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Kiper: "Ballard does it again. This is my favorite draft class."

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10 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

Ultimately, you may be right........

 

There were PLENTY of games where Inman was the clear number 2, on this team 

 

He and Luck built a chemistry

 

I think he may be back

 

 

I say not.  To many guys competing for jobs. They need to get more explosive at wr.  Let's c what the young guys can do.  Campbell, Cain and Fountain 

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Looks like Mel is more interested in everyone liking him.   C+ is his worst grade.

 

2019 NFL draft grades: Kiper on all 32 classes, best picks and steals

Indianapolis Colts: A
Top needs: wide receiver, edge rush, cornerback

Cincinnati Bengals: A-
Top needs: Linebacker, offensive line, quarterback

Cleveland Browns: A-
Top needs: Defensive back, offensive tackle, inside linebacker

New England Patriots: A-
Top needs: Tight end, wide receiver, quarterback

Washington Redskins: A-
Top needs: Quarterback, edge rush, offensive line

Arizona Cardinals: B+
Top needs: Wide receiver, offensive line, tight end

Baltimore Ravens: B+
Top needs: Guard/center, wide receiver, linebacker

Buffalo Bills: B+
Top needs: Defensive tackle, tight end, wide receiver

Chicago Bears: B+
Top needs: Running back, defensive back, tight end

Denver Broncos: B+
Top needs: Tight end, linebacker, quarterback

Pittsburgh Steelers: B+
Top needs: Cornerback, inside linebacker, wide receiver

Atlanta Falcons: B
Top needs: Defensive tackle, cornerback, offensive line

Jacksonville Jaguars: B
Top needs: Offensive line, tight end, wide receiver

Miami Dolphins: B
Top needs: Quarterback, defensive line, offensive line

Minnesota Vikings: B
Top needs: Offensive line, wide receiver, defensive tackle

New York Jets: B
Top needs: Edge rush, wide receiver, tight end

Oakland Raiders: B
Top needs: Edge rush, running back, cornerback

Philadelphia Eagles: B
Top needs: Safety, offensive tackle, defensive line

Seattle Seahawks: B
Top needs: Wide receiver, defensive back, defensive line

Tennessee Titans: B
Top needs: Defensive tackle, tight end, outside linebacker

Dallas Cowboys: B-
Top needs: Defensive tackle, wide receiver, safety

Detroit Lions: B-
Top needs: Defensive end, cornerback, offensive line

Kansas City Chiefs: B-
Top needs: Cornerback, offensive line, defensive line

Los Angeles Rams: B-
Top needs: Defensive tackle, safety, offensive line

San Francisco 49ers: B-
Top needs: Wide receiver, defensive back, offensive line

Carolina Panthers: C+
Top needs: Edge rush, wide receiver, offensive tackle

Green Bay Packers: C+
Top needs: Wide receiver, tight end, offensive line

Houston Texans: C+
Top needs: Offensive line, running back, wide receiver

Los Angeles Chargers: C+
Top needs: Offensive tackle, defensive tackle, defensive back

New Orleans Saints: C+
Top needs: Wide receiver, offensive line, cornerback

New York Giants: C+
Top needs: Quarterback, cornerback, edge rush

Tampa Bay Buccaneers: C+
Top needs: Linebacker, defensive back, wide receiver

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My mailman also gave the Colts an A!! So did the maintenance man at my office building!! Yay for Kiper, a guy with no qualifications at all, liked our draft!!

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17 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

A 100% Lock?  I dont know that there is ANYTHING in life that is 100%

 

 

Death and taxes...that's about it lol 

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19 hours ago, Luck 4 president said:

Did I say we had a bad draft? I just don’t like Kiper at all. The guy takes bribes from agents to talk up their players and put them high on his draft board. 

I can understand not liking Kiper, but your reasoning makes no sense. Teams don't base their draft on Kiper's draft board, so it wouldn't do any good for agents to bribe Kiper.

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I dont know 95% of the players drafted last week which means I dont know enough to truly tell if we did bad, OK or great. It does make me feel great when people who do know 95% of the players drafted say we killed it. 

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4 hours ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

Death and taxes...that's about it lol 

And needing toilet paper. :number1:

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3 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

I can understand not liking Kiper, but your reasoning makes no sense. Teams don't base their draft on Kiper's draft board, so it wouldn't do any good for agents to bribe Kiper.

Exactly. The obvious talented players are known by most fans but the meat and potatoes of a team is known by the GM and his staff.  Good GMs are not paying attention to who the media or fans build up.

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On 4/28/2019 at 8:19 AM, Two_pound said:

Kiper gives thoughtful, rational explainations for his analysis and you guys still bash him? The negativity on this forum is mind numbing. I think we had a great draft, not because Kiper or anyone else on tv said so, it is my opinion. Rock and Okereke are probably going to start. Campbell will be on the field a lot at wr along with Hilton, Funchess, Rogers, and Cain. That is a mix of 5 recievers that will be tough to defend all over the field, and we may even bring Iman back yet.  Depth,depth, depth, competition, competition, competition, what is not to like about it?

