quality player opposite TYH.    It wasn't until the half-way point of the season,  that we plucked Darnelle Inman off the street and he immediately became our 2nd best true WR.   That's how poor out WR group was.

 

FACT:   Luck didn't have one of his favorite targets for most of the season.   Jack Doyle was hurt in September and we lost our best true tight end.    We used guys like Hewitt and Alie-Cox to fill-in.

 

And with all that working against us,  this is what Reich's offense did with what you believe was poor play calling......    Ready?

 

Scoring Offense:   5th in the NFL,  27 points per game.

 

3rd Down Offense:     1st in the NFL

 

Red Zone Offense:    5th in the NFL.

 

Passing Offense:      6th in the NFL.

 

Offensive Line:      1st in fewest sacks allowed.

 

I won't even go into individual achievements.    I think the facts speak for themselves.    I can't imagine what in the world your comeback argument is going to be.    But I'm quite sure you will have one.    Be my guest.    Make the case that Frank Reich had a poor year calling plays.

 

I think you've got your work cut out for you....

 

I've cited just about every one of those facts. So thank you. Since you've listed all that, then you must agree that we have the physicality and talent to compete. I've been most critical of playing calling in only a few games (I'll address below). In terms of how much I watch, if I'm not travelling during the game, I'm watching (which was almost all last year)

 

So to play calling.... not much work. pretty easy.

 

Since you agree we have the physicality and talent, then why ------ with the least sacked QB, the 5 ranked scoring O, and the 6th ranked passing O, we could only muster 6 pts vs the 31st ranked passing defense and 27th ranked rushing defense? Our D held them to under there average on their home field, so the loss lays purely on the O. 

 

You can lay the blame either on the game plan / play calling, or Luck. IMO, the O game plan and play calling sucked. During the 1st half, I think we had 3 and outs the first 4 possessions (we only 5 in the first half). The play calling was predicable as hell. I think we only attempted passing the ball more than 10 yards down field twice. Mostly run on 1st down, short pass the rest... 

 

Everyone knew they were going to double TY yet you can tell a good majority of plays had him as the first read. There was a complete lack of creativity to get others free/open. Our RB average yards/carry wasn't bad at all. And the half time adjustments got us nowhere. Our next 4 drives had 5 or fewer plays and resulted in punts and one fumble. We didn't really move the ball at all except for two drives at the end of each half when we finally went deep.

 

So our D did their jobs. Our RB average was OK. So did Luck just suck that day, or was Reich's play calling to blame? I know where my vote is.

 

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Andrew is proving to be one of the best of his era.  Manning is one of the best of all time.  Probably in most people’s top five.  Andrew isn’t there.  That’s not a knock on Andrew.  He can win championships and be a great player and still not be Peyton.

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Why is it that I seem to be the only one talking about the FACT that in the Chiefs game....Smith, Leonard, and Nelson were all rookies...albeit, important rookies . They were training for the draft last year, never got any rest, and then played their first full NFL season into the playoffs for Pete's sake. Ever hear of the rookie wall?

 

We simply ran out of gas...on the road, to a rested team. Blaming the Chiefs game on play calling is laughable IMO. 

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On 7/14/2019 at 6:53 PM, NannyMcafee said:

Andrew is a great talent. And I have faith he can take us to many SB wins... I have been watching a lot of highlights of Colts of the 2000s, and Peyton Mannings touch on throws, just put you in awe of the amazingness of such a pass. How many touchdowns in the back corner of the endzone have we seen? 

 

Andrew is great and I wouldnt trade him for any in the league today. He doesn't have elite touch on his throws. And that's not to say he doesn't hit his windows. He does most of the time but I have yet to see his touch on throws reach that hight. It may be a boring observation but most are at this time of year. Is it preseason yet? 

 

One of Andrew's elite abilities is his pocket awareness from day one. 

 

 

 

You do realize when Manning was drafted in 98' he had a ton of talent around him and only managed to go 3-13 as a rookie. What did Manning have to work with offensively? Let's see.

Marshall Faulk, Marvin Harrison, Ken Dilger, Marcus Pollard, Tarik Glenn, Adam Meadows, Steve McKinney, Zack Crockett.

 

Jeff Saturday and Edgerrin came in 99.

 

Manning had Bill Polian as the Colts GM throughout his entire career in Indy. Manning always had a solid offensive line in front of him, and guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark for most of his tenure. I love Manning, but the guy had so much more around him than Luck, and Luck still managed to put together three consecutive 11-5 seasons, and multiple playoff wins while working with basically trash.

 

This is the first season I would actually feel comfortable comparing Luck and Manning since Andrew finally has talent and consistency on his side of the football for once.

 

Honestly, if both Manning and Luck were surrounded by the same exact offense, I would pick Luck over Manning every day of the week.

 

I don't know what film you're watching, but Andrew Luck has made a ton of throws that are elite level throws.

 

Just my two cents.

