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2015 vs 2019


CR91

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The colts haven't gotten this much media attention and super bowl hype since after the 2014 season when we went to the AFC Championship game. Usually in these type of circumstances, I would reiterate to not get ahead of ourselves, but this is a much different feel then 2015.

 

Coaching

 

Don't get me wrong, Pagano is a great guy, but as a coach he never improved our team imo especially on defense. Perhaps that is more of spite on Grigson for never providing the right talent rather that was draft (Green, Djoun Smith) or free agency (Art Jones, Laron Landry), however you just never got anything innovative from Pagano. He never made adjustments, his in-game decision making was very questionable, he was  non-aggressive to his game plan approach, and put way too much of the burden of winning on the shoulders of Andrew. You don't see that with Reich. He wants to win despite of Andrew. Yes he understands what he has in Andrew, but that doesn't mean the whole offense is reliant on only Andrew.  Perfect example is the cowboy game. Andrew only had 192 yards and no tds, but we had almost 180 yards rushing and two tds. We won despite Andrew not being at his best because we can win without the burden completely being on Andrew.

 

Talent

 

Let me make something clear, The colts are still a very young team. I would like to emphasize that and the reason we are young is because a lot of our team is homegrown, however that was not the case for the 2015 colts. If you look at the roster, there are a lot of FA or trade starters. Andre Johnson, Frank Gore, D'qwell Jackson, Jerrell Freeman, Erik Walden, Art Jones, Vontae Davis, Darius Butler, Mike Adams, Greg Toler. That is half the starters. The reason for that is because Grigson's drafts never seem to provide either a true difference maker or proper depth. In just three drafts from Ballard, We have re-vamped the oline, added more talent to the receiving game in Campbell, Pascal, and Hines, got a true three-down RB in Marlon Mack in the 4th round, along with adding actual talent to our defense in Leonard, Walker, Moore, and Hooker along with adding quality players in Wilson, Turay, and Lewis. 

 

Structure

 

With the current colts, you get what you see, a team built starting with the line with an established importance placed on the draft. With Grigson, there never seem to be a reason behind his plan to build the team. If we look at his first round picks, 2013 Werner, 2014 traded for Trent Richardson, 2015 Phillip Dorsett, 2016 Ryan Kelly. Three busts in the first round and a fourth when the line needed to be fixed three drafts ago. The only players currently in the NFL that were drafted by Grigson is six, Luck, Hilton, Allen, Geathers, Kelly, and Dorsett out of 5 drafts so with that in mind, that tells me Grigson did not put much importance to the draft and/or was not a adequate talent evaluator. Ballard's drafts have provided a number of starters and quality depth with so far only missing on Zach Banner and Tarrell Basham.  

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Great write up!  I'll give Grigson credit for drafting Hilton and Ryan Kelly.  He didn't get many picks rights, but we got two impactful players from his drafts.  Definitely not the ideal as you would want multiple impact players over that many drafts, but at least we got two studs out of it.  

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Grigson single handedly set this franchise back 4 yrs due to lack of talent on the roster and terrible trades!  What’s more depressing is he was a FORMER OL but couldn’t recognize OL talent if it hit him in the butt.  So refreshing we have a GM and scouts that get today’s NFL and know real talent!  Grigson was and still is a BAFOON

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49 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Grigson single handedly set this franchise back 4 yrs due to lack of talent on the roster and terrible trades!  What’s more depressing is he was a FORMER OL but couldn’t recognize OL talent if it hit him in the butt.  So refreshing we have a GM and scouts that get today’s NFL and know real talent!  Grigson was and still is a BAFOON

 

Just wanna say this is not a grigson bash thread. We've had enough of those. Im just pointing out the differences between how the two rosters were constructed

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I may be in the minority but I think the Colts are still currently a fringe playoff team. Every position group besides QB still has question marks.  The NFL season is a long grueling quest that requires a lot of luck and health. All it would take is a 3-4 injuries or the rest of the division to play up to its potential and we could be on the outside looking in. We need to see how the coaching staff develops young talent. I think they can and will make the playoffs but I wouldn’t call it a failure if we just missed out. 

 

Does AV finally get beat by Father Time? So many games decided bc of kicking. 

 

Can Hilton stay healthy? Colts offense takes a major step back when he is not himself. 

 

Will the new receivers play to their potential and fill their assigned roles? Everyone besides Hilton is new or still has the jury out on whether this is the year they develop. 

 

Does our secondary stay healthy and make the next step?  New and old faces have a lot to answer.  It’s a passing league and the pressure is on. 

 

Who will play next to DL and will he continue to play at a pro bowl level?  One of the best seasons I’ve seen from a LB but behind him who do we have?  A lot of potential that has me excited tho. 

 

Who a long the DL will become “the man”?  Does Houston transition back to a 4-3 well?  Do the young guys start to break out?  Can Autry continue to push up the middle?  