 

This is what happens when fans spend 2+ months doing mock drafts & developing draft crushes, then on draft day Ballard just makes them all look silly.

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During ESPN’s NFL Live draft recap on today’s show, both McShay & Kiper picked the Colts as having the best draft in the league this year.  Over the Pats, Cards, & Skins.  On top of that Kiper said that with the talent that CB is assembling he’s picking us to represent the AFC in the Super Bowl.

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56 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

This is what happens when fans spend 2+ months doing mock drafts & developing draft crushes, then on draft day Ballard just makes them all look silly.

I resemble that remark  ...... 

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43 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

I resemble that remark  ...... 

After seeing Ballard draft over his first three seasons I just quit all together trying to do a mock for the Colts.

He has turned over this whole team with the exception of 5 players I think is right. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

His first draft would have been a success with just about any combinations of players just from the lack of talent that was on this team when he was hired.

Last seasons draft? What more can be said? Earned him GM of the year.

This draft has maybe 2 starters and tons of depth. Taking a good team and making it better.

This team could very well be the one we been waiting for?

Some may say not yet but all it takes is for them to get hot and reach there peak at the right time.

Just never know.

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1 hour ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

This is what happens when fans spend 2+ months doing mock drafts & developing draft crushes, then on draft day Ballard just makes them all look silly.

:applause:  :scoregood:

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1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

During ESPN’s NFL Live draft recap on today’s show, both McShay & Kiper picked the Colts as having the best draft in the league this year.  Over the Pats, Cards, & Skins.  On top of that Kiper said that with the talent that CB is assembling he’s picking us to represent the AFC in the Super Bowl.

 

I'd rather he hadn't...

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4 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I'd rather he hadn't...

Yeah I understand but what they say has no bearing on if we do, or don't. It's OK for the talking heads to be talking about us. Better than being laughed at.

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8 hours ago, Two_pound said:

JPFolks, I don't know if you directed that question at me specifically or everyone in general, but I like Ebron, Doyle, Allie-Cox, Travis is coming back, and I think Swope is still in the mix. That is a solid group in my opinion, it would be nice to have one guy who would be faster. I thought Allie-Cox really improved his blocking as the season went on.

My concerns is there were times during the season where our depth was basically Ebron in terms of pass catching TE's because of injuries.  I think we might have been down to only 2 total at one point.  Our offense will be unstoppable with our top tier TEs on the field at the same time.  We need a third legit receiving/blocking TE to make it work all day and to  cover if injuries pop up.  Plus the time is now to develop a legit young TE with all around talent like Doyle while we have the top two guys there to lead the way.  I am done with the Swope experiment, I really don't understand all the effort put into this guy over just getting a guy who knows the game, and has demonstrated/developed his skills against top defensive talent in college.  Converted basketball players is almost a cliche and I wonder how good a legit all around TE to start with would have been with the same development effort put into him.  Obviously Hockensen and Fant were gone before we could have gotten them, but someone closer to their talent level day one is who I was hoping we could develop into a monster going forward.  Thanks for the response. 

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4 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

My concerns is there were times during the season where our depth was basically Ebron in terms of pass catching TE's because of injuries.  I think we might have been down to only 2 total at one point.  Our offense will be unstoppable with our top tier TEs on the field at the same time.  We need a third legit receiving/blocking TE to make it work all day and to  cover if injuries pop up.  Plus the time is now to develop a legit young TE with all around talent like Doyle while we have the top two guys there to lead the way.  I am done with the Swope experiment, I really don't understand all the effort put into this guy over just getting a guy who knows the game, and has demonstrated/developed his skills against top defensive talent in college.  Converted basketball players is almost a cliche and I wonder how good a legit all around TE to start with would have been with the same development effort put into him.  Obviously Hockensen and Fant were gone before we could have gotten them, but someone closer to their talent level day one is who I was hoping we could develop into a monster going forward.  Thanks for the response. 

One step at a time.

Ballard said till the core group of players are in place he will continue to concentrate on that.

We may not be as thin at the TE position as you might think.

Ebron, Doyle and Allie-cox are the ones who gets the attention but we also have Brown, Holmes and Travis on the roster. I am not sure if we brought in a TE after the draft but I think we did.

All of them were signed for a reason so now we wait and see.

 

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20 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

One step at a time.

Ballard said till the core group of players are in place he will continue to concentrate on that.

We may not be as thin at the TE position as you might think.

Ebron, Doyle and Allie-cox are the ones who gets the attention but we also have Brown, Holmes and Travis on the roster. I am not sure if we brought in a TE after the draft but I think we did.

All of them were signed for a reason so now we wait and see.