 

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On 7/15/2019 at 10:33 AM, Jared Cisneros said:

So you got nothing. You try and compare Dak to Mahomes (half the tds), and RGIII (a read option QB). Those guys rookie seasons stunk compared to Mahomes. Mahomes carries the team, Dak is a game manager, and RGIII could never throw an accurate pass longer than 10 yards.

 

Mahomes crushed these guys. No reason to think he'll fall off the map besides a slight decline except for the fact we all want him to so the Colts can make a few SB's.

No qb is thrown for 50 tds in consecutive  seasons.  If Mahomes  does that he may be the real deal. That being said I'd still take Luck over him as he has better pocket presence than Mahomes 

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New member, be gentle.   You can't compare Luck with Manning until Luck has as good a offensive line.   Luck reminds me more of Bert Jones.

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The biggest difference between Peyton & Andrew is, Peyton rubbed some dirt on his injuries, and Andrew forgot to do the same earlier in his career.  

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On 7/24/2019 at 1:29 AM, NewColtsFan said:

 

OK.....    if you insist.

 

I'll give you my favorite of yours.    And my post here will be long because there's so many facts on the other side of your argument.    But I'll list it all.

 

You have, in at least two threads that I'm aware of,  and two posts in one of those threads,  claimed that in your view,  Frank Reich was a poor play caller last year.     I confess I found that jaw dropping.  Simply astonishing.    You also said you hoped he'd be better this year.    I don't recall any argument you made for that.    And I found the view so stunning,  that this is why I wonder how many Colts games you actually watched last year?   Perhaps you didn't see most games and are relying on the box score and the play by play sheet?     But here would be my response....   again,  it's going to be long.

 

FACT:   Andrew Luck couldn't even practice with the team until camp opened in late July, and even then was on a limited pitch count.   He had to play his way into shape which didn't come until sometime in mid-late October.    Luck couldn't even throw a Hail Mary in September,  that's how poor his arm was.

 

FACT:   The team's offensive line,  now widely viewed as a strength,  had tough times for the first third of the season.   AC was out with his hammy,  and various players tried to hold down the RT spot until the Rookie, Smith,  finally did a solid job in October.

 

FACT:    We had a virtual unknown at running back.   Marlon Mack missed 4 games and surprised us all with what he delivered in the 12 games he played.

 

FACT:    Our WR core, was so poor,  that we used a TE, Eric Ebron,  to mostly play WR so there was a quality player opposite TYH.    It wasn't until the half-way point of the season,  that we plucked Darnelle Inman off the street and he immediately became our 2nd best true WR.   That's how poor out WR group was.

 

FACT:   Luck didn't have one of his favorite targets for most of the season.   Jack Doyle was hurt in September and we lost our best true tight end.    We used guys like Hewitt and Alie-Cox to fill-in.

 

And with all that working against us,  this is what Reich's offense did with what you believe was poor play calling......    Ready?

 

Scoring Offense:   5th in the NFL,  27 points per game.

 

3rd Down Offense:     1st in the NFL

 

Red Zone Offense:    5th in the NFL.

 

Passing Offense:      6th in the NFL.

 

Offensive Line:      1st in fewest sacks allowed.

 

I won't even go into individual achievements.    I think the facts speak for themselves.    I can't imagine what in the world your comeback argument is going to be.    But I'm quite sure you will have one.    Be my guest.    Make the case that Frank Reich had a poor year calling plays.

 

I think you've got your work cut out for you....

 

Not all heroes wear capes. You sir, nailed it!

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11 hours ago, DarkSuperman87 said:

Not all heroes wear capes. You sir, nailed it!

 

And you sir are very, very kind....

 

You words are much appreciated!   :thmup:

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On 7/30/2019 at 3:39 AM, DarkSuperman87 said:

 

 

 

You do realize when Manning was drafted in 98' he had a ton of talent around him and only managed to go 3-13 as a rookie. What did Manning have to work with offensively? Let's see.

Marshall Faulk, Marvin Harrison, Ken Dilger, Marcus Pollard, Tarik Glenn, Adam Meadows, Steve McKinney, Zack Crockett.

 

Jeff Saturday and Edgerrin came in 99.

 

Manning had Bill Polian as the Colts GM throughout his entire career in Indy. Manning always had a solid offensive line in front of him, and guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark for most of his tenure. I love Manning, but the guy had so much more around him than Luck, and Luck still managed to put together three consecutive 11-5 seasons, and multiple playoff wins while working with basically trash.

 

This is the first season I would actually feel comfortable comparing Luck and Manning since Andrew finally has talent and consistency on his side of the football for once.

 

Honestly, if both Manning and Luck were surrounded by the same exact offense, I would pick Luck over Manning every day of the week.

 

I don't know what film you're watching, but Andrew Luck has made a ton of throws that are elite level throws.

 

Just my two cents.

 

 

Never said he didnt make elite level throws.

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I think the great players on the team can be deceiving.   Although Manning was fortunate to have them on the team, he also made many of those player better than they were.

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16 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think the great players on the team can be deceiving.   Although Manning was fortunate to have them on the team, he also made many of those player better than they were.

 

I miss Manning to Torrance Small. What a combo!

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