 

Will Marlon Mack be able to be the feature back?  I think he is capable but he needs to play at least 14 games to answer this question. 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I may be in the minority but I think the Colts are still currently a fringe playoff team. Every position group besides QB still has question marks.  The NFL season is a long grueling quest that requires a lot of luck and health. All it would take is a 3-4 injuries or the rest of the division to play up to its potential and we could be on the outside looking in. We need to see how the coaching staff develops young talent. I think they can and will make the playoffs but I wouldn’t call it a failure if we just missed out. 

 

Does AV finally get beat by Father Time? So many games decided bc of kicking. 

 

Can Hilton stay healthy? Colts offense takes a major step back when he is not himself. 

 

Will the new receivers play to their potential and fill their assigned roles? Everyone besides Hilton is new or still has the jury out on whether this is the year they develop. 

 

Does our secondary stay healthy and make the next step?  New and old faces have a lot to answer.  It’s a passing league and the pressure is on. 

 

Who will play next to DL and will he continue to play at a pro bowl level?  One of the best seasons I’ve seen from a LB but behind him who do we have?  A lot of potential that has me excited tho. 

 

Who a long the DL will become “the man”?  Does Houston transition back to a 4-3 well?  Do the young guys start to break out?  Can Autry continue to push up the middle?  

 

Will Marlon Mack be able to be the feature back?  I think he is capable but he needs to play at least 14 games to answer this question. 

 

 

 

 

 

Fair points, but every team has similar questions.

 

Will father time catch up to Brady?

How will they replace Gronk?

How will they replace Flowers?

Will their young guys step up?

Can Edelman pass a urine test?

 

Can Mahones duplicate last year?

How will they replace Hill?

Can Williams be the feature back?

How will they adjust to the new D scheme?

Can they find a pass rush without Houston and Ford?

Will their young guys step up?

 

 

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4 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I may be in the minority but I think the Colts are still currently a fringe playoff team. Every position group besides QB still has question marks.  The NFL season is a long grueling quest that requires a lot of luck and health. All it would take is a 3-4 injuries or the rest of the division to play up to its potential and we could be on the outside looking in. We need to see how the coaching staff develops young talent. I think they can and will make the playoffs but I wouldn’t call it a failure if we just missed out. 

 

Let me add one more question: how much Colts can improve "in-house" from year one to year two?

 

When reading these "how much team X improved in the offseason?" articles, almost none of them ask this question. Which bothers me, because this is as importan source of potential improvement as FA or the draft. Regarding the Colts, I think this might be the MOST important at the moment. There is no team in the NFL at the moment, who has more under 25 players on their roster, who actually contribute, than the Colts. Young players can improve a LOT from year one to year two, from year two to year 3, etc. Of course, not all of them do. But if you have 20 rookies, sophomores, juniors, who already play, then simply going by the statistics, you can expect that half of them will improve. Some of them will improve a lot.

 

On the contrary, the Colts have only very few "aging" players. Players, who might raise questions about whether father time is on the horizon. Vinatiery removed, the oldest player on the roster is Margus Hunt at 31. Who is a late boomer, a "football young" guy, who started playing football much later than usual. And then, Sheard, Houston and Castonzo are at 30 (which is - barring injuries - not old as OL/DE nowadays, many play their prime at this age), everyone else is under 30. But more importantly, most of them are under or closer to 25 than 30.

 

So in one hand, there are cca 2 dozen players who, just by nature, can improve because they are very young, and in the other hand, there is virtually no-one (excep Vinatieri), who, by his age, might realistically reach his decline. Some will, some won't, but the the two hands suggest, that the Colts have HUGE "in-house" improvement-potential. Probably the biggest in the league at the moment. (Along with the Browns. These are the two "destined-to-improve-the-most" teams by the composition of their respective rosters, in my opinion.)

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On 5/11/2019 at 4:16 PM, CR91 said:

The colts haven't gotten this much media attention and super bowl hype since after the 2014 season when we went to the AFC Championship game. Usually in these type of circumstances, I would reiterate to not get ahead of ourselves, but this is a much different feel then 2015.

 

Coaching

 

Don't get me wrong, Pagano is a great guy, but as a coach he never improved our team imo especially on defense. Perhaps that is more of spite on Grigson for never providing the right talent rather that was draft (Green, Djoun Smith) or free agency (Art Jones, Laron Landry), however you just never got anything innovative from Pagano. He never made adjustments, his in-game decision making was very questionable, he was  non-aggressive to his game plan approach, and put way too much of the burden of winning on the shoulders of Andrew. You don't see that with Reich. He wants to win despite of Andrew. Yes he understands what he has in Andrew, but that doesn't mean the whole offense is reliant on only Andrew.  Perfect example is the cowboy game. Andrew only had 192 yards and no tds, but we had almost 180 yards rushing and two tds. We won despite Andrew not being at his best because we can win without the burden completely being on Andrew.