 

It really hampered our strategy last year not having good enough depth a TE.  Sure, they switched as best they could, to other strategies, but after being promised a similar TE usage in the Grigson years and now carrying over that same idea of TE's on crossing routes and mismatches all over the field, and adding Funchess who isn't much different than a pass catching TE (except he drops it too much) I am hoping they actually can follow through on this strategy as I think it is devastating and adding Parris/Hilton (can't get enough of that ironic name combination) speed as yet another twist to TE dominant playcalling, we can finally realize that strategy in full.   Luck's vision of the field and these mismatches crisscrossing mid range and deep can be a new "greatest show on turf" and that is why I would love to see 4 high quality options at TE.  Sure, that might be asking a lot, but Doyle is not reliable health wise anymore, and Ebron might prove to be a one year wonder once Funchess and Doyle dig into his catches/TDs.  Last year Ebron and Hilton were really Lucks only two viable options much of the time.  Inman helped late, but Ebron may come crashing down to earth with serious pass catchers all over the field.  I'd love to see a WR corp where there was no room for the likes of Rogers because he's just not good enough.  The end of the "lesser of evils" options Luck had last year running routes.  Sadly we could find ourselves a Doyle injury away from having to count on bad hands Funchess and Ebron in clutch time catching situations.  I'd rather have them as luxuries, not necessities.  

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1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I'd rather he hadn't...

I don’t mind the outsiders giving us some praise.  It’s time we started getting some respect again. It’s when we start praising ourselves (ala Dwayne Allen) is when I’d rather not hear it.  

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2 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

It really hampered our strategy last year not having good enough depth a TE.  Sure, they switched as best they could, to other strategies, but after being promised a similar TE usage in the Grigson years and now carrying over that same idea of TE's on crossing routes and mismatches all over the field, and adding Funchess who isn't much different than a pass catching TE (except he drops it too much) I am hoping they actually can follow through on this strategy as I think it is devastating and adding Parris/Hilton (can't get enough of that ironic name combination) speed as yet another twist to TE dominant playcalling, we can finally realize that strategy in full.   Luck's vision of the field and these mismatches crisscrossing mid range and deep can be a new "greatest show on turf" and that is why I would love to see 4 high quality options at TE.  Sure, that might be asking a lot, but Doyle is not reliable health wise anymore, and Ebron might prove to be a one year wonder once Funchess and Doyle dig into his catches/TDs.  Last year Ebron and Hilton were really Lucks only two viable options much of the time.  Inman helped late, but Ebron may come crashing down to earth with serious pass catchers all over the field.  I'd love to see a WR corp where there was no room for the likes of Rogers because he's just not good enough.  The end of the "lesser of evils" options Luck had last year running routes.  Sadly we could find ourselves a Doyle injury away from having to count on bad hands Funchess and Ebron in clutch time catching situations.  I'd rather have them as luxuries, not necessities.  

Ebron lead the league for TEs in scoring. He is already a serious pass catcher regardless of who else is on the team. Luck trust him and till that changes he will get the targets.

I think you are under valuing both Ebron and Doyle too pre mature. Doyle is the offensive team captain and as long as he contributes I don't see that changing.

Like I mentioned we have more TEs on the roster so lets see how they develop before coming to the conclusion we are thin? Till all of these players go through training camp and 4 pre season games we don't know what we have one way or another.

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On 4/28/2019 at 3:17 PM, Irish YJ said:

I think the locks are TY, Campbell, Cain, Funchess, and Rogers. We bounced several to the practice squad last year and kept them, so I can see us dong the same this year. I think they'll give Fountain another year as they knew he was long term developmental guy coming in. He's been played up as working hard in the off season trying to improve. Pascal showed flashes as well so I think he'll likely be back. Not sure about the rest.

I am confused as to why they'd use a higher pick on Fountain if he was a development player than Cain who you see as a lock? That seems reversed at best? Plus, we have no idea what Cain will be.  He flashed early in camp which historically has meant very little since we seem every year to have camp heroes that don't make the team and now has to come back from injury.  I feel like Pascal might have at least as much promise as Fountain or Cain and he did at least produce a little on the field when called on.   Rogers for better or worse likely has an advantage over all three of those guys but I am hoping the talent cut off falls above where Rogers has been in his career.  

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10 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Ebron lead the league for TEs in scoring. He is already a serious pass catcher regardless of who else is on the team. Luck trust him and till that changes he will get the targets.

I think you are under valuing both Ebron and Doyle too pre mature. Doyle is the offensive team captain and as long as he contributes I don't see that changing.

Like I mentioned we have more TEs on the roster so lets see how they develop before coming to the conclusion we are thin? Till all of these players go through training camp and 4 pre season games we don't know what we have one way or another.

I think once we have viable alternatives, we will see Ebron's numbers come back down to earth.  If he even comes close to the same production, then either Luck will set the TD record, or that means major injuries to Doyle, Hilton, Funchess and/or others.  You can't add 3 or more viable pass catchers (Doyle, Funchess, Campbell, Cain etc.), 2 of which directly eat into Ebron's arsenal, and expect the same or better production from him.  Those TD's/Catches have to come from somewhere.  Even if Luck throws 50+ TD's it still means less to go around to all those guys.  

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Everyone will need to remember if Ebron only gets 8 touchdowns and 400 yards that doesn’t mean he regressed. We just added more targets. Like the above post mentioned if Ebron has those numbers again Luck will have killed the nfl or there were injuries. I fully expect Ebron’s numbers to be half and funchess to get the other half. 

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It's nice to see the media drooling over the Colts' draft, and I too saw the ESPN Draft Grades where Kiper and McShay said the Colts had the best draft (how often do they agree?), but in the end it doesn't really matter all that much other than make us fans feel a little bit good for a while.  The proof is going to be when they hit the field, and even then it will be a while before we know for sure.  I DO think part of that grade is a little bit of built-in "shame on me" from last year though.  

 

I liked the draft and the direction they are going.  They needed help with the defense and they tried to address that.  I would have preferred a prospect or two for the interior of the DL, but overall pretty good.  I admittedly didn't do much homework this year due to some personal obligations, but I like the principle.  But Ballard has shown he should be given the benefit of the doubt, so that is what I'm giving him and his staff.

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1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

One step at a time.

Ballard said till the core group of players are in place he will continue to concentrate on that.

We may not be as thin at the TE position as you might think.

Ebron, Doyle and Allie-cox are the ones who gets the attention but we also have Brown, Holmes and Travis on the roster. I am not sure if we brought in a TE after the draft but I think we did.

All of them were signed for a reason so now we wait and see.

 

I totally forgot about Ross Travis. Now i feel even better.

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47 minutes ago, krunk said:

I totally forgot about Ross Travis. Now i feel even better.

Yeah the Colts resigned him to a contract in Feb of this year. I think he was going to make the team last year till he tore his ACL in the final pre season game.

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Bill Polian said recently that nobody can really grade a team’s draft until about 4 years later.  Understanding that concept — which is as simple as it is overlooked — is one of the reasons that man is in Canton.

 

How’d we do in the draft?  Check back in a few years.  Until then, all anybody can do is speculate.  And I don’t put that much stock in anybody’s forecasting...something that is only done to keep us all mildly entertained in the off-season.

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1 hour ago, JPFolks said:

I am confused as to why they'd use a higher pick on Fountain if he was a development player than Cain who you see as a lock? That seems reversed at best? Plus, we have no idea what Cain will be.  He flashed early in camp which historically has meant very little since we seem every year to have camp heroes that don't make the team and now has to come back from injury.  I feel like Pascal might have at least as much promise as Fountain or Cain and he did at least produce a little on the field when called on.   Rogers for better or worse likely has an advantage over all three of those guys but I am hoping the talent cut off falls above where Rogers has been in his career.  

 

I have no idea about the order.... but Fountain's background scream developmental, and is exactly what folks said about him. Cain slid for two reasons which one was a flag. The risk vs draft capital equation likely improved a heck of a lot in the 6th round.

 

1) He didn't take a step forward after taking over the WR1 spot his last year. IMO, that was more due to going from Waston to Kelly than anything else.

2) The suspension and failed drug tests. 

 

Cain by all reports had locked down the WR2 spot last year before getting hurt. If you put him up against the others, he had more consistent production at a larger school than Fountain, Pascal, and Rogers. He's playing a different position than Rogers, so wouldn't compare those to anyway.

 

Just for labeling sake, and who's competing for what position. I also added Inman even though he's not currently on the roster.

 

Z

TY - Primary Z (5-9, 183, 4.34), who can also play slot very well. 16.2% from slot. He's not getting displaced. 

 

X

Pascal -  (6-2, 220, 4.55) - Possession X. 28.6% from slot. Also return

Inman - (6-3, 205, 4.52) - Possession X. 29.8% from slot.

 

Slot

Rogers - (6-0, 185, 4.56) - 85% from slot (the other from Z). Also return. 

 

TBD

Funchess - (6-4, 235, realistically 4.55 to 4.6) - Played possession X primarily in Carolina, but played 15% from slot. He's a TE-lite, and I expect him to play both possession X and big slot bully (more than the 15% he played in Carolina)

 

Cain -  (6-2, 203, 4.43) Speed X with height, who could play slot and likely Z too. By all reports, he had locked down starting X before he got hurt. 

 

Campbell - (6-0, 205, 4.31) - could project anywhere, but played slot/hb at OSU. If Cain comes back strong, I could see him tagged as slot, but could play anywhere. If Cain is slow to come back, I could see him at X if he can get through press on the line.

 

Fountain -  (6-1, 206, 4.46) - could project anywhere but he's measurables freak. 