 

Talent

 

Let me make something clear, The colts are still a very young team. I would like to emphasize that and the reason we are young is because a lot of our team is homegrown, however that was not the case for the 2015 colts. If you look at the roster, there are a lot of FA or trade starters. Andre Johnson, Frank Gore, D'qwell Jackson, Jerrell Freeman, Erik Walden, Art Jones, Vontae Davis, Darius Butler, Mike Adams, Greg Toler. That is half the starters. The reason for that is because Grigson's drafts never seem to provide either a true difference maker or proper depth. In just three drafts from Ballard, We have re-vamped the oline, added more talent to the receiving game in Campbell, Pascal, and Hines, got a true three-down RB in Marlon Mack in the 4th round, along with adding actual talent to our defense in Leonard, Walker, Moore, and Hooker along with adding quality players in Wilson, Turay, and Lewis. 

 

Structure

 

With the current colts, you get what you see, a team built starting with the line with an established importance placed on the draft. With Grigson, there never seem to be a reason behind his plan to build the team. If we look at his first round picks, 2013 Werner, 2014 traded for Trent Richardson, 2015 Phillip Dorsett, 2016 Ryan Kelly. Three busts in the first round and a fourth when the line needed to be fixed three drafts ago. The only players currently in the NFL that were drafted by Grigson is six, Luck, Hilton, Allen, Geathers, Kelly, and Dorsett out of 5 drafts so with that in mind, that tells me Grigson did not put much importance to the draft and/or was not a adequate talent evaluator. Ballard's drafts have provided a number of starters and quality depth with so far only missing on Zach Banner and Tarrell Basham.  

Grigson bashing aside, I think one big difference is their philosophy.  Grigson almost seemed like a message board user approach where you just looked for the talent available and added them to plug holes.  Ballard clearly is focused on 'what is our scheme and which players have the very specific special abilities I need to support that scheme?' and to me, that makes ALL the difference as long as your head coach is in sync with your GM, which was always the problem with Grigson and Pagano.   Either or both likely would have done better with a counter-part who they agreed with.  Ballard had a vision and he found his coach who shared his vision (and personality).  The funny part to me is that it is harder to see any of this working out as well with "that New England guy..."  at the helm last year and this.  Let's hope the harmony and scheme focus pays off. 

6 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I may be in the minority but I think the Colts are still currently a fringe playoff team. Every position group besides QB still has question marks.  The NFL season is a long grueling quest that requires a lot of luck and health. All it would take is a 3-4 injuries or the rest of the division to play up to its potential and we could be on the outside looking in. We need to see how the coaching staff develops young talent. I think they can and will make the playoffs but I wouldn’t call it a failure if we just missed out. 

 

Does AV finally get beat by Father Time? So many games decided bc of kicking. 

 

Can Hilton stay healthy? Colts offense takes a major step back when he is not himself. 

 

Will the new receivers play to their potential and fill their assigned roles? Everyone besides Hilton is new or still has the jury out on whether this is the year they develop. 

 

Does our secondary stay healthy and make the next step?  New and old faces have a lot to answer.  It’s a passing league and the pressure is on. 

 

Who will play next to DL and will he continue to play at a pro bowl level?  One of the best seasons I’ve seen from a LB but behind him who do we have?  A lot of potential that has me excited tho. 

 

Who a long the DL will become “the man”?  Does Houston transition back to a 4-3 well?  Do the young guys start to break out?  Can Autry continue to push up the middle?  

 

Will Marlon Mack be able to be the feature back?  I think he is capable but he needs to play at least 14 games to answer this question. 

 

 

 

 

 

A lot of fair questions.  Optimism has a way of glossing over all of it.  I think I lean more positive than negative on many of those concerns, but you may be right, if a couple of them tip to the negative, it could be a massive downturn that takes Colts fans for an unexpected ride.   As long as Luck is healthy, it is unlikely we spiral, but without most of your points going the positive way, he could really struggle to get us anywhere and then even if we make it, we could see a similar result.   

4 hours ago, coltsva said:

Fair points, but every team has similar questions.

 

Will father time catch up to Brady?

How will they replace Gronk?

How will they replace Flowers?

Will their young guys step up?

Can Edelman pass a urine test?

 

Can Mahones duplicate last year?

How will they replace Hill?

Can Williams be the feature back?

How will they adjust to the new D scheme?

Can they find a pass rush without Houston and Ford?

Will their young guys step up?

 

 

This was a brilliant reminder that all teams have legit questions.  There WILL be a day when it all falls apart for New England.  (Just like it should have fallen apart for say Golden State, yet they kept right on track when things looked grim).  I think KC will struggle to win their division this year unless San Diego's list of issues (you could have made) goes bust for their team.  

 

I have to say to all 3 of you, that was one of the best post/counter post/counter posts threesomes I have ever seen on here.  Thanks to all 3 of you.  

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