 

In short, lots of moving pieces, but X has the most bodies, which is why I don't think Inman comes back if Cain is healthy. 

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27 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

 

I have no idea about the order.... but Fountain's background scream developmental, and is exactly what folks said about him. Cain slid for two reasons which one was a flag. The risk vs draft capital equation likely improved a heck of a lot in the 6th round.

 

1) He didn't take a step forward after taking over the WR1 spot his last year. IMO, that was more due to going from Waston to Kelly than anything else.

2) The suspension and failed drug tests. 

 

Cain by all reports had locked down the WR2 spot last year before getting hurt. If you put him up against the others, he had more consistent production at a larger school than Fountain, Pascal, and Rogers. He's playing a different position than Rogers, so wouldn't compare those to anyway.

 

Just for labeling sake, and who's competing for what position. I also added Inman even though he's not currently on the roster.

 

Z

TY - Primary Z (5-9, 183, 4.34), who can also play slot very well. 16.2% from slot. He's not getting displaced. 

 

X

Pascal -  (6-2, 220, 4.55) - Possession X. 28.6% from slot. Also return

Inman - (6-3, 205, 4.52) - Possession X. 29.8% from slot.

 

Slot

Rogers - (6-0, 185, 4.56) - 85% from slot (the other from Z). Also return. 

 

TBD

Funchess - (6-4, 235, realistically 4.55 to 4.6) - Played possession X primarily in Carolina, but played 15% from slot. He's a TE-lite, and I expect him to play both possession X and big slot bully (more than the 15% he played in Carolina)

 

Cain -  (6-2, 203, 4.43) Speed X with height, who could play slot and likely Z too. By all reports, he had locked down starting X before he got hurt. 

 

Campbell - (6-0, 205, 4.31) - could project anywhere, but played slot/hb at OSU. If Cain comes back strong, I could see him tagged as slot, but could play anywhere. If Cain is slow to come back, I could see him at X if he can get through press on the line.

 

Fountain -  (6-1, 206, 4.46) - could project anywhere but he's measurables freak. 

 

In short, lots of moving pieces, but X has the most bodies, which is why I don't think Inman comes back if Cain is healthy. 

 

Talent wise, Cain was projected as a 2nd-3rd round talent. I literally just read several draft profiles. To have grabbed him in the 6th because of the reasons you mentioned, I'm good with that lol. So you're essentially adding 2 starter-level WRs to the equation this offseason in Cain and Campbell, plus whatever you'd characterize Funchess as. With what's already on the roster, things could start to get crowded. Guys that may have gotten a lot of action last year may be relegated to backup roles this year, just due to the influx of talent. 

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I've been following Mel since before many posters here were even born.    He's good at his job even if most here don't seem to know it.

 

That said,   I think Mel has a HUGE man-crush on Chris Ballard.    And perhaps with good reason.   He's seen just how far the Colts have come in such a short time and it's all due to really good personnel decisions Ballard has made since he become GM less than 30 months ago.

 

Mel now wants to get out in front of the curve...  and be the firs to start talking about the Colts as a possible (likely?)  Super Bowl contender.   In his line of work,  better to be a year too soon than a year too late.    He'd rather be the first than be a late band wagon jumper.

 

I think we had a good to very good draft.    I don't think it's number one...   but I'm sure it's in the top-8... (top-10/20 percent)  and maybe even higher.     And I'm fine with that.    That's what we could've hoped for. 

 

We're now faster, more athletic, more skilled,  more competitive and far more deeper than we were a week ago.     And I'm good with that.     A really good week for Colts Nation!

 

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48 minutes ago, SouthernIndianaNDFan said:

 

Talent wise, Cain was projected as a 2nd-3rd round talent. I literally just read several draft profiles. To have grabbed him in the 6th because of the reasons you mentioned, I'm good with that lol. So you're essentially adding 2 starter-level WRs to the equation this offseason in Cain and Campbell, plus whatever you'd characterize Funchess as. With what's already on the roster, things could start to get crowded. Guys that may have gotten a lot of action last year may be relegated to backup roles this year, just due to the influx of talent. 

Yes, he was. He bounced around though, but was never considered a 6th round pick. He started off down IIRC, then moved up after the combine.

 

I have a 2 buds that are Clemson grads, and they were raving about him way back when he committed as a 5 star recruit. I remember being afraid of what he might do when ND played them. I had front row and was on the field during the monsoon. He didn't play that game, but he had a very good FR season with like 500 yards. 

 

Just goes to show you we'll never understand Ballard lol. Picks raw project with only one year of production in the 5th from a small school, then picks Cain in the 6th. Fountain is still a mystery in development, and the flagged 6th rounder is getting featured in pump up vids. Who knows if either will work out, but pretty obvious who was better prospect.

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5 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

 

I have no idea about the order.... but Fountain's background scream developmental, and is exactly what folks said about him. Cain slid for two reasons which one was a flag. The risk vs draft capital equation likely improved a heck of a lot in the 6th round.

 

1) He didn't take a step forward after taking over the WR1 spot his last year. IMO, that was more due to going from Waston to Kelly than anything else.

2) The suspension and failed drug tests. 

 

Cain by all reports had locked down the WR2 spot last year before getting hurt. If you put him up against the others, he had more consistent production at a larger school than Fountain, Pascal, and Rogers. He's playing a different position than Rogers, so wouldn't compare those to anyway.

 

Just for labeling sake, and who's competing for what position. I also added Inman even though he's not currently on the roster.

 

Z

TY - Primary Z (5-9, 183, 4.34), who can also play slot very well. 16.2% from slot. He's not getting displaced. 

 

X

Pascal -  (6-2, 220, 4.55) - Possession X. 28.6% from slot. Also return

Inman - (6-3, 205, 4.52) - Possession X. 29.8% from slot.

 

Slot

Rogers - (6-0, 185, 4.56) - 85% from slot (the other from Z). Also return. 

 

TBD

Funchess - (6-4, 235, realistically 4.55 to 4.6) - Played possession X primarily in Carolina, but played 15% from slot. He's a TE-lite, and I expect him to play both possession X and big slot bully (more than the 15% he played in Carolina)

 

Cain -  (6-2, 203, 4.43) Speed X with height, who could play slot and likely Z too. By all reports, he had locked down starting X before he got hurt. 

 

Campbell - (6-0, 205, 4.31) - could project anywhere, but played slot/hb at OSU. If Cain comes back strong, I could see him tagged as slot, but could play anywhere. If Cain is slow to come back, I could see him at X if he can get through press on the line.

 

Fountain -  (6-1, 206, 4.46) - could project anywhere but he's measurables freak. 

 

In short, lots of moving pieces, but X has the most bodies, which is why I don't think Inman comes back if Cain is healthy. 

Now THAT is how to answer a friggin' question! Awesome answer! 

 

Now here's a follow up.  Even though he PLAYED the slot on our heavily underwhelming set of options last year, is there really any reason from a skills point of view that Rogers is a good slot receiver option? (Maybe there is, but he just seems like GENERIC RECEIVER INSERT WHEREVER type of guy rather than one that displays any real penchant for being a slot. 

 

Also, which is more important, height or speed and how does that manifest itself in terms of positional usage?  Is TY locked in at Z solely based on speed OR solely based on he has been the only truly top notch WR on the roster in his entire time with the Colts, and I include Reggie who was clearly in decline even year 1 with Hilton.  Once he was gone, we had no one but TY.  (And I still insist that not bringing him back for a final year was the most low life move of Grigson's tenure because he gave us so much AND he literally was still, at the end, better than anyone we had on the team not named TY and even if he wasn't, he was world's better than nearly any other and would have been reliable when on the field even if his role was limited.  He would have EARNED the job in camp, AND he would have solidified his HOF credentials whereas now it isn't certain, certainly no where near a first ballot... but I digress...)  So let's say a LEGIT #1 talent showed up tomorrow in Indy.  Does that change Hilton's position? Does he become far more likely used in the slot? Of course he'd still be on the field all the time, but doesn't TY's talent determine he'd always be in any of those slots unless we had 3 better options?).  

 

How much "height" is enough to overcome any positional limitations, especially when attached to speed? 

 

My bottom line is shouldn't we be lining up the 3 best combinations of speed, height, hands and route running we have, regardless of X, Y, Z concepts? It's an honest question because I don't seem to see consistency.  Is Campbell an obvious slot or is Funchess? Two nearly opposite (on paper) talents? This is what I don't really get.  It seems to me that any player with an advantage in their game can use that advantage in any positional placement? 

 

Thanks again for a great response! 

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On 4/28/2019 at 4:14 PM, Irish YJ said:

I'm in the same place. There's so many things not to like about Kiper. The multiples reports of his taking bribes and greasing pockets, his huge wiffs, his broken promises, his feuds, his mocks suck, etc... 

 

Speaking of his whiffs, check this out. It's LOL worthy. Wish he would have kept his promise about Clausen.

 

https://awfulannouncing.com/espn/mel-kipers-top-10-nfl-draft-blunders.html

Note to readers: This is a long response, don't read it if you're going to whine about the length. 

 

Look, ALL these media people are shills at the top.  Some start out as honest brokers, but to last and to move up, you have to go with other peoples agendas, truth be damned.  Mel is just a guy who I am sure spends lots of time watching film, likely has seen a lot of players first hand instead of through a staff of workers eyes though I guarantee you he DOES use other people's evaluation because he doesn't have enough actual time alive and awake to watch ALL the players, so he takes short cuts off of other people's work then claims he does it alone which is a lie to start with.  But even with all of that, he's just an opinion.  He doesn't lose his job for making ignorant picks like those at that link, like those GMs who made similarly ridiculous mistakes likely did. 

 

He's a talking head propped up by his speaking/salesman skills and also propped up by agents who either pay for coverage or offer "in kind" support for coverage.  And the "in kind" support is also how all the other experts rise to the top.  If you want truly honest brokers you are more likely to find them on this message board where people give their honest opinions and aren't being paid or "favored" to do so.  And I know guys who do it as a major hobby (or look on youtube around draft time to see people with deep knowledge who have less than 1000 followers all over the place) and are as likely to be right as Mel Kiper et. al.  They are just humans with opinions.  People like Ballard by himself would be really good, but wouldn't have a CLUE how to put together his draft board without a TEAM of guys with their jobs on the line who have families to feed or career goals to survive and thrive. 

 

And even with ALL that support, they collectively still draft guys like Banner in the 4th round.  (If I have that right).  It happens.  I recall thinking to myself that Jermichael the #1 QB was a terrible prospect, and I couldn't figure out what I was missing that everyone else was seeing.  I happened to be right on that one.  I was wrong about plenty of others.  Though I do recall suggesting on here that the Colts (in a mock draft here) should draft Keanu Neal with their pick that year and I was DERIDED by all the "EXPERTS" on this board relentlessly calling my evaluation "indefensible" even though I stated my backup choice would be Ryan Kelly.  To my favor, the pick right before ours was Atlanta, who picked Neal and then we picked Kelly.  Even then these "EXPERTS" said it didn't matter even if Neal made the pro bowl, it was still a lousy mock draft pick.   The truth was I simply researched for a solid week our two positions of greatest need, Center (which I played in College so I know a bit about the position) and Safety, which I felt was clearly our greatest need IF the right safety could be found.  Neal was that guy and would have been great.  I even advocated trading back up to get Kelly, OR trading down and STILL getting him but could find no trade partners in either scenario. 

 

I would have loved to have gotten both players because I was able to focus solely on our team, and two positions of greatest need.  Ironically, we did pick Kelly (we'll never know if Neal was on our draft board for real or not in that range because he was gone a pick earlier) and the next year we picked Safety #1 producing Hooker.  Imagine having Neal and Hooker as our two starting safeties? (Sure, Neal tore his ACL, but in the alternate universe who know what would have happened.  Kelly has been hurt a lot as well).   

 

Bottom line, even when we make great picks (which we CAN) we have nothing riding on it beyond a bunch of tools on a message board attacking or "liking" our picks.  Kiper has the same nothing riding on his stuff.  The more outrageous his presentation, the more infamous he becomes and the more money that pours into his pocket.  And if he takes a little under the table to shill like his colleagues, that's just how business is done in the media at those levels.  He's no better or worse any more than one kind of deadly flu is better or worse than another. 

 

Thanks for the link, it's always fun to remember who our "experts" really are.  No better than anyone else when it comes down to it.  If I paid YOU what he makes, I feel confident your track record would be at least as good as his.  

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36 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

Note to readers: This is a long response, don't read it if you're going to whine about the length. 

 

Look, ALL these media people are shills at the top.  Some start out as honest brokers, but to last and to move up, you have to go with other peoples agendas, truth be damned.  Mel is just a guy who I am sure spends lots of time watching film, likely has seen a lot of players first hand instead of through a staff of workers eyes though I guarantee you he DOES use other people's evaluation because he doesn't have enough actual time alive and awake to watch ALL the players, so he takes short cuts off of other people's work then claims he does it alone which is a lie to start with.  But even with all of that, he's just an opinion.  He doesn't lose his job for making ignorant picks like those at that link, like those GMs who made similarly ridiculous mistakes likely did. 

 

He's a talking head propped up by his speaking/salesman skills and also propped up by agents who either pay for coverage or offer "in kind" support for coverage.  And the "in kind" support is also how all the other experts rise to the top.  If you want truly honest brokers you are more likely to find them on this message board where people give their honest opinions and aren't being paid or "favored" to do so.  And I know guys who do it as a major hobby (or look on youtube around draft time to see people with deep knowledge who have less than 1000 followers all over the place) and are as likely to be right as Mel Kiper et. al.  They are just humans with opinions.  People like Ballard by himself would be really good, but wouldn't have a CLUE how to put together his draft board without a TEAM of guys with their jobs on the line who have families to feed or career goals to survive and thrive. 

 

And even with ALL that support, they collectively still draft guys like Banner in the 4th round.  (If I have that right).  It happens.  I recall thinking to myself that Jermichael the #1 QB was a terrible prospect, and I couldn't figure out what I was missing that everyone else was seeing.  I happened to be right on that one.  I was wrong about plenty of others.  Though I do recall suggesting on here that the Colts (in a mock draft here) should draft Keanu Neal with their pick that year and I was DERIDED by all the "EXPERTS" on this board relentlessly calling my evaluation "indefensible" even though I stated my backup choice would be Ryan Kelly.  To my favor, the pick right before ours was Atlanta, who picked Neal and then we picked Kelly.  Even then these "EXPERTS" said it didn't matter even if Neal made the pro bowl, it was still a lousy mock draft pick.   The truth was I simply researched for a solid week our two positions of greatest need, Center (which I played in College so I know a bit about the position) and Safety, which I felt was clearly our greatest need IF the right safety could be found.  Neal was that guy and would have been great.  I even advocated trading back up to get Kelly, OR trading down and STILL getting him but could find no trade partners in either scenario. 

 

I would have loved to have gotten both players because I was able to focus solely on our team, and two positions of greatest need.  Ironically, we did pick Kelly (we'll never know if Neal was on our draft board for real or not in that range because he was gone a pick earlier) and the next year we picked Safety #1 producing Hooker.  Imagine having Neal and Hooker as our two starting safeties? (Sure, Neal tore his ACL, but in the alternate universe who know what would have happened.  Kelly has been hurt a lot as well).   

 

Bottom line, even when we make great picks (which we CAN) we have nothing riding on it beyond a bunch of tools on a message board attacking or "liking" our picks.  Kiper has the same nothing riding on his stuff.  The more outrageous his presentation, the more infamous he becomes and the more money that pours into his pocket.  And if he takes a little under the table to shill like his colleagues, that's just how business is done in the media at those levels.  He's no better or worse any more than one kind of deadly flu is better or worse than another. 

 

Thanks for the link, it's always fun to remember who our "experts" really are.  No better than anyone else when it comes down to it.  If I paid YOU what he makes, I feel confident your track record would be at least as good as his.  

Good post JP! Everyone always calls others "Armchair GM's" on here. Just imagine if myself or any decent draft guy on this forum had a professional team working with them along with the technology they have provided to them. Thinking about that just makes you realize how bad Grigson really was and that fans may do a decent job if they have everything provided to them like Grigson and Ballard did and do. It's a ton of work, but in this case it would be your job and not a hobby, and you'd be getting paid for it. Ballard has seemed to master it so far IMO.

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On 4/28/2019 at 7:41 PM, Chloe6124 said:

Would we really keep 6 WR on the roster. I just don’t see enough balls to go around. Especially with Doyle and Ebron. Pascal is still competing also.

 

 Pascal's has VG value as a blocker chasing down LB'ers in the run game and for bubble screens. I hope he comes in working hard.

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On 4/29/2019 at 12:41 AM, WoolMagnet said:

This is what i see as well.  Many are surprised by Ballard ignoring DL, but there was an early run and the value wasnt there by the time we picked.

  What i see is 

1. Added a legit wr #2 

2. Added OL depth/development

3. (Most importantly). Added CB,S,LB speed and measureables to help with those RB TE and slot plays that are tearing up the league. (Think chiefs game)

 After last year's draft i felt our LB corps was our weakness. I still think it was but we got more out of them (especially Leonard) than expected.  I remember thinking i hoped this draft was stocked with LBs.  

  But yes, added competition at WR, LB, S, and CB.

And i expect a few more changes after cuts again.

Ballard seems to onow exactly what he wants and what role needs to be filled.  NE has been successful doing this for decades.

Its in the money-ball realm.  And.... its common sense really.

 

 So now i see him looking for a run stuffing DT to compete with Grover, and of course a guy that can do that and push the pocket would be best.
 CB would consider anyone, including high value pricey if it was the right person. The value Probably won't come till training camp/time for final cuts, but he will add someone IMO. 

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14 hours ago, JPFolks said:

I think once we have viable alternatives, we will see Ebron's numbers come back down to earth.  If he even comes close to the same production, then either Luck will set the TD record, or that means major injuries to Doyle, Hilton, Funchess and/or others.  You can't add 3 or more viable pass catchers (Doyle, Funchess, Campbell, Cain etc.), 2 of which directly eat into Ebron's arsenal, and expect the same or better production from him.  Those TD's/Catches have to come from somewhere.  Even if Luck throws 50+ TD's it still means less to go around to all those guys.  

So, you are saying if Ebron's numbers go down, it will be a good thing.

I agree.   

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3 hours ago, Myles said:

So, you are saying if Ebron's numbers go down, it will be a good thing.

I agree.   

Actually it's the same thing.  If Ebron's numbers stay the same that means that Funchess didn't add much and/or the rest of the team (Doyle, Campbell) didn't make a difference.  I mean heck, Ebron getting numbers isn't a negative if Luck throws well over 50TDs.  Then we might see 6 TD's by Funchess and 5 by Doyle, 5 TD's by Campbell etc..  That would be spreading the wealth.  But more likely we'll see Ebron with 8 TD's, Funchess with 5 TD's, Doyle with 5 TD's and Campbell with a handful.  That wouldn't be a bad thing.  If Luck doesn't have 45 TD's it's also a bad sign.  

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